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Messages - Don Haines

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241
EOS Bodies / Re: More Images of the Canon EOS 7D Mark II
« on: September 13, 2014, 11:13:38 AM »
I'm probably going to get one just for the AF system. Any other improvements are gravy :)

242
EOS Bodies / Re: Digic 7 Development
« on: September 13, 2014, 11:10:43 AM »
This new processor is the key to high MP cameras.  Doubling the resolution will require 1.414 times the processing power.  The current Digic 6 will drop the 1Dx to 8FPS.  The Digic 7 is going to be a dual Digic 6 in one package which will allow 4x the processing power for high MP, high frame rate bodies.

Canon normally has 4 versions of their Digic Processors, the + version for the high end bodies.  I thought that the upcoming 7D will be the first to use the Digic 6+.  Why would they put a Digic 6 meant for low end DSLR's in a 1DX?  When the successor comes along, it will have two Digic 6+ processors, which will be appearing in cameras starting with the 7D MK II.

Do you have some facts?  Reference?.  Test Results? 

I'm not sure what to think of the comments, and your information about the make up of the Digic 7.

Canon uses ARM processors that are custom packaged for them and giving a Digic number.  Nikon, Sony, ...everyone does the same thing.

The issue is to get processing power with a low power usage.  This means that the fastest processors may not be used due to power consumption.
A lot depends on the architecture. You typically need computing power for short bursts, so a common trick is to use variable clock rates and to shut off cores under periods of low need. With the slower clock the devices use less power, and shutting down cores does the same. For example, perhaps the various cameras with dual digic processors normally run on one chip and only enable the second when you press the shutter....

Exactly, but not all ARM devices have the same power efficiency.  As new more efficient devices appear, they will be the candidates.

The Cortex versions seem to be the low power champions currently, but reducing the current 28nm process can reduce power / performance.

I notices a announcement that a new snapdragon processor will use the ARM Cortex A7's.  Its a lot like digic, it uses ARM processors plus more custom processors and firmware to accomplish a specialized task.  I'm not sure how the power usage compares with a DSLR, but I expect it consumes a lot of power.

http://www.fonearena.com/blog/115729/qualcomm-snapdragon-210-quad-core-and-snapdragon-208-dual-core-processors-announced.html
agreed!
I would suspect that it is lower power for some tasks and higher power for others. What the net effect is would be anyone's guess, but since it is developed for cell phones, my bet would be lower in power overall.

I don't know what the video/still ratios are on smartphones, but I suspect that the video demands are far higher than on a DSLR... after all, video runs all the time, even when taking a still picture. I don't know, I/m just guessing.

243
EOS Bodies - For Stills / Re: Post your 'Noise by Ten' results
« on: September 13, 2014, 10:59:52 AM »
Thanks for killing what could have been an interesting thread to post items that could increase knowledge and understanding, and which, also, could have been a way to keep DRones and trolls from posting in topics that are far far away from needing overly lengthy elaborations.

The subject has been beaten to death, the topic should be killed.
What this shows is how signals are amplified inside the camera. ISO's like 160, 320, and 640 are the base numbers. An ISO like 200 is gotten to by digitally multiplying the signal.... and to do that you are LOOSING the accuracy of your sensor.

An understanding of how your camera works is usually a good thing. Yes, the information is already available in charts on various sites, but what is wrong with experimenting with your camera to see what happens?

244
EOS Bodies / Re: More Images of the Canon EOS 7D Mark II
« on: September 13, 2014, 10:45:57 AM »
Just small incremental upgrades.  Not much to show for all the years of development if you ask me.  I'll skip the mark II, thank you.

I'm really torn.  One group that I talk to is saying that the 70D was only a marginal upgrade over the T2i (that I currently use).  They're also saying the 7Dii is going to probably only be a marginal upgrade as well.  I bought the T2i years ago when I was first learning how to shoot.    But there's a lot of people on this forum saying the image quality would be massively improved over the T2i if I switched to the ii.   

I'm photographing mainly wildlife, about 85% of what I photograph is birds, smallish ones.  In actuality I'm only using the center focus point probably 90% of the time as well, since I'm good at getting in the range of my 400mm, and it's close enough that the center point covers most of the bird.   

May skip the ii, and maybe go to a 5diii or 6d or something, since I'm not hurting for reach in the least.

The truth is usually somewhere in the middle. You will see an improvement in image quality with the 70D, it will definitely be noticeable, but it will not be earthshaking.... but the user interface is drastically different and according to those who have gotten used to it, much better.

As far as AF goes, yes, the 70D has far better autofocus, but if you just use the center point you will miss most of the advantages. What you will see is that the AF on that center point is more accurate and of course, if you go into live view, the DPAF is a huge improvement..

As far as the 7D2, nobody knows..... until people get their hands on it, you are just hearing guesses and opinions based on rumours and startlingly devoid of facts.

245
EOS Bodies / Re: Digic 7 Development
« on: September 13, 2014, 10:35:06 AM »
This new processor is the key to high MP cameras.  Doubling the resolution will require 1.414 times the processing power.  The current Digic 6 will drop the 1Dx to 8FPS.  The Digic 7 is going to be a dual Digic 6 in one package which will allow 4x the processing power for high MP, high frame rate bodies.

