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Messages - ahsanford

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1
EOS Bodies / Re: How does the reveal of the final 7D2 specs make you feel?
« on: September 14, 2014, 01:15:16 PM »
The one spec that no one seems to be mentioning much is the dual Digic 6 processors. Now I'm no technical guru so maybe extra processing power doesn't make much of a difference to anything but if the 7D Mk2 is such a small step forward as some are suggesting why does it need/have more processing power than any other camera in the Canon range (with the possible exception of the 1DX with it's 3rd processor)?

Ten frames a second means you need to hustle with all that data.  The new AF system will need additional CPU horsepower as well, but the 5D3 AF system seems to be of similar power and that camera only has one DIGIC chip.  And keep in mind that no 5D model (I, II or III) has ever had two chips, yet the original 7D had two chips.  So my money is on framerate. 

The 1DX is a slightly different animal in that the third chip (I thought) was dedicated to make the 1D-series level metering functions work -- like spot metering at any AF point, which is a feature I sadly don't have on my 5D3.   :(

- A

2
EOS Bodies / Re: How does the reveal of the final 7D2 specs make you feel?
« on: September 12, 2014, 08:10:58 PM »
The lack of DR for this one isn't killer...

Which Canon cameras have been 'killed' by a lack of DR??

Didn't you hear, Neuro?  Every Canon landscape photographer on the planet -- utterly moved by the kind, impartial souls at DXO -- sold their gear to buy a D800, a 14-24 F/2.8, and a comfortable pair of shoes to walk the earth and capture things at ISO 100.   :P

- A


3
EOS Bodies / Re: How does the reveal of the final 7D2 specs make you feel?
« on: September 12, 2014, 03:47:43 PM »
Is it? We don't know what marketing Canon will attach to the 7d2, all-around premium crop or specialized machine gun.

First, to the comment above: I think the needle is leaning ever-so-slightly towards the specialized machine gun, but it's not slammed all the way over.  If it had an integral grip, solid top without seams for a flash, published specs of a massive buffer, F/8 AF points scattered all over the viewfinder for the reach-obsessed folks on teleconverters, etc., then I'd say the the needle would be all the way over and they'd ask for $2,500 for it.  But the specs shown are probably going to be marketed similar to a 1D4 with a different product: an action camera with great reach.

But the 6D and 7D2 user bases are completely different animals to me.  Both may be priced about the same, but that doesn't mean they'll attract the same users:

  • 7D2 folks are one of two groups to me.  The first group -- the first-in-line early pre-orderers on day one -- will largely be sports/wildlife/birding folks who either can't afford superteles, or pros who can afford them but would rather not have to lug the biggest ones in the field all the time.  The second group are the 'stuck in crop for a host of reasons' shooters -- the 7D2 will be the top-of-the-line call as the big upgrade for Rebel or XXD owners looking for a new body, or for folks fully bought in to EF-S glass and stubbornly refuse to sell off those lenses to move to FF.

  • 6D folks run a much wider gamut of users -- pros just getting started, art/photgraphy students who prefer more potential for IQ without the bells and whistles, concert photogs for that -3 EV AF point, old manual settings/film shooters who are just now making the move to digital and hiss like reptiles when their brain first tries to process crop factors, wealthy folks buying their first SLR but wanting to have a nicer camera than the masses, etc.  It's a real mixed bag here.

I don't think one camp is better or worse than the other, it's just different strokes for different folks. 

I have, on many occasions in this forum, predicted the 7D2 could cost more than the 6D because for 'reach'-obsessed/necessitated realms of photography, the 7D2 isn't an option for them -- it is the next camera they must buy, and that's that.  Canon can take whatever they want from these folks.

- A



4

I can't help but think some megapretentious industrial design fan of an executive at Sigma has protected X% of Sigma's money on "Project: The Future", and he/she just knows that this project, by the 35th or 36th version, will change photography forever.

I design things for a living, so I LOVE out of the box ideas.  So please understand that I am -- at the same time -- mocking the madness and tipping my cap for Sigma's bravery with fielding these cameras.

- A
That sounds like a pretty cool job - do you mind if I what kind of things you design?  Also, Sigma's courage sometimes produces pretty cool things like their f/1.8 zoom!

As a lens company, I love what they do:  high quality, disruptive tech that shakes the bigger players at times.

As a camera company...  Yikes.

I design medical implants and instruments, so its a different animal completely.  But I do know a few things about grip, something both photography and instruments have in common.  But I do not ride a Segway to work or live in a Bizzaro orthogonal world like the Sigma dudes do.

- A

5
EOS Bodies / Re: How does the reveal of the final 7D2 specs make you feel?
« on: September 12, 2014, 02:15:18 PM »

[Marsu said lots of good stuff.]


That's why a 'flagship-level crop body' is such an odd, odd duck.  It's meant to be your last crop body before you make the plunge to FF, but the cost of the big white superteles gives the 7D a small slice of pros who say "Hell, I'll pay $3k, $4k for this if it saves me from having to get a 600mm L lens."

