canon rumors FORUM

Rumors => Lenses => Topic started by: Canon Rumors on April 23, 2012, 03:26:41 PM

Title: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: Canon Rumors on April 23, 2012, 03:26:41 PM
“L” Primes Coming?
Received two bits of information about possible upcoming lenses from Canon. Apparently both the 35 f/1.4L and 85 f/1.2L II are slated to be updated. As with all things in regards to lenses from Canon, no one is quite sure when either could be announced. It was suggested the 35 f/1.4L II has been delayed on numerous occasions for  redesign and tweaking.

This is the first I have heard seriously about an 85L replacement, but anything that speeds up the AF of the lens would be very welcomed.

I believe we’ll have to see the new 500, 600 and 24-70′s shipping before we get another major “L” lens updated.

cr

Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: vuilang on April 23, 2012, 03:51:32 PM
I dont want to imaging how much it will cost for the 85LIII... since the 85LII already $2200..
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: neuroanatomist on April 23, 2012, 04:02:19 PM
I'd be pleased to see a 35L II with weather sealing.  A fast-focusing 85L would be awesome (and no doubt awesomely expensive)!!
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: seymour110 on April 23, 2012, 04:21:17 PM
Why? Does canon really need to replace these lenses? they are not that old. Canon really need to get their act together and update the 35mm f2 which is a terrible lens. Seeing nikon's 35mm dx 1.8 makes me wonder why canon haven't done the same
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: Waleed Essam on April 23, 2012, 04:33:18 PM
I have really lost the will to care for any new Canon products :( I can guess the new 85 will be 3000 USD, the new 35 will be 2000 USD. Both will be overpriced like all new Canon products :( I visit this site out of a habit now not because I'm really waiting for something new because of the new prices.

Whining aside, I'd love to see new non-L primes. I love my 85/1.8 for example and I'd love to see a new good non-L 35/1.8 or 35/2 with a similar performance  :-\
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: infared on April 23, 2012, 04:46:18 PM
I dont want to imaging how much it will cost for the 85LIII... since the 85LII already $2200..
Well based on the 5DMarkIII, and the 24-70mm 2.8II...there will just be a $1000 add-on..no biggie...that seems to be Canon's modus operandi these days...so I would be expecting a price of about $3200..oh..no IS, either.
(said very sarcastically). The prices are becoming absurd.
Think I will just keep my slow focusing beast!...Love that lens except for the Chromatic Aberrations I get sometimes.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: Orion on April 23, 2012, 04:57:13 PM
For an 85 II, I would run around the block naked and then be a butler for somebody for a week!

Please heklp starving artist.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: Drizzt321 on April 23, 2012, 05:03:00 PM
Just think...if they release new versions of these the market will be flooded with used (but well taken care of) old versions that you can pick up cheap(ish).
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: EYEONE on April 23, 2012, 05:07:29 PM
If it'll bring the price of the current 85mm f1.2 down I'll be happy to see a ver. III. Odd though, the ver. II isn't that old. 6 years?
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: photoxication on April 23, 2012, 05:15:56 PM
85mm is personally my favorite focal length (I shoot full frame).  I have yet to go L lenses in this length, I still love my 85/1.8 Non-L.  I'll wait on Fred Miranda's site for a great deal on an 85LII if I get that L lens itch.  For now, I'm still in that honeymoon phase with my 85/1.8 -  something about it just makes me feel more creative when I shoot whatever, and just don't see an 85LII in the near future, and don't see an 85LIII being released any time soon.

I have been pining over the 24L TS-E II for landscaping pictures I only dream of taking, but that is for another thread.  Damn you Fred Miranda and your gorgeous pictures with that lens  ;D ;D
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: q3chap on April 23, 2012, 05:21:03 PM
35L II = 2499 USD or 2299 Euro

85L III = 3499 USD or 3299 Euro

50L II = 2700 USD or 2499 Euro

135L II IS = 2899 USD or 2699 Euro

24-105L F4 IS II = 1999 USD or 1799 Euro

100-400L IS II = 2499 USD or 2299 Euro

ALL completly redesigned ( thats why Canon can ask for more money ).

