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Canon Rumors General => Site Information => Topic started by: unfocused on February 02, 2013, 10:56:37 PM

Title: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: unfocused on February 02, 2013, 10:56:37 PM
Okay, I see the "purple-faced guy" thread has been deleted.

Honestly, once again this is an example of the moderators having much too thin of skin on this forum. Understand I appreciate the work that moderators do, but this has been an ongoing problem. Threads and comments are allowed to go on for pages and pages and then suddenly, someone decides they don't like the way it ends up, so it gets deleted.

For the record, the OP was an idiot, we all know that. He was taking some sort of perverse jollies out of playing a trolling game that only made him look like a fool. And, yes, his final post should have been deleted for his racist language (that is a legitimate reason to delete any post, although it seems to get applied arbitrarily at times).

But, we are all big boys and girls and we participate in these threads willingly. After two days of discussion, it's kind of silly and, frankly, plays right into the hand of the OP when the entire thread is deleted.

I'm sure I will get attacked for saying this, but I have been participating in this forum for years and I've found this to be annoying and counterproductive. The problem is that it can never be applied uniformly or fairly. Some frequent posters are allowed great latitude to be sarcastic and insulting at times, but others are not.

Just my opinion.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Rienzphotoz on February 02, 2013, 11:22:17 PM
Okay, I see the "purple-faced guy" thread has been deleted.

Honestly, once again this is an example of the moderators having much too thin of skin on this forum. Understand I appreciate the work that moderators do, but this has been an ongoing problem. Threads and comments are allowed to go on for pages and pages and then suddenly, someone decides they don't like the way it ends up, so it gets deleted.

For the record, the OP was an idiot, we all know that. He was taking some sort of perverse jollies out of playing a trolling game that only made him look like a fool. And, yes, his final post should have been deleted for his racist language (that is a legitimate reason to delete any post, although it seems to get applied arbitrarily at times).

But, we are all big boys and girls and we participate in these threads willingly. After two days of discussion, it's kind of silly and, frankly, plays right into the hand of the OP when the entire thread is deleted.

I'm sure I will get attacked for saying this, but I have been participating in this forum for years and I've found this to be annoying and counterproductive. The problem is that it can never be applied uniformly or fairly. Some frequent posters are allowed great latitude to be sarcastic and insulting at times, but others are not.

Just my opinion.
+1
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Sunnystate on February 02, 2013, 11:23:54 PM
Could not agree more, the karma thingy was removed as well due to thin skin of some.
We all should just start wearing uniforms with Canon logo on it, and act properly.
I have pretty good idea who is so sensitive up there, but hey we all live pretty much in the "new" brave world already.
Anyway, I have been seriously warned already in the past so this may be my last post.
Cheers.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: jdramirez on February 02, 2013, 11:54:21 PM
I participated in that thread... and now I feel like I missed the end of the movie because I drank a 64 ounce soda and had to go and tinkle.  Anyone want to clue me in on the end of the movie?  I presume we can't repost it... but I think an IM would suffice. 

Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Don Haines on February 03, 2013, 12:07:38 AM
It ended with the racist rant. Most countries have laws about that.... to allow it to remain, particularly after the moderator was made aware, is to invite legal action against CanonRumors.

The moderator is not just within his rights to remove the post, he is required by law. Kudos moderator.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: RS2021 on February 03, 2013, 12:09:47 AM
It ended with the racist rant. Most countries have laws about that.... to allow it to remain, particularly after the moderator was made aware, is to invite legal action against CanonRumors.

The moderator is not just within his rights to remove the post, he is required by law. Kudos moderator.

+1 to that!
Keep up the good work moderators! That thread needed to go!
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: sanj on February 03, 2013, 12:10:24 AM
I totally agree here.

Moderators: Grow up please!!!
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Eli on February 03, 2013, 12:21:33 AM
I'm surprised it didn't get removed earlier.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: RS2021 on February 03, 2013, 12:22:07 AM

Moderators: Grow up please!!!

Totally Disagree...they don't have to grow up. They are in fact behaving AS grown ups in removing the posts.

Just because you have a thick skin doesn't mean others should be forced to endure racist rants...

What is acceptable is determined by those who feel offended...not by those who dish it out or stand on the sidelines and snigger or support such posts under whatever guise.

History is replete with bullies and racist- and sexist-intimidators who suggest "grow up please, it is just a joke".

Recognize hate when you see it. Call out people by name when you see it. It is the only way to stop hate from being pawned off as being a joke!

Hate doesn't require "growing up" ...it requires stamping out!
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: tomusan on February 03, 2013, 12:32:57 AM
Well, I still think an Eos-5D MarkIII would have been the better choice..................
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Don Haines on February 03, 2013, 12:33:09 AM
Rules for posting on the internet......

