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Messages - pedro

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Hey gang,

I'm shooting handheld indoors without flash with my 5D3 all the time these days, it seems.  Shame on me, I know, but these are often social / performance events where the flash would not be welcomed.

In these situations, I leave the zooms at home and shoot either my trusty 50/1.4 or the surprisingly good new 28/2.8 IS.  To avoid wide open softness, I am pushing ISO into 3200-6400 levels to allow either lens to be stopped down a bit.  I won't lie that I push ISO even beyond 6400 periodically.

I am shooting RAW in these situations with the High ISO NR turned off as it seems to do nothing to RAW files (I presume it's a JPG-only feature?).

I generally prefer capturing sharpness + detail with noise than softening up the image by cranking up the noise reduction.  That said, if I can chase the noise intelligently without much detail being sacrificed, I'd love to hear how.

Can folks on this fine forum please give advice on:

1) Best RAW processing parameters to managing noise in Camera RAW.  I get lost on the five noise reduction sliders (Luminance, L Detail, L Contrast, Color and Color Detail) -- so pointers on which to use and when would be terrific.

2) Are there other settings in camera that are recommended for shooting in these indoor/handheld/low-light situations?

3) Is Camera RAW is the best tool for noise reduction work?  Should I use another RAW handler?  Does saving noise work for Photoshop to manage a better path to take?  Advice appreciated!

Thanks for your help!

I can comfortably shoot ISO 12,800 Color Images and 25,600 B&W's on my 5D3. 51,200 B&W's if needed.

I use LR4 and its Noise Reduction software. I generally apply color NR until its gone, and enough Luminance NR to lower the grain, Not to remove it. (which can be done to smooth-en portraits if needed.)

You can Use the Median Distort tool in Photoshop and selectively remove noise from an image. Its usually not needed.

The best thing for noise is to nail your exposure. I've gotten Usable ISO 3200 Files from a 5Dc because I nailed the exposure.
ISO 51k bw. +1
So amazing...some NR and that's it.
Depending on one's taste, up to ISO 25k in color...

Lenses / Re: Canon Announcements Next Week? [CR1]
« on: October 17, 2012, 05:51:22 PM »
As we are talking about 2013: A 12/14-24 f2.8 by Q4 (November) ?  8)

Just struggled this monday night with the 5D3 due to non red AF points while doing moonless nightscapes.
Darkest night. Distant lights. My trusty old  30 D always locked on without having any trouble...hmmm.
Can't be an 1DX update only. Too many wedding togs outthere. Not me, but you have my vote, gentlemen!

Hi everyone,
While enjoying the nightsky skills of my 5D3 and working my way up in the learning curve, I just thought about a WA lens for my purposes. I know, there is a 16-35, 17-40 a Samyang 14/2.8 MF. And another 12-24 from Sigma (?).

But, how are the possibilities of some 12-24 by Canon to show up these next two years? Currently I am taking pictures using a cheapo Canon 28/2.8 and that works pretty well. But there's times I'd like to go as wide as 12 mm:

Cheers, Pedro.

I was at the WFX 2012 Trade Show and our booth was immediately next to Canon's large booth. I spent a fair amount of time chatting with their camera representatives. They stated for normal situations the 1DX and 5D Mark III perform equally well. For low light/high ISO situations the 1DX performs better.

Due to it specs it must not perform differently than this! So I am happy for the PJs and everyone who can afford this cam. The 5D3 for me is plenty of camera, though. At almost half of the price. Coming from a 30D, ISO 25k is awesome...I even dare to go up as high as ISO 51kk and 102 k for b/w.
It's taking me back to my Contax 139 Quartz days some 30 years ago  8) 102k look similar to Tri-X pan pushed to ISO 3200  ;D Cheers, Pedro

I bought it three weeks ago for 3.6k CHF at a brick and mortar store.
After a grease issue on my old 30D I purchased back in 2007 and a rude letter from a canon rep after sending it in, I said to myself that I'll never buy a camera body online again.
So this time, I went to a shop in a town nearby. I met friendly people who were shocked when I told them my 30D within warranty issue.
So I paid a premium of 3.6k CHF for it, but I've seen the face of the person who sold it to me, I know her name, and she's there to send that baby in for me, whenever there is an issue.
They gave my a short intro to it and will update the firmware if needed.
Although the price tag is quite higher  than the current 3.1k CHF body only offers online , I prefer this over another online nightmare. It pays off well as I feel more save than back in 2007.

Therefore: No regrets, as the 5D3 is a too much of a camera to have a bad technical back up!

Buy it as low as ever possible, your online warranty conditions might be better than ours.

Cheers, Pedro

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon is out foxed.
« on: September 15, 2012, 10:26:22 AM »
Nikon and Sony have completely out foxed Canon.

Canon's first big mistake was putting only 22MP in the 5D3 with a sensor that performs about the same as the 5D2.

Having learnt from the lesson of the 1Ds3/5D2, Canon did not want to introduce a "lesser camera" (6D) than the 5D3 with the same sensor because lots of would-be purchasers of the 5D3 would simply buy the 6D instead. So the 6D will have 20MP to stop it stealing sales from those who want more MP (22) from the 5D3.

Where Nikon has outfoxed Canon is that their camera at about the same price ($2099 is close enough to $1999) but with 20% more pixels. Nikon were able to deliver a 24MP FF camera at $2099 because their next model up camera has substantially more megapixels - 36.

Canon's product lineup below the 1DX is screwed. They really need to throw it out and start over.

And why does Canon need to do that?

Because the number of megapixels in their sensors is now too low. And if megapixels didn't matter then why wouldn't the 6D have the same, if not more, than the 5D3?