It's time to save your money for all that lenses. (est. 16 000 USD)

cheers.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: tron on April 23, 2012, 05:22:08 PM
Just think...if they release new versions of these the market will be flooded with used (but well taken care of) old versions that you can pick up cheap(ish).
No cheap lenses even secondhand. With Canon policy to create the new versions much more expensive the old versions do not sell cheap unfortunately :(

Have you seen many cheap 300 f2.8L IS, 400mm f/2.8L IS,  70-200 f2.8L IS, 200mm f1.8L,  for example?

I am afraid we will not see cheap 500mm f/4L IS, 600mm f/4L IS either (when the II versions start selling)

This Canon policy infuriates me (not that I can do anything about it...)  >:( >:( >:(
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: preppyak on April 23, 2012, 05:27:44 PM
Just think...if they release new versions of these the market will be flooded with used (but well taken care of) old versions that you can pick up cheap(ish).
Like the used market is flooded with 5dii's right now? (hint: it's not). Not everyone upgrades instantly, especially not at the 50% price premiums Canon has been marking lenses up. Especially not for a lens that is already some people's go-to lens they are happy with.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: Camerajah on April 23, 2012, 05:33:53 PM
Your sure both new lens are not f1.4L,me think you need to double check- I am just guessing wild people ;)
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: tron on April 23, 2012, 05:34:24 PM
35L II = 2499 USD or 2299 Euro

85L III = 3499 USD or 3299 Euro

50L II = 2700 USD or 2499 Euro

135L II IS = 2899 USD or 2699 Euro

24-105L F4 IS II = 1999 USD or 1799 Euro

100-400L IS II = 2499 USD or 2299 Euro

ALL completly redesigned ( thats why Canon can ask for more money ).

It's time to save your money for all that lenses. (est. 16 000 USD)

cheers.

WHAT?
Seriously?
Are you a CANON employee?  (OK, that is a joke, unless it's true of course!!!)

135L II IS = 2899 USD or 2699 Euro 3ple price just mere IS? (don't tell me it needs to be perfected optically
I use the current 135mm at 2.0 with excellent results...)

100-400L IS II maybe after selling the version 1 assuming that Canon makes a superb lens...

35L II 2499 USD or 2299 Euro for improved sealing and (hopefully) better edges? No value for money.
The current is a very good one.

50L II = 2700 USD or 2499 Euro  This will be a joke.

24-105L F4 IS II = 1999 USD or 1799 Euro Too much for a f/4 zoom since the current one is very decent.

85L III = 3499 USD or 3299 Euro Extreme and Not for me but I would understand. There are some who swear by this lens.

Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: tron on April 23, 2012, 05:36:13 PM
How many decades ... er years I mean do we see speculations about a new 35mm 1.4L II ? I'll believe it one year after Canon announces it...
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: Zlatko on April 23, 2012, 05:39:15 PM
We all want stuff to be better, but don't want it to cost more.  Well, that's unrealistic.  If Canon is going to improve their cameras and lenses, they're going to expect to charge more too.  That's the way the world works.  That's what we do as photographers too.

I very much agree with the person who wants an improved 35/2.  That is such a useful focal length, and that lens is long overdue for an update.  I hope Canon makes a new, improved 35/2 with quiet focusing, perhaps like the recently announced 24/2.8 and 28/2.8.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: q3chap on April 23, 2012, 05:48:27 PM

24-105L F4 IS II = 1999 USD or 1799 Euro Too much for a f/4 zoom since the current one is very decent.


thats why I wrote .. All completly redesigned :) ....

the 70-300L was at the beginning 1599 USD for F4-5,6 ... so I think it is not unrealistic for the 24-105 with that price.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: tron on April 23, 2012, 06:11:00 PM

24-105L F4 IS II = 1999 USD or 1799 Euro Too much for a f/4 zoom since the current one is very decent.


thats why I wrote .. All completly redesigned :) ....

the 70-300L was at the beginning 1599 USD for F4-5,6 ... so I think it is not unrealistic for the 24-105 with that price.

