canon rumors FORUM

Gear Talk => Software & Accessories => Topic started by: EOBeav on October 07, 2012, 01:10:24 PM

Title: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: EOBeav on October 07, 2012, 01:10:24 PM
I need to get a 2nd battery for my 5DmkII.  The problem is, I don't know what a better deal is, the original Canon that sells for $50USD+, or an off-brand with similar specs that sells for $35USD? 
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: neuroanatomist on October 07, 2012, 01:21:53 PM
Depends on the off-brand. Some are fine, others don't deliver the mAh capacity they claim, or fail prematurely, some cheap knock-offs lack safety circuitry.  You pays your money and you takes your chances...   ;)
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: Mt Spokane Photography on October 07, 2012, 08:30:44 PM
Depends on the off-brand. Some are fine, others don't deliver the mAh capacity they claim, or fail prematurely, some cheap knock-offs lack safety circuitry.  You pays your money and you takes your chances...   ;)
The problem is that those in a airplane or your family are taking chances with you.  I'm not aware of any way to determine the quality other than the manufacturers record of good performance.  That limits it to two or three alternate sellers at mose with a excellent record.
You likely paid a lot to get a good camera, why scrimp on the batteries and risk melting the camera down, or just having the battery die when you needed it.
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: CharlieB on October 07, 2012, 11:44:11 PM
I got two off brand batteries from B&H for my old Rebel / 400D

They worked just the same as the OEM Canon battery.  No difference I could tell...

If you shop, you can get a spare Canon battery for a little bit less.....
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: neuroanatomist on October 08, 2012, 06:58:46 AM
If you shop, you can get a spare Canon battery for a little bit less.....

You could also end up with a counterfeit battery.  If the deal looks too good to be true...  Shop around, but stick to Canon Authorized sellers for OEM batteries.
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: Sitting Elf on October 08, 2012, 07:29:08 AM
I have a few OEM batteries, but the costs outweigh the brand name.

I use Wasabi LP-E6 betteries in my 7D, 5D II and 5D III. They are available on Amazon for $15.99 each and work with the Canon charging unit. (Though I use other chargers as well).  They are 2200mAh which is more powerful than Canon's OEM battery.

The important thing about the Wasabi's is that they have a chip onboard that allows them to communicate with the cameras, giving full available power remaining info.  MANY of the other cheaper brands do NOT communicate, and so you don't know how close they are to running out.  I also have a Wasabi LP-E4N spare for my 1DX which also apprpriately communicates.

Having all the spares is important to me as all my cameras are gripped, and I use two batteries in each.

Take a peek:
http://www.amazon.com/Wasabi-Power-Battery-Canon-LP-E6/dp/B0041MY32Y/ (http://www.amazon.com/Wasabi-Power-Battery-Canon-LP-E6/dp/B0041MY32Y/)
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: noncho on October 08, 2012, 07:46:41 AM
I have second not genuine LP-E6 for my 60D. I bought it for 13$ from ebay, it's the same as my original, but with 70-80% of the capacity - great value.   
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: neuroanatomist on October 08, 2012, 07:58:17 AM
...it's the same as my original, but with 70-80% of the capacity...

"Same."  You keep using that word...I do not think it means what you think it means.
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: DJL329 on October 08, 2012, 08:35:31 AM
If you've got a $1,500-3,500 camera, why would you worry about trying to save $15-35 on a spare battery?   ???
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: tron on October 08, 2012, 09:22:11 AM
If you've got a $1,500-3,500 camera, why would you worry about trying to save $15-35 on a spare battery?   ???
+1
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: Sitting Elf on October 08, 2012, 12:10:21 PM
If you've got a $1,500-3,500 camera, why would you worry about trying to save $15-35 on a spare battery?   ???

1. Because I buy a LOT of them.
2. Because they work just fine, or longer than OEM at less than half the price
3. Because like Apple's prices on RAM which is ridiculous, Canon overcharges for batteries - Unnecessary
4. Because owning an expensive camera doesn't eliminate being cost-conscious or selective.
5. Because I like the yellow pin covers better than Canon's gray ones!  ;D
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: neuroanatomist on October 08, 2012, 12:16:27 PM
5. Because I like the yellow pin covers better than Canon's gray ones!  ;D

Ok, I can see the first four (with the caveat that cheaper may costs are being cut somewhere, and that somewhere is often QC).

