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Author Topic: EOS 7D Mark II Information [CR2]  (Read 34368 times)

ahsanford

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Information [CR2]
« Reply #15 on: August 03, 2013, 01:18:26 PM »
The days of "having" to upgrade crop bodies is pretty much over. There's no reason to swap or sell a 7D for any other crop body....


Yes there is: much better ISO performance. I use mine for 'action photography' ie motorsports and wildlife and unfortunately find that I'm using iso 1600+ to get both the DOF and shutter speeds I want. Interestingly this is the body I would soonest replace. The 5D2 is miles ahead in image quality.

+1. 

Every photog in this forum runs up against the limits of their equipment on a daily basis.  One extra stop of IS, one more stop of low-light performance, etc. are useful adds to people who shoot weddings, indoor sports, etc.

I'm a 5D3 guy and honestly get frustrated that I need more than ISO 6400 for some shots (obviously, where a flash can't be used).  Am I spoiled for being able to capture what we couldn't 20 years ago?  Sure.  But I still want to capture my human experience, and I often am in places and that are not ideal to shoot.  Progress on every front with these rigs lets me net more keeper shots.

Applying this specifically to the 7D, the 7D2 having the 1DX/5D3 AF system alone is worth the upgrade.  That focusing system is world class.

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Information [CR2]
« Reply #15 on: August 03, 2013, 01:18:26 PM »

neuroanatomist

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Information [CR2]
« Reply #16 on: August 03, 2013, 01:39:00 PM »
This was supposed to be a camera costing more than the 6D, the 'pro APS-C rig' for birders and sports guys with huge glass, etc.  But for the first major design decision we've heard of, this is a poor way to justify that kind of money.

Well, that's what a lot of us are hoping for...but Canon just wants to sell lots of these cameras, and maybe their market research has determined that the opinions of those on this forum aren't aligned with their majority demographic.  A camera that's a bit better than the 70D, and costs a bit more but still well under 6D price, might sell a lot better than a 'pro APS-C rig' costing over $2500.
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MichaelHodges

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Information [CR2]
« Reply #17 on: August 03, 2013, 01:45:50 PM »
Yes there is: much better ISO performance.

I disagree. I've seen IQ at lower ISO's actually get worse. The 7d is noisy as hell at ISO 100, especially in the skies. 

The differences between higher ISO's on crop bodies are miniscule at best the last several years and not worth upgrading for.

SecundumArtemRx

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Information [CR2]
« Reply #18 on: August 03, 2013, 01:47:42 PM »
DSLR development appears to be reaching a plateau, and sales seem to be reflecting this. The 70D is basically a consumerized version of the 7D, similar to how the 6D was a consumerized version of the 5D2. I don’t really think there is as much room for a 7D2, as the 70D is probably good enough to basically replace it. The image quality of the 6D/5D3, and the AF advantages of the 5D3 probably have also sliced off a significant share of potential buyers. There is likely a bean counter somewhere that has figured they would be better selling more 70Ds, 6Ds, and 5D3s than having to produce and market another camera in the current economic climate. By next year these cameras will all be mid-cycle when they can re-evaluate the marketplace and put out a 7D2 to goose sales if it makes sense.
Agree, but speaking as someone who made the mistake of getting a 60D instead of the 7D and now realizing its limitations (AFMA, better focus points, etc) - I will be boycotting these marginal upgrades and hoping others will too, in favor of true market "re-evaluation." I can see the lure of improved videography with the 70D, but there's a notable absence of high end photography features to make me drop more "camera cash."

Canon fooled me once with the 60D and am waiting for the next true sports camera, rather than settling for another marginal 60D upgrade. Lets see a novel APS-C camera with 20+MP, an AF point system on par with the 1D, good iso, and I'd be first in line to buy! That'd be an awesome 7DmkII.
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MichaelHodges

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Information [CR2]
« Reply #19 on: August 03, 2013, 01:50:09 PM »
  Hopefully the body will be the same size as the current 7D or larger to fit us with larger hands.  Other wants in the new 7DII would be Magnesium body, Fully weather sealed, 100% view finder, On board Flash controller, built in Introvalometer, a rear facing sensor for wire less remote, 24 megapixels and a flip out screen.  All this and keeping the same features of the current 7D would be a nice camera.  As far as Wi-Fi, I could care less about that.


