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Messages - AvTvM

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1
EOS Bodies - For Stills / Re: Canon mirrorless: Status?
« on: August 20, 2014, 04:39:44 PM »
I see a very capable and compact camera without flapping mirror but with about 50% more resolution and 2 stops more DR than even the biggest of all big & fat [Canon] mirrorslappers.  ;D

The picture also demonstrates nicely how much easier it is to make a small camera larger, rather than a large camera smaller. :-)

http://www.thephoblographer.com/2014/08/20/review-sony-vgc1em-digital-camera-battery-grip-sony-a7a7ra7s/
And I think it's a stimulating photo to windup this discussion.  Do you believe this is the future, or do you believe this is mirrorless trying to be / to do too much? 

2
Canon General / Re: A Rundown of EOS 7D Mark II Information
« on: August 19, 2014, 05:36:33 PM »
EF mount and the Rebel line are the only innovations you can think of?
How about image stabilization, ultrasonic motors, a relatively inexpensive full-frame digital body, and high-def video in SLRs?
How about eye-controlled focus, and diffractive optics?

reasonable Video capabilities (5D II) really only happened to Canon. It was definitely not their innovation. Magic Lantern were the innovative ones, if anybody.

Image stabilization ... no Canon invention.
Ultrasonic AF drive .. no Canon invention.
Hi-def video in DSLRs .. hardly much of an innovation. Those who need it shall buy proper video cams. Should not be forced on regular DSLR buyers.

Eye Controlled AF ... yes. very nice. but last seen 20 years ago. If Canon were so innovative to bring us a working v.2 ECF in all future cameras (with viewfinder) ... I'd definitely love it. :-)

3
Canon General / Re: A Rundown of EOS 7D Mark II Information
« on: August 19, 2014, 05:10:03 PM »
They are an innovative, but generally conservative company that has slowly, over decades, built themselves up to become the market leaders in a highly competitive and at times very crowded field.

Canon has been innovative exactly 2 times in all of their history. They started out as a an utterly un-innovative japanese copy cat of german cameras and remained jist that for the first 30 years of their history.

The 2 innovative feats were:
* 1987 ... ditch the FD mount and bring a fully electronic , new mount: EF. they did not listen to theri ultra-conservative user base who were crying over their nice FD SSC lenses. Canon for once did, what was necessary: radically break with the past. Screw mechanical crap in the lens mount. Make it all electronic. Choose a good flange diostance and make the freaking hole large enough to enable all sorts of great lenese, including "still affordable"  f/1.2 lenses and carry them into the electronic and then digital future. That move along with the parallel decision to put AF into the lens, not the body and quickly recover from their initial AF disaster [T80 anyone? ;-) ] and their ability to sell the advantages of that concept really well, got them to trump Nikon and become market leader.

* 2003 - digital Rebel - first truly affordable DSLR ... under 1k €/USD. Preceded since 2000 by the decision to use CMSO sensors, when everybody else thought of CCDs to be a way better solution for imaging sensors. Agaion preceded by the unrewarding mucking around in the 1990 with Kodak (all that DCS crap) -... which convinced Canon that they needed full control over the entire digital camera stuff, including their own sensor fabs. Those desicions got Canon massive market leadership in the first half of the 2000's decade.

Unfortunately bold, true innovation has ceased quite rapidly after after that and Canon today is an arrogant, fat, bloated japanese corporation run by a typical geriatric ward. Risk-averse down to theri last toenail. Slow,  bureaucratic and encrusted. It will take quite some pain (= a copule of catastrophic balance sheets) to bring them to their senses and back onto the innovation track. Abandon DSLRs (except 1 series for people who really need those to hammer nails into walls and drop behind behind enemy lines and use 600/4 superteles handheld all day long) and fully embrace mirrorless. One great APS-C lineup - good EF-M lenses are there and the EOS-M has the right size and just needs a good upgrade and expansion (EVF, AF, battery charge). Plus ditching of the EF mount and a new, kick-ass Sony A7 killing compact line of ultra-capable FF mirrorless bodies and new native lenses. The desicion does not take that many guts as the one back in 1987, since the flange distance wil be shorter this time round, so cheap adapters without any optical elements will suffice to ease the transition.  ;D
 

4
EOS Bodies - For Stills / Re: Canon mirrorless: Status?
« on: August 18, 2014, 06:24:58 PM »
Again, I'm not arguing for Canon/Nikon to avoid this market, but it makes some sense that they let this chaotic primordial ooze of a market evolve further before trying to conquer it.

