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Messages - HurtinMinorKey

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361
EOS Bodies / Re: Canon EOS C300 Price Drop Already? [CR1]
« on: November 28, 2011, 01:13:10 PM »

Great article here on the Scarlet and some pretty ugly truths about the camera

http://philipbloom.net/2011/11/20/scarlet/


That is no lie. This is a great article. Read it if you are on the fence about RED.

362
EOS Bodies / Re: Only 4.3 mil.
« on: November 21, 2011, 12:06:27 PM »
If someone had showed me this thrown into a random flickr account of someones ametuer photography I wouldn't have blinked an eye.  Rich people are assholes and must be stopped at all costs.

Hey if it wasn't for rich people and their "superior" taste, we'd never have known who Picasso was (see Gertrude Stein).  By this i mean, if it wasn't for rich people, recklessly bidding up the price of essentially worthless objects, there'd be no market for so called art.  So thanks to them, even hacks like me can hope to score it big, if all I have to do is impress a lonely, nursing-home heiress.   :P



363
EOS Bodies / Re: RED - Scarlet.....
« on: November 10, 2011, 02:13:55 PM »
Yup, Peter Jackson's latest blog on the Hobbit says the same - OTT colours on the scenery in Mirkwood, additional red on the actors faces because the Red Epic doesn't do colour in the same way...

There is so much misinformation on this site, it's ridiculous. I don't want to correct anyone though because then you'll all go buy Scarlets and oversaturate my market share. But. . .I can't help to correct someone when they're wrong.

Regarding the makeup in LOTR: the extra red makeup has nothing to do with the camera color science... the mirrors in the 3D rig desaturate magenta from one eye ( tints green ) so instead of boosting back saturation in just one eye in post, they prefer to lift both eyes in saturation then remove it as necessary. The exact same thing would happen to any camera through the 3D rig beamsplitter. one eye goes green , one eye goes magenta. Many ways to compensate for that, this is just one.

Regarding the "reject" processors from Epics being used in Scarlets: each and every camera gets a high quality sensor. Just because you buy a Scarlet doesn't mean your sensor is any less worthy than if you bought an Epic. What is different on the Scarlet is the processing speed of the ASICs. That limits functionality (high fps, high redcode), not sensor image quality. All else being equal, you will get the exact same quality images from Scarlet; it just can't make as many of them each second. Hence the same resolutions, but lower frame rates. Slower processor doesn't mean degraded image.

The internet is a vast and wonderful place to do research, so. . .do it.

So instead of doing it in post, they alter the actors makeup and set design because that's much easier :o...  that cannot be the only reason.  Other directors have brought up issues with the color before, it's just funny as hell that Jackson outed Red in that manner.  If he wanted to blame it on the 3d rig, he would have.

I don't believe that RED would use "reject processors".  But this doesn't change the fact that RED hasn't yet mastered things in 2k yet, let alone 4k, because of color issues (see my earlier comment  comparing  "Fight Club" to the "The Social Network").

RED makes some good cameras (I still might buy one), but people need to stop judging the C300 based on just resolution and fps.

At the end of the day, I'm surprised people are giving RED so much credit for Scarlet. They went with the simplest solution possible: use the same sensor and nerf the processor. That should have taken 2 days not 2 years.   






 

364
EOS Bodies / Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« on: November 09, 2011, 05:52:08 PM »

You think wrong then...

As I said on another thread. Compare the "Social Network"(RED) to "Fight Club"(FILM).
It's the same Director, and same DP on both. The Social Network looks like sh*t in comparison.

That's a bit of a simplistic comparison is it not? Just looking at production costs alone, the Fight Club when adjusted for inflation in 1999 cost close to 30 million dollars more than the price tag to put out the Social Network.

I don't think it is.

1. Sure, shooting on RED can save you a bunch of money(especially since Fincher likes to do 100 takes for everything), but my point was that even thought RED is 4K, the picture doesn't look so hot, especially when compared to film.  So since they haven't proved they can make 1080p look like film yet, let's not get ahead of ourselves and call anything that doesn't output in 4k "obsolete".

2. The budget disparity is exaggerated by the fact that Fight Club had Brad Pitt and Edward Norton, whereas the Social Network had Jessie Whatshisname and Mara Whatsherface.  :)

365
EOS Bodies / Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« on: November 08, 2011, 03:28:21 PM »
Which one is the most disappointing? :) I think RED ONE is already almost 30% of mainstream productions.

You think wrong then...