Canon normally has 4 versions of their Digic Processors, the + version for the high end bodies.  I thought that the upcoming 7D will be the first to use the Digic 6+.  Why would they put a Digic 6 meant for low end DSLR's in a 1DX?  When the successor comes along, it will have two Digic 6+ processors, which will be appearing in cameras starting with the 7D MK II.

Do you have some facts?  Reference?.  Test Results? 

I'm not sure what to think of the comments, and your information about the make up of the Digic 7.

Canon uses ARM processors that are custom packaged for them and giving a Digic number.  Nikon, Sony, ...everyone does the same thing.

The issue is to get processing power with a low power usage.  This means that the fastest processors may not be used due to power consumption.
A lot depends on the architecture. You typically need computing power for short bursts, so a common trick is to use variable clock rates and to shut off cores under periods of low need. With the slower clock the devices use less power, and shutting down cores does the same. For example, perhaps the various cameras with dual digic processors normally run on one chip and only enable the second when you press the shutter....


And doubling the resolution SQUARES the computing demands... you need 4X the computing power.

246
Third Party Manufacturers / Re: Most exciting thing at Photokina?
« on: September 12, 2014, 06:13:58 PM »
I will be excited when it is over.
LOL, but then it's another 2 years of painful anticipation...
NO! Not two more years to wait for the 7D2!!!!

247
EOS Bodies / Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Specifications Confirmed
« on: September 12, 2014, 05:36:01 PM »
I really don't understand what the fuss is about....

Seems to be a love-hate relationship with Canon :-o ... I certainly have one since I bought my first film camera (eos 620) in the early 90s. Canon is smart and keeps designing their products so people shell out a lot of $$$ while still wishing for more. Plus photogs in general seem to be quick to adopt a smug, know-it-all attitude, after all you're the one having the power and pressing the BUTTON :->

What we have here is someone wants some aspect of their next camera to be better than what they have now... WHY ARE YOU PEOPLE ARGUING!!!!!

To some extend, I can understand both sides and thus can skip reading: Until I kept using Magic Lantern's dual_iso module (nearly 15ev dynamic range on the 6d) I didn't miss anything and kept bracketing. If you don't shoot higher dr scenes or are simply are used to 10ev, it's easy to perceive others as trolls. But higher dr is big news, it means less hassle with exposure and more freedom for shooting scenes that were out of scope of photography some years ago.

To be ot: Personally, the rgb metering is the most interesting news to me - it also means better exposure = more of the dr used = less noise. Strangely, this innovation seems lost in the thread.
I still don't understand the arguing.....

Take Jrista as an example..... he wants more DR and less noise in his images.... The thing is, we all do. If the 7D2 came out with 20 stops of DR and almost no noise, would anyone refuse to buy it because Canon made it too good? Of course not.... but we would expect even more from the next model out. We always want more, and if the other guy already has it, that just makes the desire stronger.... So why are people arguing? Shouldn't the reaction be "me too" and then the great debate ends?

248
EOS Bodies / Re: Canon EOS 7D Mark II Specifications Confirmed
« on: September 12, 2014, 05:00:07 PM »
I really don't understand what the fuss is about....

What we have here is someone wants some aspect of their next camera to be better than what they have now... WHY ARE YOU PEOPLE ARGUING!!!!!


249
PowerShot / Re: SX-60 coming at Photokina!
« on: September 12, 2014, 04:30:51 PM »
.
I'm guessing that 2000mm is with digital. I'd be surprised if optical zoom went beyond 1200mm.

Either way, I'm probably going to get one. Looks like lots of fun, and the images I've seen are more than adequate for what it is. What will my old S95 say?

The SX-50 already has a 4X digital zoom for "4800mm"....

250
PowerShot / Re: SX-60 coming at Photokina!
« on: September 12, 2014, 01:24:28 PM »
One of the more interesting rumours is:

The Powershot SX60 HS IS will be the replacement to the popular SX50 HS model and may come with the new DIGIC 6 processor, a 15MP sensor and a 20-2000mm focal length capability 100x zoom lens.

251
PowerShot / SX-60 coming at Photokina!
« on: September 12, 2014, 11:35:53 AM »
The latest rumour is that the SX-60 is coming to photokina.

The SX-50 works surprisingly well.... but what changes will come on the SX-60? A larger zoom range is a given... I have heard rumours of 60X and 100X... but does anyone know what the specs are supposed to be?

DPAF would be a killer addition, but I doubt we will see it. Wifi? Megapixels? anything?????

252
Third Party Manufacturers / Re: How do you say Nikon
« on: September 12, 2014, 10:10:08 AM »
We pronounce it the same way people in "Dog River" pronounce "Wollerton"...

(A reference that only Canadians will get :) )

253
EOS Bodies / Re: Is Canon now two generations behind Nikon?
« on: September 12, 2014, 09:17:16 AM »
From a Canon employee (although not one from DSLR division or even from Japan):"....or those expecting 4K video in a DLSR will be very disappointed. Canon sees no reason for this in a consumer camera yet. They told my boss only about 10% of people buy a 5D III for it's video capabilities. They are focusing on cinema market and want you to pay big dollars for the C300/500 or 1DC if you must have a DSLR with 4K. 5D IV will not get it IMO and at best we will see 1080p @ 60fps."