The 70-300L lens didn't exist before (It's version 1) and it is a major upgrade for someone who has the non-L (and much cheaper) version. This price is understandable more or less.

However the 24-105 is an already decent L version. Even redesigned cannot be a major upgrade for the version 1 owners. True a little less vignetting and a 4-stop IS (but it has a 3-stop IS already) would be welcome but my point is that a second version 1K more expensive lens  wouldn't be value for money.

Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: Fatalv on April 23, 2012, 06:13:48 PM
Sigh... still dreaming waiting for a new 50mm without issues. 1.4 with true USM would be awesome or 1.2L without focus shift issues. Please canon... I don't want to have to get the Sigma  :-\
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: Martin on April 23, 2012, 06:16:46 PM
with canon "new" policy, I suppose the "new" 35 II or 85L will be the same as the old one, but with higher price tag.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: tron on April 23, 2012, 06:21:05 PM
with canon "new" policy, I suppose the "new" 35 II or 85L will be the same as the old one, but with higher price tag.
;D
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: EYEONE on April 23, 2012, 06:33:54 PM
Sigh... still dreaming waiting for a new 50mm without issues. 1.4 with true USM would be awesome or 1.2L without focus shift issues. Please canon... I don't want to have to get the Sigma  :-\

I agree. I'd take either one.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: JR on April 23, 2012, 06:37:05 PM
sign me up for both!  I like it.  the only thing is I wonder how will the dxo guys would rate these new lenses - not! [sarcasm]

 8)
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: squarebox on April 23, 2012, 07:46:49 PM
35L II = 2499 USD or 2299 Euro


This is probably a good guess as it seem that the new lens are based off of a new higher exchange rate.  Just for reference, the current 35L I sells for $1850 USD new and $1500 used in Japan right now at local retailers.  So I think your guess is right that the 35L II would be in the $2250-2500 range.

Just remember Canon prices aren't evil, but that the USD is worth 60% of what it was against the JPY 6 years ago.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: tron on April 23, 2012, 07:52:12 PM
35L II = 2499 USD or 2299 Euro


This is probably a good guess as it seem that the new lens are based off of a new higher exchange rate.  Just for reference, the current 35L I sells for $1850 USD new and $1500 used in Japan right now at local retailers.  So I think your guess is right that the 35L II would be in the $2250-2500 range.

Just remember Canon prices aren't evil, but that the USD is worth 60% of what it was against the JPY 6 years ago.

B&H prices: Canon 35mm 1.4L  $1,479.00 USA  $1,379.00 Imported. (OK street prices)
Nowhere near $1850 USD.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: vcp on April 23, 2012, 08:49:45 PM
I would love a weather sealed 35mm 1.4, its my most used lens and the only one without weather sealing. I find it hard to believe the 85 would be updated so soon. It has only been 6 years since the mkii was released, where as it has been 14 years for the 35.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: stilscream on April 23, 2012, 08:51:51 PM
I found my 35mm L 1.4 at the pawn shop I work at. It had been priced at only $300, because they don't know lenses well enough. I already had the same lens, but how fast did I buy this lens?? So fast it makes your head spin. Sold my old copy for $1100, and made $800 quick-like!
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: Etienne on April 23, 2012, 09:27:05 PM
Rumors of a 35L II started about 4 years ago I believe.
I'd buy one, but at CR1 today, that lens won't be out until 2015.

I'd also like an updated 50 1.4 which is sharp at 1.4 and blazing fast and accurate USM.