And that's why Canon should offer this for $5000 for the first three months and then drop it down to the $1800-ish we're expecting.  Some folks have to buy this based on the glass they own and the reach they must have.  Canon really owns them.

- A

6

I can't help but think some megapretentious industrial design fan of an executive at Sigma has protected X% of Sigma's money on "Project: The Future", and he/she just knows that this project, by the 35th or 36th version, will change photography forever.

I design things for a living, so I LOVE out of the box ideas.  So please understand that I am -- at the same time -- mocking the madness and tipping my cap for Sigma's bravery with fielding these cameras.

- A

7

Only Sigma has the stones to find a way to turn a fixed lens point and shoot into a medium format ergonomic footprint...

http://photorumors.com/2014/09/12/new-sigma-dp1-quattro-camera-three-lenses-and-two-teleconverters/

Quattros have always been an odd, odd duck.  They have amazing detail in the sensor, yet such poor low light performance that a review I saw of this little thing was largely done on a tripod (!).  The science fiction ergonomics, the fixed lens, all of it -- is wacky and "why?"-inducing. 

But that viewfinder, good gravy that viewfinder...  [Does the bon appetit hand to mouth kiss of perfection.]

Stick with lenses, guys.  Stick with lenses. 

- A

8
2 years behind? who behind who?

This seems much more a 5D3 variant to me, 2 years after the 5D3 is released on the market, then only this spec? The Nikon reactions are not that positive. This is not a worthy successor of the marvelous D700. Think about water sealant, fps, 1/4000 max shutterspeed, missing AF-On, max 1/200 x-sync.

As mentioned by the OP, a lot of this camera is a mix of pro but also of entry level. Thought this Nikon would really push Canon to look at further development. However, it only seems a spec that's close to the 5D3. Never the less a nice specification, but not a D700 version 2.

Features-wise, I understand your point, but I price would imply pros will value this camera less.  5D3 is a D8-something competitor (regardless of the MP count).    The 5D3 is a $3399 camera vs. the D750 at $2300. 

So I'm assuming the build quality, pop-up flash, etc. imply the D750 is for enthusiasts more than pros.  It may not be built for dyed-in-the-wool pros with tougher needs and higher expectations.

- A

9
EOS Bodies / Re: How does the reveal of the final 7D2 specs make you feel?
« on: September 12, 2014, 01:35:28 PM »
I think the fact not one person has ticked the "I'm over-the-moon with the spec list.  This is beyond my expectations."

Speaks volumes

But how and why?  Are they looking for too much?  Are they being pragmatic and waiting for testing?  Have their expectations been mostly met?

Partly it's high expectations, but partly it's the reality that Canon cannot hit every variable out of the park.  'Over the moon' would imply that the camera -- top to bottom -- checks off all of your boxes. 

Zooming in on this a bit, of maybe 10-12 things that frame up the kind of camera we want, each of us really gives a damn / prioritizes about (I'd guess) 3-5 of those.  I'm going to go out on a very sturdy limb and state that if there is one thing that is keeping the 16% of us currently pegged as 'Excited' from saying 'Over the moon' would be the sensor.  I'm not necessarily a high MP fan, and I'm not saying that it's a 70D sensor in there, but 20.2 MP hints that it may not be a breakthrough new piece of tech. 

(That is wild speculation of course, but I'm guessing that many more readers of this post bobbed their head at the notion I've presented rather than those who scorn the lack of logic and facts behind it.  Not my best moment, I admit.  Honest, I'm not a troll, 20 year old fanboy or rabble rouser.  I'm just sayin.)

As everyone cares about the sensor as a very high (if not highest) priority, hearing/inferring/believing it will be good but not great will limit how fired up people are for this.

A not very brave hypothesis:  if the confirmed spec list included, say, a 24-28 MP sensor or even the current 20.2 with a clear addendum of "two to three stops better low light performance than the 7D", the percentage of over-the-mooners would skyrocket.  Because everything else on this spec list is pretty solid, save for a meager 2.9% of us who are pining for 4K, Wifi, tilty-screen, touch-screen, etc. 

- A

10
EOS Bodies / Re: How does the reveal of the final 7D2 specs make you feel?
« on: September 12, 2014, 11:38:07 AM »

Wow.  Double woohoo.  200 votes in the poll!

- A

11
Nikon just put out their D750 announcement:

http://petapixel.com/2014/09/12/nikon-d750-officially-announced-24mp-full-frame-dslr-designed-photo-enthusiasts/

Nikon has, of course, gone a little crazy with all the FF offerings.  But the D750 is not a weird sidebar project (like the D800E), a retro/style play (Df), a quality fix (like the D610) or a refresh/update (like the D810).  This is a new segment at first glance.