Great so they want to go from a lot buying the 5D2 for video to 10% for the 5D3 to 0.1% for the 5D4. Brilliant.

If this is true and no Exmor-low ISO.... maybe Canon really and truly has lost the plot.
We'll see next year.

I still findit hard to believe they'd be that THAT foolish to leave 4k out of even the 5D4 though. I still think it will ahve it.

'A Canon employee', well that's specific.  There are close to 200,000 of them, and the vast majority know nothing about the details of future corporate strategy.  Anyone placed highly enough in the organization to actually know would also know better than to divulge.  I'd give your quote about the same level of reliability if I heard it from a gas station attendant or supermarket cashier.
Perhaps it's the photocopier repairman..... photocopier repairmen are instrumental in charting the future of Canon's imaging division.... and they can make copies of squirrel pictures....

254
EOS Bodies / Re: How does the reveal of the final 7D2 specs make you feel?
« on: September 12, 2014, 03:29:56 AM »
I took the identical picture with a 5D2 a couple moments later.... It was definitely a better picture. A better sensor will definitely give you a better picture, but unlike an earlier poster's claim, ISO200 is not the point of no return.

And yes, I hope that they do improve the noise on the 7D2 beyond what we have come to expect from Canon... We should find out in a week :)

I would never try and compare any crop sensor body next to a full frame body of similar resolution. They both have their advantages and disadvantage over each other. The primary advantage of crop is lower cost and usually speed (fps) compared to the FF counterpart.

This really isn't about FF vs crop. It's been proven again and again that FF sensors perform much better.

What does this mean? Well for me it means that I will buy the best camera I can afford for what I need to use it for and use the hell out of it until it breaks.

This is kind of like comparing cars against one another... each model offers something the other lacks and to get both advantages be ready to pay out the nose for it.

Cameras are no different. Not everyone can afford a 5D3 or 1DX. My opinion? Quit putting other people down because YOU own a 5D3 and brag how "superior" it is to a 7D or Rebel. Instead, show them how to use the camera to the best of the bodies ability and let them upgrade later if they feel like it.

Some of my best photos (to date) were taken by my VERY humble XTi and "non-L" 70-300. I still outsell some of those photos over what I have shot with my 7D and with my 5D2...

A true professional does not put others down because they have a "lesser" camera. Instead they teach the "newbie" HOW to learn to use his or her equipment and to learn it well.

D
The point was, that you can push a crop camera with the much maligned 18Mp sensor to the limits of the camera and still get a decent picture.

I have never put anyone down because of their gear or bragged about mine being better.

255
EOS Bodies / Re: How does the reveal of the final 7D2 specs make you feel?
« on: September 11, 2014, 10:47:34 PM »
I should have clarified, my biggest beef is with noise.  I can be standing next to someone shooting a Nikon and they're at IS01600, meanwhile I'm at 200 because even 400 starts to show way too much noise.    I'm thinking it's the same sensor (at least tech wise) since it's the EXACT same mp amount.  VERY fishy.  I guess we'll see

Wait. What? You're shooting sports at 200?  Ok first thing - those dudes are shooting 1600 because no one really cares about noise for sports. Freeze the action, in focus, get a face and a ball and worry about noise some other day. Second, I've shot a lot with a 40D and 7D and yeah they get noisy but not really noticeably bad until 800 at least. I gotta wonder if you might be expecting too much. Also, are you shooting with short lenses and cropping real deep? Because that'll amplify noise like crazy.
You can go pretty deep into the high ISO range and still get a decent picture....

60D, ISO12800 (as high as the camera goes) 1/30th second exposure, lens wide open, and the lighting is a mix of tungsten and fluorescent.... conditions about as bad as they get.... The only processing is to adjust white balance and the noise slider in lightroom....

and yes, I would love it if the 7D2 had less noise, but honestly, I find focusing issues to be far more important (at least for the way I shoot) than noise issues. However you slice it, the 7D2 should be better at both than my 60D and that is why I plan on upgrading.

Just to point out, and please don't take this as any kind of diss of your photography, it's not: You can clearly see the effects of rather extreme NR in that photo. The woman's face is practically devoid of any kind of features. I think I might actually opt for a little bit of noise if it meant maintaining some skin features.

However, it would also be much better if you simply had a higher SNR to start with, and ideally lower RN, so that you didn't have to make the decision about whether to push NR so much that you lose facial features, or hold back and suffer the noisy consequences. It isn't "necessary" to have that, to have more SNR and less noise...but it's still better. It still improves the results in the end...and allows you to achieve those improved results with less effort (and fewer choices.) ;)
I took the identical picture with a 5D2 a couple moments later.... It was definitely a better picture. A better sensor will definitely give you a better picture, but unlike an earlier poster's claim, ISO200 is not the point of no return.

And yes, I hope that they do improve the noise on the 7D2 beyond what we have come to expect from Canon... We should find out in a week :)

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