How about a great 85 1.4 with fast Focus? I'd take an 85 1.4 over the 1.2 just to save weight and money.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: LetTheRightLensIn on April 23, 2012, 09:30:32 PM
85L III = 3499 USD or 3299 Euro

Hmm that is how much my 300 2.8 IS cost me, just about.  :o
(plus the current 85 L has pretty amazing image quality)
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: LetTheRightLensIn on April 23, 2012, 09:32:25 PM

24-105L F4 IS II = 1999 USD or 1799 Euro Too much for a f/4 zoom since the current one is very decent.


thats why I wrote .. All completly redesigned :) ....

the 70-300L was at the beginning 1599 USD for F4-5,6 ... so I think it is not unrealistic for the 24-105 with that price.

The 70-300L lens didn't exist before (It's version 1) and it is a major upgrade for someone who has the non-L (and much cheaper) version. This price is understandable more or less.

However the 24-105 is an already decent L version. Even redesigned cannot be a major upgrade for the version 1 owners. True a little less vignetting and a 4-stop IS (but it has a 3-stop IS already) would be welcome but my point is that a second version 1K more expensive lens  wouldn't be value for money.

I gotta disagree. The 24-105L disappointed me more than any lens ever. Convenient but very average performance (1/4 price Tamron was sharper, even at FF edges).

The 24-105 has room, if any L lens has room, to improve.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: warrionex on April 23, 2012, 09:33:01 PM
What??? 40% price increase for new Canon L lenses!!!!

If Canon people is looking @ this post, i just wanted to let you guys know, forget it, im not a canonista anymore. Seriously considering selling everything and move to Nikon.  The price increase is as abusive as slavery.  They are playing the game of major petroleum & oil companies. The filthy game of speculation!!  So corrupt, evidently no commitment to customers that has been loyal to the brand for many years.

Sincerely, Charlie
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: LetTheRightLensIn on April 23, 2012, 09:33:32 PM
I found my 35mm L 1.4 at the pawn shop I work at. It had been priced at only $300, because they don't know lenses well enough. I already had the same lens, but how fast did I buy this lens?? So fast it makes your head spin. Sold my old copy for $1100, and made $800 quick-like!

Whoa that is the one of the most insane deals I've ever heard, maybe the most insane!
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: facedodge on April 23, 2012, 09:45:04 PM
Gas prices are double what they were 3 years ago... Bernanke has added trillions of funny money... Japan was hit with a tsunami, the Dollar has gotten much weaker than the Yen. Lens technology is not the same as computer technology. It does not get 2x better every 18 months for the same price.

I would enjoy this thread so much more if we could quit complaining about the greedy corporate fat cats at Canon and focus on the great advancements we would like to see in our favorite lenses.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: RC on April 23, 2012, 10:23:03 PM
We all want stuff to be better, but don't want it to cost more.  Well, that's unrealistic.  If Canon is going to improve their cameras and lenses, they're going to expect to charge more too.  That's the way the world works.  That's what we do as photographers too.

Don't necessarily agree with the notion that everything new and updated must cost more, or at least a lot more.
 
There are plenty of products out there where new and updated versions are better and less expensive than previous versions such as the computer and TV industries.  Yes I realize its an apple vs oranges scenario when comparing photo equipment with TVs and computers.   Photo equipment holds a much better value than TVs and computers.

IMO it seems to me Canon chooses to charge the very highest price they think the market will support in effort to make a profit as opposed to charging a slightly lower price and making that same profit with higher volume of sales.    We all know Apple is very successful with this strategy, but they could increase their market share even more if they lowered their prices some.

Yes I get it, Canon is in business to make money.  I believe their primary goal is not to make us happy, but first and for most make money.  I realize they need to cover their R&D, manufacturing, tooling, and material costs.  But don't tell me some of those costs can't be carried over into the next generation of a lens or body.

I'm saving up for a 35L II in hopes of WS.  I'm expecting this lens will be priced too high and I will end up getting the current version.  As a general  rule, I think a 15 to 20% cost increase over the current is justified and I would hope Canon can still cover their costs and make a profit.