Imagine you are standing in the middle of an intersection and you are about to shout something out to the world.... On one corner is your family.... spouse, children, parents, etc... On the second corner there is a group of policemen, judges, and lawyers.... On the third corner are your friends and aquaintences.... On the fourth corner is your boss and co-workers.... and behind you is the criminal element and in front an assortment of religious leaders.... If it's still a good idea to shout whatever it is out, then it is safe to be posted on the internet.

that post failed on so many levels......
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: jdramirez on February 03, 2013, 12:52:42 AM
Who (what group) was he racist towards?  I presume many of us are without race simply because we have cameras as our avatar... and just because you last name (like mine) ends in a Z doesn't really mean anything.  It's weird. 
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: BrandonKing96 on February 03, 2013, 01:44:48 AM
Well his problem was resolved anyway as he did end up getting the 1Dx (well claimed to), so there really was no reason of keeping the thread up.  Oh and after being on a forum board for many years of my teenage life, moderators tend to dislike when there's a post that is directly aimed at them and is insulting to some degree.

But oh well what business is his should just stay his business.  There was no need to publicise it at all.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: agierke on February 03, 2013, 01:47:13 AM
that was a horribly useless thread and if it ended the way that was described then should have been deleted. the OP should get a very stern warning if not a ban.

take that garbage to another forum. its not appropriate to a gear forum such as this.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: wayno on February 03, 2013, 01:59:20 AM
Well, I still think an Eos-5D MarkIII would have been the better choice..................
+1
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: rpt on February 03, 2013, 03:01:40 AM
Well, I still think an Eos-5D MarkIII would have been the better choice..................

ROTFL
HA! HA! HA!
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: rpt on February 03, 2013, 03:09:19 AM

Moderators: Grow up please!!!

Totally Disagree...they don't have to grow up. They are in fact behaving AS grown ups in removing the posts.

Just because you have a thick skin doesn't mean others should be forced to endure racist rants...

What is acceptable is determined by those who feel offended...not by those who dish it out or stand on the sidelines and snigger or support such posts under whatever guise.

History is replete with bullies and racist- and sexist-intimidators who suggest "grow up please, it is just a joke".

Recognize hate when you see it. Call out people by name when you see it. It is the only way to stop hate from being pawned off as being a joke!

Hate doesn't require "growing up" ...it requires stamping out!
+10 ^ 10 ^ 10 ^ 10 ^ 10...

I think all those in favor of not deleting that thread should consider if say 49% of the threads on this site were like that, would you be visiting the site? Would you tolerate such rants in your own house? I think not. Freedom of speech comes with responsibility. Responsibility was not demonstrated by the OP of that thread. My opinion is that thread should have been killed earlier.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Marsu42 on February 03, 2013, 03:30:37 AM
I'd like to comment that I read the purple thread but didn't write anything because the op really seemed disturbed (though of course I cannot tell from just reading some outbursts). But towards the end it got more calmed down and had an interesting topic - how important is camera gear in comparison to other real world issues?

I found some thoughts on this valuable, esp. since I recently spend the money originally reserved for top 5d3+24-70ii gear for other, but more important real world purposes, so I'll end up with a 6d+24-70vc ... but I'm happy with my decision.

Could not agree more, the karma thingy was removed as well due to thin skin of some.

As far as I remember karma was removed because there was some abuse and, imho more importantly, it just didn't work - people confused "agree/disagree" to a particular post with an overall rating of a poster, so being critical esp. towards Canon products drove your karma into the ground which I find unfortunate for matter of fact discussions.

It ended with the racist rant. Most countries have laws about that.... to allow it to remain, particularly after the moderator was made aware, is to invite legal action against CanonRumors.

Well, I didn't read the post, but there's always freedom of speech that has to be weighted against opinions (idiotic as they may be), to remove a racist post is probably more good taste and common political sense then preventing a lawsuit.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: J.R. on February 03, 2013, 03:34:50 AM

Moderators: Grow up please!!!

Totally Disagree...they don't have to grow up. They are in fact behaving AS grown ups in removing the posts.

Just because you have a thick skin doesn't mean others should be forced to endure racist rants...

What is acceptable is determined by those who feel offended...not by those who dish it out or stand on the sidelines and snigger or support such posts under whatever guise.

History is replete with bullies and racist- and sexist-intimidators who suggest "grow up please, it is just a joke".

Recognize hate when you see it. Call out people by name when you see it. It is the only way to stop hate from being pawned off as being a joke!

Hate doesn't require "growing up" ...it requires stamping out!

