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EOS Bodies / Re: Canon APS-H mirrorless rumor from the past...
« on: June 18, 2012, 12:13:41 PM »
There are some things about this rumor that don't line up.  One of the stated motivations for APS-H mirrorless was to share the R&D costs with the 1D4, which we know isn't happening.  We also have to keep in mind that the rumor is 2 years old, and a lot can change in 2 years.

I tried to bring some sanity to this earlier but my post was deleted. Apparently some people can't handle the truth.

This is a two-year-old rumor based on an e-mail that Photo Rumors guy received. No doubt, Canon Rumors Guy had access to the same information but it never showed up on this site, even as a CR-1.

The rumor precedes the announcement by Canon that it has merged the 1D lines into a single full frame body. That decision solves the problem of having orphaned R&D costs.

The rumor talks about this mysterious APS-H mirrorless camera being released soon. It takes quite a leap of faith to think that "soon" hasn't come and gone over the last two years.

If people want to search the Internet for outdated rumors and then speculate on them that's their prerogative. But, please understand that the likelihood of this materializing is roughly equivalent to finding Elvis working at a gas station in Birmingham, England.

What I'd really like is for Canon to deliver an APS-C sensor with significantly lower ISO noise, and put it in a 1-series type body.

I'd be happy with that sensor in a 5- or 7-series body.


The only other direction I could see for the 7D is this:

APS-C sensor
30 MP
fill in the rest with whatever...

Not so sure, why not 5D3 AF, 22MP, APS-C, 6fps (8-10fps if they can fit two digic 5+, part of me thinks they could get at least 7fps out of one digic 5+ and they chose not to for the 5D3 maybe due to using a slower mirror box, but who knows).
Basically the exact same thing as the 5D3 only it is APS-C and maybe 1-3 more fps.

I don't see 30MP. Perhaps someone is just being pessimistic. Given Canon's emphasis so far this year on ISO over resolution, I wouldn't be surprised to see the 7D sensor stay between 18-22 MP. I wouldn't be surprised to see an extra 1-3 fps and I also expect in most other respects it will be an APS-C version of the 5DIII.

EOS Bodies / Re: Is the 5DIII the New 50D?
« on: June 15, 2012, 01:52:21 PM »
Chuck Alaimo,

Basically, I don't think we are in disagreement. Like you, I've been amazed at how well these two cameras (one at $3,000 and one at $3,500) have been selling when compared to much lower priced models. I just checked the Amazon list and both are in the top 50 for all cameras and photo, which includes point and shoots. And, this at a time when the economy is still struggling.

I was simply speculating on the sustainability, given what appear to be some pretty significant market pressures that may be just around the corner (Pressures, by the way, that are self-inflicted by these two companies if they really do elect to release low-cost full frame models.)

I enjoy watching the competitive market work, observing how companies react and trying to guess where the market and companies may go next.  Most product releases are pretty predictable. And, Canon and Nikon have traditionally released products that are remarkably similar at virtually identical price points. The 5DIII and D800 seemed to break that pattern. Did one of the companies make a mistake? Only time will tell. I just enjoy watching and trying to figure it all out.

From a marketing perspective, a full frame 70D modeled after the 60D makes sense. It would allow an entry level full frame camera, to answer the Nikon D600 without putting to much pricing pressure on the 5D MkIII or the 7D MkII. It could be priced around the 7D without hurting its sales. Just like today most sport shooters would still buy a 1D MkIV over a 5D MkIII, they would by the 7D Mk II over the 70D entry level full frame.

Also an entry level full frame camera is still an entry level camera, not a pro camera, not marketed to pros, it doesn't need pro numbering or a pro body. A poly carb Super Rebel body like the 60D allows lower cost of production to keep the price low. It would work as a back up body for pro full frame shooters, or as an entry level full frame camera for those that want to step up.

