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Rumors => EOS Bodies => Topic started by: Canon Rumors on June 27, 2013, 11:27:55 AM

Title: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: Canon Rumors on June 27, 2013, 11:27:55 AM

Canon EOS 70D

As expected the next DSLR from Canon will be the EOS 70D. No specs of the camera have leaked out yet, but the last we heard it would utilize the 18mp sensor currently in the Rebel SL1. The specs have leaked.


The camera will come kitted with either the EF-S 18-55 IS STM or the EF-S 18-135 IS STM. The battery grip will be called the BG-E14


cr


Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: tomscott on June 27, 2013, 11:41:28 AM
So no new sensor tech then  :-\
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: schmidtfilme on June 27, 2013, 11:42:10 AM
Not really revolutionary then. Wondering how long it takes for real new sensors.
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: RGF on June 27, 2013, 11:55:31 AM
Wonder how much more canon an get from the SL1 sensor.   The sensor is only 1 part of the camera, but it is a key (a d often limiting part of the light gathering system).  Will we see improvement in low light / high ISO ability?   Higher FPS? 

Could be canon's way to keep the 7d and 70d well separated inorder to charge more for the 7D
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: hmmm on June 27, 2013, 11:56:58 AM
Evidently they are sticking with the plan to roll out the new sensor with the 7D mkII.

The 70D will have the touchscreen stuff, of course.  What else? -- with the same old 18 mp I guess I really don't care...    Why wait so long to roll this out if it is the same-O same-O all over again?
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: killswitch on June 27, 2013, 12:00:43 PM
Meh!
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: Rocguy on June 27, 2013, 12:06:35 PM
So glad I didn't keep waiting and went for the 6D!  8)
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: preppyak on June 27, 2013, 12:08:56 PM
Wonder how much more canon an get from the SL1 sensor.   The sensor is only 1 part of the camera, but it is a key (a d often limiting part of the light gathering system).  Will we see improvement in low light / high ISO ability?   Higher FPS? 
The sensor graded out worse than every other APS-C Canon is currently selling at DxO. While it's just one measure, they are just focusing on the sensor itself, so, there better be some damn impressive processing ability in the camera to shine up that turd.
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: dunkers on June 27, 2013, 12:10:35 PM
Did the SL1 have the exact same 18mp sensor?
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: preppyak on June 27, 2013, 12:10:50 PM
The 70D will have the touchscreen stuff, of course.  What else? -- with the same old 18 mp I guess I really don't care...    Why wait so long to roll this out if it is the same-O same-O all over again?
Yeah, I'm honestly wondering what Canon is thinking sticking with the same sensor. I can get a 60D for <$600 right now, so, for a camera that will retail at nearly double that ($1099 or $1199 for the body), it'll need to have massively better build quality, frame rate, AF, etc for it to sell. And then the 7DII will have to be a whole step above that.

Not sure they're gonna have much luck with that strategy
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: preppyak on June 27, 2013, 12:13:58 PM
Did the SL1 have the exact same 18mp sensor?
Again, just going of DxOMark, it's got the same performance as the 50D, and is slightly worse than the 60D sensor.

(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-KcPGcxkdSYM/Ucxksrd5zaI/AAAAAAAAHyQ/ZcWziJN9nVM/s600/Untitled.png)
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: candyman on June 27, 2013, 12:18:04 PM
So glad I didn't keep waiting and went for the 6D!  8)


Good for you!  8) Even better for Canon. You still bought a Canon and even a more expensive camera ;)
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: dstppy on June 27, 2013, 12:18:23 PM
To those saying it's the same sensor, what are we considering a 'new sensor'?  I believe one of our in-house experts outlined the differences at one point (CR's search isn't the greatest).

Honestly, does the 70D really need to be anything other than a 7D with an articulating screen and DIGIC V to sell?

The only dire news I'm expecting is a less than modest price bump :/
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: Etienne on June 27, 2013, 12:20:01 PM
This rumor doesn't excite me. I'd like an APS-C for reach and second body, but I'm in no hurry. My next DSLR will have to have IQ at least on par, preferably better than, my 5DIII. So maybe the 7DII will deliver. I hope Canon takes the time to get it right.
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: preppyak on June 27, 2013, 12:24:44 PM
Honestly, does the 70D really need to be anything other than a 7D with an articulating screen and DIGIC V to sell?
Probably not, but, that requires them putting in 19pt AF and 8fps, plus build quality. Those are all pretty significant improvements over the current model.
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: noncho on June 27, 2013, 12:27:38 PM
So, I'm now gonna look for... 1D mkIIN and EOS M to replace my 60D.
I'll miss EF-s 60mm macro.
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: tgara on June 27, 2013, 12:33:07 PM
The sensor graded out worse than every other APS-C Canon is currently selling at DxO. While it's just one measure, they are just focusing on the sensor itself, so, there better be some damn impressive processing ability in the camera to shine up that turd.

Are the differences between the APS-C sensor test results at DXO statistically significant?  E.g., 21.8 bits on the SL1 vs. 22 bits on the 7D?  I'd say those differences matter little in real-world shooting.