+1 ... Exactly what I feel
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: J.R. on February 03, 2013, 03:40:50 AM
http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?topic=1442.0 (http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?topic=1442.0)

See rule 5 -

"5.  Politics - This is a subject that many have strong feelings about, and is sure to start a flame war.  Political threads disguised a photography discussion will be removed."
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: 35mm Film on February 03, 2013, 03:51:50 AM
On the topic of ethical behaviour my Philosophy Tutor at University said if you have to think about what you are about to communicate, then ask yourself would I direct it to people I love and respect.

What I have found with photography in this day and age is that digital photography is easily accessible to people who have massive egos and very little skill. The same people don’t understand that photography is about people and if you’re not taking pics of people your sharing your images with people. No offence intended.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Rat on February 03, 2013, 09:00:30 AM
if say 49% of the threads on this site were like that, would you be visiting the site?
This. I visited that thread several times to see if some redeeming information had shown up or if someone with more than half a brain had put some sense into the OP - being disappointed each time. Not a big surprise, since the whole thread was based on lies.

Thankfully, I missed the racist rant but in general: I visit this forum to become a better photographer - not to be subjected to the "the internet is a big free-for-all, get lost if you don't like me" movement. And that is not even considering that such behaviour is not just brutally offensive, but also inherently contradictory.

Anyhoo - moderators, thank you. I too had expected this to happen earlier, but it sure is the right course of action.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: sanj on February 03, 2013, 10:21:18 AM
I missed the racist post that everyone is talking about so do not know how bad it was.

But the rest seemed fine for a forum to me. If we cant take simple discussion like that then we would have tough time discussing concepts or results with clients. :)

I kind of believe in free speech.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Rat on February 03, 2013, 10:32:16 AM
I kind of believe in free speech.
I think everybody here does that, but all freedoms can be abused. Read e.g. "The boy who cried wolf".
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Marsu42 on February 03, 2013, 10:36:00 AM
I kind of believe in free speech.

Me too, but since CR & other channels are run by private individuals or enterprises with a business interest you are free to speak up to your pets and family in the comfort of your own home or write a sign and stand next to the freeway :->

Having said that, I never saw anything removed on CR that I'd consider to be censorship or over the top, and narrowing down the theme to photography does make sense. My only potential issue is the exclusion of politics, since it's very fuzzy what is political and what not, but I think the mods have good common sense here and mostly remove dumb party politics or comments on international warfare (declared or undeclared).
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: wellfedCanuck on February 03, 2013, 10:42:49 AM
Well, if it's turning into a poll- although I believe in free speech- I support the moderators on this one. I've run internet forums, Compuserve forums and even a fidonet BBS back in the early '90s. The value of the entire place diminishes greatly when a free-for-all erupts. People get crazy behind the anonymity of a keyboard and as much as we like to think we're all adults- the conversation often needs to be nudged back in proper directions.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: FatDaddyJones on February 03, 2013, 11:07:41 AM
I support free speech. I also support the right to kick someone out of my house that I don't like, or tell somebody to shut up if I don't like what they're saying, if they're in my home. The same should go for websites. Moderators have the right to moderate on a site, for whatever reason. It's their website, not yours. They have the right to allow or disallow any information they want. Someone said that moderators are required by law to remove posts. No they're not. Maybe in Iran or North Korea. Not in the free world.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: CR Backup Admin on February 03, 2013, 11:57:19 AM
We remove very few threads, however, this is not a free for all.  In this case, We had a little more info than was apparent to many readers.  It was not about the many worthwhile posts, but the OP, and when he went, so did his posts and threads he started. 

Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: RS2021 on February 03, 2013, 12:00:49 PM
I visit this forum to become a better photographer - not to be subjected to the "the internet is a big free-for-all, get lost if you don't like me" movement. And that is not even considering that such behaviour is not just brutally offensive, but also inherently contradictory.

+1   Amen!
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: sanj on February 03, 2013, 12:04:18 PM
We remove very few threads, however, this is not a free for all.  In this case, We had a little more info than was apparent to many readers.  It was not about the many worthwhile posts, but the OP, and when he went, so did his posts and threads he started.

You must have your reasons and I respect them.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: distant.star on February 03, 2013, 12:06:15 PM
.
Good exercise of free speech, Mark. Responsible, reasonable statement of opinion. No surprise that I agree with you mostly since we both have journalism backgrounds.