But...but Canon LP-E6 and LP-E4N batteries all have yellow covers for the contacts.   :P
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: DJL329 on October 08, 2012, 01:25:04 PM
If you've got a $1,500-3,500 camera, why would you worry about trying to save $15-35 on a spare battery?   ???

1. Because I buy a LOT of them.
2. Because they work just fine, or longer than OEM at less than half the price
3. Because like Apple's prices on RAM which is ridiculous, Canon overcharges for batteries - Unnecessary
4. Because owning an expensive camera doesn't eliminate being cost-conscious or selective.
5. Because I like the yellow pin covers better than Canon's gray ones!  ;D

The issue is risk versus reward.  I wouldn't risk my $6,000 investment in 2 bodies on the chance that I might save about $30 on a battery.  Is some third-party company going to pay to repair your body if their battery damages it?
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: 7enderbender on October 08, 2012, 02:05:52 PM
I need to get a 2nd battery for my 5DmkII.  The problem is, I don't know what a better deal is, the original Canon that sells for $50USD+, or an off-brand with similar specs that sells for $35USD?


Considering that after all is said and done you are carrying around several thousand dollars worth of equipment I didn't see the value in saving 20 bucks on a battery. And I would recommend making it a point buying the original Canon batteries from an authorized dealer. There are very convincing looking counterfeit batteries out there down to the details and holograms on the package.
Batteries can go bad and cause damage. With an original one from a reputable dealer you are covered at least. 
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: Sitting Elf on October 08, 2012, 02:14:35 PM
Quote
The issue is risk versus reward.  I wouldn't risk my $6,000 investment in 2 bodies on the chance that I might save about $30 on a battery.  Is some third-party company going to pay to repair your body if their battery damages it?


Please show me any post anywhere on the net that has proof of a third party battery damaging a camera.
That's like saying that if you don't put a genuine GM air filter on your engine, you risk damage.

C'mon!  The risk is so low as to be non-existent.. but you go ahead and buy overpriced OEM batteries, most of which are made by the SAME companies that are selling under their own brand name for much cheaper.

I own 10 LP-E6 batteries not by Canon... as well as four Canon brands.  Four of the batteries do not have the info chip, and I don't use them much anymore for that reason. My Wasabi's have been PERFECT, with no loss of power; charge evenly and quickly; and work just as well in all three of the cameras I use them in. (7D,5DII,and 5DIII)

If these batteries caused damage in high-end cameras, the news would be all over every photo forum and Photocentric web site in the world.... so where's the substantiation for your caution? You run a much higher risk of damaging your camera by dropping it, or banging it, or playing with your mirror/sensor than you do with batteries.
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: Sitting Elf on October 08, 2012, 02:21:01 PM
Quote
Considering that after all is said and done you are carrying around several thousand dollars worth of equipment I didn't see the value in saving 20 bucks on a battery. And I would recommend making it a point buying the original Canon batteries from an authorized dealer. There are very convincing looking counterfeit batteries out there down to the details and holograms on the package.
Batteries can go bad and cause damage. With an original one from a reputable dealer you are covered at least.

So you think reputable dealers don't sell third party batteries cheaper??
Apparently you don't think B&H is "reputable"
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/591870-REG/Pearstone_LP_E6_LP_E6_Lithium_Ion_Battery_Pack.html (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/591870-REG/Pearstone_LP_E6_LP_E6_Lithium_Ion_Battery_Pack.html)

And check the reviews. This is one decent brand amongst others. In my case, I prefer Wasabi... Japanese made, and they don't make crappy electronics.
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: preppyak on October 08, 2012, 02:29:48 PM
4. Because owning an expensive camera doesn't eliminate being cost-conscious or selective.
Bingo. Sure, I could buy all Canon LP-6's, but the reality is that I can buy 3 or 4 of the knock-offs for the price of a single Canon battery. That means 75% of them can fail and I'd still be just as good off...and from reviews, I'd say <5% of them fail completely.

I'd rather not throw away money that could be put towards a nicer filter, a better ball head, or a better set of legs. Failing to be price conscious adds up pretty quickly (buy the $200 filter when the $75 one is just as good, buy the $500 tripod when the $200 combo works just as well, etc).
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: preppyak on October 08, 2012, 02:39:32 PM
So you think reputable dealers don't sell third party batteries cheaper??
Not what he stated. He said that disreputable dealers say fake "Canon" batteries. B&H markets those batteries as 3rd party, non-oem batteries. Lots of places do that, simply because OEM batteries are working with huge margins, and they can make more profit selling a battery for $30 (instead of Canon's $60) that actually costs them <$10.

