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Rumors => EOS Bodies => Topic started by: surfing_geek on June 28, 2012, 03:19:34 AM

Title: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: surfing_geek on June 28, 2012, 03:19:34 AM
It's been announced officially by Canon Europe

http://www.1001noisycameras.com/2012/06/canon-announces-major-7d-firmware-update.html (http://www.1001noisycameras.com/2012/06/canon-announces-major-7d-firmware-update.html)

http://www.canon-europe.com/About_Us/Press_Centre/Press_Releases/Consumer_News/Cameras_Accessories/Canon_adds_a_range_of_new_features_to_the_EOS_7D.aspx (http://www.canon-europe.com/About_Us/Press_Centre/Press_Releases/Consumer_News/Cameras_Accessories/Canon_adds_a_range_of_new_features_to_the_EOS_7D.aspx)
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: jueming23 on June 28, 2012, 05:13:55 AM
Great!So there is no 7DII?
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: whatta on June 28, 2012, 05:33:23 AM
Great!So there is no 7DII?

I guess the 70d is close in time and it will be close to the 7d in features (I hope everything except build quality).
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: moreorless on June 28, 2012, 05:59:34 AM
Great!So there is no 7DII?

I wouldnt say "no" 7D2 but probabley not anytime soon, my guess is these updates are to try and keep the existing 7D competitive with a new 70D until the mk2 comes out next year.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: ashmadux on June 28, 2012, 07:34:44 AM
While this sounds very swell, what does it do for a body that wont focus proper?

7d pain on this side. Sorry for the rantish post. But Cannon is f'ing with me right now...3 times back and no dice
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: SwampYankee on June 28, 2012, 07:39:49 AM
while good news this is not good news for me.  I'm sitting on on my 50D waiting with money in the bank waiting for an upgrade to either the 60D or the 7D.  New firmware for the 7D means no replacement for the 7D.  So now I wait for a 60D replacement or perhaps a cheaper full frame.  I have money to burn here Canon, show me something I want
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: eeek on June 28, 2012, 08:00:21 AM
I'm sorry....  August?
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: DzPhotography on June 28, 2012, 08:04:31 AM
Good news  :D
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: mememe on June 28, 2012, 08:05:40 AM
Just a try to keep the 7d selling a bit...
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: dstppy on June 28, 2012, 08:05:53 AM
So, 7D owners get THIS and 60D owners get a serial number and spell check fix?

Seems fair  :o
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: RC on June 28, 2012, 08:06:16 AM
Tough crowd so far.  Looking forward to the new firmware-- thanks Canon!   :)
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: Jim K on June 28, 2012, 08:06:59 AM
I'm sorry....  August?

Nothing I must have NOW. So that means I'll wait until September to update. Just in case ...
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: darrellrhodesmiller on June 28, 2012, 08:15:17 AM
sounds really nice, sure wish they would have added 5 or  7 AEB bracketing... seems simple.. but other than that its a nice little upgrade.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: bigbadhenry on June 28, 2012, 08:21:57 AM
while good news this is not good news for me.  I'm sitting on on my 50D waiting with money in the bank waiting for an upgrade to either the 60D or the 7D.  New firmware for the 7D means no replacement for the 7D.  So now I wait for a 60D replacement or perhaps a cheaper full frame.  I have money to burn here Canon, show me something I want


Same here, I have a 50D and am after a new 7D mkII or very similar. No way am I buying a 3 year old 7D

Over to you Canon.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: lonelywhitelights on June 28, 2012, 08:48:12 AM
I just don't understand this "update"... I can already shoot 25/26/27 (it tend to vary) RAW images in high speed continuous mode...
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: mchubi on June 28, 2012, 09:24:23 AM
Hi at all,

well, what I am really missing is the possibility of a quick change between a single-shot and fast multi-shot. The need to use the quick-menue is quite awkward. If you could assign that feature to the "jpg-raw-switch-button" for example, it would be a real improvement.

So, why assigning a switch between single- and multi-shot? If I turn on fast multi-shot I often get two frames instead of the wanted single one. Perhaps I am too slow in releasing my finger or press it down too hard... but I bet I am not the only one. And If you bump into a situation where you need fast multi-shot it just would be -pressing that button
-selecting speed
-pushing "set"
and shoot. Instead of
-pressing "quickmenue"
-operating around to the right area via stick (what often is the most annoying part)
-spin the wheel
-pushing "set"
and shoot.

Personally, for me even the jpg-raw-switch functionality for the next picture could be abandoned. I never used it and don't feel any need to do so for saving some bytes. Converting a raw-file is not an expenditure...

:)
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: mitchell3417 on June 28, 2012, 09:31:02 AM
Hi at all,

well, what I am really missing is the possibility of a quick change between a single-shot and fast multi-shot. The need to use the quick-menue is quite awkward. If you could assign that feature to the "jpg-raw-switch-button" for example, it would be a real improvement.

So, why assigning a switch between single- and multi-shot? If I turn on fast multi-shot I often get two frames instead of the wanted single one. Perhaps I am too slow in releasing my finger or press it down too hard... but I bet I am not the only one. And If you bump into a situation where you need fast multi-shot it just would be -pressing that button
-selecting speed
-pushing "set"
and shoot. Instead of
-pressing "quickmenue"
-operating around to the right area via stick (what often is the most annoying part)
-spin the wheel
-pushing "set"
and shoot.

Personally, for me even the jpg-raw-switch functionality for the next picture could be abandoned. I never used it and don't feel any need to do so for saving some bytes. Converting a raw-file is not an expenditure...

:)
There's a button for that on the top of the camera. I really don't know what you mean here. All you have to do is hit one button and scroll to the correct option. And you can do it all with your right hand. Why would canon add functionality that's already there.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: pixelk on June 28, 2012, 09:31:34 AM
I just don't understand this "update"... I can already shoot 25/26/27 (it tend to vary) RAW images in high speed continuous mode...

Try it with a slow CF. A fast CF enables you to write the first pictures stored in the internal buffer to the CF before the internal buffer is full.
They improved the internal buffer, meaning that you will even get more burst pictures with the same CF.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: herbert on June 28, 2012, 09:35:54 AM
well, what I am really missing is the possibility of a quick change between a single-shot and fast multi-shot.

There is the AF.Drive button on the top of the camera:

- Press the AF.Drive button
- Spin the thumb wheel to select the mode
- Carry on shooting (the mode will be set when you press the shutter button to continue)

No need to go into the quick menu.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: Lee Jay on June 28, 2012, 09:53:57 AM
And no video crop modes - on the 7D v2, on the 5DIII or on the T4i.

