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Messages - Ruined

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EOS Bodies / Re: 70D or 7D MK II
« on: Today at 04:22:28 PM »
If you're serious about video quality do not buy a 70D. The 7D is a much video better camera.

If you're serious about video quality, actually there's just one Canon choice: The 5d3 with pixel binning (= no moire) and Magic Lantern raw video. Who knows when this will arrive on the 7d2, if ever.

True about the raw video, but the 7D2 from samples online looks to have much better moire performance than the 70D and 6D - about on par with the 5D3.  I think this camera would be a solid video performer... and raw video is massive  :)

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon 7DII - Did you preorder?
« on: September 18, 2014, 12:16:40 PM »
I already blew my budget  for 3+ 7DIIs on a 1D X, so I think I'm set.  If this was a few years back, I'd snag this and the Tamron or Sigma 150-600 and be all set for some great wildlife shooting.  This is a great time for action photographers!

Or, you could sell the 5DIII, get the 7DII and bank the rest ;)
Don't think I haven't thought of that already!  I really like shooting wide, esp. with the new 16-35 f/4 IS, so I think I'll pass for now.

Ah okay, I thought you liked to do a lot of tele stuff also.  The 1DX and 7DII would be an epic combo, best full frame paired with the cream of the crop! :)  Not that 1DX and 5DIII is bad, but the 7DII will give you reach that 5DIII can only dream of!  Unless you need two full frame bodies at the same time (i.e. for backup purposes on paid gigs which I empathize with or if you frequently need two FF sensors for other reasons) personally I would get that 5DIII on the market ASAP ;)

Plus, I could see 5DIII easily being replaced next year, it is getting a bit long in the tooth.  You could still get good money for it now.

EOS Bodies / Re: 5diii to 7dii?
« on: September 18, 2014, 12:04:38 PM »
Hello everyone,

I currently using a 5diii with 24-70ii, 70-200ii, 100L, and mp-e 65.

There are times, I believe the 5diii may be an overkill for my needs. I current shoot landscapes with a gigapan and usually my 2 kids playing in the park or taking portraits in a home studio.

I also do not use the 5diii as much as I did when I first bought it.  I'm thinking I can sell it for a 7dii and use the rest to invest in a prime lens which I'm missing in my collection.

5diii to 7dii?

Thank you in advance.

Given the description of what you shoot you'd be much better off with a full frame 6D than a crop 7DII, and it will cost you even less at this time for a 6D than a 7DII since Canon refurb store stocks the 6D.  Since you are not doing any pro sports/bird shooting that is demanding of cutting edge AF technology, I think the AF system of the 7DII and even 5DIII would go to waste, and it does not appear you need the reach of the 7DII.  But, with your portraits and landscape you could still benefit from a full frame sensor.  The 6D AF is not as good with fast moving subjects, but if you learn to use it your results will be fine - I have used the 6D even for demanding panning shots during autocross races and have gotten excellent results, your usage will likely be much less demanding that this.  For best results with the 6D, for fast moving subjects use the center point; for slow or still subjects, other points will usually work just fine.

Also if you are interested in shallow DOF portraits with fast primes, the 6D supports the user-installable Eg-S high precision focus screen (like the 1DX and 7DII) so you can see the true DOF of what you are shooting.  5DIII does not have this option (Canon removed likely so they could upsell people to 1DX) and thus with a fast prime you will not see the true DOF in the viewfinder on the 5DIII resulting in potentially unexpected results and inability to properly manual fine tune focus.

During Canon refurb sales you can get a refurb 6D for ~$1250.  That would be your best bet for sure.

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon 7DII - Did you preorder?
« on: September 18, 2014, 12:02:49 PM »
I already blew my budget  for 3+ 7DIIs on a 1D X, so I think I'm set.  If this was a few years back, I'd snag this and the Tamron or Sigma 150-600 and be all set for some great wildlife shooting.  This is a great time for action photographers!

Or, you could sell the 5DIII, get the 7DII and bank the rest ;)

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon 7DII - Did you preorder?
« on: September 18, 2014, 12:01:07 PM »
I definitely plan to pick up a 7DII in time, but I'd rather others be the guinea pigs early adopters in case there are any bugs, and if you wait ~6 months you can generally save a few hundred or even more on Canon refurb sales.

Technical Support / Re: 5D III OR 6D or 7DII
« on: September 17, 2014, 09:58:51 AM »
I may be misquoting him but I think Neuro often says the main advantage of crop vs FF is that the crop camera is cheaper. Also cropping 5D3 FF to 7D crop sensor size is very similar except now you have a 8MP file instead of a 18 MP file (for the 7D).