Try dealing with one of the NY scam companies who has the balls to post something like this: http://bestpricephoto.com/h/product_info.php/extended-life-lpe6-lithium-ion-battery-w3-year-replacement-warranty-p-20013?osCsid=abb1f46ace1980698f8d7e30f1b9bbb7 (http://bestpricephoto.com/h/product_info.php/extended-life-lpe6-lithium-ion-battery-w3-year-replacement-warranty-p-20013?osCsid=abb1f46ace1980698f8d7e30f1b9bbb7)

Yes, that's an LP-E6 at 10x the price of a Wasabi, 3x the price of a Canon OEM...but of course its pricier, its that rare "extended life" battery that Canon totally sells
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: Sitting Elf on October 08, 2012, 02:47:06 PM
I agree that there are scammers everywhere. But one of the reasons for forums like this one is so that people can get opinions and reviews on products from those who actually USE them... not just blind opinions.

The OP asked about batteries. The posts, including mine, have replied with first-hand knowledge of products we actually use, are happy with, and have a educated opinion of.  That is appropriate.  Others, who pooh-pooh the use of anything other than OEM products haven't claimed in ANY of the posts here that they have used third party batteries that have either damaged, or otherwise been a bad purchase. So that makes those kind of posts sound specious, and simply elitist.
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: Meh on October 08, 2012, 02:57:49 PM
...it's the same as my original, but with 70-80% of the capacity...

"Same."  You keep using that word...I do not think it means what you think it means.

Clever clever... wow, a scientist, photographer, AND a movie buff.  Fantastic.
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: K-amps on October 08, 2012, 03:20:22 PM
I agree that there are scammers everywhere. But one of the reasons for forums like this one is so that people can get opinions and reviews on products from those who actually USE them... not just blind opinions.

The OP asked about batteries. The posts, including mine, have replied with first-hand knowledge of products we actually use, are happy with, and have a educated opinion of.  That is appropriate.  Others, who pooh-pooh the use of anything other than OEM products haven't claimed in ANY of the posts here that they have used third party batteries that have either damaged, or otherwise been a bad purchase. So that makes those kind of posts sound specious, and simply elitist.

Sitting Elf has arisen  :)

If you have had first hand experience with them, then you should not be bracketed with those who make unsubstatiated opinions. Nuff said. Lets move on.
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: jointdoc on October 08, 2012, 03:37:26 PM
+1 Sitting Elf
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: 7enderbender on October 08, 2012, 04:04:52 PM
Quote
Considering that after all is said and done you are carrying around several thousand dollars worth of equipment I didn't see the value in saving 20 bucks on a battery. And I would recommend making it a point buying the original Canon batteries from an authorized dealer. There are very convincing looking counterfeit batteries out there down to the details and holograms on the package.
Batteries can go bad and cause damage. With an original one from a reputable dealer you are covered at least.

So you think reputable dealers don't sell third party batteries cheaper??
Apparently you don't think B&H is "reputable"
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/591870-REG/Pearstone_LP_E6_LP_E6_Lithium_Ion_Battery_Pack.html (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/591870-REG/Pearstone_LP_E6_LP_E6_Lithium_Ion_Battery_Pack.html)

And check the reviews. This is one decent brand amongst others. In my case, I prefer Wasabi... Japanese made, and they don't make crappy electronics.


That's not what I said. Of course you can get thrid-party or even house-brand batteries from good dealers. If it blows up or leaks they will still not help you. If you decide to buy original Canon it makes sense in my opinion to buy from authorized Canon dealers given how many counterfeit items are out there. I don't know anything about those Wasabis. I bought four original LP-E6 and never gave it another thought.
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: Timothy_Bruce on October 08, 2012, 04:15:12 PM
I use original Canon LP-E6 and  two GPI  ones. The Canon ones are much more consistent and can relay give something on the % the show.
On the other hand the self discharge on the GPI is much worse and the tend to jump in % what the canons never do.  But the just costed half the price.

With the 7D and 2.xx the % some times just doesn't work.
 
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: 7enderbender on October 08, 2012, 04:17:33 PM
I agree that there are scammers everywhere. But one of the reasons for forums like this one is so that people can get opinions and reviews on products from those who actually USE them... not just blind opinions.

