canon rumors FORUM

Rumors => EOS Bodies => Topic started by: Canon Rumors on March 03, 2014, 12:20:00 PM

Title: Patent: Canon EF 600 f/4L IS III & EF 600 f/4 DO IS
Post by: Canon Rumors on March 03, 2014, 12:20:00 PM

A new patent showing the 600mm f/4 optical formula. Is Canon already working on the replacements to the current super telephoto lenses? It’s quite possible! Although I suspect we’re talking 7-10 years from now. These sort of patents could also be for technology that will appear in  other lenses. Such as the upcoming replacement of the EF 800mm f/5.6L IS.


I do expect we’ll be seeing more DO lenses in the future. There seems to be an awful lot of patents for DO optical formulas. I suspect the cost of production is the hinderance to bringing these lenses to market at the present time. We already have $11,000 200-400 f/4 lenses and $18,000 800mm lenses. I suspect we’re at the ceiling of what people will pay for a lens…. or not. :)


Patent Publication No. 2014-26210



Example 1



Example 5



Source: [EG]


cr


Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 600 f/4L IS III & EF 600 f/4 DO IS
Post by: neuroanatomist on March 03, 2014, 12:26:46 PM
A new patent showing the 600mm f/4 optical formula. Is Canon already working on the replacements to the current super telephoto lenses? It’s quite possible!

Possible, yes.  But I also recall that they developed the prototypes for the 400/4 DO IS and a 400/4 L (non-DO) simultaneously, so having a 'regular' 600/4 in the patent application along side a 600/4 DO might just be part of the development process.
Title: What is left here of DO?
Post by: Maximilian on March 03, 2014, 02:23:16 PM
Example 1
...
  • Total lens length 374.7mm
...
Example 5
...
  • Total lens length 343.5mm
  • Inner focus
  • Diffraction optical element
I'm a little bit surprised that the DO is giving a size advantage of just a little bit more than 3 cm.
I suppose that this is due to how strong the diffraction effect of the DO is and that this patent is giving more to IQ than size advantage.
But what is left of the advantage of the DO then? Less CA?

Comparing actual "standard" to "DO" lenses with that little size advantage I would go the standard - if I had the money and the need of such a lens.

Or do I miss something? Advice is very welcome. Thanks.

(Disclaimer: I know of course that these patents have to turn into real available products, and that patents are not quite good for IQ discussions. But my question is still there...)
Title: Re: What is left here of DO?
Post by: mackguyver on March 03, 2014, 02:47:41 PM
Example 1
...
  • Total lens length 374.7mm
...
Example 5
...
  • Total lens length 343.5mm
  • Inner focus
  • Diffraction optical element
I'm a little bit surprised that the DO is giving a size advantage of just a little bit more than 3 cm.
I suppose that this is due to how strong the diffraction effect of the DO is and that this patent is giving more to IQ than size advantage.
But what is left of the advantage of the DO then? Less CA?

Comparing actual "standard" to "DO" lenses with that little size advantage I would go the standard - if I had the money and the need of such a lens.

Or do I miss something? Advice is very welcome. Thanks.

(Disclaimer: I know of course that these patents have to turn into real available products, and that patents are not quite good for IQ discussions. But my question is still there...)
Using Google Translate (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=auto&tl=en&prev=_dd&u=http%3A%2F%2Fegami.blog.so-net.ne.jp%2F2014-03-03): It looks like the key is that the current 600 f/4 II is 461mm (Canon US) / 448mm (according to EG), so both lenses in the patent would be a lot shorter. Beyond that, your guess is as good as mine...
Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 600 f/4L IS III & EF 600 f/4 DO IS
Post by: East Wind Photography on March 03, 2014, 03:34:25 PM
Or it's simply just a patent designed to keep another manufacturer from using it.  The current mk ii lens is about near perfect.  Unless they are planning to adapt it to a medium format or 100MP plus sensor, I dont see this one coming to market soon.  Pardon the quote but DO is "dead to me".  I've tried some DO lenses and the bokeh is quite awful.  I suppose it has it's purpose but not for anything that I could shoot with them.
Title: The best white super-telephoto...
Post by: Hesbehindyou on March 03, 2014, 06:51:07 PM
The best white super-telephoto is the one you have with you.

