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Messages - Marsu42

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EOS Bodies / Re: 6D Autofocus not impressive
« on: June 23, 2013, 08:35:03 PM »
I believe that Canon made the decision to leave out the cross-type AF points to make room for the WiFi and GPS.

I hope I'll not be reprimanded for mentioning this, but the af array is on the *bottom* of the camera- afaik major space (and production costs) saving only occur due to making the af array smaller, i.e. like 5d2 and not like 5d3 ... here's good article on this by our very own Dr. Neuro: http://www.the-digital-picture.com/photography-tips/Canon-EOS-DSLR-Autofocus-Explained.aspx

As for the top: Canon didn't include a flash (like in the Nikon d600) because that's where the gps/wifi antennas are, for the same reason the casing is not full metal unlike the other Canon ff cameras.

Animal Kingdom / Re: Wildlife Tips?
« on: June 23, 2013, 04:03:42 PM »
Do you use Spot and Partial Metering often as well as Center-Point Focus?  Av or Tv; generally?

* Mode: For wildlife (I've been shooting (semi-)wild horses during the last months a lot) I'm using Av to pre-set the desired depth of field. With the 6d/5d3/1dx or Magic Lantern's auto iso you can then set a lowest shutter speed so you don't get motion blur, and let the camera set the iso. If you use flash remember that beyond x-sync the flash power drops a lot, so you might want to lock the shutter speed at x-sync.

* Metering: For servo af I use spot (center point af, only the 1d can link it to other af points), otherwise eval with a little ec correction which is a matter of experience.

AI Servo usually? Thanks for any guidance although I'm sure I'll have to learn a lot just by doing.

* AF: Everyone raves about how important ai servo is, an this is certainly true for sports & action. But for non-moving wildlife you'll usually want the eyes in focus and if the animal isn't at 90 degrees angle servo will focus on the front, i.e. with a thinner depth of field the eyes will be out of focus. So use one-shot af and either focus the eyes & recompose, or with a 1d/5d3 af select the correct af point, plus don't be too shy to re-af and re-shoot a couple of times because getting the eyes in focus is a lot of hit & miss really.

EOS Bodies / Re: 6D Autofocus not impressive
« on: June 23, 2013, 09:37:58 AM »
Fine.  I stand by my points and opinion, and you are equally entitled to yours.  I will argue no more - I've got better things to to do  8)

Actually, I also have :-p (not that I'd think you'd wanted to imply otherwise), I just felt the need to reply to your criticism since I value your contributions to CR, have fun shooting!

EOS Bodies / Re: 6D Autofocus not impressive
« on: June 23, 2013, 09:25:11 AM »
My problem is that you while you say you are planning to get the 6D, I read you doing little other than continually criticizing it.

In this case, you really might want to try to read again, I even often put a disclaimer under my posts to prevent just what you implied now. - I went out of my way writing about the 6d being a good camera over crop or 5d2, even topping the 5d3 in some things: http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?topic=11309.0

If you really want the camera, fine, then buy it.  If you don't really want it, then buy another a different camera...and that's also fine.

Or if I simply want to wait some for the prices in Germany to drop (€100 in the last *week*, here it's still *more* expensive than the d600), that's also fine. While I'm doing that, I feel free to contribute to any threads here from people wondering about the same thing I wondered about, often pointing to my positive 6d fact list mentioned above. In fact, I'd feel free to post even if I'd decide never to buy a 6d because I'd think crop is sufficient for me and let other people know about my decision making process :-)

And, with all due respect, the implication that owner's bias trumps the experience they have through ownership is fallacious.  If I own something that isn't actually good, I quickly sell it and replace it with something that is.  It's that simple.

Without putting too fine a point on it, in my very humble opinion you are mistaken because there is no alternative to the 6d with Canon and in this price range except for the outdated 5d2. So what would someone who's unhappy with the 6d replace it with? Sell all glass and buy Nikon? Spend €1000 + 6d loss more and get a 5d3? See - it isn't that simple. Plus many people are simply attached to things once they bought it, I know I am.

As for what trumps what - I'd take my privilege to evaluate this on a case by case basis. In your case, experience certainly trumps owner's bias (if there is any at all). In other cases where someone does low light photography, then reads about lacking servo af performance, goes outside, snaps something and posts the (one?) keeper saying "it's just fine" I'm not so sure.

EOS Bodies / Re: 6D Autofocus not impressive
« on: June 23, 2013, 07:06:25 AM »
P.S. Not trying to be disrespectful, but it seems to me that the primary posters that keep questioning the AF system on the 6D are those that don't actually own the body.