You must have gotten the MP kool-aid.  MP's aren't everything!  If the rumored specs said 24 MP, would that and that alone make this on par?  No.  Where the d800 differentiates itself from the mk3 isn't in mp's, but in IQ and DR at ISO 100-800, and above ISO 800 Canon takes the lead in both IQ and DR.

Back to why these specs suck.  It isn't MP's --- if it said 40 MP's it would still suck due to only having 11 AF points with 1 cross type at the center, and sd card only memory (unless this new sensor fixed the DR issues - but if it did, then the 6d would be closer to $2800).  Those are really the biggest issues. It's 2012, we shouldn't have to center point recompose on a brand new $2000 camera.  I could even deal with SD only if the AF was actually modern - it doesn't need to be the 61 point of the mk3, but dang it use the 21 point from 7d or the 45 point from the 1d4.  If it had at least that then it would be a worthy purchase and sit on my left side as backup to my mk3 (if the ISO performance is close to that of the mk3).  As it stands, the throwback to 2008 AF is useless, and SD only would prevent any kind of burst shooting due because SD wouldn't be able to handle writing at higher speeds.  So sorry, while I agree these specs are a big fail --- it isn't because of MP's...
+1 Chuck Alaimo

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon EOS 6D Specs Leaked?
« on: September 15, 2012, 10:18:08 AM »
At reading some of the posts in this 21 page thread at the time I feel happy for not having waited on an entry FF body. About 3 weeks ago I bought the 5D3 and yes, I paid full price 3,6 k at a brick and mortar retail shop but I do not regret it one moment. It is a tremendously versatile camera (I am a passionate amateur, sometimes making a few bucks on selling a photograph, or getting remunerated with a "reader photographer fee" if the regional newspaper publishes a picture I took. I do all the ISOs. H1 and H2 are just fine for b/w available light as the "grain" even after post still looks like in the old days with pushed Tri-X pan's ;-) I like this "feature". And even though the 5D3 price is high (I've saved up for a long time) it is worth it. Getting kind of a mini 1Dx at almost half the price is great.
But a decent entry FF would make sense. The annoying thing in these specs is the SD only mode, and the AF unit. If  the sensor is based on the 5D3's and 1Dx the lower MP count might even help IQ-wise. Warning: I am not a tech. So, if this cam will have H1 (51k) and (102k) it will deliever. And we'd get back to affordable FF days after a long time. Hope it doesn't break the 2k mark.

Anyone out there having the same problems while doing night sky?
Yes, I happened to take a night shot with stars using a 5D3 yesterday, and I see this precise phenomenom for saturated stars when the default sharpening is used (just tested). When I turn sharpening off, the black halos disappear. I just tried it but am to lazy to produce screenshots for you... just try it yourself. Using unsharp mask as a "sharpening" filter is particularly good at producing black halos.

Well, yours is a very valid point. After reading the tips provided by fellow posters, I went back and put the RAW sharpness settings and unsharp masking to zero before converting the file to TIFF and: halos are gone. So there is a simple cure to all that. Then in post in CS2 I just did some unsharp masking and that was it. Very satisfied about the result halo wise. But I also will take care next time and won't do 45 shots within 15 minutes!
Here's the new sample. I took these RAWs in mRAW.

bkorcel, nubu,GuyF,wockawocka: Thank you for your inputs. I will take them into practice. It helps me a lot as I thought I had a defective device. But, as in most cases: It's always the dude behind the cam 8) What a privilege to live in this century, with helpful mates around the web! You're great folks.

I took a look at your link and can only suggest the points look a bit like hot pixels (assuming not all hot pixels would go red). I'm only speculating but maybe a combination of higher ISO and long exposure has caused them to get a bit hot.

Were you taking a number of long exposure shots in quick succession? This could produce hot pixels. Perhaps our resident guru Neuro might know.

You are right. I  took about 45 pictures within 15 minutes, mostly way up to ISOs as high as insane 51k and 102k. Absolutely unusable, though. Well, Neuro, may have another take on that too  8)

@wockawocka: thanks for your input as well! I will take less pictures. I followed examples seen on flickr concerning nightphotography. But yes, I will take it slower next time. As I aimed at "testing" the ISOs for the first time outside, there was a good thread in nightphotography on here, 1Dx vs 5d3 in ISO...Your input will be considered next time I am outside. The only thing is, that it started to look like this right after the first picture I seen in post. Therefore I cannot be a 100% sure if that is a heat issue only...or at least not while I was starting to take pictures...otherwise I just know too less about any camera tech to judge on this...Thanks anyway, your input as all the others is much appreciated! Cheers.

@GuyF, risc32 thanks for your concern.

The phenomenum appears in RAW.
Sharpening mode setting is the in camera setting 3.
yes, I applied long expsoure NR, after the picture was taken.

There was a firmware update (1.1.3) out by June but as far as I could read, it did not address the black halo phenomenum.

Here's a full exif sample at mRAW (or is it related to mRAW?)

The black halos aren't "visible" at print size, but they appear as strange clusters...

Hope Canon gets this fixed by the next firmware update.
Anyone out there having the same problems while doing night sky?

Still enthusiastic about my 5D3 but...Did some night sky photography last night and detected in all the frames black shadows around certain star clusters, no matter what ISO setting it was.

Guess I've seen this in early reports about the 5D3 in March or April. So as I bought it exactly for this kind of photography...What can I do? Did I get a lemon? Serial number: 04230012696. bought the cam on August 27 from a retail dealer...

Thanks for your help. Cheers, Pedro.

Here's the dpr thread about it

Fiddled a bit more with my 5D3
Here are two samples
51k, some NR
102k, NR: Brightness 11, Chroma: 20, darkened a bit

B/W at these ISOs works quite well.

All I was looking for. Plenty of camera.

If we get some 25kish 51k some 6 years down, that'd be awesome!  8)

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