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Rumors => EOS Bodies => Topic started by: Canon Rumors on March 12, 2014, 06:55:14 AM

Title: Patent: Canon EF 180mm f/3.5L IS
Post by: Canon Rumors on March 12, 2014, 06:55:14 AM
More Canon lens patents have shown up. This time we get some macro patents that also include hybrid IS. We’ve been told that the 180mm f/3.5L macro is on its way out, and this could be the direction Canon takes it.

A few other focal lengths also appear in the patent as well such as 200mm & 300mm versions with hybrid IS.

The information below is a Google translation.

Source: [EG]

cr

Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 180mm f/3.5L IS
Post by: Ellen Schmidtee on March 12, 2014, 07:12:50 AM
What's "Shifutobure"?
Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 180mm f/3.5L IS
Post by: Marsu42 on March 12, 2014, 07:24:40 AM
We’ve been told that the 180mm f/3.5L macro is on its way out, and this could be the direction Canon takes it.

That's great news as the 100L for macro is rather short for ff. But on the other hand, 180mm really doesn't qualify as a dual-use portrait lens anymore but as a shorter fixed tele, so imho they might just bump it to 200mm.

It would be even greater news if this would arrive at a somewhat reasonable price, but looking at the current 180L price and Canon's recent policy, I'm not so positive about this :-o
Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 180mm f/3.5L IS
Post by: TrabimanUK on March 12, 2014, 07:37:22 AM
What's "Shifutobure"?


"the image blur caused by the imaging device are shifted in parallel (hereinafter, referred to Shifutobure) is generated by the motion or the like of the arms holding the camera"

http://www.google.com/patents/WO2012141193A1?cl=en (http://www.google.com/patents/WO2012141193A1?cl=en)

I don't fully understand it, but it looks like it Image stabilisation is related to hand shake whilst holding the camera.

Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 180mm f/3.5L IS
Post by: funkboy on March 12, 2014, 07:42:43 AM
The 180mm focal length was always a bit of an odd-ball.  Also the 180L macro has about the slowest AF of any L lens I've ever seen (certainly because of the huge glass elements involved, but even behemoths like the 85mm f/1.2L are faster).

A 200mm f/3.5L macro with hybrid-IS and fast(er) AF would be a welcome addition to the lineup.

But really I'd love to see them add IS to the 135 f/2L & 200 f/2.8L, or really any other for-mere-mortals fast telephoto prime for that matter.
Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 180mm f/3.5L IS
Post by: Woody on March 12, 2014, 07:52:17 AM
So many patents, so few releases.

Perhaps, it'll be more appropriate to call this the Year of Lens Patents.  ;D
Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 180mm f/3.5L IS
Post by: squarebox on March 12, 2014, 07:53:50 AM
What's "Shifutobure"?


"the image blur caused by the imaging device are shifted in parallel (hereinafter, referred to Shifutobure) is generated by the motion or the like of the arms holding the camera"

http://www.google.com/patents/WO2012141193A1?cl=en (http://www.google.com/patents/WO2012141193A1?cl=en)

I don't fully understand it, but it looks like it Image stabilisation is related to hand shake whilst holding the camera.


Bure means shake in Japanese and "shifto" is just "Shift".  I wonder if this is their IS technology for panning shots.
Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 180mm f/3.5L IS
Post by: neuroanatomist on March 12, 2014, 09:09:36 AM
Supports Shifutobure (???)

I think this refers to the correction of translational shifts by the hybrid IS, in addition to the angular shake for which traditional IS compensates.
Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 180mm f/3.5L IS
Post by: KarstenReis on March 12, 2014, 09:41:24 AM
These look like zooms based on the focal lengths and the zoom ratios listed.   I don't know much about how these patents work but I thought that primes usually only have one focal length listed.   Am I reading these wrong?
Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 180mm f/3.5L IS
Post by: preppyak on March 12, 2014, 10:03:21 AM
These look like zooms based on the focal lengths and the zoom ratios listed.   I don't know much about how these patents work but I thought that primes usually only have one focal length listed.   Am I reading these wrong?
Yeah, I dont really get that either. I know there is an effect of the lens being shorter at min focus distance vs focusing at infinity, but that wouldnt explain the 300-150 zoom. And also, previous macro patents listed as one focal length: http://www.canonrumors.com/2011/10/new-65-f2-8-180-f3-5-macro-patents/ (http://www.canonrumors.com/2011/10/new-65-f2-8-180-f3-5-macro-patents/)
Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 180mm f/3.5L IS
Post by: ajfotofilmagem on March 12, 2014, 10:48:28 AM
These look like zooms based on the focal lengths and the zoom ratios listed.   I don't know much about how these patents work but I thought that primes usually only have one focal length listed.   Am I reading these wrong?
Yeah, I dont really get that either. I know there is an effect of the lens being shorter at min focus distance vs focusing at infinity, but that wouldnt explain the 300-150 zoom. And also, previous macro patents listed as one focal length: http://www.canonrumors.com/2011/10/new-65-f2-8-180-f3-5-macro-patents/ (http://www.canonrumors.com/2011/10/new-65-f2-8-180-f3-5-macro-patents/)
Yes, it seems that the patent actually refers to the Macro zoom. I'd like a 150-300mm F3.5-5.6 Macro, Magnification 1X (life size). After all, Macro always need openings F11, or more closed yet. This could save a lot of glass, weight and cost, compared to 180mm L.
Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 180mm f/3.5L IS
Post by: mackguyver on March 12, 2014, 10:51:14 AM
The 180mm focal length was always a bit of an odd-ball.  Also the 180L macro has about the slowest AF of any L lens I've ever seen (certainly because of the huge glass elements involved, but even behemoths like the 85mm f/1.2L are faster).