there is nothing chaotic in the mirrorless market. Definitely less so than in the artificially crippled, "marketing-differentiated" world of DSLRs. Batteries, Battery grips, external WFT-Wifi bricks ... all of them totally incompatible even within one manufacturers line of cameras! Canon offering 5 different APS-C mirror-slappers in parallel - 1200D, 100D, 700D, 70D, 7D/7D II at the same time .. Nikon running 3 different APS-C DSLRs, all with the same sensor in parallel and moving towards 5 different FF DSLRs in parallel-  D610, D810, Df, D4s + one new rumored. And to make the mess even worse ... all of these grandfather-DSLRs "video-optimized", although mirrorless cams will always win the video game. Naturally. No mirror to be flapped out of lights' way all the time! :-)

Now where's the primordial ooze? The mess. The clunkiness. The mirror-slappin. Fat, greasy, old and heavy 19-century mechanical tech stuff?  Looks rather like Jurassic Park to me. Soon to go extinct. :P

5
EOS Bodies - For Stills / Re: Canon mirrorless: Status?
« on: August 18, 2014, 05:57:32 PM »
I strongly resent cameras with fixed lenses. Sony RX-1 ... bah, I'd never buy it. Even with a "bolted-on" zoom lens I'd feel narrowed in. I want to be able to change lenses if I and whenever I want to. Including usi9ng my 70-200/2.8 L IS II on my EOS-M at a concert. And put the TS-E 17/4 on that same EOS-M the next day when I am urbexing at some god-forsaken abandoned textile mill in the middle of nowhere.

There is no reason whatsoever to limit myself - or even worse - let others limit me to a 24-85 eq. FOV. :-)

Since Sony has proven, that a capable, full-frame mirrorless camera does not have to be any bigger than a mFT or APS-C one ... that's what I really want.

And btw. the mirrorless market (with lens mount) is no zoo, it is fairly simple. There are currently only four tiers to it,. and it will shrinkt to only two some time soon:

  • 1" ... Nikon 1 ... bound to die. Sensor too small. Only one player without much of clue. Dead end, stay away.
  • mFT - many players. also a dead end. Sensor too small relative to camera and lens size. Glass does not scale proportionately. Will be around for some years to come though. Enjoy it, while it lasts. Market leaders: Oly, Panasonic
  • APS-C ... very reasonable budget alternative. One stop less photographic opportuniities at significantly lower cost than FF. As in DSLRs. Will survive for many years to come. Clear market leader: Sony/E-Mount.
  • FF - 135 format. 36-24. Getting more affordable by the day. ANd really small. Inclduing nice pancakes that don't cost an arm and a leg. Clear market leader and innovator: Sony.

Rather simple, isn't it? :-)

Canon? So far ... nowhere. EOS-M a success due to fantastic, but totally unwanted price/value position. And thanks to APS-C lenses that are small, really good IQ and dirt cheap. Hang in there and clamor for more and better things to come (bodies!) :-)

6
EOS Bodies - For Stills / Re: Canon mirrorless: Status?
« on: August 18, 2014, 12:30:45 PM »
Nothing can stop mirrorless. Only open question is how fast it's goint to happen. Some DSLRs will be avalaible for a long time, similar to MF cameras todays and vinyl records.

It makes no sense whatsoever to "protect" DSLR sales by NOT offering the most attractive possible mirrorless camera systems. Economies are much better for mirrorless bodies. They can be produced quite a bit cheaper than correspondingly featured DSLRs [due to lack of mechanical elements needing very careful alignment and adjustment] .. but can be sold at rather similar prices. For that reason alone mirrorless will succeed. :-)

If Canon does not start to offer these soon and "in earnest", they will loose out. Including FF (135 format) sensors and lenses.  No matter what their analysts may say. Others will offer these cameras and there will be market share losses.

Yes, a 70-200/2.8 will always be a fairly sizeable lens. But most amateurs and pro's do not NEED a 70-200/2.8 ALL THE TIME. When more than 300mm focal length are used - especially with a fast tele lens, it is more often than not used on a tripod/gimbal or on a monopod. A small camera body will not hurt handling then ... all that's reuqired is to shift the lens-camera combination a bit backwards on the Arca plate attached to the lens collar foot to get it nicely into balance on the pivot point.  :-)

7
Canon General / Re: A Rundown of EOS 7D Mark II Information
« on: August 18, 2014, 11:25:39 AM »
Thanks Danuiela. I believe that perfectly describes current Canon thinking. However, as opposed to Canon and their analysts I am convinced this ignorance and arrogance towards their customers will cost them dearly.

