Messages

391

EOS Bodies / Re: New Extensive Firmware for the Canon EOS 7D? [CR1]

« on: May 04, 2012, 12:15:36 PM »

I'm also anxiously awaiting the next generation of 7DII, but just want to point out that the 7D is not as old as its competitor the Nikon D300S,  and it is still a far better camera. I also just checked and it's still in the top 20 on Amazon's list as of this a.m. (And has been in the top 100 for 970 days -- which pretty much coincides with its entire life cycle) 

So, while I'm anxious to see what the next generation brings, I'm not sure Canon will feel any competitive pressure to release a new model until Nikon makes a move as well. I'm still hoping for Photokina.

good point ;  the competitive landscape is a far more important influence to the product lifecycle than Canon's own history .  let the marketing games begin!  no question that 7D is still very succesful, so maybe Canon feels that a little kick in the pants and they can ride this train even longer to better position them to compete with the next Nikon offering. 

The picture you are suggesting implies that the next move is likely to be Nikon's and that the D300s could get a refresh sooner than does the 7D.  this will be a good show to watch.  I took a quick look at some Nikon rumors and discovered that anticipation is high for a D300s replacment perhaps with a new Sony 24mp APS-C sensor claiming crazy ISO performance.  Given D800 evidence I'd say Sony is clearly on the sensor warpath and Canon better have something up their sleeve as well -- it appears that the stage may be set for a premium crop body showdown.  front seat tickets please!

look what happend to 5D3 and D800 -- we could have a similar dual in the crop bodies, as we approach photokina time, and we will get to watch how the Marketing strategies work, i.e. whether we will see an announcment before (and intended to trump) photokina, or if we will wait for photokina itself to know. 

392

EOS Bodies / Re: New Extensive Firmware for the Canon EOS 7D? [CR1]

« on: May 04, 2012, 11:14:01 AM »

I'd see the introduction of new firmware as an indication that Canon may be planing a new sensor for the 7D2, and needs to hold on for dear life until that can happen.  Its also an indication (assuming true.  its CR1 so far...) that Canon is still investing in that market position (premium 1.6x prosumer).   I hope they blow socks off with 7D2, frankly, but the market window of opportunity (it seems to me) is shrinking -- 9-12 months remaining, at the max.   Except for the 1Ds3, 7D is currently as old or older than any other body in Canon's entire DSLR lineup since the begining. 

Actually I hope 7D2 is positioned as a pro-level 1.6x body

393

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon 7Dmk2 any rumors??

« on: May 04, 2012, 10:58:25 AM »

I can't see the 7D line being killed off.  Clearly it is the camera pros use when they need the extra reach.  And I think Canon has a pretty strong history of supporting pro fotogs.

I can't see 7D being killed off either, but for different reasons.  As briansquibb has rightly pointed out, the 7D (in its present form) is not aimed at the pro wildlife photographers, as this need is currently being fulfilled by the 1.3x crop 1D4. 

7D is certainly positioned (currently) as the premium 1.6x crop, in addition to the other two lines, xxD and Rebel.  It has been arguably very succesful for prosumers, but it doesn't have the feature set required for a truely pro level wildlife body.  given the choice, I would gladly take a 1D4 over a 7D

 I was walking around an event yesterday and saw at least 3 people carrying both a 5 series and the 7D.   Anecdotal I know - but almost every place I see fotogs gathered together - there will be a few 7D's.   7D has high demand - I just don't see Canon dropping this line.  Doesn't make sense. 

yes indeeed, and  some may even suggest 7D is wildly succesful, not to mention a great compliment to the 5Ds.  But I would only point out that neither of these are truly the top, pro/flagship bodies -- designations fulfilled by the FF 1Ds and the 1.3x 1D4.

And if the 7D is killed off, there will only be one camera between the Rebels and the full frames (60D or maybe 70D).  This also doesn't make sense.  There will be a hole in the crop line that I am sure Nikon will take advantage of. 

well -- don't forget 1D4, which is still alive, although yes I agree the weight of evidence puts the future of the 1.3x crop body in question.  With or without the 1.3x in the picture, 7D has a strong future imho even if it remains as a prosumer 1.6x crop body, which it is today, and this would likely remain the case even if Canon pulls a fast one and introduces a new 1.3x body with somethign besides a "1" in the name. 