Canon,  you're supposed to be going forwards, not backwards.  I want flexible video crop modes in all resolutions, preferably with smooth transitions rather than steps accessed through the menus.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: cszy67 on June 28, 2012, 10:01:58 AM
Additional news on the North American site now:

http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/consumer/standard_display/EOS7D_firmware (http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/consumer/standard_display/EOS7D_firmware)
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: Birdshooter on June 28, 2012, 10:02:59 AM

Same here, I have a 50D and am after a new 7D mkII or very similar. No way am I buying a 3 year old 7D

Over to you Canon.

You don't have to buy a 3 year old one, I am sure that you can find a new one in the stores.

Or do it like me. Pick up a year old 7D with only 2.500 clicks on it for half the price of a new one.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: Trovador on June 28, 2012, 10:23:18 AM
Additional news on the North American site now:

http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/consumer/standard_display/EOS7D_firmware (http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/consumer/standard_display/EOS7D_firmware)

Nice! I for one am still very happy with my 7D and welcome this upgrade, thanks Canon!
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: mrjimmy on June 28, 2012, 10:40:36 AM
Ok cool, I will take what I can get. its a free update. But really why wait so long for it. just post the update NOW
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: steves on June 28, 2012, 10:48:14 AM
What about adding some kind of focus bracketing? Even with center-point spot focusing, I often find that it is a bit off. Being able to shoot a bracket of images at slightly different focus points would make it easier to nail the perfect point.

-Steve
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: RLPhoto on June 28, 2012, 11:21:21 AM
I Love my 7D. Now I'll love it even more. ;D
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: aznable on June 28, 2012, 11:30:59 AM
What about adding some kind of focus bracketing? Even with center-point spot focusing, I often find that it is a bit off. Being able to shoot a bracket of images at slightly different focus points would make it easier to nail the perfect point.

-Steve

it would be cool, but for fast moving targets you would risk to miss every shoot
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: unfocused on June 28, 2012, 11:41:14 AM
Interesting.

Good news: A very nice firmware upgrade. This should put to rest the rumors that Canon will abandon the 7D or merge with a 70D. The language and tone of the announcement are clearly meant to communicate the message that the 7D remains their flagship APS-C model. As someone has already pointed out, this is in sharp contrast to the minor firmware upgrade of the 60D. ("no microfocus adjustment for you.")

Bad news: Probably no 7DII for Photokina.

Will we see a repeat of the pattern we saw last year with the 5D? Deep discounts before Christmas to boost sales, followed by an announcement of the 7DII in the first quarter 2013.

Pure speculation on my part: I wonder if after seeing the recent sensor performance from Nikon/Sony they were taken aback a bit and decided to delay a new APS-C sensor until they could make some added improvements. "Let's upgrade the firmware and cut prices to buy ourselves six months of added R&D."

Wondering now what they do with the 70D. Does it get a new sensor? Do they give it the 7D's features but use the T4i sensor? Do they hold off on it as well? Do they care if a 70D cuts into sales of the three-year-old 7D for a few months? Perhaps they figure that the build quality of the 7D alone will be sufficient differentiation for a few months, especially if they lower the 7D price.

While I'm a little disappointed that Canon won't be taking my money for awhile longer (at least not for a 7DII, but then there are always lenses), I'm pleased that they are giving me a 7D 2.0 for free. While I'd rather have a II instead of the 2.0, I'm not going to complain and it does give me time to brace for the inevitable price hike.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: adhocphotographer on June 28, 2012, 11:50:06 AM
an update of the 7D can never be bad... :)
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: DanielW on June 28, 2012, 12:01:53 PM
@ unfocused
So, if I want AF microadjustment I'd better sell my 60D? I loved it until I bought my 50 f/1.4.
Damn, can there be 3rd party firmwares?
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: Rob on June 28, 2012, 12:17:47 PM
I wonder if Canon has included the continuos video recording ability that the 5d3 & 1dx has, that lets you record video for just under 30mins splitting the video into 4gb files??. Im assuming they Havant, but thought I would mention it just in case.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: gshocked on June 28, 2012, 12:24:13 PM
Hi all,

I have a canon 500D and have had it for 2/3 yrs.  I can't afford to change to a full frame, is it too late in the picture to update to a 7D? Any thoughts?

Thanks,
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: RLPhoto on June 28, 2012, 12:26:44 PM
Hi all,

I have a canon 500D and have had it for 2/3 yrs.  I can't afford to change to a full frame, is it too late in the picture to update to a 7D? Any thoughts?

Thanks,

Its never too expensive for FF. Just buy a 5Dc if you really want FF.

As for the 7D, You may want to hold off for a bit. Check out the t4i though.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: pdirestajr on June 28, 2012, 12:27:52 PM
This is exciting news. It seems like I am in the minority here as I have no complaints and already love shooting with my 7D! More features for free? Ok, I'll take it :)

Also, why do people feel the need to upgrade camera bodies so frequently? I plan on shooting with my 7D & 5DII till they die. Digital cameras are finally good, the upgrades are pretty incremental now.

I'll spend my cash on glass!
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: distant.star on June 28, 2012, 12:36:57 PM

.
Sounds like you got the one I sent back!




While this sounds very swell, what does it do for a body that wont focus proper?

7d pain on this side. Sorry for the rantish post. But Cannon is f'ing with me right now...3 times back and no dice
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: ruuneos on June 28, 2012, 12:48:58 PM
Waiting is over ! ;D
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: odfotim on June 28, 2012, 12:57:57 PM
I m surprised that somebody forgot such a thing as a AEB bracketing ... not only 3 shots, but 5,7,9 !!! What about HDR shooters?? So wellbuild camera without this important function?
Maybe time to sell 7D and buy 60D and use  magical "not officlal" firmware...
Marco
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: mchubi on June 28, 2012, 01:06:47 PM
@herbert
Quote
"There is the AF.Drive button on the top of the camera:"
I did not mean changing focus-mode. I meant switching between single and continuous shoot (max. 8 frames/sec).

@mitchell3417
Quote
"There's a button for that on the top of the camera. I really don't know what you mean here."
That M-Fn one? Nope, does not work. And the other four ones have no influence on changing single-shooting to high-speed or low-speed continuous.
-> [  ] -> [  ]]] -> [  ]]]H

(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-kY5cpbLX9Zw/T38hI8d5MkI/AAAAAAAAA4U/-cZTcZmUYqw/s1600/QuickMenu_FrameRate.jpg)
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: Etienne on June 28, 2012, 01:07:59 PM
And no video crop modes - on the 7D v2, on the 5DIII or on the T4i.

Canon,  you're supposed to be going forwards, not backwards.  I want flexible video crop modes in all resolutions, preferably with smooth transitions rather than steps accessed through the menus.