The OP asked about batteries. The posts, including mine, have replied with first-hand knowledge of products we actually use, are happy with, and have a educated opinion of.  That is appropriate.  Others, who pooh-pooh the use of anything other than OEM products haven't claimed in ANY of the posts here that they have used third party batteries that have either damaged, or otherwise been a bad purchase. So that makes those kind of posts sound specious, and simply elitist.


Let me again rephrase my point:

This has nothing to do with being "elitist". In fact, I'm usually a pretty cheap bastard. But sometimes being successful at being "cheap" means doing it right in the first place. With these batteries there are essentially four choices:

1. Buy whatever from any Chinese vendor on ebay
2. Buy third party from known dealers after doing the research
3. Buy cheap "original" from the guy in #1
4. Buy Canon from a Canon authorized dealer

Chances are, #1 and #3 are junk and you get ripped off. Chances are also that #2 and #4 may (!) actually be the same exact battery from the same Chinese factory with some kind of Japanese quality control in place. What you are paying extra for in #4 is basically some kind of insurance in the probably rare event that the battery destroys your camera - assuming that you keep your receipt etc.

Buying "Canon" from some guy on the web or from a corner store runs the risk of getting one of the many many fake batteries out there. It may not even be a scam on part of the seller. They may just not know. Same thing could actually happen at an authorized dealer I suppose. Counterfeiting has become a serious problem. Talk to people in the pharmaceutical industry where stuff gets swapped along the entire supply chain. There are estimates that 1 in 4 medications are fake.
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: brad-man on October 08, 2012, 04:54:30 PM
4. Because owning an expensive camera doesn't eliminate being cost-conscious or selective.
Bingo. Sure, I could buy all Canon LP-6's, but the reality is that I can buy 3 or 4 of the knock-offs for the price of a single Canon battery. That means 75% of them can fail and I'd still be just as good off...and from reviews, I'd say <5% of them fail completely.

I'd rather not throw away money that could be put towards a nicer filter, a better ball head, or a better set of legs. Failing to be price conscious adds up pretty quickly (buy the $200 filter when the $75 one is just as good, buy the $500 tripod when the $200 combo works just as well, etc).


Yes. Buy 4 Wasabi LP-E6s for slightly more than the price of one Canon, and put that money where it really works for you. Bigger faster cards from Sandisk or Lexar...
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: Sitting Elf on October 08, 2012, 05:24:04 PM
All I'm saying is that I need a LOT of LP-E6 Batteries!!  ;D :P :o
(Crappy quick iPhone shot)
(http://sittingelf.smugmug.com/photos/i-xTTJ6r3/0/XL/i-xTTJ6r3-XL.jpg)

OK so the last one in in this camera line needs an LP-E4N, but the other grips have two batteries in already.  Need fully charged bat's for the road away from chargers for up to three days at a time. (Going to Africa)
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: marekjoz on October 08, 2012, 05:58:25 PM
All I'm saying is that I need a LOT of LP-E6 Batteries!!  ;D :P :o
(Crappy quick iPhone shot)

OK so the last one in in this camera line needs an LP-E4N, but the other grips have two batteries in already.  Need fully charged bat's for the road away from chargers for up to three days at a time. (Going to Africa)

Do you go to test EOS-1S or 7d2 comparing it to the present gear? :D
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: prjkt on October 08, 2012, 07:29:42 PM
Bought two identical off-brand batteries for my 450D a few years back, one failed within 2 months, the other is still working... so within my limited experience, that's a 50% fail rate there

having said that, I had a mix of 5-6 official and off-brand batteries for my 350D/400D combo, couldn't really tell the difference with those ones, so it really comes down to the quality of the brand of battery I guess
Title: Re: Needing a primer on batteries
Post by: Hillsilly on October 08, 2012, 11:34:02 PM
In Australia, a genuine NP-E3 battery is almost $300.  That's a bit excessive for four AAs and some plastic casing.  Given that you can get an almost identical third party battery for $35, choosing the third party option isn't that hard. (For anyone interested, I've found the ones from Aussie Battery to fit well and have a high shot capacity).

Although I've never had a problem, I am a bit more paranoid about the third party batteries.  I charge them on a granite benchtop with nothing nearby that might catch fire.  And I tend to check on them more regularly.  I don't know if the instances of failure are higher than OEM, but there are enough stories to make you a little wary.