For every reason I can think of, a 7Dmkii makes a lot of sense.  I say Photonica 2012.  On shelves by Christmas 2012.

no argument there!  I hope you are right

394

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon 7Dmk2 any rumors??

« on: May 03, 2012, 12:29:47 AM »

I want to believe. I want to believe.

Seriously, there are a few things that lead me to believe we will see a 7DII in the next six months. 

<reasonable stuff>

4) Canon still has to satisfy the APS-H shooters who lost their beloved 1.3 crop. A 1.6 7DII with image quality equal to the old 1D IV is very doable and would address the concerns of sport and wildlife shooters who want more reach.

valid point, and that would interest me as well, if priced accordingly (a serious 1.6x body under $2,500 should be doable, as long as we're wishing!) .    I'm not quite as strong on this angle though, mainly because I haven't yet seen the proof that 1.3x is going away.  I agree that there is weight of evidence, but all we know is that 1D and 1DS are merging.  that doesn't necessasrily mean 1.3x is going away, or that a  $5K 1D5 won't ever happen.  But I acknowledge that there are indications that Canon may head that way, and if so that would certainly put the upward pressure on the capability set of the 7D2!

Wishful thinking? A little. But not totally divorced from reality.

agreed on all three counts!

395

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon 7Dmk2 any rumors??

« on: May 02, 2012, 07:56:00 PM »

respectfully disagree, which is of course the point of sharing rumors and engaging in reasonable speculation.   I would just point out that speculation based on product lifecycle histories and the competitive landscape does have some interest, at least greater interest than nothing.  Its true 7D has  no predicessor but neither did any of the other bodies when they were first introduced and none of those,  except the 1Ds3,  has  enjoyed a signigicantly longer "life before update" than the current 7D.  Additional evidence that the 7D may be updated soon is that it's sensor is behind the competitive state-of-the-art and yet it represents the best Canon has to offer in a 1.6. 

It will be interesting to see what market the 7D stays aimed at;  presently 7D is in the same camp as the 5D (as regards life cycle) and differentiated from the xxD and rebels which typically turn over much more frequently.   

396

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon 7Dmk2 any rumors??

« on: May 02, 2012, 06:20:34 PM »

unless one splits hairs, the 7D has been out "about the same"  as the 5D2 was before it (5D2) was updated.  Both are still available. 

397

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon 7Dmk2 any rumors??

« on: May 02, 2012, 05:33:25 PM »

I'd suggest the weight of evidence does suggest a 7D2 this calendar year.  if you look at the product life cycle history, you'll see that except for the 1Ds3, the 7D has been out as long or longer than any other camera body in all of Canon DSLR history, without being updated.  Allowing for Tsunami delays, and the market drive to update crop cameras more often (witness Rebels and xxD)  I'd say we're over due for a new 7D and Canon's silence on this topic suggests to me that they have something up their sleeve. 

Just on the basis of its original intro (premium prosumer crop/wildlife) the 7D has been very succesful and would be due for an update without any change in its market positioning -- and this is without regards to all of the noise about a possible 1.6x pro level wildlife body to replace the 1D4 if 1.3x is dead.  If 1.3 is really dead, then if you ask me that puts upward pressure on the capability set of the 7D2

398

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon 7Dmk2 any rumors??

« on: May 01, 2012, 03:17:57 PM »

Yes, today. Imagine the 5D3 had 45MP so that when crop'd to APS-C, it delivered 18MP.

If only it were that simple, though -- just think:   The IQ/MP discussion would be moot, MP counts could go arbitrarily high and still meet IQ/ISO goals, pixel density wouldn't matter and the 7D2 could be a FF  -- oh wait but if that were possible,  then Canon could raise the pixel density even higher in a  crop sensor and still win the large print contest over a cropped FF image producing the same FOV

399

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon 7Dmk2 any rumors??