I have purchased hardly anything from Canon during the last 5 years (7D) and will continue to do so, as long as they do not deliver the products I want [basically, a mirrorless "Sony A7R killer" or at the very least a "Fuji XT-1 killer" (APS-C)]. I've recently sold the 7D and some of the Canon lenses and have no qualms to sell the remaining approx. 5k in Canon lenses, if need be.

Yes, that's just me ... but I know, it is not just me. :-)

Information from Japanese Canon fan girls, who are working @Canon:

Information about the successor of the 7D and the 5DIII are under total NDA. And total means total. There is just an small circle of engeneers and managers who know all of these Cameras. Others are just working on fragments of this Cameras to avoid leaks. If anyone says, he knows details on these products, he is not telling the truth.
In earlier times print jobs for tranportation and manuals were given to the printeries weeks before announcement. This time, there ist still just printing time reservated. No files have been sent to them (status from 08/12).

Canon is still thinking that they do not have to produce the best and most innovative products in the low and mid price segments. Sales figures show that the market analysts are right. Canon is still the best power seller on the market. And the analysts know that in future time, the market wil not grow and other brands are coming in. Sony will be very active, maybe an 5DIII and 1DX mirrorless competitor is coming in the near future.
The slow reaction on the D7100 and the still "no reaction" on the excellent D800/810 is well calculated. No need to hurry, Canon products are still sold well. There are not many persons switching to Nikon, because the majority of Canonians will not be able to spend a lot of money on new expensive lenses. The average Canon customer will be satisfied by new Canon products, even if other brands will produce superior products.

And the rumored prices of the 7D successor are just rumors. Some Canon fans in Japan think that there will be an hefty price increase on Canon products on coming products. Analysts say, that customers are willed to pay the increase. The increasing number of tests and scores, where Canon products are often just a few points /percents better than e.g. third party lenses, will prompt the average (and scores fixed) Canon fan to buy this "bettert product".
If you can see that in their pictures? I do not know.

8
EOS Bodies - For Stills / Re: Canon mirrorless: Status?
« on: August 18, 2014, 11:16:16 AM »
But buying an EOS-M and then slapping an adaptor on it is a fail.  The killer app for this system is size, and when you bolt the old mirror box distance back on, what's the point?

The point is very simple. I want ONE fully capable camera system only. ONE battery type, ONE charger. ONE lens mount. ONE user interface to learn and know by heart and blindfolded. 

Whenever possible, I like to go really small and light. Small and light camera body plus one or a few small + light  native short-flangeback lenses. I am willing to limit myself to and including 200mm on APS-C [witness the EF-M 55-200] or about 85mm focal length on FF.

Only ocassionally my shooting situations will require larger gear. Either studio (lights) or events in darkish places (speedlites plus fast glass), or a "longish tele" [in my case max. 400mm] or a Tilt-Shift or some other more "special" lens (fisheye 8-15, 100 Macro etc.],

In many of these shooting situations - especially with larger lenses) I also carry along and use a tripod and have my DSRLs in LiveView mode. So I do not use or need any of the mirror or OVF. I would be much better served by a small and light mirrorless camera. Especially if it had a fully electronic shutter without any vibrations and any noise. Plus EVF. E.g. for use at concerts (classical music).

I have no need whatsoever for a mirrorslappin' DSLR ... IF and when I get a fully capable (FF-sensored, 6fps, tracking AF as good as or better than Sony A6000 Fuji XT-1) small and light mirrorless camera. I'd be willing to bridge the time until then with a really good Canon EOS M3 ("Pro") with APS-C sensor.

9
EOS Bodies - For Stills / Re: Canon mirrorless: Status?
« on: August 18, 2014, 10:59:58 AM »
Canon hopefully have learned their lesson. Do NOT bring sub-par specced gear (EOS-M) to market, asking WAY TOO HIGH PRICES for it (EOS-M).

I definitely expect an
* EOS M3
body size like EOS-M2, AF as good as Sony A6000/5100, sensor equal, Wifi built in, flash built-in priced competitively [i.e. around USD/€ 650 including EF-M 18-55] 
plus additionally
* a much better specced EOS M "Pro 1"
with kick-butt 7D II sensor, mirrorless class-leading DP-AF, fully articulated touch-screen 1920x1080 Full-HD res, WiFI, GPS and RT-Commander built in; 4k video like pany GH4, body size slightly smaller than Fuji XT-1, 1 thumb/select wheel in back, plus 1 dial close to shutter, priced competitively at around USD/€ 1299,-
any time soon.