Also, while the sensor itself may be older, the supporting software packages are not.  The Digic chip and other bits that process the images captured by the sensors have seen significant upgrades, which translate into better images with the same sensor.  For me, it's the image that counts at the end of the day, and I don't particularly care which component gets the job done to make the best image.
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: whothafunk on June 27, 2013, 12:42:34 PM
while the sensor itself may be older, the supporting software packages are not.  The Digic chip and other bits that process the images captured by the sensors have seen significant upgrades, which translate into better images with the same sensor
blah blah blah at the end, the picture will not be more "beautiful" compared to the old digic chips and old software. maybe a bit more detail in high ISO (a BIT), but that's it.
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: Mt Spokane Photography on June 27, 2013, 12:44:11 PM
The sensor in the SL-1 was packaged in a ultra compact configuration, and is really no better if as good as older 18mp sensors.
 
The only reason to use that sensor would be if the 60D were getting thinner, which does not make a lot of sense to me.  Of course, the new sensor package may be designed for Canon's robotic assembly process, in which case we will see all new sensors with a similar style package.
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: Sabaki on June 27, 2013, 12:58:29 PM
Guys, educate me here quickly.

Is the dynamic range superiority of the D800, exclusively down to the chipset or are there other factors too, like software for example.

I ask this because it seems the Magic Lantern developers are doing some incredible things with older cameras.
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: insanitybeard on June 27, 2013, 01:00:34 PM
My 7D continues to be available for service, and continues to take decent pictures. It will keep fulfilling that role until something comes along to justify the upgrade. Until that time, no sweat from me.
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: Sabaki on June 27, 2013, 01:08:36 PM
My 7D continues to be available for service, and continues to take decent pictures. It will keep fulfilling that role until something comes along to justify the upgrade. Until that time, no sweat from me.

Speaking of the 7D InsanityBeard, can you tell us if the version 2 software improved things like noise at higher ISOs, colour rendition or dynamic range at all?

Thank you
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: transpo1 on June 27, 2013, 01:11:06 PM
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<p><strong>Canon EOS 70D<br />

</strong><a href=\"http://www.canonrumors.com/2013/05/canon-eos-70d-coming-in-july-cr2/\" target=\"_blank\">As expected the next DSLR from Canon will be the EOS 70D</a>. No specs of the camera have leaked out yet, but the last we heard it would utilize the 18mp sensor currently in the Rebel SL1.</p>
<p>The camera will come kitted with either the EF-S 18-55 IS STM or the EF-S 18-135 IS STM. The battery grip will be called the BG-E14</p>
<p><strong><span style=\"color: #ff0000;\">c</span>r</strong></p>


Any idea when this and the potential new compacts announcements would be?
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: insanitybeard on June 27, 2013, 01:12:35 PM
My 7D continues to be available for service, and continues to take decent pictures. It will keep fulfilling that role until something comes along to justify the upgrade. Until that time, no sweat from me.

Speaking of the 7D InsanityBeard, can you tell us if the version 2 software improved things like noise at higher ISOs, colour rendition or dynamic range at all?

Thank you

I cannot answer this I'm afraid, having read some people's stories of the camera locking up or some AF issues (I think) after installing the version 2 firmware, I have not done it myself! The camera continues to operate with the firmware it came out of the box with. Perhaps somebody else can answer your question.....
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: chops411 on June 27, 2013, 01:16:47 PM
My 7D continues to be available for service, and continues to take decent pictures. It will keep fulfilling that role until something comes along to justify the upgrade. Until that time, no sweat from me.
same here
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: Chosenbydestiny on June 27, 2013, 01:33:34 PM
Well... This rumor does imply "utilize" so I'm hoping for the chance it's nowhere near the same as an SL1 sensor... But hopefully that also means they're focusing harder on upgrading the AF, something we've been waiting for too long.
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: hamada on June 27, 2013, 01:54:04 PM
im glad i switched from APS-C to FF.

maybe i will buy the 7D MK2 to acompany my 6D.

Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: whothafunk on June 27, 2013, 02:30:23 PM
Speaking of the 7D InsanityBeard, can you tell us if the version 2 software improved things like noise at higher ISOs, colour rendition or dynamic range at all?
not 1 person or review could confirm that software update did improve anything regarding IQ/ISO. it's the same.
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: martinmm on June 28, 2013, 12:34:21 AM

I was looking forward to something that would keep me from buying a Nikon D7100.

This is not it.