I thought the FF market had settled into:

Entry:         6D / D6-something (2 models 1 model  ::))
Pro:           5D3 / D8-something (3 models)
Flagship:   1DX / D4-something (2 models)

It looks like (and I haven't scrutinized this terribly long) this D750 camera is a mish-mosh of:

* D6-something sensor (entry)
* D8-something AF system (pro)
* D8-something video (pro)
* D810 and D4s image processor (pro/flagship)
* 6.5 FPS burst (pro* is not quite this fast, but 6.5 is nowhere near their flagship level)
* D6-something fastest shutter speed (entry)

And everything -- features and price -- seems to line up with a new mid-level FF price point.

Is this tenable as a business model?
Can Nikon sustain four price points of FF shooters and not:

  • Leave one price point unattended for long periods with new offerings?
  • Frustratingly blur the lines between the segments and have new offerings muddle things further?

As a consumer, I love all the options, but surely this is a tough road for Nikon to take, isn't it?  Would Canon ever try to stretch out and subdivide the FF market in this fashion?

- A

12
EOS Bodies / Re: How does the reveal of the final 7D2 specs make you feel?
« on: September 12, 2014, 11:10:22 AM »
"In general I am excited" - provided there is a decent buffer of 30 to 40 RAWs (3 to 4 seconds worth of 10 fps burst), this looks like a good action camera for focal length limited work, for the price cited. For those who are enamored of the Nikon D7100, the RAW buffer is pitiful at about 1 second worth, 6 or so RAW images. The Nikon D300 is as old as the 7D and there is no D400 showing up. There is no other amateur-priced competitor to these AF and burst rate specs. It might not be sufficient for happy 7D users to upgrade, though every 7D owner who has experienced the recent 5D3/1DX AF has commented that the 7D AF is outclassed by newer AF.

Yep.  The buffer is certainly a wildcard as we never get tabulated buffer-size numbers for JPG / RAW / JPG+RAW in a spec list like this. 

As much as Canon folks get flogged for their sensors, they often deliver excellent burst rate and large buffer size bodies.

- A

13
Lenses / Re: Canon EF 16-35 F/4L IS -- Reviews are trickling in...
« on: September 12, 2014, 10:50:10 AM »
+1. The tests by lensrentals.com are more objective and representative than any other tests considering their larger sample size, and Roger uses some cool instruments that the DxO guys probably never heard of.

Of course, I trust Roger Cicala more than anyone.  He has better tools and widely is accepted as a very neutral opinion, bias-free guy. 

But I do miss the basic old test reports there.  I really liked his simple center, border, corner sharpness results.  The new lens-only system is impressive, but it's two levels deeper information than I can quickly process.  I'm concerned that LR will turn into a very cool but not-very-accessible place for optics nerds to get lost in minutiae.

- A

14
EOS Bodies / Re: How does the reveal of the final 7D2 specs make you feel?
« on: September 11, 2014, 09:00:05 PM »

Woohoo!  100+ responses to the poll!

Nice work, everyone.

- A

15
EOS Bodies / Re: How does the reveal of the final 7D2 specs make you feel?
« on: September 11, 2014, 06:36:24 PM »
Posted this in another thread, sums up how I feel:

I shoot wildlife/sports/action photography.  I use a T2i right now when I'm shooting with a crop.  Know why?  My glass is all Canon.  If it wasn't for that I'd have switched.  The 70D offers absolutely no improvement in image quality over the T2i.  It's the same flippin sensor, just using new technologies to squeeze a .001% image quality improvement out of it.  Now this is coming out with the SAME F'ING SENSOR.   The sensor is about 80% of the reason you'd buy a camera, once you choose your subject matter.   The 7Dii is going to be a glorified T2i. Same old ancient sensor technology, with a few useless bells & whistles, none of which get down to the root: THEY HAVEN'T MADE A SINGLE INNOVATION IN SENSOR TECHNOLOGY IN YEARS. It's the same mediocre sensor, just rehashed.    This is why they're starting to, or will continue to lose market share to other companies.  Absolutely insane that it took a half decade to refresh, and it's basically going to be the exact same camera with the exact same sensor, just with a tiiiiny bit extra squeezed out of that sensor.  Absolute garbage.  I can't tell you how pissed off I am right now.

I hear you, I do.  But let me understand the train of thought:

T2i = 18 MP sensor
70D = 20.2 MP sensor (absolutely not the same sensor)

However, at least for noise, I do agree there isn't much difference between the two:
http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Comparisons/Canon-EOS-Rebel-T2i-550D-Digital-SLR-Camera.aspx

But that's the T2i vs. the 70D.  Just because the new 7D2 sensor is 20.2 MP doesn't mean that it's the same one.

Again, we don't know the low light performance of this new sensor.  Unless we have confirmation from an interview with a Chuck Westfall that it is in fact the same (not gonna happen) or a teardown that it's the same component (and I'm sure there's more to it than just the sensor itself), we don't know what we're dealing with here.  Sensor performance is not something a spec sheet will tell us.  So we have to let the Bryan Carnathans of the world shoot the samples with the 7D2 (like the ones I linked) and then we'll know for sure.

But yeah, if I was in the market for a new APS-C body, the name 7D2 alone isn't enough to get my money -- especially based on Canon's APS-C sensor track record.  I would want to see reviews, specifically noise information.

- A

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