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	<title>Comments on: A Canon Roadmap? &amp; CR Rating Changes [CR1]</title>
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	<link>http://www.canonrumors.com/2009/04/a-canon-roadmap-cr-rating-changes-cr1/</link>
	<description>You gotta know</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 21 Nov 2009 03:59:42 -0800</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Riley</title>
		<link>http://www.canonrumors.com/2009/04/a-canon-roadmap-cr-rating-changes-cr1/comment-page-1/#comment-11243</link>
		<dc:creator>Riley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Jun 2009 20:49:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.canonrumors.com/?p=1754#comment-11243</guid>
		<description>Having a goldfish is a relaxing hobby for me. I love their bright orange color and they are not a high-maintenance pet to keep.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Having a goldfish is a relaxing hobby for me. I love their bright orange color and they are not a high-maintenance pet to keep.</p>
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		<title>By: David</title>
		<link>http://www.canonrumors.com/2009/04/a-canon-roadmap-cr-rating-changes-cr1/comment-page-1/#comment-8825</link>
		<dc:creator>David</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Apr 2009 05:29:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.canonrumors.com/?p=1754#comment-8825</guid>
		<description>Oh dont take me so seriously Zac. This is a rumors site with alien technology raising megapixels on us all before the invasion begins, and I was body-snatched into a troll a long time ago ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh dont take me so seriously Zac. This is a rumors site with alien technology raising megapixels on us all before the invasion begins, and I was body-snatched into a troll a long time ago ;)</p>
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		<title>By: Zac</title>
		<link>http://www.canonrumors.com/2009/04/a-canon-roadmap-cr-rating-changes-cr1/comment-page-1/#comment-8809</link>
		<dc:creator>Zac</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Apr 2009 00:12:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.canonrumors.com/?p=1754#comment-8809</guid>
		<description>David, I&#039;m sorry to have offended you with the lecture comment, I did not mean that I don&#039;t care for the information, rather that it was tangential.  Please do note that immediately after mentioning the &quot;ultimate resolution limit&quot; I said that 15 mp in aps-c was close to it, not that all current cameras were near it. I&#039;m sorry.  I feel that I&#039;ve made an ass of myself here in large part because I got annoyed that you didn&#039;t understand things that I worded very poorly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>David, I&#8217;m sorry to have offended you with the lecture comment, I did not mean that I don&#8217;t care for the information, rather that it was tangential.  Please do note that immediately after mentioning the &#8220;ultimate resolution limit&#8221; I said that 15 mp in aps-c was close to it, not that all current cameras were near it. I&#8217;m sorry.  I feel that I&#8217;ve made an ass of myself here in large part because I got annoyed that you didn&#8217;t understand things that I worded very poorly.</p>
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		<title>By: Adam</title>
		<link>http://www.canonrumors.com/2009/04/a-canon-roadmap-cr-rating-changes-cr1/comment-page-1/#comment-8779</link>
		<dc:creator>Adam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Apr 2009 16:54:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.canonrumors.com/?p=1754#comment-8779</guid>
		<description>Camera companies donÃ‚Â´t do public roadmaps. Someone is making up BS</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Camera companies donÃ‚Â´t do public roadmaps. Someone is making up BS</p>
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		<title>By: David</title>
		<link>http://www.canonrumors.com/2009/04/a-canon-roadmap-cr-rating-changes-cr1/comment-page-1/#comment-8738</link>
		<dc:creator>David</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Apr 2009 21:37:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.canonrumors.com/?p=1754#comment-8738</guid>
		<description>Well now you are changing your statement to limit just XXD &amp; 1D resolution, which I&#039;m certain will not happen, but your first declaration was &quot;I think resolution does have a ceiling&quot; regarding DSLR&#039;s. I still think you are mistaken in both cases.

You are not the only one who can use sarcasm, Zac, so when I stick my tounge out and say I&#039;m right, which I am of course, and you&#039;re not, it&#039;s a jest.

Where I think you are wrong is your assumptions are based, as you said, on current technology, which as we all know when it comes to chip design is old tech by the time we are talking about it here. You assume things as they appear in a current production model and do not factor in the rapid development and improvements being made for the next round.

Another place you are wrong is your continued assumption that I think only resolution will increase and not other aspects of design such as noise and dynamic range also getting better. You seem to have it stuck in your head lower MP means better picture quality, which if one assumes as you seem to do that chip design will not improve, you might be correct, but I see no evidence that is going to happen - so I disagree with your assumptions and conclusions.