None of these are worth upgrading over the current 7D, especially since the IQ appears to be the same with their latest sensor in the 70D.

RGomezPhotos

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Information [CR2]
« Reply #20 on: August 03, 2013, 02:01:37 PM »
I guess this makes good marketing sense. Canon came out with the SL1, 70D and PROBABLY the new "M" camera before the year is over. Enough to keep mindshare active when they have a huge year for 2014.

Lets see: BIG MP DSLR which will probably blow away the Nikon D800. 7D MK II. Fastest APS-C camera on the planet with great ISO performance and even better AF. The new successor to the 1DX. And there isn't much they can do to better the 1DX. So that will be interesting. And they will probably announce the successor to the 5D MKIII at the end of the year.

The 7D is still a fine camera and have some great pics come out of them. Yes, ISO and AF performance could be better. But it's really good as it stands and Canon is smart for milking it as long as they can.

But heck. I know full-time professionals who are still using their 1D MKII N cameras and supporting their families very well with them.  Same with the 1Ds MKIII.  So yeah, Canon knows people will wait for something that's going to be significantly better than what they have.
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ahsanford

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Information [CR2]
« Reply #21 on: August 03, 2013, 02:01:56 PM »
  Hopefully the body will be the same size as the current 7D or larger to fit us with larger hands.  Other wants in the new 7DII would be Magnesium body, Fully weather sealed, 100% view finder, On board Flash controller, built in Introvalometer, a rear facing sensor for wire less remote, 24 megapixels and a flip out screen.  All this and keeping the same features of the current 7D would be a nice camera.  As far as Wi-Fi, I could care less about that.


None of these are worth upgrading over the current 7D, especially since the IQ appears to be the same with their latest sensor in the 70D.

Disagree.  That's like saying you only buy a new lens if it's sharper than the old lens.  There's so much more to life than IQ.  Consider:

  • A great AF system will net you more keepers.
  • Faster burst will net you more keepers.
  • Better high ISO performance will help you net previously uncapturable shots, or in situations where the light is only bad (and not terrible), you can actually use higher ISO to get a slightly quicker shutter or larger DOF.
  • Better build and weathersealing will help the camera last longer.

If you are not pushing the limits of your gear -- if you only shoot stills in good light -- then you are right.  Buy a Rebel or XXD and an F/4 zoom or F/5.6 supertele and snap away.  Your pictures will be fantastic and you didn't spend a fortune to do it.  That's a win.

But if you live in a difficult shooting environs -- low light, sports, wildlife, handheld, etc. -- there are other considerations than IQ.  It's the overall value of the camera that drives it's worth, and the above four points will absolutely move units in the marketplace.

- A

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Information [CR2]
« Reply #21 on: August 03, 2013, 02:01:56 PM »

Dylan777

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Information [CR2]
« Reply #22 on: August 03, 2013, 02:04:20 PM »
My 2cents for 7D II:
1. 51 - 61pts AF system, 10fps, solid body built, wifi,

2. NO NEW SENSOR. Don't expect huge improvement in high ISO - half stop better than current crop models.
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DzPhotography

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Information [CR2]
« Reply #23 on: August 03, 2013, 02:27:56 PM »
My 2cents for 7D II:
1. 51 - 61pts AF system, 10fps, solid body built, wifi,

2. NO NEW SENSOR. Don't expect huge improvement in high ISO - half stop better than current crop models.
second that
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crazyrunner33