+1000 on video crop mode. It works really well on the T3i, and I expected that feature to become standard on all models. It's inexplicable why they withheld this!

Same with AF in video. The T4i can use the new STM for video focus, but the 5DIII cannot. Go figure  :o
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: AvTvM on June 28, 2012, 01:40:09 PM
I am not excited. It's a long list but most items don't really do much for me - or most other 7D users.

* Buffer size ... fine. Hardly ever take more than 5-10 shots in fast series anyway. I know, for sports shooters it is different. But I bet, 95%+ of all 7D users are not going to use 23 (25) RAW buffer more often than I do.

* Auto-ISO ... upper ISO limit. Good. But still miles away from fully functioning Auto-ISO (as seen in the Nikon D800, D4). This impementation is still a lot inferior to Nikon's D7000

* GPS-compatibility ... nice. But that fat, expensive, hot-shoe-hogging GPS-E2 unit is just ridiculuos. Actually, it won't even transmit data via the hotshoe, oh no - it needs an additional, external USB cable.  Why not finally a small GPS-USB dongle, something like the GP-E1 but with a USB plug, instead of some proprietary Canon-connector working with the 1D X / C only?   

* faster scrolling in zoomed playback ... fine. No big deal. Why not from the very start?

* in camera raw conversion ... gets the 7D to the level that most competitors reached about 7 years ago

* in-camera rating ... give me a break.

* everything else .. basically firmware junk, either useless or should have benn in that cam from the very start.

and where are the following firmware items:
* Exposure bracketing with 5/7/x shots .. user selectable?
* metering linked to active AF-field in Spot metering?
these features would be way more useful on a 7D than "time zones" or other bloated firmware gadgets.

And to top it all off: what is taking you so long Canon? August ...  WOW, I am impressed.
NOT.

I would definitely NOT pay for this FW update. And even as a freebie it is very little, very late. I got my 7D almost 3 years ago!
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: neuroanatomist on June 28, 2012, 01:48:32 PM
* Auto-ISO ... upper ISO limit. Good. But still miles away from fully functioning Auto-ISO (as seen in the Nikon D800, D4). This impementation is still a lot inferior to Nikon's D7000

Right.  So, say you've been wandering in the desert for a few days, no water, dying of thirst.  Someone comes along and hands you a Dixie cup of water, do you pour it out because it's not the Big Gulp your mirage-addled mind was imagining?   :o
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: Irishpanther on June 28, 2012, 02:03:18 PM

That M-Fn one? Nope, does not work. And the other four ones have no influence on changing single-shooting to high-speed or low-speed continuous.
-> [  ] -> [  ]]] -> [  ]]]H

(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-kY5cpbLX9Zw/T38hI8d5MkI/AAAAAAAAA4U/-cZTcZmUYqw/s1600/QuickMenu_FrameRate.jpg)

The AF-Drive button absolutely does have influence on the shooting mode.  The top scroll controls the AF mode and the back scroll wheel will change your drive mode.  Takes maybe a second and a half (being conservative, pretty sure I can flip this in under a second) and you don't even have to move the camera from your eye.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: akiskev on June 28, 2012, 02:18:34 PM
How is this upgrade to buffer size possible?? Does this mean that all this time there was a software limitation which was put on purpose? If so, why? Or was it some kind of persistent bug?
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: AvTvM on June 28, 2012, 02:21:11 PM
* Auto-ISO ... upper ISO limit. Good. But still miles away from fully functioning Auto-ISO (as seen in the Nikon D800, D4). This impementation is still a lot inferior to Nikon's D7000
Right.  So, say you've been wandering in the desert for a few days, no water, dying of thirst.  Someone comes along and hands you a Dixie cup of water, do you pour it out because it's not the Big Gulp your mirage-addled mind was imagining?   :o

ah yes ... Canon the good samaritan saving ppor folks from starving.
Sorry, I have to wake you from your religious visions.
I found a much better analogy for how I feel being a paying Canon customer instead of a Nikon client: 
Cucumber Grape Monkey Experiment (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HK8Mp3OJYjk#ws)

I pretty much feel very CUCUMBERED by Canon, you know?! And I may just throw their FW update straight back at them.   >:(
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: Mt Spokane Photography on June 28, 2012, 02:22:16 PM
I thiink its fantastic, a updated body for free.  Canon seldom adds features to a older body, so they must be seeing sales sag, while they do not yet have a replacement ready.
I likely would not buy a MK II, so the update is very welcome.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: BM on June 28, 2012, 02:41:05 PM
Hi at all,

well, what I am really missing is the possibility of a quick change between a single-shot and fast multi-shot. The need to use the quick-menue is quite awkward. If you could assign that feature to the "jpg-raw-switch-button" for example, it would be a real improvement.


You can program "One shot <-> Ai servo" function to "Depth-of-Field Preview Button". Big problem is that this "Depth-of-Field Preview Button" is on very hard situation. And second big problem is: why I can't program this funtion to any another buttons? Why there is different funtions available for all programmable buttons? Why all the funtions do not have available for all the buttons? And for this same scene, Why I can't program buttons: "RAW-JPG", "Q" and "PictureStyle"? These functions are very useless for me.


I'm very happy that Canon release new firmware for old camera. Litle bit I waiting more features for shooting. I can't understand these post-process staf on camera.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: CanonUser99 on June 28, 2012, 03:17:32 PM
Well considering Canon don't usually enhance their products, only fix bugs, I am quite glad to hear about this.

Most welcome for me is the Auto ISO limit.

I would really like the movie crop mode and a twist out screen but I doubt they can help with the 2nd one.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: distant.star on June 28, 2012, 03:25:02 PM
.

Interesting fantasy, Big Brain. For me, I don't pour it out the dixie cup of water, I throw it in his face for teasing me. If you don't have enough water to save my life, go to hell! I could pee a dixie cup full of water and have that much to drink.

As several have suggested, this "upgrade" has little substance, and that suggests a more covert purpose. Unfortunately, like all companies and most individuals in this time of oligarchic banditry, Canon is squeezing its resources. It probably can't manage the resources to retool for a 7D2 at this point, especially after just doing it for the 5D3 and the 1DX.

One interesting observation is that the 5D2 body has been removed from the Canon refurb shop. It's still available as a kit with some lenses you don't want to buy, but the body alone is gone. That might suggest the rumored sub-5D3 full-frame is in the offing. On the other hand, it could simply suggest the 5D2 has pretty much tanked since the 5D3 became available.

Since Canon has suggested these "upgrades" are in response to request from users, I'd love to know how many asked for that wind-noise squelching feature. Those foamy microphone covers are such a drag!