I"m not an economist or marketing person so maybe I'm missing something, but I' don't think I'm  too far off.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: swrightgfx on April 23, 2012, 10:37:40 PM
How many decades ... er years I mean do we see speculations about a new 35mm 1.4L II ? I'll believe it one year after Canon announces it...
Considering the current version is already a stellar performer and certainly near to or top of the L line-up, I'd like Canon to invest their research and development elsewhere. While weather-sealing would be wonderful, in practice it isn't as big a "problem" as the issue of slow 85L II AF.

And you can bet that the price of the 35L will shoot up as the new version comes in at a premium. Start buying now, before the crazy deals pass!
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: RC on April 23, 2012, 10:38:40 PM
Gas prices are double what they were 3 years ago... Bernanke has added trillions of funny money... Japan was hit with a tsunami, the Dollar has gotten much weaker than the Yen. Lens technology is not the same as computer technology. It does not get 2x better every 18 months for the same price.

And I completely agree with you.  Maybe that is enough to set the prices as they are.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: epiem on April 23, 2012, 11:56:25 PM
Where is the damned 50 1.2 II
THAT is what I wanna know....
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: hippoeater on April 24, 2012, 12:33:36 AM
I just got the 50mm 1.2L last week and I have been shooting with it since.

I haven't noticed any of the negative comments I often see being thrown around about it. I don't see a need for a mark 2 just yet. On my 5dmk3 it focuses quickly, is extremely sharp (even wide open).

1.2 is extremely shallow and does take some getting used to, but overall it is a pretty fantastic lens and I'm having a hard time discovering what so many people find faulty with this lens.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: Mt Spokane Photography on April 24, 2012, 12:46:40 AM
Why? Does canon really need to replace these lenses? they are not that old.

The 35mmL was introduced in 1998.  Its not exactly a new lens,
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: dolina on April 24, 2012, 12:54:01 AM
These are the L primes that are much older than the 85L II.

1993 EF 400mm f/5.6L USM
1996 EF 200mm f/2.8L II USM
1996 EF 180mm f/3.5L Macro USM
1996 EF 135mm f/2L USM
1997 EF 300mm f/4L IS USM
1998 EF 35mm f/1.4L USM

My preference is that Canon updates the EF 400mm f/5.6L USM, EF 135mm f/2L USM, EF 35mm f/1.4L USM and then the EF 180mm f/3.5L Macro USM before doing anything with the 85L II.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: swrightgfx on April 24, 2012, 01:11:41 AM
Why? Does canon really need to replace these lenses? they are not that old.

The 35mmL was introduced in 1998.  Its not exactly a new lens,
I guess it is more an issue of priority. I think the 35L is a pretty reliable piece of kit and has plenty of potential left in it to satisfy most photographers needs.

1996 EF 180mm f/3.5L Macro USM.
Yes! This would be nice. Canon is short on long macro lenses (short on long!?). It would be nice if they could pull the minimum focus to around the level of the 100L, while also improving the bokeh above 5.6, perhaps with 9 blades instead of the current 8.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: dolina on April 24, 2012, 01:36:03 AM
Nikon updated their 35/1.4.

Time for Canon to do the same, me thinks.

Why? Does canon really need to replace these lenses? they are not that old.

The 35mmL was introduced in 1998.  Its not exactly a new lens,
I guess it is more an issue of priority. I think the 35L is a pretty reliable piece of kit and has plenty of potential left in it to satisfy most photographers needs.

1996 EF 180mm f/3.5L Macro USM.
Yes! This would be nice. Canon is short on long macro lenses (short on long!?). It would be nice if they could pull the minimum focus to around the level of the 100L, while also improving the bokeh above 5.6, perhaps with 9 blades instead of the current 8.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: stilscream on April 24, 2012, 03:04:41 AM
I found my 35mm L 1.4 at the pawn shop I work at. It had been priced at only $300, because they don't know lenses well enough. I already had the same lens, but how fast did I buy this lens?? So fast it makes your head spin. Sold my old copy for $1100, and made $800 quick-like!