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Information [CR2]
« Reply #24 on: August 03, 2013, 02:33:27 PM »
DSLR development appears to be reaching a plateau, and sales seem to be reflecting this. The 70D is basically a consumerized version of the 7D, similar to how the 6D was a consumerized version of the 5D2. I don’t really think there is as much room for a 7D2, as the 70D is probably good enough to basically replace it. The image quality of the 6D/5D3, and the AF advantages of the 5D3 probably have also sliced off a significant share of potential buyers. There is likely a bean counter somewhere that has figured they would be better selling more 70Ds, 6Ds, and 5D3s than having to produce and market another camera in the current economic climate. By next year these cameras will all be mid-cycle when they can re-evaluate the marketplace and put out a 7D2 to goose sales if it makes sense.
Agree, but speaking as someone who made the mistake of getting a 60D instead of the 7D and now realizing its limitations (AFMA, better focus points, etc) - I will be boycotting these marginal upgrades and hoping others will too, in favor of true market "re-evaluation." I can see the lure of improved videography with the 70D, but there's a notable absence of high end photography features to make me drop more "camera cash."

Canon fooled me once with the 60D and am waiting for the next true sports camera, rather than settling for another marginal 60D upgrade. Lets see a novel APS-C camera with 20+MP, an AF point system on par with the 1D, good iso, and I'd be first in line to buy! That'd be an awesome 7DmkII.

Unfortunately the 70D isn't appealing to professional videographers, even as a B cam.  It still line skips and creates terrible moire, aliasing and nasty artifacts.  The cameras also use crippling codecs that are terrible to work with and destroy the IQ. 

It appears that Canon has not fixed any of the much needed issues for videographers and have not given the photographers a worthy upgrade.  At this point I would only buy a Canon camera that would work well with Magic Lantern; they seem like their providing more ground breaking features at a faster pace when compared to Canon.

insanitybeard

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Information [CR2]
« Reply #25 on: August 03, 2013, 03:07:56 PM »
Realising this is a rumour, so with that in mind....

IF it was to have the same sensor as the 70D, which by some accounts will have little improvement at RAW level compared to the current 7D etc, I figure I may as well put my money towards a full frame body upgrade, which of course, may all be part of Canon's grand plan......
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neuroanatomist

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Information [CR2]
« Reply #26 on: August 03, 2013, 03:18:37 PM »
Realising this is a rumour, so with that in mind....

IF it was to have the same sensor as the 70D, which by some accounts will have little improvement at RAW level compared to the current 7D etc, I figure I may as well put my money towards a full frame body upgrade, which of course, may all be part of Canon's grand plan......

I believe that is exactly Canon's plan.  Or course, then your EF-S lenses won't work and will need to be replaced, and your longest lens will no longer be long enough.  I wonder if Canon has thought of that, too?  ::)
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ahsanford

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Information [CR2]
« Reply #27 on: August 03, 2013, 03:20:51 PM »
Realising this is a rumour, so with that in mind....

IF it was to have the same sensor as the 70D, which by some accounts will have little improvement at RAW level compared to the current 7D etc, I figure I may as well put my money towards a full frame body upgrade, which of course, may all be part of Canon's grand plan......

I'm not even a crop shooter and I still think the 7D2 could be dynamite if they 'pro' it up on build, framerate, AF, etc.   If you own $10k+ of longer glass, I still think a built-for-war, high FPS, stellar focusing APS-C rig could sell for $2500 and be successful.

- A

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Information [CR2]
« Reply #27 on: August 03, 2013, 03:20:51 PM »

lopicma

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Information [CR2]
« Reply #28 on: August 03, 2013, 03:24:58 PM »
I like the GPS spec.  There are too many Wi-Fi alternatives available for me to "need" it built into the camera.  GPS, on the other hand, is an expensive camera add-on.  Having it built into the camera seems to be more wallet friendly.

I am guessing it [GPS] can't be shoe horned into an SD card, otherwise Eye-Fi and others would have it available.

Speaking of which, I am trying out the app GPS4CAM until my dream of a GPS in every camera comes true.
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RLPhoto

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Information [CR2]
« Reply #29 on: August 03, 2013, 03:37:38 PM »
If it still has 10fps and 61 Pt AF, It will still sell like hotcakes...
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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Information [CR2]
« Reply #29 on: August 03, 2013, 03:37:38 PM »