* Auto-ISO ... upper ISO limit. Good. But still miles away from fully functioning Auto-ISO (as seen in the Nikon D800, D4). This impementation is still a lot inferior to Nikon's D7000

Right.  So, say you've been wandering in the desert for a few days, no water, dying of thirst.  Someone comes along and hands you a Dixie cup of water, do you pour it out because it's not the Big Gulp your mirage-addled mind was imagining?   :o
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: CanonUser99 on June 28, 2012, 04:36:33 PM
.
As several have suggested, this "upgrade" has little substance, and that suggests a more covert purpose.

Of course Canon are doing it for their sake rather than ours, would you expect anything else? This is no more than enhancing the 7D's feature matrix to make it more appealing than the 60D or to a lesser extent the 650D.

Canon are not going to add all the features you, me and everybody else wants to every camera, they want to keep selling cameras not have us get the perfect camera and only upgrade again in 10 years time.

Since I am getting it for free and at least one of the enhancements is of use to me I am not complaining (and I usually do).

However I will wait until people have loaded this new version just to make sure they don't remove some other feature...
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: mchubi on June 28, 2012, 05:46:39 PM
@Irishpanther:
Quote
The AF-Drive button absolutely does have influence on the shooting mode.  The top scroll controls the AF mode and the back scroll wheel will change your drive mode.
Okkkkkay. I have to admit: shame on me...  ;) You're right.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: Marsu42 on June 28, 2012, 07:39:01 PM
So, if I want AF microadjustment I'd better sell my 60D? I loved it until I bought my 50 f/1.4.

No, you buy a lens copy that needs no afma - that might involve some returns and is a major hassle (Thanks, Canon) but is a possibility to make open aperture lenses work on the 60d.

Damn, can there be 3rd party firmwares?

Um, like Magic Lantern!?!? Works on the 60d/5d2/... execpt for the 7d.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: tq0cr5i on June 28, 2012, 08:11:21 PM
I would want a version 3 firmware for my EOS 5D Mark II if there was.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: briansquibb on June 28, 2012, 11:42:34 PM
Say the autoiso limit is set to 400 and the exposure would ideally require iso800.

How will it deal with that? Slow the shutter?Open the aperture or just flash the dot at the user?
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: jrista on June 28, 2012, 11:47:22 PM
* metering linked to active AF-field in Spot metering?

Canon's iFCL color metering always factors in the active AF points. FOCUS, COLOR and LUMINANCE metering. Its weighted, and exactly what weighting it gets depends on your metering mode, but this has been around since the 7D was released (and is available in all other bodies that use iFCL metering, including the 5D III.)

Here are Canon's explanations:

Quote
iFCL Metering with 63 zone dual-layer metering sensor that utilizes AF and color information for optimizing exposure and image quality

The EOS 7D features a 63 zone dual-layer sensor designed to complement the 19-point AF system. By taking into account the color and luminosity surrounding chosen AF points, this system delivers high levels of accuracy for better results even in difficult lighting situations. Since the metering sensor has a color measurement function, exposure errors and focus errors caused by different light sources are minimized; the EOS 7D gives stable exposure from shot to shot in situations where light changes, such as in a theater or concert hall. This makes the EOS 7D ideal for scenes with extreme difference in brightness such as brightly lit scenes or backlit scenes; the camera balances exposure of the main subject at the background, and exposures are not overly influenced by bright areas in the shot.

And:

Quote
Metering algorithm

To work with the iFCL metering sensor, the EOS 7D also features a specific metering algorithm. The EOS 7D always measures focus with all AF points regardless of the selected AF mode. During the exposure reading the EOS 7D looks to see which points, in addition to the selected point, have achieved or almost achieved focus. This information lets the camera know which part of the image is the subject. It then takes metering readings from the zones corresponding to the AF points that have achieved (or almost achieved) focus and combines them with readings from all the other zones. This allows for consistent shot-to-shot exposure, even in complex situations – for example, where there are reflections from a model’s glasses.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: jrista on June 29, 2012, 12:13:09 AM
I am not excited. It's a long list but most items don't really do much for me - or most other 7D users.

Don't presume you are the supreme exemplar of all 7D users. Personally, as a 7D user, I find many of the new features to be very welcome. They are free, and they give new live to a my camera, rather than requiring that I buy a new 7D II THIS YEAR...something I don't have the funds to do. I believe the majority of 7D users are more like myself than you...welcoming FREE IMPROVEMENTS. The vocality here is a minority.

* Buffer size ... fine. Hardly ever take more than 5-10 shots in fast series anyway. I know, for sports shooters it is different. But I bet, 95%+ of all 7D users are not going to use 23 (25) RAW buffer more often than I do.

A deeper buffer is always a good thing. Its not about the number of continuous unbroken shots...its about how many full-framerate shots you can keep taking, even if they are in short bursts like 3-5 or 7-10 frames, before the camera has to start slowing down. Right now, with my bird photography, even though I usually only take 2-4 shot bursts for perching, wading, or standing birds and up to around 8-10 for BIF, its NOT infrequent that I find the opportunity to take multiple bursts one after the other, before the buffer is empty. A deeper buffer is VERY WELCOME...especially when paired with a higher speed CF card. I already get around 24-25 shots...this firmware update adds 7 more...which would mean I can get around 31-32 now. ABSOLUTELY NOT COMPLAINING ABOUT THAT!!

* Auto-ISO ... upper ISO limit. Good. But still miles away from fully functioning Auto-ISO (as seen in the Nikon D800, D4). This impementation is still a lot inferior to Nikon's D7000

This is also a welcome feature. There are times when I would prefer to shoot at ISO 6400 and expose properly despite the noise, than shoot at ISO 3200 and have to boost in post. Noise is bad either way, however an extra stop is an extra stop, and from a shutter speed standpoint a single stop can be the difference between getting the shot and not. Again, most definitely welcome feature.

As for Nikon's functionality, the only thing the 7D is lacking vs. the D7000 is the minimum shutter speed option. The minimum shutter speed exists in Canon's direct competition to the D800 and D4, the 5D III and 1D X. There are some additional options on those cameras as they have corresponding camera HARDWARE to support them, such. This is just a firmware (software) update to an old camera, its not adding new hardware, so we can't expect additional Auto ISO features that require hardware counterparts. Competitively, Canon is pretty level here, and at least they are offering this enhancement to an existing and increasingly old camera body...FOR FREE.

* faster scrolling in zoomed playback ... fine. No big deal. Why not from the very start?

When your out in the field and you need to chimp quickly, better firmware performance is always a bonus. I like my birds eyes to be sharp, but good shots are always happening around you when birds are flitting about. Spending a lot of time zooming and panning to determine if a shot is a keeper or not is also a valuable thing. Better yet if performance is improved for those short video clips that are necessary to really capture what your subject is doing when a still doesn't do it justice.