Whoa that is the one of the most insane deals I've ever heard, maybe the most insane!

Yeah, most of the time its opposite, they loaned too much, making the price we sell it more than it should be. I did a dbl take and looked hard for abuse. Either the person who pawned it, stole it and got away with it, was in drugs and couldn't afford to come back...I don't understand how they only loaned $150 unless they missed the difference in f-stop. I've bought overpriced stuff too, but that was an exciting day! Glad I bought it before any customers who knew phtography did. Can't know everything about everything, even in the Google/Wikipedia/EBay era.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: Gcon on April 24, 2012, 03:27:35 AM
Canon are pushing to get all their L lenses, with the exception of the L-series TS-E lenses, updated to fully weather sealed specification.

The Tilt shifts will never be weather sealed due to their design.   All the others will be though.

Thus, the current L 35mm and 85mm will be updated again, and include weather sealing.  The 35mm will also get rounded aperture blades, which is another L-series feature that Canon are pushing, and for good reason - it creates smoother bokeh.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: Marsu42 on April 24, 2012, 04:20:35 AM
The 35mm will also get rounded aperture blades, which is another L-series feature that Canon are pushing, and for good reason - it creates smoother bokeh.

Smoother bokeh? On the 35L? Looking at the samples, I think there's hardly and room for that?

We all want stuff to be better, but don't want it to cost more.  Well, that's unrealistic.  If Canon is going to improve their cameras and lenses, they're going to expect to charge more too.  That's the way the world works.

I don't think so - it's just how Canon marketing works, getting as much revenue as possible. *Usually* when technology develops, older products get replaced with newer ones at about the same price because the manufacturing processes evolve and competition wouldn't allow for anything else (see Intel processors). The other alternative: a products gets bumped up feature-wise, but replaced with a "real" successor later on (like 5d2->5d3 and upcoming 5d2 replacement).

If what you're saying would be true, the prices of all products that are available for a longer time like cars, hifi sets, mobile phones..  would go up and up, but they don't. It's just that Canon can (still) get away with it. I hope Nikon, Sony and Pentax kicks their a** to get a grip.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: swrightgfx on April 24, 2012, 04:42:40 AM
The 35mm will also get rounded aperture blades, which is another L-series feature that Canon are pushing, and for good reason - it creates smoother bokeh.

Smoother bokeh? On the 35L? Looking at the samples, I think there's hardly and room for that?

We all want stuff to be better, but don't want it to cost more.  Well, that's unrealistic.  If Canon is going to improve their cameras and lenses, they're going to expect to charge more too.  That's the way the world works.

I don't think so - it's just how Canon marketing works, getting as much revenue as possible. *Usually* when technology develops, older products get replaced with newer ones at about the same price because the manufacturing processes evolve and competition wouldn't allow for anything else (see Intel processors). The other alternative: a products gets bumped up feature-wise, but replaced with a "real" successor later on (like 5d2->5d3 and upcoming 5d2 replacement).

If what you're saying would be true, the prices of all products that are available for a longer time like cars, hifi sets, mobile phones..  would go up and up, but they don't. It's just that Canon can (still) get away with it. I hope Nikon, Sony and Pentax kicks their a** to get a grip.
I agree, the bokeh on the 35L is buttery smooth and some of the best from Canon, but there is always room for improvement, which rounded blades or more blades will always give.

Current Canon pricing dictates that they are more than likely to go up as new releases come out. Unless there is significant improvement to the lenses, then the additional expense can feel quite considerable for the consumer. Having said that, Japan has had its fair share of bad luck of late, as has the US Dollar, Euro and Pound. Thank fully, the Australian Dollar has come through quite well, but with the greater import costs, we only just now almost balance with US prices.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: Ricku on April 24, 2012, 04:45:42 AM
We all want stuff to be better, but don't want it to cost more.  Well, that's unrealistic.  If Canon is going to improve their cameras and lenses, they're going to expect to charge more too.  That's the way the world works.
Perhaps the dumbest statement of the year.

if there were any truth in what you are saying, then TV's, camcorders, computers, cellphones, tablets, (and other gear) would also get more and more expensive each year. But in reality they DON'T! In fact, technology becomes better and cheaper each year.