Well, idea is, if you have a bottomless pit of money with full frame you can just buy a longer lens and get better results than crop with a shorter lens.  But, the OP has a 100-400 and shoots wildlife; the FOV at 400mm on his current camera is ~640mm.  In order to get that on full frame he'd have to spend $10k on a Canon EF 600mm f/4L or start putting on teleconverters which will negatively impact the image quality (and often autofocus) more than a crop camera will.

So yeah crop is cheaper, but its not just the camera but more importantly the lens when you get to longer focal lengths.

As for cropping full frame to APS-C, when you are reach limited there will be more pixels on the target with crop.  Cropping full frame will work but you will lose detail because of this.  The exception to this rule would be when shooting in low light (i.e. ISO6400) when the lower noise & higher contrast of full frame would likely be a better tradeoff for a little less detail.  Some feel that cropping full frame is at worst no difference but that is not my experience at lower ISOs and it does not logically make sense to me knowing how digital imaging works.

jrista did a fairly well controlled test here that can demonstrate the loss of detail when cropping full frame vs using a crop camera on a reach limited target for a visual demonstration; you can see in his test the full frame crop loses a ton of detail on the moon surface/craters because there just aren't enough pixels to fully reproduce it on full frame due to the cropping:

Technical Support / Re: 5D III OR 6D or 7DII
« on: September 17, 2014, 02:44:15 AM »
Ruined: You are a smart person. I like smart people.  Thanks for coming to the forum :) I am going to go out and do a photoshoot at 250 and see if I can tolerate it... This might be a diccy (& fight provoking) question, but, how much could you 'crop' a full frame image to say it is the 'same' quality as a crop. Rather than 250, could it maybe closer to 300/320?  oh god my brain hurts and I'm not even trying to work out the answer.  I guess there are probably many variables...

There have been quite a few tests done on this, even here at CR.

To sum it up, if you have good light (i.e. ISO 1600, maybe 3200 if the 7DII improves over the 7D - which initial tests seem to indicate) and you are reach limited (meaning that in this case, you are taking a picture that does not fill up the whole frame of a crop camera when using your longest lens), then generally crop will win.  If ISO is higher (3200-6400+) full frame will probably win with cropping, but do remember if you are at 300+mm with your 100-400 frequently you probably want to stick with the crop.  Otherwise, its going to be a real pain in post to crop every shot, and cropping aside the subject may be too small in the viewfinder to take the type of photos you want; I see a lot of emotion in your wildlife photos, that may going to be hard to capture if it is too small to see due to lack of reach when taking the photo!  If you have Lightroom (and some other programs), you can set a filter to see what focal length your entire library of photos is at; see what percentage of your photos are greater than 250mm focal length to get an idea how many you'd need to crop on full frame to get the same picture.  You can do the same with ISO to see how many you need ISO higher than 1600-3200.

Full frame is quite excellent, but crop has its applications too.  That is why they make a pro crop camera, and the 7D line is known to be popular with wildlife photographers due to the extra reach. Full frame has an allure too, for my portrait work I would never give up full frame.  But full frame is not a panacea that conquers all, it is simply another option that mostly offers significant improvements, but does have some notable drawbacks as well for the type of photography you shoot based on your website photos - reach being the largest.

IMO in your case there really is no definitive answer.  If you want only one body, you will have to pick between reach and high ISO!  So, you should check the usual focal lengths you shoot too see what percentage >250mm, what percentage >3200 ISO - then do some shoots capped at 250mm on your current camera to see if the reach is sufficient.  If photo analysis and your tests indicate 250mm on your current camera will be enough for 95%+ of your photos, then definitely go for the 5D3.  If you exceed 250mm frequently and need the reach, I would think twice about buying a full frame camera due to all the cropping that will be needed - plus a good deal of the benefit of full frame (not all) is lost when you crop lots of the frame away every picture.

In short, do your research on your own photos/photography to see which solution is best for you.  Don't buy full frame just to buy full frame, as you may be disappointed if you want/need the reach of crop.

Technical Support / Re: 5D III OR 6D or 7DII
« on: September 16, 2014, 05:15:43 PM »
Wow thanks guys, loving the support...

I totally get what you are saying Ruined and you make So much sense. I just can't seem to get my head around having two bodies... I would always have decisions every time I do anything (I don't like so many decisions).  I was going to keep my 600D as my back up (in case it broke - not as a carry along).  I know pros take 2 bodies, but i'm trying to minimise my gear, not increase it on travels. If all I did was out of a car/house then you make more sense, but travelling/backpacking at times, its a bit too heavy. 

I can understand, if you are dead set on only one body then 7DII vs 5DIII would depend whether reach/framing or high ISO is more important; I would not get the 6D alone as it will likely leave you wanting more for fast moving wildlife.  Note though, you don't necessarily have to take two bodies every time you go out, you can take the one that simply makes most sense for what you are primarily taking that day.  As a warning though I realize its just a backup, once you handle any of these three cameras (5D3, 7DII, 6D) you may have a rough time going back to the 600D as the handling and features of those three will have spoiled you!