Stop complaining. If you want what Nikon has to offer, ditch Canon and move to Nikon. Bitching and moaning about Canon when they DO GIVE YOU FREE S____ ain't going to make them your friend. It won't change the past either. Going forward Canon offers competitive features like in-camera retouching and better bracketing, as well as things like in-camera multiexposure or even things Nikon cameras can't always do...such as continuous shooting at a lower rate once the buffer is full (this is an area where Canon excels, but one where Nikon is hit and miss, miss more often than not). So if you stick with the brand, you won't be disappointed. But I don't think thats going to satisfy you...the only thing that will really satisfy you, based on your comments, is a Nikon camera. SO GO GET ONE ALREADY!
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: briansquibb on June 29, 2012, 03:29:20 AM
* Auto-ISO ... upper ISO limit. Good. But still miles away from fully functioning Auto-ISO (as seen in the Nikon D800, D4). This impementation is still a lot inferior to Nikon's D7000

This is also a welcome feature. There are times when I would prefer to shoot at ISO 6400 and expose properly despite the noise, than shoot at ISO 3200 and have to boost in post. Noise is bad either way, however an extra stop is an extra stop, and from a shutter speed standpoint a single stop can be the difference between getting the shot and not. Again, most definitely welcome feature.

As for Nikon's functionality, the only thing the 7D is lacking vs. the D7000 is the minimum shutter speed option. The minimum shutter speed exists in Canon's direct competition to the D800 and D4, the 5D III and 1D X.

The AutoIso + max ISO will be very welcome. It certainly would make me think about keeping the 7D as a walkabout/shoot the family camera by maxing the ISO at 400. Still no details as to what will happen if the ISO wants to be higher than the max - will the shutter speed/aperture be altered or will the little dot flash at me?
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: AvTvM on June 29, 2012, 04:35:36 AM
The AutoIso + max ISO will be very welcome. It certainly would make me think about keeping the 7D as a walkabout/shoot the family camera by maxing the ISO at 400. Still no details as to what will happen if the ISO wants to be higher than the max - will the shutter speed/aperture be altered or will the little dot flash at me?

in Auto-ISO camera will adjust one or both of the two exposure parameters other than ISO if max. permissible ISO setting is reached.
Just tested it with lens cap on my 7D [current firmware - Auto-ISO max. = 3200].

Results are:
P ... will open aperture to max, raise ISO to max. [3200] and slow shutter time to camera max. [30"]; if this results in under-exposure, it will blink in the viewfinder [warning] but does NOT freeze shutter   

Av ... aperture setting will be maintained as long as possible, meaning it raises ISO to max [3200] and slows shutter time to max [30"]. If Safety Shift in C.Fn is enabled, it will override chosen aperture and open aperture all the way, otherwise it will stick to chosen aperture setting. If underexposure results, it will blink warning, but keep exposing.

Tv ... same as in Av ...  depending on Safety Shift on or off it will maintain chosen time value or slow all the way to 30" once ISO = 3200 and aperture = wide open.

M ... remains "M" ... meaning: you set time value and aperture, camera manages ISO up to max. [7D currently 3200] to achieve correct exposure. If this is not sufficient, it will expose and show you on the light balance at bottom of viewfinder, that exposure is to dark. As always in "M" ... at this point photog needs to slow time and/or open up aperture if still possible to achieve correct exposure ... if at all possible at ISO3200, open aperture and 30" shutter time ... which is a pretty low EV ;-)

With the new firmware, the only thing that will change, is that max. ISO limit can be user selected between ISO 400 and 6400.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: briansquibb on June 29, 2012, 04:41:18 AM
@AvTvM - Many thanks for confirming that

Now all we need is the min shutter speed and we get the faux M with ec through using AV

M with autoiso/ec would be good but I suspect min shutter speed would be easier
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: AvTvM on June 29, 2012, 04:52:25 AM
@AvTvM - Many thanks for confirming that
Now all we need is the min shutter speed and we get the faux M with ec through using AV
M with autoiso/ec would be good but I suspect min shutter speed would be easier

I cannot see any firmware/programming difficulty whatsover to enable EC in M mode as it is enabled in ALL  shooting modes [other than "M" and "B"]. I suspect all it would take is to change a "0 for No" to "1 for Yes" in one single byte of the EPROM for "M" mode.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: briansquibb on June 29, 2012, 05:13:32 AM
@AvTvM - Many thanks for confirming that
Now all we need is the min shutter speed and we get the faux M with ec through using AV
M with autoiso/ec would be good but I suspect min shutter speed would be easier

I cannot see any firmware/programming difficulty whatsover to enable EC in M mode as it is enabled in ALL  shooting modes [other than "M" and "B"]. I suspect all it would take is to change a "0 for No" to "1 for Yes" in one single byte of the EPROM for "M" mode.

They already do this coding in the 1 series - so the code would just have to be transfered across
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: Marsu42 on June 29, 2012, 05:36:48 AM
I cannot see any firmware/programming difficulty whatsover to enable EC in M mode as it is enabled in ALL  shooting modes

A company designing the 1dx surely is capable of implementing much more features in firmware than are currently available. The question just is: What does Canon want? The answer: Maximize profit. This means: 1) minimize costs (like recycling the 5d2 sensor for the 5d3 and have as little support/testing for seldom used firmware features as possible). And 2) maximize money flowing to them (sell as as much cameras as they can and as expensive models as they can).

To achieve the sales goal, first they have to competitive, so they of course provide the basic feature set (like 3x bracketing) and cover up for problems (like in-camera hdr & multi-shot nr). Furthermore, they have to differentiate their products. And between mid-range and top cameras this will concern features that are important if you are an advanced photog. Examples of this are afma (dropped on the 60d for the 7d) and Ec on m (no dice on 5d) - so unless you can come up with a commercial reason for Canon to implement it, forget it.

It is very unfortunate Magic Lantern is not able to fix most things outside live view - but well, never look a gift horse in the mouth.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: neuroanatomist on June 29, 2012, 06:37:44 AM
* metering linked to active AF-field in Spot metering?

Canon's iFCL color metering always factors in the active AF points. FOCUS, COLOR and LUMINANCE metering. Its weighted, and exactly what weighting it gets depends on your metering mode, but this has been around since the 7D was released (and is available in all other bodies that use iFCL metering, including the 5D III.)