First, I have to acknowledge what I see as improvement in overall moderating. Of course, it's a thankless job and a lot of people contribute a lot of work to keep good order here. Overall, I've never seen a better or more useful forum. A year ago I would have described the "moderator" as someone who thought this should be a sort of proper English gentleman's club (no offense intended to English or gentleman's clubs). "Damn Yankee" would probably pass muster then, but certainly not "damn Canon." It seems not to be that touchy now, and thankfully a bit more realistic in what is a rough-and-tumble world. My only real niggling complaint is there seems to exist a small clique of somehow privileged members who think a bit more of themselves than warranted while acting like the mass of posters are common rabble. But, that's my perhaps irrational perspective. Who knows!

What I've accepted is this place is kind of like a bar, let's say Cheers (although they don't know most of our names!). Let's call our bar the Lens Half Full. The people who run the bar want to make a few bucks while providing a place for people to interact with good order. There is a bouncer, and the bartender/owner keeps a shotgun behind the bar, just in case. We can stop in after work, talk about photo stuff, share some experiences, tell some stories, maybe learn how other people get along in the world of picture making -- and go home better folks for it. See you same time tomorrow at Lens Half Full.

Some folks may not understand what "good order" means. Sometimes a bouncer oversteps a bit. _hit, as they say, happens. Life is not perfect. We learn. We go on.

The comedian Ron White tells a wonderful story of being arrested in New York for being "drunk in public." Basically, he went into a bar wearing a hat. The bouncer told him to take it off as they did not allow hats. Ridiculous rule, but it's their bar. You want to be there you take your hat off. Ron puts his hat back on, and they throw him out.

Official Ron White - I Got Thrown Out of a Bar (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=neUaSTSKFZc#ws)

Anyway, yesterday's purple thread was remarkable, to me, only in that so many people fed into his nonsense. It doesn't take long to spot an attention whore. When you do, you ignore him. That guy was not looking for advice, help or anything else useful. He wanted nothing but for people to pay attention to him. When you walk down a city street and see a guy who hasn't bathed in weeks wearing a torn, dirty shirt and waving his arms in the air warning that Napoleon has returned to get him, you ignore him. If necessary, you turn around and walk the other way. You do not engage him in a conversation about the Napoleonic Wars or the island of Saint Helena. (No offense meant to France or the French people. Vive la France!)

One of the things I most enjoy about free speech is that people have absolute freedom to embarrass themselves, show how dumb they are, whatever. We listeners have an equal right to make a judgement about whatever they say. The real crux of wisdom is how we react to what is said.

Yesterday we had a thread worth ignoring. Today, we have one worth participating in.

Thanks, Mark.

Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: sanj on February 03, 2013, 12:11:05 PM
I support free speech. I also support the right to kick someone out of my house that I don't like, or tell somebody to shut up if I don't like what they're saying, if they're in my home. The same should go for websites. Moderators have the right to moderate on a site, for whatever reason. It's their website, not yours. They have the right to allow or disallow any information they want. Someone said that moderators are required by law to remove posts. No they're not. Maybe in Iran or North Korea. Not in the free world.

I agree you have the right to kick someone offensive from your house.
I agree that it is their website and not mine.

I do NOT agree with "allow or disallow ANY information..."

I feel that when a website starts a forum, it needs to allow people to express themselves in any way they like as long as it is not offensive. A forum in fact is inviting people to participate, or else it would not exist. 'Offensive' can be subjective and the judge of that needs to be the moderators.

I felt (not having read the racist remark) that the rest was not offensive.

I mean we are not school kids. Really! We are working professionals who have to deal with lots worse during the course of our regular day.

Anyway no big deal and this is just my opinion. :)
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: rpt on February 03, 2013, 12:17:40 PM

Yesterday we had a thread worth ignoring. Today, we have one worth participating in.
Brilliant! Lovely message.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: rpt on February 03, 2013, 12:33:18 PM
Let's call our bar the Lens Half Full.
Whatcha talking about Willis? Are you referring to half the photons? ;)

:) Sorry, could not help myself...
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Don Haines on February 03, 2013, 12:33:54 PM

It ended with the racist rant. Most countries have laws about that.... to allow it to remain, particularly after the moderator was made aware, is to invite legal action against CanonRumors.

Well, I didn't read the post, but there's always freedom of speech that has to be weighted against opinions (idiotic as they may be), to remove a racist post is probably more good taste and common political sense then preventing a lawsuit.

Most western countries, with the exception of the USA, have enacted hate crime legislation, legislation which also covers "hate speach". Here in Canada, it also applies to internet activity and those running a website can be liable for what others post on it. Obviously, other countries differ to various degrees.... and this is an international forum and things get nebulous...

