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Messages - meli

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151
EOS Bodies / Re: Understanding the price increase on the 5DIII
« on: March 05, 2012, 08:12:03 PM »
And pray tell us what kinda of wizardry has Nikon implemented with D800's price, since the d700 launched @ 300k Yen?

152
OP here;
I do sense a defensive stance from some people that already preordered the camera or they're about to, and perhaps its my fault cause i should had clarify it a bit better.
There're a million good reasons to buy M3, the question of this thread is whether you feel that  the 500$ gap over the competition is justified, objectively and with the info we have so far.


153
Geez enough threads about the price and trying to justify paying the price. 

The problem is that too many people have waited to upgrade and now they feel like they waited for nothing, or that they should have just updated to the 5DII a year ago.  They hung on to their 30D/40D/50D/60D/7Ds patiently and assumed (incorrectly) that the 5DIII would be the exact same price as the 5DII.  Now that the 5DIII is out of their price range, they are trying to internally rationalize why it's not worth $3500, even if the simple reason is that they just can't afford it.  They are trying to marginalize it, make it seem like it's just a 5DII with improved AF, because after all, it's hard to admit "hey this thing is awesome, I've been waiting on it forever, and I can't have it."  It's much easier to tell yourself "meh, it's just a little better than the 5DII, I'm not missing out." (which makes them feel better about now having to get a 5DII).  Then the confirmation bias sits in, they only read reviews that make the 5DIII seem not that great, they ignore the praises, and before you know it they genuinely believe it's a crap camera.  They post polls talking about what would "justify the price tag."  ;)

I mean usually when people DONT want something they DONT talk about it, why should they care?  Yet I see thread after thread of people that supposedly "dont want a 5DIII because it's not worth it," yet they can't shut up about the thing.  I know it sucks that it's out of reach for some people, I mean announcement day was the closest thing to Christmas morning that an adult camera enthusiast can experience, and it's a bummer when you realize Santa didn't bring you anything.  But have patience, the price will come down and a 5DII is still an awesome, very capable camera (I'm not getting rid of mine).

woah slow down mate,

no doubt there're people frustrated cause the M3 turned out of reach but lets not mix everything up,
its one thing if one can or cant afford it
its another thing if someone will buy it irregardless of cost
its another if someone want to be the first kid on the block
and its totally another if some feel that the camera is more expensive than it should be, judging by competition/tech

as far as this gem:
Quote
when people DONT want something they DONT talk about it
you do realize that some people have invested in the platform and seeing canon jacking up prices all across the board makes them justifiably nervous right?

154
I think Canon justified the price with the 61point AF and the sensor. The ISO performance from that sensor is incredible. $3500 is a lot, and is certainly more than I expected but I don't think it's overpriced. It might be a tad unfortunate for us but fair. I plan on buying one as soon as I can.

I do get the feeling that Canon's priorities for the new sensor were more towards pleasing the video community rather than the photographer, im really really curious about the low Iso DR

155
It might also help if they say offered it in a kit with the 24-70 II instead of just the 24-105 (which I do not want ever again) for a nice big discount, say $500 for the combo. $3500+$2300 for the pairing is a bit nuts. A kit with a big discount would start making the pricing look a bit more sensible.

doubt if the combo will fall below 5k any time soon; I can see MarkIII dropping in price rather soon, be it cause of the market or production cost, but 24-70 might hold its premium for quite awhile

156
EOS Bodies / Re: Nikon D800 vs Canon 5d3 sample images.
« on: March 05, 2012, 08:34:33 AM »
Hi, a bit off topic but I didn’t want to start a new just for this. There was a post and link given at some point in the mêlée pre 02/03 to a web site where the guy compared Canon & Nikon sensors when the same image is pushed. Was a photo looking out a window so very high DR. Can anyone help me with that link again please?

might be this: http://testcams.com/blog/2011/05/03/nikon-dx-vs-canon-aps-c-dynamic-range/

157
EOS Bodies / Re: Canon 7D Mark II specs wishlist.
« on: March 03, 2012, 09:53:05 PM »
catch up with exmor sensor low Iso DR, wireless trigger, and not jacking it up to some insane price as is the pattern lately  >:(

158
...
To me, the 5D3 is really most of a 1Dx for a lot less money.
...

that's the thing Bennymiata, 5d & d800 are supposed to have tech from the corresponding top models. The point is how much of this tech trickles down, how it combines with original features to create a round product and for what price each company is willing to let it go.

In this sense it seems to many that Nikon's offer to their userbase is much more sound.

And of course a company doesnt have to have any kind of loyalty towards its userbase, but thats not a reason for people to not get pissed off with'em!

159
With the AF and ISOs, I think it's hard to balk at the price.  The 5D3 is a sweet machine that will allow for unmatched low-light photography.  And as some have already noted - considering inflation it's actually less than the 5D2 was in 2008.