I think you're missing the point.  Those long statements from Canon about iFCL metering which you posted are referring to evaluative metering, and yes, that's been weighted toward the selected AF point for a long time.  What AvTvM is talking about is spot metering, where the metering is done exclusively (not 'weighted' to some unknown fraction) at a small spot (1.5-4% of the field, depending on model).  On 1-series bodies, that spot metering areas can be immediately surrounding any selected AF point, whereas on all other current bodies, spot metering is only in the center, regardles of the AF point seleted (meaning if you want an off-center subject and you want to focus and meter specifically on that subject, you must meter-AELock-recompose-focus-shoot, vs. just shoot).

Try it yourself on a non-1-series - put an off-center AF point on a static subject that's much darker or brighter than the rest of the scene, meter using evaluative metering, then try spot metering right on that subject - you'll usually get a different exposure value, sometimes very different depending on subject and background.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: neuroanatomist on June 29, 2012, 06:41:54 AM
When I look at the list of new features in the v2.0 firmware, I think: "Gee, there are some nice improvements there, a couple of them are even useful to me." 

Then I get this email from Canon.  I mean, I kow that exaggeration is Marketing's job...but...reallly?!?   :o

Then again, I suppose the truth, "We're throwing you a bone with the inclusion of a few features we delivered on newer, lower-end models," was too long to fit inside the center of the sunburst-type graphic...
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: Marsu42 on June 29, 2012, 06:59:08 AM
Then I get this email from Canon.  I mean, I kow that exaggeration is Marketing's job...but...reallly?!?   :o

Omh, this is hilarious - if this wasn't you posting the picture, I'd say it's pure sarcasm from a Nikon troll :-> ... imagine what Canon could achieve if they gave 1/10th of their marketing staff a programing tutorial and put them into development to figure out and implement really useful features...
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: infared on June 29, 2012, 07:35:13 AM
Two Words: EXPANDED BRACKETING
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: Marsu42 on June 29, 2012, 07:46:52 AM
Two Words: EXPANDED BRACKETING

To say something good about Canon for a change: Nikon cripples its camera bodies even more, and there's no Magic Lantern to provide unlimited, automatic bracketing there. For example, the d7000 only allows for 3x +-2ev bracketing which is a known Nikon nuisance and often isn't enough for very high contrast hdr scenes...
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: DB on June 29, 2012, 09:35:33 AM
Canon 7D Firmware 2.0 Update (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GEqBByBcfs#)
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: candyman on June 29, 2012, 10:28:49 AM
Canon 7D Firmware 2.0 Update (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GEqBByBcfs#)

In the video it is mentioned:

2 Figure based on updated firmware, ISO 100, Standard Picture Style and with UDMA 7 CF memory cards
Note: UDMA 7 CF memory card read/write speeds are not fully supported with the EOS 7D Digital SLR camera

Pardon me, I am trying to understand that. You have a speed increasement based upon use of UDMA 7 CF memory cards. But the UDMA 7 CF Memory card is not fully supported? Can someone explain what they mean here?
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: unfocused on June 29, 2012, 10:55:44 AM
Then I get this email from Canon.  I mean, I kow that exaggeration is Marketing's job...but...reallly?!?   :o

Omh, this is hilarious - if this wasn't you posting the picture, I'd say it's pure sarcasm from a Nikon troll :-> ...

It is amusing. But I keep asking myself, would Canon be offering this firmware and hyping it to this degree if they were about to kill off the 7D series? These are the actions of a company trying to buy some time between upgrades, not a company about to radically reposition or dump a model.

As Neuro knows, there is all kinds of crazy talk going on in other threads. Fantasies about a new APS-H body being delivered to the masses by bigfoot riding a unicorn notwithstanding, I see this firmware announcement as an affirmation of the 7D series.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: candyman on June 29, 2012, 10:58:30 AM
O, and another thing. What is it with the UDMA 7 and speed?

Sandisk is offering a 600x (90MB/s) 64GB CF and they mention it as: UDMA 6
Transcend is offering a 600x (90MB/s) 64GB CF and they mention it as: UDMA 7

Both have the same specifications but are not the same UDMA?
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: John Thomas on June 29, 2012, 11:35:56 AM
@AvTvM - Many thanks for confirming that
Now all we need is the min shutter speed and we get the faux M with ec through using AV
M with autoiso/ec would be good but I suspect min shutter speed would be easier

I cannot see any firmware/programming difficulty whatsover to enable EC in M mode as it is enabled in ALL  shooting modes [other than "M" and "B"]. I suspect all it would take is to change a "0 for No" to "1 for Yes" in one single byte of the EPROM for "M" mode.

Hmmm... It might be if they already have the code in 7D's firmware, otherwise I don't think so. There are other things to be updated like the GUI, for example. Don't forget that EC gauge in M mode shows other things.

However this isn't a showstopper at all and they must do it, imho. Just pointing out that sometimes the things aren't so easy as it sounds.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: CanonCollector on June 29, 2012, 12:06:41 PM
The unexpected firmware that only makes this very good camera even better by adding new features beyond those you purchased it with is not good enough for you people? OMG
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: jasonkrasnov on June 29, 2012, 12:27:17 PM
The Canon 7D's firmware will be released in early August.

There will not be a Canon 7D Mark ii anytime soon and I would gladly buy a 3 year old Canon 7d for shooting photo and video. 

The new firmware has a lot of great updates with manual recording levels for sound.  This is a huge help for filmmakers and photographers transitioning into video.

Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: candyman on June 29, 2012, 01:07:10 PM
O, and another thing. What is it with the UDMA 7 and speed?

Sandisk is offering a 600x (90MB/s) 64GB CF and they mention it as: UDMA 6
Transcend is offering a 600x (90MB/s) 64GB CF and they mention it as: UDMA 7

Both have the same specifications but are not the same UDMA?

UDMA is the way in which the card can talk to the camera.

The speed is how fast the card can read/write internally.


Okay.
So to stay with the example of the two cards mentioned here; I have to choose the Transcend to take full advantage of the firmware new introduced maximum RAW buffer since it is a UDMA 7 with 90MB/s. Correct?
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: DB on June 29, 2012, 01:41:42 PM
O, and another thing. What is it with the UDMA 7 and speed?

Sandisk is offering a 600x (90MB/s) 64GB CF and they mention it as: UDMA 6
Transcend is offering a 600x (90MB/s) 64GB CF and they mention it as: UDMA 7

Both have the same specifications but are not the same UDMA?

UDMA is the way in which the card can talk to the camera.

The speed is how fast the card can read/write internally.

Plus the maximum write speed on a UDMA 6 card is 133MB/sec, but is up to 167MB/sec for UDMA 7, so > 25% faster (in terms of actually getting the data from the camera processor onto the memory card).