Followed somewhat later by the announcement of the Canon FF EOS XL1" and "XL 3" mirroless cams plus new short-back lens mount Canon EF-XL and initial native lens selection of 24-70/4.0 plus pancake set of 20/2.8, 50/1.8 and 75/2.8.   8)  8)  8)

Guess, which one I will pre-order! :-)

10
Canon General / Re: A Rundown of EOS 7D Mark II Information
« on: August 18, 2014, 04:25:19 AM »
All i care about is images ... And i know, i cannot get such images with the 7D or the EOS-M and also not with a Canon 6D or 5D3 or 1D-X.


Then why do I see similar images from those cameras all the time? Browse a photo sharing site some time.


Well, I have shot myself and seen enough images from all sorts of current Canon EOS cameras ... and NONE of them can deliver these kind of images out of cam / without REALLY HEAVY post processing. 


http://aboutphotography-tomgrill.blogspot.co.at/
Quote
Exceptional dynamic range, from the bright window to the deep shadows with no noise and smooth tonal trasition. No fill was added to this severely back lit shot.





11
Canon General / Re: A Rundown of EOS 7D Mark II Information
« on: August 18, 2014, 01:30:39 AM »
I don't care at all about DXO. And I don't care whether it's called "DR", "photographic DR" or "latitude".
I do care about images ... and i know, I cannot get images like in the following link (Nikon D810 review) from my 7D or the EOS-M and also not from a Canon 6D or 5D3 or 1D-X or any other Canon EOS.

Here goes:
http://aboutphotography-tomgrill.blogspot.co.at/2014/08/nikon-d810-hands-on-review.html?m=1

BEcause I (greatly) prefer the Canon user interface, I would like to get this type of IQ and "DR" from a Canon EOS ... preferably mirrorless FF camera the size and weight if a Sony A7.

And I don't care, whether it is called 5D IV, 6D II, EOS-M Pro or whatever. As long as they bring it to market at competitive prices = somewhere between Alpha 7R and Nikon D810  ;D

12
Canon General / Re: A Rundown of EOS 7D Mark II Information
« on: August 15, 2014, 12:55:57 PM »
"Serious" videographers should not clamor for freaking video-optimized crap in stills cameras, especially not in DSLRS with a mirror in the lightpath. They should go buy a panasonic GH4 if they are poor or a Sony A7S if they want "full frame/shallow DOF" or a canon C-something if they want a video-optimized camera or if they really dont mind the mirror and want FF plus 4k, then a canon EOS 1D-C ... if they are not so poor. An APS-C DSLR is by its very nature the least suitable video-recording device. So stay away from it.

I hope the 7D successor comes without any video-recording capabilities whatsoever. A lean and mean STILLS machine.

13
EOS Bodies / Re: Plan B
« on: August 14, 2014, 01:01:05 PM »
use EOS-M only. Buy 11-22. Sell all my EF-S lenses except 60 Macro.  :-) 

14
EOS Bodies / Re: A Bit of EOS 7D Replacement Info [CR2]
« on: August 13, 2014, 03:50:37 PM »
As long as canon and all other digicam makers are able to put wifi and gps into quite a number of measly and cheap 1/1.7" and 1/2.3" dwarf-sensored compact and bridge cams .. Powershots, elphs, coolpix ... And are able to get regulatory approvals for those pieces of junk around the world ... There is no excuse on earth for not putting wifi, gps and rt flash commander into every single dslr they make.

15
EOS Bodies / Re: Patent: Dual Pixel Phase Detect AF While in AI Servo
« on: August 12, 2014, 02:02:03 PM »
1. I see a mirror flapping in that patent.
2. To me it looks like a feedback loop for automatic, in-camera "AF-Micro-Adjustment".

I do not se anything directly linked to dual-pixel AF [automatic AFMA for DSLR-phase-detect AF-unit could be achieved with any sort of additional in-sensor plane AF ... CD-AF and/or PD-AF] nor to improved Servo-Tracking performance. And I also fail to see how this patent might improve AF-capabilities of *mirrorless* cameras.

As much as I am looking forward to the demise of the flapping mirror, too.  ;D

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