The OP spewed a line of disgracefull behaviour and ended it by making derogatory comments towards certain ethnic groups while calling all the members of this form fools and idiots.... so the moderator pulled the plug... actions have consequences....HA HA HA LOOK AT ME I CAN DO WHATEVER I WANT AND INSULT YOU....hey..where did everyone go? how come I can't log in any more? Why doesn't anyone want to play with me?
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: FatDaddyJones on February 03, 2013, 12:40:33 PM
I support free speech. I also support the right to kick someone out of my house that I don't like, or tell somebody to shut up if I don't like what they're saying, if they're in my home. The same should go for websites. Moderators have the right to moderate on a site, for whatever reason. It's their website, not yours. They have the right to allow or disallow any information they want. Someone said that moderators are required by law to remove posts. No they're not. Maybe in Iran or North Korea. Not in the free world.

I agree you have the right to kick someone offensive from your house.
I agree that it is their website and not mine.

I do NOT agree with "allow or disallow ANY information..."

I feel that when a website starts a forum, it needs to allow people to express themselves in any way they like as long as it is not offensive. A forum in fact is inviting people to participate, or else it would not exist. 'Offensive' can be subjective and the judge of that needs to be the moderators.

I felt (not having read the racist remark) that the rest was not offensive.

I mean we are not school kids. Really! We are working professionals who have to deal with lots worse during the course of our regular day.

Anyway no big deal and this is just my opinion. :)

The point was that it should be left up to the discretion of the site moderators as to what is allowed and not allowed - which is exactly the way it is, and the way it should be. I never read this "purple" thread at all.  The problem with total free speech with no rules or moderation on the internet is #1 Spam, #2 Trolls, #3 offensive speech that drives away traffic from your website. There has to be rules and enforcement of them, otherwise you get a bunch of foul language, arguments, and Vi@gra advertisements.

We remove very few threads, however, this is not a free for all.  In this case, We had a little more info than was apparent to many readers.  It was not about the many worthwhile posts, but the OP, and when he went, so did his posts and threads he started. 

Obviously, the OP was banned, and not just that particular thread removed.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Larry on February 03, 2013, 12:40:58 PM
  It was not about the many worthwhile posts, but the OP, and when he went, so did his posts and threads he started.

 ???

Can you please explain the reasoning behind this aspect of "removal"?

If there existed " ...many worthwhile posts",  why deprive future readers of that "worth" simply because their provider is to be exiled?

Are those posts suddenly worth-less to forum readers when the author's behavior is considered flawed, ...or is this seen as some sort of punishment? If so, who is really being punished, author or readers?
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Larry on February 03, 2013, 12:51:07 PM
  It was not about the many worthwhile posts, but the OP, and when he went, so did his posts and threads he started.

 ???


If there existed " ...many worthwhile posts",  why deprive future readers of that "worth" simply because their provider is to be exiled?

Are those posts suddenly worth-less to forum readers when the author's behavior is considered flawed, ...or is this seen as some sort of punishment? If so, who is really being punished, author or readers?

Example to illustrate previous post:

Pythagorus contributes a "theorem" in a post to a mathematics forum.

The thread follows with much discussion of the terrific potential uses for the theorem to engineering, etc.

Pythagorus gets drunk, and makes an insulting fool of himself in a subsequent post.

The baby (thread) is thrown out with the bathwater (drunken offender).

Who is the loser? ::)
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: CR Backup Admin on February 03, 2013, 12:52:23 PM
  It was not about the many worthwhile posts, but the OP, and when he went, so did his posts and threads he started.

 ???

Can you please explain the reasoning behind this aspect of "removal"?

If there existed " ...many worthwhile posts",  why deprive future readers of that "worth" simply because their provider is to be exiled?

Are those posts suddenly worth-less to forum readers when the author's behavior is considered flawed, ...or is this seen as some sort of punishment? If so, who is really being punished, author or readers?
Its the way the forum software works, remove the first post (OP) and the rest of the thread goes away.  If he was not the OP, only his posts would go away. Thats the way SMF and most forum software works.  You do not have a thread if there is no original post, and when the OP is gone, so are threads he started.  His posts could remain intact, but we did not want to keep them.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: rpt on February 03, 2013, 12:53:09 PM
  It was not about the many worthwhile posts, but the OP, and when he went, so did his posts and threads he started.

 ???


If there existed " ...many worthwhile posts",  why deprive future readers of that "worth" simply because their provider is to be exiled?

Are those posts suddenly worth-less to forum readers when the author's behavior is considered flawed, ...or is this seen as some sort of punishment? If so, who is really being punished, author or readers?

Example to illustrate previous post:

Pythagorus contributes a "theorem" in a post to a mathematics forum.

The thread follows with much discussion of the terrific potential uses for the theorem to engineering, etc.

Pythagorus gets drunk, and makes an insulting fool of himself in a subsequent post.

The thread (baby) is thrown out with the bathwater (drunken offender).