It seems that Canon have tried to address this issue back in April 2011 with firmware 1.2.5, but with not too much success (see link below). Now it appears that they've mastered the problem.

http://www.learn.usa.canon.com/resources/blogs/2011/20110426_eos7d_firmware125.shtml (http://www.learn.usa.canon.com/resources/blogs/2011/20110426_eos7d_firmware125.shtml)

It would appear that firmware 2.0 for the 7D will create a big uptick in demand for UDMA 7 CF cards, which by the way are quite difficult to find (on eBay only find one seller in Brooklyn, NY) and most sellers just say UDMA-enabled (not version 5, 6 or 7).
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: DHaass on June 29, 2012, 01:47:48 PM
One thing to note in the small print from the Canon USA site speaking to the firmware update:

* Figure based on ISO 100, Standard Picture Style and with UDMA CF memory card.

** Figure based on updated firmware, ISO 100, Standard Picture Style and with UDMA 7 CF memory cards. Note: UDMA 7 CF memory card read/write speeds are not fully supported with the EOS 7D Digital SLR camera, if using UDMA 7 memory cards, the read/write speeds will be equivalent to UDMA 6.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: jasonkrasnov on June 29, 2012, 02:55:53 PM
Does anyone know the deal for the GPS integration? 

I heard you can map out a route using google maps as well via a mounted receiver that can be attached?
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: Marsu42 on June 29, 2012, 03:52:56 PM
But I keep asking myself, would Canon be offering this firmware and hyping it to this degree if they were about to kill off the 7D series? These are the actions of a company trying to buy some time between upgrades, not a company about to radically reposition or dump a model.

You might be right, and since Canon seems to be very conservative (euphemism for non-innovative), maybe all will stay the same:

The 70d in q4/2012 might be a release like the 5d3: upgraded body (metal) and firmware (afma), but just a face-lifted sensor with the current tech. And then, maybe in q4/2013 with the time they just bought the 7d2 with a real sensor upgrade as the new aps-c flagship.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: japhoto on June 29, 2012, 05:59:30 PM
But I keep asking myself, would Canon be offering this firmware and hyping it to this degree if they were about to kill off the 7D series? These are the actions of a company trying to buy some time between upgrades, not a company about to radically reposition or dump a model.

You might be right, and since Canon seems to be very conservative (euphemism for non-innovative), maybe all will stay the same:

The 70d in q4/2012 might be a release like the 5d3: upgraded body (metal) and firmware (afma), but just a face-lifted sensor with the current tech. And then, maybe in q4/2013 with the time they just bought the 7d2 with a real sensor upgrade as the new aps-c flagship.

There could be many reasons for the bigger firmware upgrade. It could be that the demand for this 3 year old camera is down and they have loads of them in stock (or parts for 7D cameras that can not be used in another model). So they try to make it more appealing over the coming 70D with this firmware so they can keep selling it.

Sure it's good to see that Canon as a company is "supporting" the older gear as well, but I can also see why people are not too impressed with this upgrade in the whole. Most of the "new features" are quite trivial with a few exceptions and they sure are done in a way that doesn't even start to step on the toes of the more expensive models in the Canon lineup. The much wanted bracketing is one of these things.

It's a free update, which is great (although the timeline and the hype before it is ridiculous). What I don't get is the mentality that some here have about praising the update because it adds features to the camera that weren't even there when it was first bought. I think camera manufacturers should go even further with the firmware updates and definitely do them more often. As a piece of consumer electronics a camera isn't cheap so with the 7D I'm pretty sure they could have improved on the AF and more importantly the noise levels via firmware updates.

Maybe that's just me, but as consumers I think we should demand that the support from the manufacturer should be more than just incremental and trivial updates. With film cameras it was a different deal, but DSLRs could be made better just by implementing a new firmware. The manufacturers seem to be stuck in the film ages still...

And yes, I do see the reason why they do things this way, but it isn't necessarily the best way to do business.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: AvTvM on June 29, 2012, 06:38:22 PM
1. the current firmware upgrade even if it is free is: too little, too late
2. rather than this hyped, free FW update  I would have preferred Canon to provide an open interface for third party software providers like Magic Lantern for the 7D. THEN we would be receiveing firmware updates that would be truly innovative and worthwiloe. Rather than the lukewarm Canon software junk.

3. Buffer depth: the table at the bottom of Canon's marketing info on  firmware 2.0.X,
http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/consumer/standard_display/EOS7D_firmware_compare (http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/consumer/standard_display/EOS7D_firmware_compare)
and the small print at the very bottom state, that RAW buffer goes from 15 to 23 frames in succession if a 8GB CF card ("standard speed" - whatever that may mean) is in the camera. 25 RAWs in succession were achieved using an UDMA-7 CF Crad with 128 GB (unfortunately they don't say which specific make and model). The smallprint footnote states, that UDMA-7 is not supported by the 7D (irrespective of firmware version). UDMA 7 cards operate at the same speed as UDMA-6 cards in the 7D. Unfortunately Canon leaves it open, whether 25 RAWs in a row could also be achieved with an UDMA-6 card and/or with CF cards smaller than 128 GB.

So I guess we will have to wait until Rob Galbraith tests the new 7D firmware with CF cards of various speeds and sizes. I hope he is gin to do this.

My take on this is, that Canon has tweaked the firmware a little bit to make better use of faster CF cards - but that's all there is to it. Many users report that they do get 24-26 RAWs in succession with thze 7D and current firmware plus some of the faster CF cards.

Certainly this firmware upgrade does NOT make the 7D a new, better camera. It is basically the smallest possible patch to some of the shortcomings the camera had all along.  This is not to say, it is a bad camera - I use one myself and generally am fairly happy with it. However, items like Auto ISO, exposure bracketing and some other lacking or poorly implemented features could and should have been fixed much better and much sooner with one of the many firmware updates we already had. Rather than just correcting spelling mistakes in the Greek or Korean language menus. 

 
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: Marsu42 on June 30, 2012, 04:36:44 AM
Maybe that's just me, but as consumers I think we should demand that the support from the manufacturer should be more than just incremental and trivial updates.

That's the well-known problematic point: demand how? Writing forum posts? Buy less Canon gear or switch to Nikon as a regular consumer? All of these won't be noticed or for the wrong reasons. The things that might work is cps professionals telling Canon they're considering to switch to another brand because of mediocre support.

And yes, I do see the reason why they do things this way, but it isn't necessarily the best way to do business.

I hate to say it, but personally I think Canon is rather clever engineering people into buying the most expensive stuff which they never though they'd to a short time ago. Canon now just has to meet the competition, i.e. upgrade their sensors like on the 1dx and do r&d on mirrorless.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: japhoto on June 30, 2012, 09:13:11 AM
Maybe that's just me, but as consumers I think we should demand that the support from the manufacturer should be more than just incremental and trivial updates.