Some will always pay a premium for smaller.  Re the size of the patented lenses, perhaps they've designed the DO lens, then designed a 'regular' lens optimised for compactness (as opposed to IQ), to illustrate what DO can bring to the table.
Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 600 f/4L IS III & EF 600 f/4 DO IS
Post by: Etienne on March 03, 2014, 06:54:24 PM
I wish they'd just update the 400 5.6 ... put in IS, make it sharper, and don't massacre my piggy bank. It would be light enough to carry regularly, and probably do just fine with the 1.4x at f/8.

That would be my "poor-man's" super-tele.
Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 600 f/4L IS III & EF 600 f/4 DO IS
Post by: RGF on March 03, 2014, 06:55:54 PM
Current 600 is a great lens.  Only suggestion besides major weight loss, would be a built-in 1.4.  That would be handy!
Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 600 f/4L IS III & EF 600 f/4 DO IS
Post by: eml58 on March 04, 2014, 12:21:25 AM
Current 600 is a great lens.  Only suggestion besides major weight loss, would be a built-in 1.4.  That would be handy!

That's it, in spades, would be a great addition, they could have 2 models, one with one without.
Title: Re: What is left here of DO?
Post by: Maximilian on March 04, 2014, 09:38:00 AM
But what is left of the advantage of the DO then? Less CA?
It looks like the key is that the current 600 f/4 II is 461mm (Canon US) / 448mm (according to EG), so both lenses in the patent would be a lot shorter. Beyond that, your guess is as good as mine...
Thanks  mackguyver, for pointing that out.
I was aware of that, but didn't think it necessary to put in here to get even more confusion.
Of course comparing the actual lens with the example 1 patent it's great to see, that these "normal" lenses can be made even shorter than today. And some 8 cm are quite a lot.

But I think it is only "fair" to compare new design with new DO design.
Let's wait and see, what becomes reality...
Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 600 f/4L IS III & EF 600 f/4 DO IS
Post by: tron on March 04, 2014, 09:45:28 AM
Or it's simply just a patent designed to keep another manufacturer from using it.  The current mk ii lens is about near perfect.  Unless they are planning to adapt it to a medium format or 100MP plus sensor, I dont see this one coming to market soon.  Pardon the quote but DO is "dead to me".  I've tried some DO lenses and the bokeh is quite awful.  I suppose it has it's purpose but not for anything that I could shoot with them.
I beg to differ. DO technology is absolutely necessary for the creation of ... DODO lenses  ;D ;D ;D ;D

P.S I will leave some time to see if you know what I mean and then I will gladly explain it  :)
Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 600 f/4L IS III & EF 600 f/4 DO IS
Post by: tron on March 04, 2014, 05:53:50 PM
Or it's simply just a patent designed to keep another manufacturer from using it.  The current mk ii lens is about near perfect.  Unless they are planning to adapt it to a medium format or 100MP plus sensor, I dont see this one coming to market soon.  Pardon the quote but DO is "dead to me".  I've tried some DO lenses and the bokeh is quite awful.  I suppose it has it's purpose but not for anything that I could shoot with them.
I beg to differ. DO technology is absolutely necessary for the creation of ... DODO lenses  ;D ;D ;D ;D

P.S I will leave some time to see if you know what I mean and then I will gladly explain it  :)
OK, no response so far. So I owe you the explanation DODO = Difractive Opticts for Digital Ornithologists  ;D (= BIF photographers  ;D )
Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 600 f/4L IS III & EF 600 f/4 DO IS
Post by: neuroanatomist on March 04, 2014, 06:08:00 PM
OK, no response so far. So I owe you the explanation DODO = Difractive Opticts for Digital Ornithologists  ;D (= BIF photographers  ;D )

Oh...  I just thought it was a reference to something extinct.  ;)