I am sure you probably know this, but if you want to somewhat simulate the reach & framing of the 5DIII with your 100-400mm, put it on your existing camera and zoom all the way to 400mm - that will be the 7DII FOV max reach.  Now zoom out back to 250mm - that will be 5D3 FOV max reach.  If you are okay with the reach you see at 250mm then I'd get the 5DIII.  If you'd really prefer the greater reach and sacrifice some ISO to do so, then get the 7DII.   If you really want to be comprehensive, go out on a few simulated photoshoots and force yourself to be limited to 250mm max on your current camera to see if it really will work for you or whether you will be stuck in post cropping all day.

I do events and I can't wait to get the 7DII because the reach can be key for certain types of events like racing (since I don't want to buy or lug around a 10k 8.5lb lens :)) and other events when getting close is not practical.  it also opens up alternative FOVs for primes.  But, there is also no doubt in my mind that my FF camera will handily beat it at ISO 3200+.

Lenses / Re: Canon Reveals Details for future Telephoto Lens Line
« on: September 16, 2014, 05:05:31 PM »
Nice!  Sounds like there will be a 70-300 DO II.  That would be awesome given the improvements discussed.

Lenses / Re: Lenses that you want Canon to release next
« on: September 16, 2014, 05:03:25 PM »
135L II
85L III redesign, similar to the 50 1.0 > 1.2 redesign

Lenses / Re: EF11-24mm F4L listed on a Japanese site
« on: September 16, 2014, 05:02:25 PM »
pic looks fake to me, there is all sorts of suspicious mosquito noise on the text around the hood.

Technical Support / Re: 5D III OR 6D or 7DII
« on: September 16, 2014, 01:31:15 AM »
Based on your photos you have a pretty wide range of stuff you take.

Camera body:
Buy both 7DII & 6D for ~$3000 (get refurb 6D from Canon store)
-Take 7DII when you need reach, framerate, and/or 1DX-quality autofocus - birds, wildlife, etc
-Take 6D when you need ISO 6400, do landscape, or want thinnest DOF for your shot

You have a heavy wildlife focus so I think having a "pro" APS-C camera is a good idea for reach (and macro) & the best autofocus, but in those scenarios where you need high ISO or want thin DOF you can use the 6D which will do a much better job than the 7DII in those areas.  5DIII would be spending a lot of money for a camera that will not have the FOV/reach you would probably like for your large amount of wildlife shots; you will probably find yourself being forced to excessively crop in post.  But if you get this 7DII+6D combo, you can bring the appropriate camera (or both) and use whichever makes sense for what you are shooting at the time. 

Want crazy reach?  You got it, 7DII.  Want high ISO?  You got it, 6D.  You can't have both crazy reach + high ISO with the 5DIII alone unless you are prepared to spend $10k+ on a 600mm, 8.5lb full frame lens - but if you get the 7DII+6D combo you can simply use your 7DII when you need reach and your 6D when you need high ISO.  Best of both worlds without having to spend $10k on a single lens or being stuck having to crop in post every long subject you shoot (plus having the ability to actually see and frame far away subjects in the viewfinder).

In addition to the increased flexibility of both APS/APS-C you will as a side bonus then have a backup camera! :)

Sell tokina.  Sell Canon 15-85.  Note its good to get all EF/fullframe lenses if you go this route so they work on both bodies.
Buy Canon 24-70mm f/2.8L II - will have different FOV depending on what camera body you put it on (7DII or 6D).  Since you will likely use the 6D for landscape, the wide end of this lens would be perfect for that - then when you put it on the 7DII you will get a bit more reach on the tele end which you'd probably want for your wildlife subject matter.  24-70mm f/2.8L II is also unique as it has minimal coma wide open so its great for stars.
Future buys: Canon 8-15mm f/4L Fisheye; Canon 16-35mm f/4L IS; Canon 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II

EOS Bodies / Re: How can we improve on 5D3 to 5D4?
« on: September 16, 2014, 01:13:59 AM »
1. Interchangable focus screen (still baffled they took this out of 5D3)
2. ISO performance comparable to 6D

EOS Bodies / Re: 7DII No Wifi
« on: September 15, 2014, 09:16:21 PM »
I would buy the wireless addon despite the expense... IF Canon got their act together on the software side.

While the iPhone app is decent...

-There is no Windows phone/Lumia app at all. (i.e. for Lumia 1020 - best photography smartphone that exists)
-The desktop PC version is an all around mess with very obvious spaghetti code
-There is no Windows 8 Touch app (i.e. for Surface and windows tablets) at all
-I heard the Android version needs work too, but I have no experience with it.

Either way, Canon's needs to spend some real money on software development before they get me to buy an addon like that.

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