The big difference in our thinking is I do not hold to old film-school thinking about what a DSLR camera &quot;should&quot; be or can be. I remember very clearly hearing all prophesies when the 1D came out that digital WOULD NEVER match film quality. I heard all the prophesies that they would never add video to DSLR&#039;s, especially not a Pro DSLR. What people, and you specifically Zac, fail to realize is competitive market forces drive advancements, and because competition is not going to end, ever, neither will development of better pictures including higher MP in all cameras, and I am absolutely certain that in 10 years we will all consider what is today &quot;state of the art&quot; to be a total joke.

I&#039;m also not saying all cameras &quot;should&quot; increase resolution, personally I don&#039;t care if a Rebel was still 3MP or 15MP it&#039;s not a camera I will ever buy just because of the name, I&#039;m saying they all WILL as a result of advancement in design and competitive market driving forces. As for some models having lower MP to increase fps to appeal to a different market segment, sure, but they will also rise in MP like all the other cameras will.

As for lecturing, whatever...I write as I want to write, as do you I might add without my telling you how to write, and just as I do not accept your limited thinking about what a DSLR camera should be, I do not accept your opinion I can not explain my thinking, give examples, or talk about cameras or photography as I see it.

:)~~~</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well now you are changing your statement to limit just XXD &amp; 1D resolution, which I&#8217;m certain will not happen, but your first declaration was &#8220;I think resolution does have a ceiling&#8221; regarding DSLR&#8217;s. I still think you are mistaken in both cases.</p>
<p>You are not the only one who can use sarcasm, Zac, so when I stick my tounge out and say I&#8217;m right, which I am of course, and you&#8217;re not, it&#8217;s a jest.</p>
<p>Where I think you are wrong is your assumptions are based, as you said, on current technology, which as we all know when it comes to chip design is old tech by the time we are talking about it here. You assume things as they appear in a current production model and do not factor in the rapid development and improvements being made for the next round.</p>
<p>Another place you are wrong is your continued assumption that I think only resolution will increase and not other aspects of design such as noise and dynamic range also getting better. You seem to have it stuck in your head lower MP means better picture quality, which if one assumes as you seem to do that chip design will not improve, you might be correct, but I see no evidence that is going to happen &#8211; so I disagree with your assumptions and conclusions.</p>
<p>The big difference in our thinking is I do not hold to old film-school thinking about what a DSLR camera &#8220;should&#8221; be or can be. I remember very clearly hearing all prophesies when the 1D came out that digital WOULD NEVER match film quality. I heard all the prophesies that they would never add video to DSLR&#8217;s, especially not a Pro DSLR. What people, and you specifically Zac, fail to realize is competitive market forces drive advancements, and because competition is not going to end, ever, neither will development of better pictures including higher MP in all cameras, and I am absolutely certain that in 10 years we will all consider what is today &#8220;state of the art&#8221; to be a total joke.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m also not saying all cameras &#8220;should&#8221; increase resolution, personally I don&#8217;t care if a Rebel was still 3MP or 15MP it&#8217;s not a camera I will ever buy just because of the name, I&#8217;m saying they all WILL as a result of advancement in design and competitive market driving forces. As for some models having lower MP to increase fps to appeal to a different market segment, sure, but they will also rise in MP like all the other cameras will.</p>
<p>As for lecturing, whatever&#8230;I write as I want to write, as do you I might add without my telling you how to write, and just as I do not accept your limited thinking about what a DSLR camera should be, I do not accept your opinion I can not explain my thinking, give examples, or talk about cameras or photography as I see it.</p>
<p>:)~~~</p>
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		<title>By: Zac</title>
		<link>http://www.canonrumors.com/2009/04/a-canon-roadmap-cr-rating-changes-cr1/comment-page-1/#comment-8733</link>
		<dc:creator>Zac</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Apr 2009 20:59:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.canonrumors.com/?p=1754#comment-8733</guid>
		<description>David please read this comment stream from top, I think it help you understand the point I&#039;m trying to make.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>David please read this comment stream from top, I think it help you understand the point I&#8217;m trying to make.</p>
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		<title>By: Zac</title>
		<link>http://www.canonrumors.com/2009/04/a-canon-roadmap-cr-rating-changes-cr1/comment-page-1/#comment-8732</link>
		<dc:creator>Zac</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Apr 2009 20:51:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.canonrumors.com/?p=1754#comment-8732</guid>
		<description>You read too much into the statement David, me asking why we should is not me saying we shouldn&#039;t. But a lot of the same physics applies in limiting the ultimate resolution possible, yes the envelope keeps getting pushed and lenses keep getting better, but lenses have getting better for as long as their have been lenses, and beofre digital film grain, which is basically it&#039;s resolution was constantly improving. I never told you to go buy a MF system if you need more resolution, just not to lecture about how MF film and 4x5 givenetter results than a FF digital camera. I also never said that they have reached their top resolutions. Just that for models not based on resolution that they&#039;re at the point of rapidly diminishing returns, at least with current technology, so then keeping the same resolution 50D to 60D to let technology mature for another year isn&#039;t a terrible idea, and hopefully they&#039;ll consider it. Of particular concern to me is the diffraction limited aperture, not that I see how that can get better with tech, but there probably is a way. 