That would be me? The general problem as I see it is that people who have shelled out a lot of $$$ for a dslr might have a bias toward liking the camera, as of course it's a good camera, as is any current dlsr. Fortunately have a very matter-of-fact approach and seem to have a lot of experience with the 6d, but in general I'd be hesitant to prefer any given "owner" opinion over a few hours of "non-owner" testing, esp. if people don't also own the competition (7d, 5d3).

Testing one in shop or using a friends' is not really a substitute for having the camera, calibrating a lens, and becoming familiar with using it.  I'm not saying that you can have no knowledge, but you certainly don't have the knowledge that I have acquired by owning two the cameras and taking thousands upon thousands of photos with them in a variety of conditions.

My contribution to this thread was that the af point spread is far smaller than on the crop cameras, and thus focusing & recomposing might get trickier with a small dof, lowering the keeper rate with spot-on af @100% crop. I explicitly suspected that my problems when trying the 6d also have to do with a lack of experience/technique - but even your two cameras are bound to have the af points in the same place as all the other 5d2/6d. So I really appreciate your great input and reviews, but in this case I don't see how extended usage of a camera changes the position of the af points :-o

EOS Bodies / Re: 6D Autofocus not impressive
« on: June 22, 2013, 01:55:28 AM »
I just wanted to say that with a 600EX-RT on top providing the red AF assist grid, the outer points on the 6D work fantastic in any lighting conditions, from bright sunlight to a pitch black room. Now that I've moved to the Canon RT system I have absolutely no problems with the 6D's autofocus

Just two points (though of course it's great you're happy with the combination):

1. You wouldn't have needed the expensive 600rt for that, the larger spread of the newest flash is made for the 1dx/5d3 af array - for the 5d2/6d af a 580ex/430ex/3rdparty-something would be sufficient.

2. Of course you can af in pitch blackness with af assist, same goes for my 60d, but one main advantage of the 6d is to focus w/o beam distraction & shoot in available light (high iso capability) - so fixing the outer af point light sensitivity with af assist doesn't entirely satisfy me.

Lenses / Re: New Wide Angles Lenses in 2013 [CR2]
« on: June 20, 2013, 07:19:17 AM »
I can confirm that a EF 16-50 f/4 prototype exist.

.. which most likely would exclude a 2013 release date, thanks. And Canon will sell the more expensive 14-24 uwa first anyway to max profit, just like they sell the 600rt flash and we're still waiting for the cheaper version

 Last not least, there also is a 17-40 mk2 prototype, so depending on marketing strategy Canon might opt to go for this cheaper version than a more expensive 16-50L ... or they just cheat a little on the focal lengths and relabel the 17-40L to 16-50L :->

EOS Bodies / Re: 6D Autofocus not impressive
« on: June 20, 2013, 07:02:14 AM »
Your argument is unique to your market; the D600 is $100+ more than the 6D in the North American market.  He wasn't wrong by the market standard that he lives in, your market is obviously different.

I know :-> - but I couldn't help but to make the point that Canon's strategy, i.e. a Japanese company selling in *all* countries, cannot be judged by looking at US-$ prices alone. If someone says the d6 will *always* be less  expensive than d600 which is an absolute theory it can be contradicted by one different example from another large market, even if the US might be the biggest (as things should be :-)).

well i believe that you are never check on real life and only read on website. even you check on bnh store: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/buy/Digital-Cameras/ci/9811/N/4288586282  u can see that nikon D600 is 100usd more expensive that canon 6D. so do your homework or reality check

Well, your homework consists of finding a globe and trying to find the US. Got it (it might say "Center of the world" on your version)? Good. Then look at all the other countries, amazing, isn't it? Well, and Canon sells dlsr everywhere, that's why I quoted the € (that's "Euro") prices, and even if you don't care about that in an English-written forum there are always the Brits and the Ozzies who don't pay in US-$.

Lenses / Re: New Wide Angles Lenses in 2013 [CR2]
« on: June 19, 2013, 06:15:22 PM »
The 16-50 F4L IS sounds REALLY intriguing, lets hope it's around 1k and I'll buy it. :)

No way - the 17-40L already is €600 after years and years on the market, a wider version (ad $$$) plus larger zoom range (add $$$) plus better iq (add much more $$$) will result in a hefty price tag - and Canon will sell it, because a really good 14-24 will be even more expensive.

For me, this is good news because I'm very happy I bough my 17-40L at a really reasonable price for a sealed L lens, it's sturdy and has good for what I do with it :-)

EOS Bodies / Re: 6D Autofocus not impressive
« on: June 19, 2013, 05:42:10 PM »
As for complaining that Canon "hobbled the 6D"...if they did, it was not for fear of impacting sales of the 5D3.  It was to ensure that the Nikon D600 could never be offered at a lower street price than the 6D (because Canon's frontend cost on the 6D is lower than the Nikon's for the D600).  I thought this was common knowledge?  The 6D's feature set has nothing at all to do with the 5D3...think about it.