About 5 years ago I spent $2500 on a new flat screen TV, and also bought a new high end computer. Today I can get a way better TV for much less, and a better computer for almost half the price.

There is no excuse for Canon' ridiculous pricing! ..But hey, I guess they can get away with it. Photographers seem to pay whatever it takes to get the latest gear, and I am sure that Canon is well aware of this.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: Marsu42 on April 24, 2012, 04:59:32 AM
Perhaps the dumbest statement of the year.

*smite* ... do you consider this good style?

There is no excuse for Canon' ridiculous pricing! ..But hey, I guess they can get away with it. Photographers seem to pay whatever it takes to get the latest gear, and I am sure that Canon is well aware of this.

It's because of dlsrs as a luxury commodity, too - they are much less expensive than other recreations: sports car, sports like golf, ...

I agree, the bokeh on the 35L is buttery smooth and some of the best from Canon, but there is always room for improvement, which rounded blades or more blades will always give.

I just remembered some lens reviews: They say the most obvious effect of rounded blades are seen at sunstars which aren't as large and distinct as with sharp ones, and it's often rated as a disadvantage. I don't know if they necessarily have a very large effect on the bokeh in general.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: Ricku on April 24, 2012, 05:15:02 AM
*smite* ... do you consider this good style?
I know. I'm just having a bad day.

It's because of dlsrs as a luxury commodity, too - they are much less expensive than other recreations: sports car, sports like golf, ...
Explain to me why dslrs can be seen as a luxury comodity, more than a high end PC, flat screen 3D-TV or an Ipad 3?

It is a tool. Nothing more, nothing less.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: seymour110 on April 24, 2012, 06:17:18 AM
Why? Does canon really need to replace these lenses? they are not that old.

The 35mmL was introduced in 1998.  Its not exactly a new lens,

Yeah, i was mainly referring to the 85L. Still 1998 is newer than 1990 when they introduced the normal 35mm. I'm really starting to think Nikon is looking after its lower level customers far better than canon is. Even the new 24mm and 28mm are around £700. They need to produce a similar priced 35mm as nikon's DX one thats around £185.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: squarebox on April 24, 2012, 06:18:42 AM
35L II = 2499 USD or 2299 Euro


This is probably a good guess as it seem that the new lens are based off of a new higher exchange rate.  Just for reference, the current 35L I sells for $1850 USD new and $1500 used in Japan right now at local retailers.  So I think your guess is right that the 35L II would be in the $2250-2500 range.

Just remember Canon prices aren't evil, but that the USD is worth 60% of what it was against the JPY 6 years ago.

B&H prices: Canon 35mm 1.4L  $1,479.00 USA  $1,379.00 Imported. (OK street prices)
Nowhere near $1850 USD.

My understanding is "imported" could be from any country.  Like HK which the lens are probably closer to the U.S. prices.  The $1850 I quoted is what Amazon.co.jp and local chains (which are pretty damn cheap) are selling for, here, in Japan.  Which is why I saved myself $500 usd and bought my 35L in the U.S. in Feb. 2012.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: HarryWintergreen on April 24, 2012, 06:21:00 AM
There are products that really need an update like the 100-400. Here, the additional charge to me made sense. In the case of the 85/1,2 one has to be very critical about what you really gain and have to pay for.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: AdamJ on April 24, 2012, 06:29:32 AM
I feel sure that the whole existing lens range, except for those announced or released in the last year or so, will look like bargains compared with their future replacements. I only hope they don't replace the 135mm L,100mm L Macro and 24mm L II before I have a chance to buy them new. After that, I'm not sure I'll ever buy a new Canon lens again.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: imboyster on April 24, 2012, 10:20:32 AM
No no no no. My 35L is 2 weeks old and my 85L is 1 year old. NO. Seriously though, i love my lenses. :)
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: Marsu42 on April 24, 2012, 10:52:23 AM
My 35L is 2 weeks old

