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Messages - FunPhotons

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EOS Bodies / Re: Disappointed in 2012 cameras, looking for suggestions
« on: March 17, 2012, 02:44:57 PM »
More clarity - as I said I'm not obsessive, and I don't feel I need more pixels, but that I would use more pixels. If more pixels were to come along, I'd enjoy the upgrade. I don't go out of ISO100 much, I'll usually flash first and get more control. More frames per second? I barely use one enough. But more pixels means more crop flexibility, more beautiful detail, better landscapes, more to experiment with ... Canon's upgrade path is for the sports crowd (frames, ISO and speed) which isn't something that matters much to me.

I remember watching the whole drama the first time digital broke 1 megapixel. I didn't buy though. I waited until the FIRST rebel, which I bought along with some nice glass at a crazy rebate they had back then (I got a fishy, 24-70 and 50 1.4). Then my next camera was the 5DMKII because I felt that finally the price of full frame came down to the point where mere mortals could afford it.

Now I'm shooting like crazy. Back in the film days I had an AE-1, and the cost of development kept me from shooting very much. Man I hated that ... and the long turn around. But now I have more money, and the technology is getting seriously wonderful, so I am putting more into getting the glass, pixels, and extras.
And because of this I'm taking tens of tens of thousands of shots - most of them bad - but you know this body is getting some serious work. Will it be getting pretty worn out in a few years? If so, I'd rather upgrade rather than send it in to get a new shutter, etc. So I don't lament the upgrade cycle on digital - the day to day cost is so much lower than film, who cares?

Oh, and I should add one more thing, one thing I hate about the 5DMKII is the crummy focusing system. I have a lot of shots that could have been great, if it wasn't focused on the wrong thing. I'm working on improving my technique to get better at this, but I would love a better camera. Sure, the III has the system I want, but it's not enough, for the price, to entice me.

EOS Bodies / Re: Disappointed in 2012 cameras, looking for suggestions
« on: March 17, 2012, 12:18:27 PM »
    Good thoughts folks. I mentioned a few concerning points but should have made them clearer.

    • 600EX-RT
    Exciting new technology. Not all the functionality is available to the 5DMKII, namely group mode, and per manual HSS and you lose a stop of power. According to Syl Arena HSS and all the power is available at all speeds, so it could be a conservative spec. Or it could be flash firmware that hasn't been locked down (he got pre-release flashes). We don't know yet, but we know for sure that group mode isn't available. Will Canon update the 5DMKII? Unknown, up to Canon marketing I expect.
    • Roadmap
    Sure, Canon will update the megapixels ... or will they? Or can they? When will they? I've heard that the Canon engineers are really struggling with handling all those pixels already, and obviously Canon's #1 pro customer are the sports photographers. This is evidenced by their main concerns ... 1) Speed (frames per second 2) Getting the shot (extremely conservative specs, slow feature development roadmap, long beta test, ...) So I think Canon will be slow on the Megapixel race.

So from these two hypothesis I'm wondering if in three years I'll be in a place where there won't be a new pro body coming along for a few years, and the existing camera will becoming pretty aged, as by then it will be five years old which is old in technology and camera body terms. And, at that point, I won't be inclined to buy then (by-then old) 5DMKIII. Maybe better to take the plunge now and get it over with.

Just to be clear, I'm not some obsessive about this, I'd be happy waiting three years if I knew that in three years Canon will release a 30+ MP camera with all the existing features and then some. I'm speculating on my upgrade path, and basically I'm a little skeptical of what Canon marketing is really going to allow.

Yeah I read that review when it came out, and stopped when I saw 

"So are there any negatives to owning this camera? Maybe just one. You will lose the ability to blame the camera for any shortcomings in your own photographic ability. "

Excessive fanboyism, unlikely I'd learn anything useful from the review.

Can I trigger the camera with IR instead of radio? I'm using 600D and not planning to buy ST-E3 (I would rather upgrade my camera in the future than using an on-top accessories, unconvenient).

Don't know about the 600D but I have an IR remote trigger for the 5DMKII. Annoying little thing, it only supports 2S delay shoot mode (AFAIK), and the remote has to be pointed just right to get it to fire. For self shots (group and self portrait) I have to quickly try and trigger and put my arm down.

It does work and is cheap however.

EOS Bodies / Disappointed in 2012 cameras, looking for suggestions
« on: March 17, 2012, 09:31:46 AM »
Hi folks,
    I have a 5DmkII I bought in 2010 and have very much enjoyed. I planned on getting a second body and using the 5DmkII as a backup, but the lineup doesn't do much for me. I plan on getting a 1D one day - maybe 2012 would be the year - but they went for low pixels and high shutter. Exact opposite of what would entice me. Arguments on whether more pixels are actually needed aside, I know that I don't need more then a few frames per second, so while this is a great camera I'm just not enticed.

Likewise for the 5DmkIII, or the 3D as I like to think of it. Here I'm getting socked with a much higher price, and while there are a lot of great features nothing stands out, especially given the price.

Pro body upgrades are few and far between, how many years will I likely have to wait until the next product cycle? Seems like 3-4 years? If so having a five year old body might start to get pretty old, especially if they don't upgrade the 5DmkII firmware for the latest 600EX-RT features.

PS. I'm happy to fill out my lenses, flashes and other stuff in the meantime, but I'm concerned about being hobbled by my body in a few years and being stuck.

Sounds revolutionary -good luck!

Probably not, experiments end up with nothing more often then not.  :) But sometimes ....

EOS Bodies / Re: What does Sony know that we don't know?
« on: March 16, 2012, 05:55:52 AM »
Having worked in the semiconductor industry ...

Same here and this is a good explanation. I also heard that Canon is having engineering problems with handling large amounts of data. Look at the dual Digic 5's in the latest 1DX for example, so they can push 12 frames per second ...