A 200mm f/3.5L macro with hybrid-IS and fast(er) AF would be a welcome addition to the lineup.

But really I'd love to see them add IS to the 135 f/2L & 200 f/2.8L, or really any other for-mere-mortals fast telephoto prime for that matter.
I own the 180L and have never understood the complaints against it, other than the weight.  The focal length is ideal for macro and I have used AF on it when I calibrated it with FoCal, but I'm not sure I've ever used it in the field.  For any other use, it's a terrible lens, but for macro, it's perfect.  From what I've read, the AF is slow for precision, and if you set the focus limiter to the far distance, it's actually as snappy as nearly any other USM lens.

I think it's stupid to add IS because the DOF is so shallow (even at f/16) that IS would be all but useless at 1:2 to 1:1 macro distances, and it's a poor choice for just about any other use compared to Canon's other offerings.  I'd much rather have f/2.8 and 9 rounded aperture blades like the 100L macro.
Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 180mm f/3.5L IS
Post by: photonius on March 12, 2014, 11:29:22 AM
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More Canon lens patents have shown up. This time we get some macro patents that also include hybrid IS. We’ve been told that the <a href=\"http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/112541-USA/Canon_2539A007_Telephoto_EF_180mm_f_3_5L.html/bi/2466/kbid/3296\" target=\"_blank\">180mm f/3.5L macro</a> is on its way out, and this could be the direction Canon takes it.</p>
<p>A few other focal lengths also appear in the patent as well such as 200mm & 300mm versions with hybrid IS.</p>
<p>The information below is a Google translation.</p>
<ul>
<li><strong>Patent Publication No. 2014-41224</strong>
<ul>
<li><span>Publication date 2014.3.6</span></li>
<li><span>Filing date 2012.8.22</span></li>
</ul>
</li>
<li><strong>Example 1</strong>
<ul>
<li><span>Zoom ratio 1.37</span></li>
<li><span>Focal length f = 180.03-167.06-131.08mm</span></li>
<li><span>Fno (3.6-4.8-5.8 actual aperture). 3.6-3.3-2.59</span></li>
<li><span>Half angle ω = 6.85-7.38-9.37 °</span></li>
<li><span>Image height 21.64mm</span></li>
<li><span>The overall length of the lens 228.39mm</span></li>
<li><span>BF 68.14mm</span></li>
</ul>
</li>
<li><strong>Example 2</strong>
<ul>
<li><span>Zoom ratio 1.58</span></li>
<li><span>Focal length f = 198.49-164.7-125.48mm</span></li>
<li><span>Fno (3.6-4.8-5.8 actual aperture). 3.6-2.99-2.28</span></li>
<li><span>Half angle ω = 6.22-7.48-9.78 °</span></li>
<li><span>Image height 21.64mm</span></li>
<li><span>The overall length of the lens 231.65mm</span></li>
<li><span>BF 71.4mm</span></li>
</ul>
</li>
<li><strong>Example 3</strong>
<ul>
<li><span>Zoom ratio 1.92</span></li>
<li><span>Focal length f = 289.97-213.39-151.33mm</span></li>
<li><span>Fno (3.6-4.8-5.8 actual aperture). 3.6-2.65-2.21</span></li>
<li><span>Half angle ω = 4.27-5.79-8.14 °</span></li>
<li><span>Image height 21.64mm</span></li>
<li><span>The overall length of the lens 294.36mm</span></li>
<li><span>BF 68.05mm</span></li>
</ul>
</li>
<li><strong>Canon patents</strong>
<ul>
<li><span>Inner focus</span></li>
<li><span>(Part of the fourth lens group) antivibration</span></li>
<li><span>Supports Shifutobure (???)</span></li>
<li><span>Floating</span></li>
</ul>
</li>
</ul>
<p>Source: [<a href=\"http://egami.blog.so-net.ne.jp/2014-03-12\" target=\"_blank\">EG</a>]</p>
<p><strong><span style=\"color: #ff0000;\">c</span>r</strong></p>


These are zooms, that would tie in with earlier rumors about a zoom macro (no focal length was specified there).

I speculated as follows then:
"a say, 135 (150) - 200mm (or 180mm) macro with 1:1 at 200mm and IS does not sound implausible."

anyway, 2 of them seem very close to what I speculated, i.e. a 130-180 mm macro, and a 125-200mm macro.

Title: Re: Patent: Canon EF 180mm f/3.5L IS
Post by: Rienzphotoz on March 12, 2014, 11:55:05 AM
Sounds good ... hope it will be released within the next one year.