« on: April 30, 2012, 07:55:21 PM »

focus should definately stay on 7D2 rumors and related topics that might shape such rumors.  imho, The EF-S vs L discussion is only relevant to the extent that 7D2  might take a more prominant place on the stage of wildlife bodies.  For example if Canon really does kill the 1.3x sensor (as the owner of this forum and site maintains), AND maintains commitment to a crop body for wildlife, THEN the next pro-level wildlife body (meaning 1D4 successor) could be a 1.6x, in which case the high-end APS-C lenses start to become more important to a crowd other than amatuers and prosumers.  Whether or not such a camera would be the 7D2 is another topic, to be sure.

But yea to maintain focus on the OP, I agree lets keep this to the 7D2 body specs and release timing, what 1.6x sensor Canon has up its sleave, and whether or not the 7D2 will be a yawn or a game changer.

400

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon 7Dmk2 any rumors??

« on: April 27, 2012, 05:47:22 PM »

You STILL have to invest in a FF body to get the most out of uwa (and certainly fisheye)

Fish eye works fine on the 1.3 - just dont get the full bubble

works fine on the 1.6 too , without the full bubble

401

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon 7Dmk2 any rumors??

« on: April 27, 2012, 05:21:28 PM »

yea . not only that, if one is specialized enough to have a 1D4, then the additional speciality of a FF pro body isn't that surprising of an expectation, should it be needed. 

What is interesting to me is whether there will be a specialized pro body for wildlife or not.  If they discontinue the 1.3, and a 1.6x body becomes the wildlife body of choice, then what Canon will have decided is that  such a body is still "general purpose" at the uwa application because all you have there is the non-weather sealed EF-S 10-22 and 17-55.  You STILL have to invest in a FF body to get the most out of uwa (and certainly fisheye)

402

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon 7Dmk2 any rumors??

« on: April 27, 2012, 04:33:00 PM »

the biggest focal gap for 1.3 is an uwa rectilinear zoom

Which lens is that??

there is none (in the Canon lineup anyway):  Thats the 1.3x focal length gap I was attempting to highlight: no uwa rectilinear zoom for 1.3x bodies. 

In FF FOV equivalence terms, the 1.3x bodies have an 18mm prime and 21-45mm zoom, while both the 1.6x and the FF bodies have a 16-35mm zoom (provided by the 10-22 for 1.6x bodies)

403

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon 7Dmk2 any rumors??

« on: April 27, 2012, 03:38:51 PM »

the biggest focal gap for 1.3 is an uwa rectilinear zoom

weather sealing things that hinge and move is doable;  It is more difficult/costly

404

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon 7Dmk2 any rumors??

« on: April 27, 2012, 02:19:49 PM »

As a sports camera, for the aps-h an ultra wa lens is a bit redundant methinks - not really an indication of its demise. The strength of the crop is the extra reach - reach that the ff cannot match.

yea I see your point -- if Canon releases a new 1.3x body it will be because they have decided to continue targeting the niche pro wildlife market with the expectations that such photographers will be specialized to not require uwa, or if they do, they will have a FF body as well.  Whether or not that market is strong enough to remain as profitable as Canon wants may be another issue, and I expect that will drive the 1.3 dead or alive question.  But the 1.3x market does highlight that uwa capability is simply not present -- a compromize that serious wildlife shooters are willing to accept.

The way the 7D appears to be positioned, it is intended to serve the needs of all focal lengths, and such photographers will expect all (rectilinear) focal lengths to be available, i.e to get down to the FF 16mm FOV equivalent on a crop body, which currently supplied by the EF-S 10-22

405

EOS Bodies / Re: Canon 7Dmk2 any rumors??

« on: April 27, 2012, 01:08:09 PM »

[As to the 1.3 crop sensor - I see the huge drawback that there are no UWA lenses for that kind of sensor, which would make it only interesting for a very specific clientele. The 7D currently appeals to a very wide customer base, which is one of the reasons for it's success.

that is a great point, and evidence that 1.3 may be going away.  I can't see Canon re-designing a1.3 body to accept the "C" lenses, but I guess they know more than I do!

Also agreed on the grip body -- 7D2 should (imho) have and accessory grip as a choice. 

high IQ 18mp dual digic-V+ 10fps 30 frame buffer, the best BIF AF system known to man, 1.3x crop sensor, weather sealing, grip option.. (well we can dream can't we).  updated high-end EF-S lenses with more rugged internals and weather sealing to compliment... etc.

and it should optimize stills photography