When the 35L2 is announced at $2500 you can sell your 35L at more than you paid yourself... and keep calm, it's [CR1] which means its a wild guess just as good as yours or mine.
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: cayenne on April 24, 2012, 01:22:59 PM
85mm is personally my favorite focal length (I shoot full frame).  I have yet to go L lenses in this length, I still love my 85/1.8 Non-L.  I'll wait on Fred Miranda's site for a great deal on an 85LII if I get that L lens itch.  For now, I'm still in that honeymoon phase with my 85/1.8 -  something about it just makes me feel more creative when I shoot whatever, and just don't see an 85LII in the near future, and don't see an 85LIII being released any time soon.

I have been pining over the 24L TS-E II for landscaping pictures I only dream of taking, but that is for another thread.  Damn you Fred Miranda and your gorgeous pictures with that lens  ;D ;D

I just went to the fred miranda site....and wondering where you're seeing any deals?

It appears his whole site is run by Amazon.com....and looking at his prices, they're just the same as all others on amazon.com.....

Is there a 'special' link I need to go to for deals?
 ::)
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: sharkcalgary on April 24, 2012, 05:42:18 PM
Judging from the quality of the lens released in the past few years, I have no doubt in my mind that Canon will create something spectacular, even the predecessors are the legendary 35L and 85LII.  Also judging from the prices of the new lens in the past few years, the new lens will be expensive, even the predecessors are 35L and 85L  ;)

The 85LII lost a bit of appeal to me after the release of the 70-200L IS II, to the point that I want to sell my 85LII.  Maybe Canon needs to rejuvenate the 85L to restore its magic to Me_Me_Me the 70-200L IS II, Sigma 85/1.4.  That may explain the relative short refresh cycle for this lens.

Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: ecka on April 26, 2012, 05:35:22 AM
My 35L is 2 weeks old

When the 35L2 is announced at $2500 you can sell your 35L at more than you paid yourself... and keep calm, it's [CR1] which means its a wild guess just as good as yours or mine.

It better be 35/1.2L ... for that price ;D
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: Marsu42 on April 26, 2012, 07:18:26 AM
It better be 35/1.2L ... for that price ;D

Imho the most important thing would be that it is sharp wide open, too - better a sharp f1.4 than a softer f1.2 that starts getting better at f1.8... and looking at my budget, better a sharp f1.4 at $1500 than a sharp f1.2 at $2500 :-o
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: ecka on April 26, 2012, 09:43:48 AM
It better be 35/1.2L ... for that price ;D

Imho the most important thing would be that it is sharp wide open, too - better a sharp f1.4 than a softer f1.2 that starts getting better at f1.8... and looking at my budget, better a sharp f1.4 at $1500 than a sharp f1.2 at $2500 :-o
I wouldn't buy it even for $1000 if it's not sharp ;D
Title: Re: Lenses: 35L II & 85L III Next Up? [CR1]
Post by: swrightgfx on April 26, 2012, 10:19:05 PM
It better be 35/1.2L ... for that price ;D

Imho the most important thing would be that it is sharp wide open, too - better a sharp f1.4 than a softer f1.2 that starts getting better at f1.8... and looking at my budget, better a sharp f1.4 at $1500 than a sharp f1.2 at $2500 :-o
Indeed. I really think there is little to do to improve this lens, other than weather sealing and a bit more metal in the body (not that is isn't strong enough already, more for aesthetics/self-defence). Is the price of $2500 a bit steep? Sure it is, but it is also hardly surprising given the state of the US dollar and the harsh hits to Japan in recent times. If you need one and you need one with weather sealing, then I guess the price isn't as much an issue. If you don't want the sealing, go for the 35 1.4L now while prices are low.