I thought about it and you're wrong: the d600 costs nearly €200 less than the 6d, and it has been this way from the start. Canon probably figures that €200 will make nobody jump ship.

 The reason why Canon did the 6d as it is was ...
* save research time after the Nikon d600 release, i.e. recycle as much as they had (6d = 6ßd+5d2+5d3),
* to sidestep Nikon d600 (gps, wifi, low-light af but less af points) while at the same time
* protecting the 5d3 sales (af precision, af spread, fps, ...) and most of all to
* generate profits: I'm sure the 6d is cheap to produce.

Disclaimer: The 6d is a good camera, esp. over the 5d2 (see my positive fact list: http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?topic=11309.0) but if you want to shoot af shallow dof in non-center you might be less than happy if you want to stay with Canon but not pay €3000 for a camera body that probably also won't last as long as the successor due to the legacy sensor tech.

EOS Bodies / Re: 6D Autofocus not impressive
« on: June 17, 2013, 08:01:38 PM »
how often do you do shots like this?  and, at what time of day?  There is the option of using a less shallow DOF.

Well, yes, but one point of putting 1700€ (€!) into a ff and a f2.8 lens is to shoot with shallow dof, if I need to crop for that or revert to a smaller aperture one ff advantage is lost.

Either way, if your doing extreme corner focusing, nothing out there other than shooting in live view and manual focusing will get you there because as far as I know, there is no such camera that has AF points in the extreme corners--

Please not: I wasn't talking of the extreme corners, of course not, but simple *near* the edge of the frame, say 3/4 to the side or corners... and here the real 5d2/6d vs 5d3 af spread tells the whole story. I suppose the crammed af points are good for tracking though, that's when the 40d/50d/60d-style compeletely fails vs. 7d.

The lack of a proper joystick is also a terrible loss, as the directional pad is mushy as all hell and imprecise.

My 2ct: You don't need a joystick for 9 or 11 af points, you can easily select them with the multicontroller.

What the 40/50D does well at least is how the middle points on the diagonals are located spot on in the intersections for rule of thirds and that is after all where a good amount of shots will want the focus

+1, that's one thing I like about my 60d's af points, I often use the diagonals for macro shooting.

EOS Bodies / Re: 6D Autofocus not impressive
« on: June 17, 2013, 06:58:09 AM »
an idea or 2 --- try stepping back, and framing the shot wider when you are working with extreme DOF - then crop to get the composition you want.

Looking at your shots, I see what you mean - it's just I'm not overly happy that the most practical solution to the "thin dof and soft edges" problem is less recomposing but more cropping - if I plan to regularly crop from the 20mp ff sensor I could just keep shooting with a real 18mp crop sensor :-p

Disclaimer (again): The 6d is a good/ok (depending on what value you see for the price) camera, my question here is about specific shooting situations.

EOS Bodies / Re: Patent: EF 100-400 f/4.5-5.6L IS
« on: June 16, 2013, 06:05:26 PM »
For me the 70-300L has proven itself worthwhile. It's perfectly sharp

No way, it doesn't outresolve either the ff or crop sensors - I'd say it's absolutely "sharp enough", but no comparison to for example the 100L or afaik other very sharp zooms like the 24-70ii or the 70-200is2.

EOS Bodies / Re: 6D Autofocus not impressive
« on: June 16, 2013, 06:03:15 PM »
I understand your concern, but is there such a thing as a FF camera with autofocus points in the corners?

I know, but at least the 5d3 has the af points not as much in the center as 5d2/5d3, so it's probably less way to move the camera to focus & recompose. Nikon d600 isn't any better in this matter afaik btw.

I just wanted to ask around here for experiences when recomposing with a small dof on ff because with the 6d I found it much harder than with my 60d, of course /me lacking the proper technique.

Site Information / Re: Issues with Integration of JPGs in Posts
« on: June 16, 2013, 07:13:01 AM »
Doubt its under attack we would be seeing Nikon adverts everywhere

Not necessarily - when a system is under high stress from an attack might behave entirely unpredictable if there aren't any built-in failsafes (i.e. the site shuts down the moment something is wrong), it's digital going analog :-)

Holy Mackerel, A nutless headless Squirrel on CR, Someone call Squirrel Shepard.

The interesting part of buffer overflows and garbled data is that the system can read beyond the original range or somewhere else entirely, that includes private and protected data. So watch out for any yet undisclosed rumors that is still covered by a nda :-p

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