.
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: neuroanatomist on June 28, 2013, 07:41:25 AM
Not really revolutionary then. Wondering how long it takes for real new sensors.
Canon can always open the door and make a visit to Sony, Toshiba, Aptina, Panasonic and start a collaboration, but they are to proud and have invest much prestige in their own sensors

Pride?  I doubt that...just good fiscal sense.  They're selling plenty of dSLRs using their own sensor technology, and all the DxOMark Scores in the world haven't changed that. So, why dilute their profits by giving some of them to another sensor manufacturer?  Clearly, in the case of the many PowerShots that use Sony sensors, they're not 'too proud' - for that market segment, the economies of scale make it logical to source those sensors from another manufacturer.
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: Don Haines on June 28, 2013, 07:50:05 AM
Not really revolutionary then. Wondering how long it takes for real new sensors.
Canon can always open the door and make a visit to Sony, Toshiba, Aptina, Panasonic and start a collaboration, but they are to proud and have invest much prestige in their own sensors

Pride?  I doubt that...just good fiscal sense.  They're selling plenty of dSLRs using their own sensor technology, and all the DxOMark Scores in the world haven't changed that. So, why dilute their profits by giving some of them to another sensor manufacturer?  Clearly, in the case of the many PowerShots that use Sony sensors, they're not 'too proud' - for that market segment, the economies of scale make it logical to source those sensors from another manufacturer.

Also, keep in mind that few of us, if any, have a clue (I certainly don't) as to what is under developement in the labs and what the corperate strategic decisions are..... we are just speculating... there could be something fantastic coming down the pipe, there could be nothing... but until it gets released, we just don't know.
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: mjbehnke on June 28, 2013, 08:35:23 AM
I'm at a loss? So, the 20.2 MP sensor with dual pixel CMOS AF is not a new sensor?  I would think that having 2.2mp over the current 18mp sensor, they would have had to make a new one? I'm not at all a techie person, so that's the reason I ask.

Thanks,
Matthew
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: Nishi Drew on June 28, 2013, 08:54:42 AM

I was looking forward to something that would keep me from buying a Nikon D7100.

This is not it.

.

HAHA, if you're looking for something else to go against the decision of purchasing the D7100 then obviously you don't really want the D7100 to begin with, you're looking forward to a "better" camera but with the intention of settling with one you don't quite want? The D7100 looks like a pretty fine camera, it even has decent video (matters to me) while over here the flip screen is a big plus, just need to see if Canon was woken up with Magic Lantern's recent RAW video discovery and the 70D actually has something neat from the start. Or not... depends on how the sensor is now
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: Don Haines on June 28, 2013, 09:13:21 AM
I'm at a loss? So, the 20.2 MP sensor with dual pixel CMOS AF is not a new sensor?  I would think that having 2.2mp over the current 18mp sensor, they would have had to make a new one? I'm not at all a techie person, so that's the reason I ask.

Thanks,
Matthew

There is no ISO improvement over the T5i, so I expect it is the same technology as the T5i and SL1, just slightly smaller pixels... So yes, it is a new sensor, but no (probably), it is not new technology.
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: m.malvitz on June 28, 2013, 09:17:02 AM
What type of toggle with this have?  Do you think it will go back to the joystick of the 50D and 5D MkIII?  Or will it be the pad in the 60D and 6D?
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: whothafunk on July 03, 2013, 01:40:57 PM
havent you seen the 70D on pictures? no joystick, just d-pad.
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: x-vision on July 03, 2013, 03:10:38 PM
its a new sensor but  probably build with the same design as all other APS , 24x36mm  sensors from Canon since 2004

We can't be sure.

At the CMOS/electronics level, the 70D sensor is a 40mp sensor, basically.
That seems way too many for Canon's old 500nm process - when even 18mp was pushing it.

I guess we'll find out when Chipworks puts the 70D sensor under the microscope.
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: Policar on July 03, 2013, 03:38:34 PM
its a new sensor but  probably build with the same design as all other APS , 24x36mm  sensors from Canon since 2004

We can't be sure.

At the CMOS/electronics level, the 70D sensor is a 40mp sensor, basically.
That seems way too many for Canon's old 500nm process - when even 18mp was pushing it.

I guess we'll find out when Chipworks puts the 70D sensor under the microscope.

Might the pixels being split for AF hurt ISO performance by a stop?

The Mark III (and I'm assuming 1DX even more so) has good high ISO performance. It's low ISO that suffers. If anything Canon would want to fix that but I don't think they'd want to publicize it since the problem is not really well-documented except in niche communities. (Noisy ADC or somesuch.)
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: neuroanatomist on July 03, 2013, 03:40:44 PM
The Mark III (and I'm assuming 1DX even more so) has good high ISO performance. It's low ISO that suffers. If anything Canon would want to fix that but I don't think they'd want to publicize it since the problem is not really well-documented except in niche communities. (Noisy ADC or somesuch.)

So why would they want to fix it at all?   ::)
Title: Re: EOS 70D Next to Be Announced
Post by: Policar on July 03, 2013, 03:45:47 PM
The Mark III (and I'm assuming 1DX even more so) has good high ISO performance. It's low ISO that suffers. If anything Canon would want to fix that but I don't think they'd want to publicize it since the problem is not really well-documented except in niche communities. (Noisy ADC or somesuch.)

So why would they want to fix it at all?   ::)

Maybe they don't. There's not much evidence they care. The gap between Canon and Sony sensors is wider in terms of read noise than quantum efficiency, so there's more room to improve there, but I agree with you there's much less incentive.

There might be more incentive when/if the mythical 3D studio/landscape camera launches, however, in which case Canon might be moved to improve their cameras' read noise without really publicizing that they ever had an issue with it. Probably not, though.