Pro cameras are a tough piece of engineering, and everything I see (way overly conservative specs, slow introductions, extensive/crazy beta test, ...) with Canon is they are extremely conservative. Certainly the customers are unforgiving anal-retentative freak heads. All it takes is one bum pro camera, or one bum frame during a sports event or wedding shoot to entirely kill Canon's reputation.

So in addition to the manufacturing difficulties comment, surely even more Canon is having enough success selling existing bodies and glass that they want to take it nice and sloooowwwwww. The present mantra seems to be 'better pixels not more pixels', and they'll push more pixels when it's obvious, easier and cheaper, no doubt.

I ran into a guy that worked at the Hachioji Canon factory (I think it was Canon) on the train there once. Should have asked him ..  ;D

Love to hear about the standless flashes - I find I use 3 for portraits - one each side, one overhead. Using the supersize umbrellas do give wonderfull soft light that wraps around amazingly well

Its a work in progress. I love to use stands and big modifiers, but don't like carrying, setting up and breaking them down. It seems like every piece of gear is just another thing keeping me from taking pictures.

So far I've got good success with a few techniques, that I won't spill here! I'll either put up a web page, or write a small book on the subject when the experiments are concluded.

With the integrated RT flash solution I'll be able to keep my kit down to a single Pelican 1510 case http://www.pelican.com/cases_detail.php?Case=1510 and a small photo backpack.

Basically a few lenses, flashes, tripod head and pano bar, compact Manfrotto stands and light modifiers. OK I cheat and the tripod is extra.

I'm working my way down to one lens, and a total bare minimum of equipment. I'm working on a way to use the flashes without stands or umbrellas.

I thought I read somewhere that you can trigger the shutter remotely with the new 600EX/STE3 combo. For instance, with the ST-E3 mounted on the body, I believe you can trigger the shutter on the camera via radio with a 600EX. Can anyone confirm or refute this? I really like the Odins, but this feature would be a nice perk.

Yes I've read that multiple places. Only with a 2012 camera I believe (5DMKII and 1DX). A ST-E3-RT will also remote trigger.

I have a stack of 580EX/580EXII so to move to all Canon 600 RT would mean a big hit and high cost. I hope you are right about the inclusion of legacy speedlights - that would potentially make life easier in the future

I hear you, keeping up with the technology curve can be painful! I've just got a 430EX, a 530-IIex and I was planning on buying a third and final flash when they did the latest upgrade - and it happens that they didn't include mixing optical and RF wireless. Purely a software omission I'm sure for marketing purposes.

At any rate I pretty much decided to go whole hog and get the three 600's and digital controller. For the times I want more flashes I can go optical, futz with line of site, hotshoe cord and use all five. If they do release a legacy receiver then I'll buy two for my older flashes.

I've been surprised before, but I think/hope these flashes will last a long, long time.


HSS is definitely available with PW - it is totally automatically and is an improvement on the Canon HSS. Manual is the same as the infared system. Also the PW can fire a manual slave (such as a studio light)

Second curtain does work with PW

Interesting, Syl Arena has stated unequivocally that HSS is only available with an all Canon system, maybe I misunderstood him. 

I read through their theory for improved performance. I've noticed that the Canon engineers are extremely conservative, a trait that I can appreciate being I'm an engineer is a similar field (i.e. my customers are, shall we say, intolerant of errors on my part). So they also under spec and over deliver. Since they bracket HSS with guard bands I expect they want to make sure that you get the shot - the flash tube is warmed up before the shutter opens. The PW guys are willing to live closer to the edge.

No matter, Canon RT is still less equip, lower profile (wireless built into flash and eventually built into bodies I'm sure), and I've heard a rumor from a Canon rep that they'll be releasing receivers for legacy flashes and studio strobes, plus of course the recycle report back. I'm glad I waited.


Are you talking manual flash then?

With eTTL there is full control when putting a master in the hotshoe (such as a 580EXII or ST-E2. Full flash compensation is available that goes to all slaves automatically). I believe this is the same with the Odins.

The recently relased PW Plus III is not an eTTL controller

My understanding is that HSS isn't available, manual isn't available, and I wasn't sure about ETTL. Sounds like the latest isn't eTTL. I don't know about flash exposure compensation and the other bits.

The only thing that doesn't work with Canon is 2nd curtain sync over wireless - and odd omission. I don't think there are technical reasons preventing it, but since Canon doesn't support it I have to assume there is some timing problem or other.

In what way does the PW not integrate with your system?

My understanding is that I cannot fully control the speed lights from the back of the camera, as I can with a Canon flash on a Canon body using the full menu system. I would have to walk around and change settings by hand, which would slow down my workflow too much. The new Speedlights also have the slaves communicating back to the master when they have recharged, with a friendly beep to tell you when they're ready (hurrah! no more black frames). Finally, while the PW have a new version out that is smaller and more streamlined I believe, when I last considered it I thought they were way too large and clumsy on the top of my camera.

If I'm wrong on any of these particulars please let me know. I'm not trying to bash PW or any 3rd party trigger - just saying that I've held out for the fully integrated Canon solution.

Price doesn't bother me. Trying to make good photos is a pain, lugging equip around, lens, filter, flash, gel selection ... I've held off buying a PW system because it's clunky and doesn't fully integrate with my cameras capabilities. The Canon system is clean, simple and will work flawlessly. Even gels - I hate stupid tape or velcro solutions, finally there is a nice holder and a clean way to manage them.

I saw a comparison somewhere of the new Canon against some 3rd party wireless, and the Canon came out $75 more expensive for a three flash with ST-E3-RT solution (and that was before the ST-E3 last minute price drop).

So I preordered three flashes and the ST-E3-RT.

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