But, if you wanted to do straight comparisons - I don't think a jump to $3,500 from $2,700 over 4 years is enough to warrant pulling out the pitchforks.  $800... that's $200/year, or a couple of portrait gigs. 

Anyway - I voted that the price is justified.  Considering I just sold my 5D2 for $2,000, having to come up with $1,500 for the latest and greatest technology in pro-photography is not too much to ask, at least in my opinion.

I've no doubt that you 'll enjoy 5D3 cause its a pretty solid offer.

Concerning the price, consider there's a competing product from another brand from the same country! And its not that upon launching it a week ago there was noise about it being 500$* cheaper despite the inflation!

Perhaps the fuss about the price is getting amplified cause all Canon's latest offerings were pinched up, some by a serious margin



*even more actually, i think d700 had higher MSRP than 5dII

160
i wanted to $800 USD rebate to your poll  :o

sorry mate, features only  ;D

161
EOS Bodies / What would make $3500 for 5DmIII justifiable for you?
« on: March 03, 2012, 07:20:49 PM »
My vote would be for a fully fledged wireless connectivity, so, what would make it for you?

ps1. MPs to fps was loosely based to 144mbs throughput (perhaps 7-8 would be for an APS-H subselection?)
ps2. Wireless would be a full feature, means flash controller/ file transmission /remote control
ps3. some would prefer a 500$ voucher included but lets keep it to features people!

edit:
i would like also you guys that already preordered to chime in;
I do understand that many of you have your reasons or that you'll have upgraded eitherway cause M3 does sound like a fine camera. What do you think? What would balance the +500$ over the competition?*


*Ofc we dont know anything about the real qualities of these cams, We dont really know how good AF or IQ etc might be, so lets just consider that both cameras perform half good as expected and then some!

162
EOS Bodies / Re: Hugely Disappointed In 5D III Price
« on: March 02, 2012, 11:04:47 AM »
Quote from: SRHelicity
We, as consumers, should demand more.  I still maintain that the 5D3 should be <= $3k.  I'm not a professional, nor do I make big $$, so $3500 is a significant chunk of change for me. If I had a 5D2, I couldn't see myself justifying spending $3500 (+ tax) for the 5D3.  I currently have a 60D, and I've been looking to jump up to FF, but I'd rather get a budget FF (<$2k) with 3-4 fps, less sophisticated AF and AE, etc.; I may end up with a 5D2 assuming the price drops.

Sorry, while a nice sentiment, and perhaps even a popular sentiment, that's not how business works. Consumers don't get to set pricing based on what an item "should be". Pricing of a sole-source product is set by the seller based on what the market (as a whole) will bear. If all preorders are filled in days, and then people are waiting until April/May for a 5DM3 body, we might learn that the $3500USD price was too low!

As a consumer, all you can do is buy or not buy. Begging or wishing might get you some thumbs up on a forum, but will be largely ineffective with the seller.

For a lot of people, a used 5DM2 + a great lens (or 2!) is a far better use of funds.

I doubt if its really "largely ineffective with the seller"; being the market how it is in both sides of the pond, the competition, and the premium for first time FFers (24-105 pack price, not even mentioning 24-70+grip+flash) i really cant foresee some great Q3-Q4 results for Canon with the current pricing policy

163
EOS Bodies / Re: No f/8.0 autofocus with 5D Mark III
« on: March 02, 2012, 07:50:14 AM »
Sorry double post. Just to repeat for emphasis, 1Dx & 5D3 AF > D4/D800 AF, based on number and spread of cross-type AF points, presence of increased-precision X-type f/2.8 & cross-type f/4 sensors, customizability (things not found on spec sheets) & AF pt. orientation-switching, etc. Anybody saying otherwise is a DPR Nikon troll.  :P

Ahem, so said the CR canon troll  ::)

lets just wait for  the reviews, canon's recent AF history doesnt really point where you want it to(literally sometimes), no matter what X-Cross-Quantum-Warp-Mazer-type they implement

164
Yes & Yes.

Mk3 seems like a great camera for 2700. Seems like an ok camera for 3k. But asking 3500 is just too much. Coupling it with a grip and a new 24-70 it borders to ridiculous.

I've been with Canon since the 650 came out, now that was a revolution. I wont be selling any equipment in the near future but i will have a look at d800 as soon as it comes out. I wont touch the mk3.
Its not only the jacked up price, its mainly the stance of Canon as a company. Too few of ideas/innovation , too slow on implementation, too obvious on nerfing down products (5d series), too self assured of their userbase loyalty.

ps. Canon should consider themselves lucky that Nikon went the stupid way with d800. Cant imagine what would happen with a 3k$ 28/5 or 24/6 d800 instead of 36/4 vs the $3.5k 5Dmk3...

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