100% agreement with your comments. Not sure about the numbering convention though. I think they'll call the full frame entrance level camera something different. (They are running out of numbers though, so not sure what they do) I'm still predicting the high megapixel camera will be called a 5DHD or something similar. Same body as the 5DIII, just a different sensor (and lower frame rate as a result). I think they still need the 70D in the lineup as an APS-C option for those who don't or won't spend as much as what a 7D costs.

Lots of people seem to think Canon and Nikon want to move everyone to full frame. But they might prefer to move everyone to two bodies: one full frame and one APS-C. Having a full range of choices in both formats gives them greater flexibility to suck every available dime out of us.

The 7D mk II HAS to be APS-C. If it is not, there will be blood, sweat, and tears!!!

On a serious note, neutering the 7D MK II would indeed be a marketing disaster. Will canon bloat the sensor to FF? I think not. The 5D MK III is nearly a FF 7d. Will Canon turn the 7D into the 70D? Only if they want Nikon to gobble that market.

Is it possible for Canon to do something mind-numbingly stupid? Yes. Anyone remember ET, the atari game?

Possible? Yes. Likely? No.

Don't despair. Canon is a shrewd, sophisticated company. They know their 7D customers and they know how to get us to upgrade to the II. We will see an APS-C 7DII and it will be spectacular. (And of course, they'll probably squeeze every cent out of us that they can. But we will go happily like lambs to the slaughter because we loves our 7Ds)

The debate over whether we'll see a direct 7D (and D300s) replacement is getting even more interesting.  If the pictures of the D600 on NR are real, what does this imply for a D300s replacement? ...Could Nikon therefore market a 'D400' in the same position as the D300s (i.e. a high end "DX" camera in a D800 style body) alongside this D600 without sending out mixed messages, and if they did, what price point would it occupy? Perhaps the lack of a D400 with the D7000 generation indicates that the high-end 'DX' format camera is dead? Having made this suggestion, Nikon have done this before with the D100 and D70.

Could Nikon market both a D600 and a D400 at similar price points? Could Canon market both a 7DII and a Full-Frame Rebel at similar price points?

Why not?

APS-C and Full Frame are two very different formats with very different strengths and weaknesses. One is not better than the other, they are simply different. It is much easier to market two different products at similar price points than it is to market two nearly identical products at vastly different price points – but that will be the real challenge both Nikon and Canon will face if they release "entry-level" full frame cameras that compete with the 5DIII and the D800.

Almost every other industry gives people similar choices. Look at cars for example. Order the small coupe with all the options or for the same price, get the stripped down full-size sedan. One doesn't eat into the sales of the other because they are bought by two different customers. A much more difficult marketing challenge would be to sell the same full-size sedan at $25,000 and $60,000 with the same engine and nearly identical options.

Technical Support / Re: What type of paper do you use for Photo Book?
« on: June 14, 2012, 05:17:59 PM »
I wonder what type paper do you use for your photo book?  Is "Proline Pear Photo" from Blurb is high quality paper? Or do you use something else?

I'm looking for decent - high quality paper for my 1st Photo Book.

blurb and high quality is a oxymoron.

I disagree. I've tried Picaboo, Mixbook, MPix and Blurb. Picaboo and Mixbook had horrible color shifts. Images were often dark and muddy. MPix was good, but the options were very limited, especially if you have much text. I used Blurb's InDesign plug-in and converted all images to CYMK in Photoshop.

As with any CMYK conversion, it helps to have some idea what you are doing and properly review and prep your images. Don't ever expect to have the images look the same as they do on-screen. They are two very different technologies and you have to understand and adjust for the differences.

With dozens of short-run print options out there, I am sure others have different opinions and experience, but of the services I have actually tried, Blurb is one I would use again.

Really, if you have a ff camera and need more reach you probably can afford one of the TCs.

Sure...if your variable-aperture or f/5.6 lens will AF with one...

Well, if you have a full frame camera and need more reach, you should just buy a 7D. That way your variable-aperture or f/5/6 lens will AF. (Credit Neuro with pointing this out many times on previous threads. The best available extender is an APS-C body.)