Personally, asa 6 film in a 6x7 will continue to own for quite some time, but it&#039;s not practical to use at all.

The big difference, I think, between us, is that you want very high resolutions for all cameras, where I would prefer that the 5D and Ds type cameras keep chasing resolution, while the others XXD and 1D slowly increase resolution, while concentrating on other areeaa, like noise and dynamic range, or exposure latitude :), 

About the 1d sensor versus the Ds sensor, they&#039;re not directly comparable because they are designed for differennt purposes, the Ds is a maximum resolution possible, the resolution in the 1D is limited for additional speed, they could have put more pixels in the original 1D. But they chose not to.so comparing those to show the progress is just not a great example.

Oh, and David, chill a little bit, I&#039;m not personally attacking you or what you want, so if you could turn down the I&#039;m right you&#039;re not, particularly considering that I have trouble communicating my points to you, it would be appreciated.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You read too much into the statement David, me asking why we should is not me saying we shouldn&#8217;t. But a lot of the same physics applies in limiting the ultimate resolution possible, yes the envelope keeps getting pushed and lenses keep getting better, but lenses have getting better for as long as their have been lenses, and beofre digital film grain, which is basically it&#8217;s resolution was constantly improving. I never told you to go buy a MF system if you need more resolution, just not to lecture about how MF film and 4&#215;5 givenetter results than a FF digital camera. I also never said that they have reached their top resolutions. Just that for models not based on resolution that they&#8217;re at the point of rapidly diminishing returns, at least with current technology, so then keeping the same resolution 50D to 60D to let technology mature for another year isn&#8217;t a terrible idea, and hopefully they&#8217;ll consider it. Of particular concern to me is the diffraction limited aperture, not that I see how that can get better with tech, but there probably is a way. </p>
<p>Personally, asa 6 film in a 6&#215;7 will continue to own for quite some time, but it&#8217;s not practical to use at all.</p>
<p>The big difference, I think, between us, is that you want very high resolutions for all cameras, where I would prefer that the 5D and Ds type cameras keep chasing resolution, while the others XXD and 1D slowly increase resolution, while concentrating on other areeaa, like noise and dynamic range, or exposure latitude :), </p>
<p>About the 1d sensor versus the Ds sensor, they&#8217;re not directly comparable because they are designed for differennt purposes, the Ds is a maximum resolution possible, the resolution in the 1D is limited for additional speed, they could have put more pixels in the original 1D. But they chose not to.so comparing those to show the progress is just not a great example.</p>
<p>Oh, and David, chill a little bit, I&#8217;m not personally attacking you or what you want, so if you could turn down the I&#8217;m right you&#8217;re not, particularly considering that I have trouble communicating my points to you, it would be appreciated.</p>
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		<title>By: David</title>
		<link>http://www.canonrumors.com/2009/04/a-canon-roadmap-cr-rating-changes-cr1/comment-page-1/#comment-8727</link>
		<dc:creator>David</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Apr 2009 17:38:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.canonrumors.com/?p=1754#comment-8727</guid>
		<description>Also, Zac, when I said DSLR&#039;s are just now hitting 35mm quality I was referring to the likes of Dx3, 1Ds3 and the 5D2 and high quality film. Obviously I was not talking about disposable 35mm cameras nor crappy film. My point is film had an inherent resolution cap and if one wanted higher resolution the only option was bigger size film. Digital changes that, and we will be crossing the threshold that will prove it with the next generation of DLSR chips and new lenses, which is why Canon has been slowly coming out with II versions of lenses. If resolution was going to stay at 35mm quality we would not see lenses like the 24-70 L replaced with a II new version designed for higher resolutions - but we will see that, as I am right and you are not.