As I said on another thread. Compare the "Social Network"(RED) to "Fight Club"(FILM).
It's the same Director, and same DP on both. The Social Network looks like sh*t in comparison.


366
EOS Bodies / Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« on: November 08, 2011, 01:36:54 PM »
People want tech that looks good right now. And there is reason to believe that the C300 looks better than the red at 1080, so it can still compete in the format that's currently most in demand.  Clearly there are problems with Red's sensor if directors need to adjust makeup and set design to account for it, and it doesn't seem to be a problem that can be fixed in post, even in RAW.

I like the Red concept. But I've been disappointed at the quality of the feature films I've seen shot on it.

Also, I think the people working at RED certainly were not laughing, and their actions support this notion. Because at the end of the day, the Red Scarlet is just a nerfed version of the old Red Epic. After all that time, that's their new technology??????  That should have taken them 2 days, not two years.

Lets face it, RED knew Canon was jumping into the game;  but Red was nowhere close to feasible new technology, so they decided to rename old technology and just throw it out there. 



 

367
EOS Bodies / Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« on: November 07, 2011, 08:38:44 PM »
I don't know who Canon is competing with a $20K price range, the Sony F3? It certainly isn't the Scarlet-X. Why pay more for a video system that performs poorly against its cheaper rival? Only an idiot would do that.

Here's an article from Canon Digital Learning Center that, I think, gives a nice explanation of what exactly were the people at Canon smoking when they designed the C300 and who they think they're selling this thing to. What they're basically claming is that this camera performs well enough for most people potentially interested in buying one and it's way easier and faster to work with than any of the current 4K cameras. It would appear that they've done their research and discovered that there's plenty of "idiots" out there to justify the R&D costs.


And these people are idiots because?

Whats with the 4k obsession?   Is there anyone out there gonna even use it?   If the this camera (C300) does a better job rendering color than the Red cameras, than it might be worth it. 

Ya know, the new i-phone has a 8 mpix camera, does that make it as good as the 1D mkii?   :o

368
EOS Bodies / Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« on: November 06, 2011, 07:51:05 PM »
Q: Is the Bayer pattern on the C300 equivalent to chroma sampling 4k @ 4:2:0? It looks like it to me. 

369
EOS Bodies / Re: RED - Scarlet.....
« on: November 04, 2011, 07:10:05 PM »
So the difference between Red and Canon is? ???

If canon charges you $20K for a Camera, you're actors won't have to wear special makeup(see post about the hobbit above) to account for sketchy color.

370
EOS Bodies / Re: RED - Scarlet.....
« on: November 04, 2011, 02:02:17 PM »
At first glance, based on the specs, one would have to agree, but the only way to truly tell the difference is side by side comparison of performance.

Red has always had trouble reproducing colors accurately.  Just compare blu-ray copies of "Fight Club" to "the Social Network" (both by badass director David Fincher).

Fight Club (shot on film) looks sooooo much better than the social network (shot on red epic) it's not even funny.

I'd rather have good color at 2k than so-so color at 4k.  If canon can do this, then maybe it's worth the extra coin.

371
EOS Bodies / Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« on: November 04, 2011, 11:45:18 AM »
How come there isn't a lot of discussion about the new video camera? Are people disappointed?  Isn't the 50Mbs the same data rate as the 5DMKII? Doesn't it use the same codec as 1Dx? So why the is it $20K?

372
EOS Bodies / Re: November 3, 2011 Announcement
« on: November 03, 2011, 09:04:29 PM »
Nice response RED. Their website just melted down.

373
EOS Bodies / Re: Live Coverage of the Announcement
« on: November 03, 2011, 08:37:24 PM »
So why is this camera 2X as expensive as the 1Dx when the output is the same essentially?

374
EOS Bodies / Re: November 3, 2011 Announcement
« on: November 03, 2011, 08:26:10 PM »
Looks like they are really trying to emphasize that this thing does an amazing job of color reproduction. People are nailing it for not being 4k output thought. $20 is kinda steep though. Still...if it does a better job of color reproduction that Red Camera, then even at 2k it will be worth it.

But seriously, can it be that much better than the 1dx?  They both produce the same output, with the same compression.

Someone help me out here...

375
EOS Bodies / Re: November 3, 2011 Announcement
« on: November 03, 2011, 05:59:42 PM »
Red make their announcement 3 hrs later, allowing them to decide their price point no doubt  ;)

or time to make up lies about scarlet's specifications once they get outgunned and under priced.

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