Who is the loser? ::)
That post had NO "theorem"!
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: FatDaddyJones on February 03, 2013, 12:54:09 PM
Most forum software deletes all posts and threads that were made by a banned member. Other posts in the same thread are "collateral damage." It's too much work to remove them all manually, and the threads usually wouldn't make sense anyway with some of the posts being removed. 
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: sanj on February 03, 2013, 12:56:53 PM
"The point was that it should be left up to the discretion of the site moderators as to what is allowed and not allowed"

I do not like the sound of that. Nope. As then it is not evenly fair. Please read MANY more fights on this forum which have not been deleted as the moderators did not find them wrong.

"There has to be rules". I like that. Then it is even for all...

In any case he is not my friend nor was the post important. Am out of here...

Peace!
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Larry on February 03, 2013, 12:57:49 PM

That post had NO "theorem"!

My question was not about the offending post, but rather about previous threads which, according to the moderator were "worthwhile".

To Moderator - Thanks for the quick response.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: FatDaddyJones on February 03, 2013, 01:08:25 PM
"The point was that it should be left up to the discretion of the site moderators as to what is allowed and not allowed"

I do not like the sound of that. Nope. As then it is not evenly fair. Please read MANY more fights on this forum which have not been deleted as the moderators did not find them wrong.

"There has to be rules". I like that. Then it is even for all...

In any case he is not my friend nor was the post important. Am out of here...

Peace!


I never said it was fair. But someone has to make the decisions, even if it is subjective. In this case, he broke the rules that were posted for this forum, so this wasn't just a subjective judgment.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Patrick on February 03, 2013, 01:28:15 PM
Almost sorry that I missed that thread!
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: And-Rew on February 03, 2013, 02:07:26 PM
I thought the only thing that upset Americans was gun control!  :o

Seriously though, as daft as the post was, it provided a talking point over values and morals etc. I didn't see the racist comment - but sadly, i have to agree that such comments have to be deleted and the Member banned.

Disagreeing with some one is one thing, even sarcasm is tolerable, but offensive hatred in any form is just not acceptable. There always has to be a line - and once crossed - should not be surprised to see action taken to remedy the infringement.

For those demanding Free Speech - remember that free speech carries with it the duty of respect. If you can't treat people with respect, you forego the right to free speech >:(
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Faxon on February 03, 2013, 03:08:21 PM
I am in favor of the moderators rejecting posts that do not relate to Canon cameras or photography.  The deleted thread seemed to be only about the family problems of the poster, and made me feel quite uncomfortable seeing it here.  If my son dropped my lens or something, I might post asking about repair or selling for salvage, perhaps, but I certainly would not use this space to recreate my angry response to the accident. I really enjoy this forum, almost as much as I enjoy thumbing through Shutterbuy or Pop Photo.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Click on February 03, 2013, 03:16:22 PM
Well, I still think an Eos-5D MarkIII would have been the better choice..................

+1

ROFL  ;D
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Marsu42 on February 03, 2013, 04:56:04 PM
Most western countries, with the exception of the USA, have enacted hate crime legislation, legislation which also covers "hate speach". Here in Canada, it also applies to internet activity and those running a website can be liable for what others post on it. Obviously, other countries differ to various degrees.... and this is an international forum and things get nebulous...

Indeed, and while I I guess US law would apply to CR I can only comment on Germany: Over here it's pretty easy to get sued for "Volksverhetzung" when posting nationalsocialist propaganda and emblembs, but other than that most recent trials ended up supporting the freedom of speech, again idiotic as the content may have been.

Completely separate from this fact is that most forum admins rather delete when in doubt than pay a ~€1000 fee just for freelance lawyers threatening to sue them, even if the trial most likely would end in the forum owner's favor. But there is a law in the making limiting these lawyer's fees, so there's hope that the balance will be restored.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Area256 on February 03, 2013, 06:23:25 PM
Rules for posting on the internet......

Imagine you are standing in the middle of an intersection and you are about to shout something out to the world.... On one corner is your family.... spouse, children, parents, etc... On the second corner there is a group of policemen, judges, and lawyers.... On the third corner are your friends and aquaintences.... On the fourth corner is your boss and co-workers.... and behind you is the criminal element and in front an assortment of religious leaders.... If it's still a good idea to shout whatever it is out, then it is safe to be posted on the internet.

that post failed on so many levels......

+1

I am in favor of the moderators rejecting posts that do not relate to Canon cameras or photography.  The deleted thread seemed to be only about the family problems of the poster, and made me feel quite uncomfortable seeing it here.  If my son dropped my lens or something, I might post asking about repair or selling for salvage, perhaps, but I certainly would not use this space to recreate my angry response to the accident. I really enjoy this forum, almost as much as I enjoy thumbing through Shutterbuy or Pop Photo.