:)~</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Also, Zac, when I said DSLR&#8217;s are just now hitting 35mm quality I was referring to the likes of Dx3, 1Ds3 and the 5D2 and high quality film. Obviously I was not talking about disposable 35mm cameras nor crappy film. My point is film had an inherent resolution cap and if one wanted higher resolution the only option was bigger size film. Digital changes that, and we will be crossing the threshold that will prove it with the next generation of DLSR chips and new lenses, which is why Canon has been slowly coming out with II versions of lenses. If resolution was going to stay at 35mm quality we would not see lenses like the 24-70 L replaced with a II new version designed for higher resolutions &#8211; but we will see that, as I am right and you are not.</p>
<p>:)~</p>
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		<title>By: David</title>
		<link>http://www.canonrumors.com/2009/04/a-canon-roadmap-cr-rating-changes-cr1/comment-page-1/#comment-8723</link>
		<dc:creator>David</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Apr 2009 16:45:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.canonrumors.com/?p=1754#comment-8723</guid>
		<description>The reason, Zac, that we should most certainly get medium format resolution from DSLR is because there is no reason not to - and just because you say we should not is not a good reason. Before the format was limited by film size, now it is not, it is only limited by chip design and lens quality, both of which can and will continue to improve because competition and the need for Camera companies to sell more products will drive them to do so. I do not accept your limited view of photography nor your view that if I want higher resolution I should have to buy medium format system. 

Also, you missed my point entirely about quoting the 1D, which was not to compare the 1D and 1Ds line, but only to show the FACT that chip design and resolution have evolved and will continue to do so despite your opinion the world should accept your decision DLSR&#039;s have reached their top resolution.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The reason, Zac, that we should most certainly get medium format resolution from DSLR is because there is no reason not to &#8211; and just because you say we should not is not a good reason. Before the format was limited by film size, now it is not, it is only limited by chip design and lens quality, both of which can and will continue to improve because competition and the need for Camera companies to sell more products will drive them to do so. I do not accept your limited view of photography nor your view that if I want higher resolution I should have to buy medium format system. </p>
<p>Also, you missed my point entirely about quoting the 1D, which was not to compare the 1D and 1Ds line, but only to show the FACT that chip design and resolution have evolved and will continue to do so despite your opinion the world should accept your decision DLSR&#8217;s have reached their top resolution.</p>
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		<title>By: Zac</title>
		<link>http://www.canonrumors.com/2009/04/a-canon-roadmap-cr-rating-changes-cr1/comment-page-1/#comment-8692</link>
		<dc:creator>Zac</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Apr 2009 22:34:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.canonrumors.com/?p=1754#comment-8692</guid>
		<description>When the 1D came out there was no 1Ds and it was the highest resolution Canon DSLR camera at the time.
soÃ¢â‚¬Â¦ my point was you shouldnÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t compare a 1D to a 1Ds to show the increase in resolution, and btw i donÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t suppose that a limit on useful resolution is capped indefinitely, rather that it needs to slow less it outstrips the capability of the lenses made for it.
thanks for the film lecture, I do not have personal experience shooting chromes with 35mm and 6Ãƒâ€”7 or 4Ãƒâ€”5 P/N. so i am unable to comprehend the concept that larger and more expensive camera lens systems would produce superior images at the reduction of speed and flexibility. (sarcasm, in case you couldnÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t tell) oh, btw digital has already far surpassed all but the best 35mm slide filmÃ¢â‚¬Â¦
which is the territory of the Ds and 5D bodies, since choosing which digital body one shoots with is very like choosing your film stock, and those can match the resolution of the slide film. why should we be able to get MF results with 35mm digital? why? and in case youÃ¢â‚¬â„¢re wondering, if I chose a DSLR to compare a 4Ãƒâ€”5 film shot to, it would be to a mamiya with a p60 back, not a 35mmÃ¢â‚¬Â¦ the best DSLR depends on the specific application and changes with advances in technology, do not presume so much pleaseÃ¢â‚¬Â¦</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When the 1D came out there was no 1Ds and it was the highest resolution Canon DSLR camera at the time.<br />
soÃ¢â‚¬Â¦ my point was you shouldnÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t compare a 1D to a 1Ds to show the increase in resolution, and btw i donÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t suppose that a limit on useful resolution is capped indefinitely, rather that it needs to slow less it outstrips the capability of the lenses made for it.<br />
thanks for the film lecture, I do not have personal experience shooting chromes with 35mm and 6Ãƒâ€”7 or 4Ãƒâ€”5 P/N. so i am unable to comprehend the concept that larger and more expensive camera lens systems would produce superior images at the reduction of speed and flexibility. (sarcasm, in case you couldnÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t tell) oh, btw digital has already far surpassed all but the best 35mm slide filmÃ¢â‚¬Â¦<br />
which is the territory of the Ds and 5D bodies, since choosing which digital body one shoots with is very like choosing your film stock, and those can match the resolution of the slide film. why should we be able to get MF results with 35mm digital? why? and in case youÃ¢â‚¬â„¢re wondering, if I chose a DSLR to compare a 4Ãƒâ€”5 film shot to, it would be to a mamiya with a p60 back, not a 35mmÃ¢â‚¬Â¦ the best DSLR depends on the specific application and changes with advances in technology, do not presume so much pleaseÃ¢â‚¬Â¦</p>
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