That's the well-known problematic point: demand how? Writing forum posts? Buy less Canon gear or switch to Nikon as a regular consumer? All of these won't be noticed or for the wrong reasons. The things that might work is cps professionals telling Canon they're considering to switch to another brand because of mediocre support.

And yes, I do see the reason why they do things this way, but it isn't necessarily the best way to do business.

I hate to say it, but personally I think Canon is rather clever engineering people into buying the most expensive stuff which they never though they'd to a short time ago. Canon now just has to meet the competition, i.e. upgrade their sensors like on the 1dx and do r&d on mirrorless.

I do agree with you here, not buying Canon gear doesn't do any good since other manufacturers do things quite similarly so the "message" wouldn't go through. Although I must say that when I had 4/3rds gear, Olympus did for example release optimizations to their AF systems both for bodies and lenses (the lenses also had upgradeable firmware). And to my knowledge the issues were pretty minor and they released a fix in a reasonable time frame. I don't know if that's too much to expect, but again I agree that I don't know how this change could be made.

Also I tend to agree with you on the business side of things, I meant originally that it's not perhaps the most ethical way to do business, but yes, it is damn effective. Just look at the 5D - series, making sure there was a lack of much needed features on the MkII they can pretty much ask for what they want for the MkIII. But at the same time I feel that they could trickle the features down from the 1D - series to their flagship APS-C - sensor camera (at the moment 7D). I don't think that for example adding better bracketing to the 7D or its successor would affect the sales of the 1DX.

It would be really cool if someone would release a modular DSLR like the computers are at the moment. With upgradeable "motherboard", sensor, AF-system, body etc. I'd be all over that :D
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: Marsu42 on June 30, 2012, 10:08:04 AM
Quote from: japhoto link=topic=7665.msg141144#msg141144
It would be really cool if someone would release a modular DSLR like the computers are at the moment. With upgradeable "motherboard", sensor, AF-system, body etc. I'd be all over that :D

It would be completely sufficient to provide documented firmware hooks for 3rd party firmware like magic lantern to do more things outside live view, and without time-consuming reverse engineering. They could also invent a "this will void your warranty" flag if they fear too many bricked bodies returning.

Actually, I think this would benefit Canon because ml only runs on Canon's very good digic processors (well, except dual cpu bodies like the 7d). And because 1d or 5d users would still buy the same camera body and not say "Well, ye know, the 600d does unlimited bracketing with magic lantern, why would I need a 5d3?". So imho, this specific shortcoming is poor business due to sheer, blatant ignorance and arrogance.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: skitron on June 30, 2012, 11:15:46 AM
1. the current firmware upgrade even if it is free is: too little, too late.

I agree. I passed on the 7D for the sole reason it did not have manual audio control. Now it finally has it but the rest is getting rather dated. So good for existing owners, but no incentive to buy one unless a really cheap price.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: Marsu42 on June 30, 2012, 12:10:55 PM
So good for existing owners, but no incentive to buy one unless a really cheap price.

At least with working auto-iso, the 7d is up to par to newer bodies and it's possible to circumvent the sensor's problems by setting an upper iso limit like on the 60d. So imho if you need a high fps camera with ok iq, the 7d at the current price could be counted as "cheap" given the Canon & Nikon competition in this sports sector.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: SDsc0rch on June 30, 2012, 02:16:03 PM
The unexpected firmware that only makes this very good camera even better by adding new features beyond those you purchased it with is not good enough for you people? OMG

^this^
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: AvTvM on June 30, 2012, 04:47:00 PM
So good for existing owners, but no incentive to buy one unless a really cheap price.

At least with working auto-iso, the 7d is up to par to newer bodies and it's possible to circumvent the sensor's problems by setting an upper iso limit like on the 60d. So imho if you need a high fps camera with ok iq, the 7d at the current price could be counted as "cheap" given the Canon & Nikon competition in this sports sector.

I do  not consider AUto-ISO "solved". Canon has supplied the ABSOLUTE MINIMUM... and it comes three years after the cam has been released. A cheap, extremely simple poiece of software code.  Every Nikon from  the D80 and better has a better Auto ISO implementation than firmware 2.0.X for the  7D, Canon's APS-C flagship camera.

And the 7D's lease on life probably  expires  the very minute Nikon brings out a DX D400. If they decide to ever get one to market. :-)  Until a possibly superior D400 materializes, I do prefer my 7D over the Nikon D300s, despite the D300s' better Auto-ISO feature. :-)
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: gabriele on July 02, 2012, 06:57:39 AM
Would have been nice if they added some of those functions on the way more expensive Canon EOS 5D Mark II.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: Marsu42 on July 02, 2012, 07:19:37 AM
Would have been nice if they added some of those functions on the way more expensive Canon EOS 5D Mark II.

True, but that's why everybody recons that the 7d2 is not around the corner: Canon does not seem to be in the habit of adding features to cameras that already or nearly have a successor. So the firmware upgrade for the 5d2 is the 5d3.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: gabriele on July 02, 2012, 10:20:11 AM
Would have been nice if they added some of those functions on the way more expensive Canon EOS 5D Mark II.

True, but that's why everybody recons that the 7d2 is not around the corner: Canon does not seem to be in the habit of adding features to cameras that already or nearly have a successor. So the firmware upgrade for the 5d2 is the 5d3.

I know that's the hint of no 7D Mark II around but I hate this kind of Canon marketing: never seen such an expensive firmware upgrade!
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: Marsu42 on July 02, 2012, 10:30:01 AM
I know that's the hint of no 7D Mark II around but I hate this kind of Canon marketing: never seen such an expensive firmware upgrade!

Good marketing is not when you love it, but when you buy it (or at least don't buy something else) :-o ... just like the most annoying tv advertisement or the radio jingle you can't get out of your head. But of course you know that, I just couldn't resist writing it again.
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: PCPhil on July 02, 2012, 10:37:39 AM
Would have been nice if they added some of those functions on the way more expensive Canon EOS 5D Mark II.

True, but that's why everybody recons that the 7d2 is not around the corner: Canon does not seem to be in the habit of adding features to cameras that already or nearly have a successor. So the firmware upgrade for the 5d2 is the 5d3.

Ooo.  Download link please    :)
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: canon20d7d on July 02, 2012, 11:25:55 AM
will the firmware update give us audio controls while recording like the 5dm3 and let you see your audio levels live? or will it be more like the audio controls on the 5dm2/60d where you have to preset your settings?

i cant really tell by the descriptions
Title: Re: 7D Firmware officially announced
Post by: cheinly on August 03, 2012, 02:09:45 PM
I hope this firmware comes out soon as my GP-E2 just shipped from B&H. hate to have GPS that will not work with camera till i get the firmware update