+1

Personally I'm also glad that thread was deleted.  These forums should be about photography and our random gear talk - mature (and sometimes passionate, but polite) debates about lenses, cameras, photography techniques, company polices, best stores to buy from, ect. are what belongs here.  No need to have the forums polluted with trolling posts, clearly intended to offend or provoke.  It doesn't make for a welcoming place to talk about our collective hobby or profession.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: serendipidy on February 03, 2013, 06:23:42 PM
I read every post on that thread and even replied several times trying to help the obviously seriously disturbed OP (I made the comment about sending his wife roses). At the end, he finally admitted (as many of us suspected) to being a troll whose only purpose posting was to amuse himself by seeing how much he could make fools of anyone on this forum and to get even for an earlier perceived slight to a previous post.

His OP had almost nothing to do about photography but was about a personal and family situation. Most of the replies also were really not about photography. Like rpt said...no theorems here. I like this forum due to it's congenial tone and helpful knowledgeable members who teach and share their knowledge. His last post was full of obscenities (spelled out with initials) attacking a person of "middle eastern" origin who sold his wife the camera.

I wish to thank the CR moderator/s for removing this trash. I wish it had been done earlier but I think they tried to give the OP every benefit of a doubt and his final post showed his true colors. Allow too much of this type of rubbish to pile up here and I think a lot of posters will go elsewhere.
If that's what a person wants, they could look for a forum called "I'm a jerk troll who likes to cause as much acrimonious fighting and trouble as I can".
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: distant.star on February 03, 2013, 08:06:21 PM
If that's what a person wants, they could look for a forum called "I'm a jerk troll who likes to cause as much acrimonious fighting and trouble as I can".

I tried that forum for a while -- didn't really care for it.
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Mt Spokane Photography on February 03, 2013, 09:47:10 PM


Indeed, and while I guess US law would apply to CR
Nope, CR is in Canada.   Those who post are responsible for their own posts, but the moderators try to make it a plesant place to carry on reasonable conversations about photography.
They even let some of the US citizens like Neuro and myself post here.  My son was born in Toronto and has a Canadian father, so I guess that makes me part Canadian - eh :)
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: neuroanatomist on February 03, 2013, 09:58:24 PM


Indeed, and while I guess US law would apply to CR
Nope, CR is in Canada.   Those who post are responsible for their own posts, but the moderators try to make it a plesant place to carry on reasonable conversations about photography.
They even let some of the US citizens like Neuro and myself post here.  My son was born in Toronto and has a Canadian father, so I guess that makes me part Canadian - eh :)

...and my mom was born in Regina and is still a Canadian citizen with permanent resident status in the US.  Maybe we should start a conspiracy theory about a requirement for a 'Canadian connection'...   ;)
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: serendipidy on February 03, 2013, 10:04:45 PM
In college one summer, I worked for Canada Dry Bottling Co. Does that count? ;D
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: jp121 on February 03, 2013, 10:16:44 PM
I read the OP and couldn't really understand the whinge. I didn't read past the first page.

My first thought was WOW what a great wife & kid and what a fantastic family. Most people have lost count of how many useless/thoughtless presents they have received over the years. You have an amazing thoughtful family and you're complaining to the world! I wondered how they felt, after they put in so much effort, and spent so much money.

My second thought was it's not the camera but the person behind the camera. The camera (especially these 2 juggernauts: 5DM3 vs 1DX) is the least limiting factor to capturing great images.

I couldn't read anymore.

About this thread:

American "freedom of expression" is used to override the laws of defamation and put forth a message of hatred. We are not all American and don't have that legal freedom. As was previously mentioned, some of us do however have a legal obligation to quash acts/messages based on hatred.

However if people would take a moment to construct their messages. They would find that there are many ways convey the same sentiment and with the same gravity to get their point across (or float their boat).
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Mt Spokane Photography on February 03, 2013, 10:48:46 PM
In college one summer, I worked for Canada Dry Bottling Co. Does that count? ;D
Check out the history of the company, your citizenship will be really difficult to prove.  Canada Dry seems to have been passed around from Company to Company over the years.  You are as of now, a Texan. ;)
 
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Rienzphotoz on February 03, 2013, 11:32:58 PM
It is amusing to note that those who claim that this is a photogrpahy forum and that they come here to know/learn photography and that there is no room for this, that and the other are still replying/posting in this "supposedly useless" thread, when there is nothing of photographic value here or in any such similar threads ;D ... I mean if one thinks the egg is rotton from the first bite, does one have to eat the whole egg to make sure it really is rotton!
Ironically these "supposedly useless" threads somehow seem to go on and on, largely thanks to those who claim they do not like these kind of posts/threads.  ;D
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: AprilForever on February 04, 2013, 12:40:45 AM


Indeed, and while I guess US law would apply to CR
Nope, CR is in Canada.   Those who post are responsible for their own posts, but the moderators try to make it a plesant place to carry on reasonable conversations about photography.
They even let some of the US citizens like Neuro and myself post here.  My son was born in Toronto and has a Canadian father, so I guess that makes me part Canadian - eh :)

...and my mom was born in Regina and is still a Canadian citizen with permanent resident status in the US.  Maybe we should start a conspiracy theory about a requirement for a 'Canadian connection'...   ;)

I once dated a girl from Quebec... I suppose I count?
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: serendipidy on February 04, 2013, 01:37:41 AM


Indeed, and while I guess US law would apply to CR
Nope, CR is in Canada.   Those who post are responsible for their own posts, but the moderators try to make it a plesant place to carry on reasonable conversations about photography.
They even let some of the US citizens like Neuro and myself post here.  My son was born in Toronto and has a Canadian father, so I guess that makes me part Canadian - eh :)

...and my mom was born in Regina and is still a Canadian citizen with permanent resident status in the US.  Maybe we should start a conspiracy theory about a requirement for a 'Canadian connection'...   ;)

I once dated a girl from Quebec... I suppose I count?

Only if you kissed her ;D

@Rienzphotoz...no fair using logic :o

@Mt Spokane...Texas? I had no idea. :)
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: wellfedCanuck on February 04, 2013, 07:51:31 AM


Indeed, and while I guess US law would apply to CR
Nope, CR is in Canada.   Those who post are responsible for their own posts, but the moderators try to make it a plesant place to carry on reasonable conversations about photography.
They even let some of the US citizens like Neuro and myself post here.  My son was born in Toronto and has a Canadian father, so I guess that makes me part Canadian - eh :)

...and my mom was born in Regina and is still a Canadian citizen

I bought my first non-kit lens in Regina, so we're practically brothers...

Actually, since it was only a Canon EF 75-300mm f/4-5.6 I, I guess I'm more of a backwards 2nd cousin, twice-removed- but still!!
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: mbpics on February 05, 2013, 04:18:50 AM
Well, I still think an Eos-5D MarkIII would have been the better choice..................

ROTFL
HA! HA! HA!

If only he had seen this... http://www.lensrentals.com/buy/canon/canon-eos-1ds-mark-iii-serial-number-631078 (http://www.lensrentals.com/buy/canon/canon-eos-1ds-mark-iii-serial-number-631078)
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Mt Spokane Photography on February 05, 2013, 11:46:25 AM
It is amusing to note that those who claim that this is a photogrpahy forum and that they come here to know/learn photography and that there is no room for this, that and the other are still replying/posting in this "supposedly useless" thread, when there is nothing of photographic value here or in any such similar threads ;D ... I mean if one thinks the egg is rotton from the first bite, does one have to eat the whole egg to make sure it really is rotton!
Ironically these "supposedly useless" threads somehow seem to go on and on, largely thanks to those who claim they do not like these kind of posts/threads.  ;D

I see you are posting here too.  And, I agree with you, nothing of photographic value in this post.  Thats likely why the OP put it in Site information.  The site Information forum seems like a good place to discuss forum policies.  He seemed to be concerned that hate posts were being removed.
 
Title: Re: Moderators: You are Too Sensitive
Post by: Don Haines on February 05, 2013, 09:51:56 PM


Indeed, and while I guess US law would apply to CR
Nope, CR is in Canada.   Those who post are responsible for their own posts, but the moderators try to make it a plesant place to carry on reasonable conversations about photography.
They even let some of the US citizens like Neuro and myself post here.  My son was born in Toronto and has a Canadian father, so I guess that makes me part Canadian - eh :)

...and my mom was born in Regina and is still a Canadian citizen with permanent resident status in the US.  Maybe we should start a conspiracy theory about a requirement for a 'Canadian connection'...   ;)

I once dated a girl from Quebec... I suppose I count?
It's quite easy to get an honorary Canadian citizenship. All you have to do is:

End a sentence with eh? - Eh
Drink a beer while wathching a hockey game.
Know what a Timbit is....
Pronounce "Winnipeg" as "Winterpeg"
Think that melted curds and gravy on top of fries is a delicacy
Know that they are only two seasons.... winter and blackfly.

And for your viewing pleasure... http://www.onf.ca/film/blackfly (http://www.onf.ca/film/blackfly)   This is a film by the National Film Board that accurately depicts life in Canada between winters... eh... enjoy