EOS Bodies / Is the 5DIII the New 50D?
« on: June 14, 2012, 12:45:22 PM »
Okay, I know this is sure to be controversial, but what the heck.

The differences between the 5DIII and the D800 have been the subject of endless debate on this forum. Now, Nikon seems poised to release a well-equipped D600 at a remarkably low price point if the rumors are true.

The 5DIII reminds me a bit of the 50D. The 50D was a great camera, but kind of a sales flop. It came out just as video was being introduced into DSLRs, but it had no video. Most 40D owners did not choose to update (instead waiting for a 60D that turned out to be the 7D...well I won't get into all that again).

Anyway the point being that there was nothing wrong with the 50D, but that a series of missteps, bad luck and poor timing combined to hurt the camera's sales.

I wonder if something similar is happening with the 5DIII. By all accounts, it is a great camera and seems to be very popular among its target audience: wedding and event photographers. But, will Canon be able to sustain 5DIII sales over the next three to four years? Is it $500 better than the D800? Or, is the D800 actually a slightly better camera at a lower price point? And, will sales fall if Nikon releases an entry-level full frame camera and Canon is forced to respond.

Now, before the Canon lovers and the Canon haters all go ballistic, keep in mind I'm not suggesting this means Canon is stupid or getting any part of its anatomy kicked or anything of the sort. In fact, making mistakes and learning from those mistakes are what makes a great company great. I'm just talking about one model in an entire lineup and suggesting that when we look back four or five years from now, I wonder if the 5DIII will be viewed as great camera that suffered from a series of unfortunate events.

EOS Bodies / Re: 4 More DSLRs Coming in 2012? [CR2]
« on: June 14, 2012, 11:51:59 AM »
Nikon Rumors is reporting that Nikon could release four new DSLRs before the end of the year. (Sound familiar?)
Likely candidates are a D400 (Equivalent to the 7DII); the D600 (Low-Cost Full Frame); the equivalent to the 60D/70D and an entry-level Rebel equivalent.

So, that would seem to make the four Canon DSLRs before the end of the year plausible.

At least three of the rumored Nikon DSLRS are directly equivalent to existing or rumored Canon products (60D, 7D and mythical full frame entry level) I think Canon might be done with Rebels for the year, so it's possible that a fourth camera could be a 5DHD (High Definition).

Of course, I was most heartened by the published D600 specifications and rumor that it could be released around Photokina. I don't see Canon allowing Nikon to have the flagship APS-C market to itself, so if the D600 materializes, I expect the 7DII to follow shortly thereafter.

EOS Bodies - For Stills / Re: right time to turn pro...?
« on: June 13, 2012, 11:08:47 PM »
As far as when is a right time, a big photographer once said to keep your day job as long as it doesn't kill you.

There's actually more truth to this than you can even imagine. Let me challenge your thinking a little bit just for the sake of having a complete picture:

Just like yourself, a few years ago, I too was hating my day job and was eagerly awaiting the moment when I could go full time. However as I started getting more and more booked, I slowly realized that I didn't really want to do photography full time at all. Instead I found a better day job...At the same time I have the benefit of 2 independent revenue streams so should I lose my job, I will at least have something to fall back on... I made a disturbing realization that the more I was shooting for money, the more my hobby was dying. It has now been YEARS since I went out to take some pictures just for fun. It's not that I don't have time to do it - I just don't feel like it if you can believe that. And that thought saddens me, because I loved my hobby...

Sorry for posting again immediately, but this was so insightful I couldn't help myself. Incredibly candid and honest. I salute you SB.

EOS Bodies - For Stills / Re: right time to turn pro...?
« on: June 13, 2012, 11:04:30 PM »
All good advice.

Here is something I would add: learn something about business before jumping in. In the U.S. there are extensive support networks for small business. I imagine it is the same in the UK. I'm talking about community colleges that offer free seminars in how to start a business, government agencies that also offer advice and training and what are often called Small Business Development Centers here in the U.S. Make an appointment to talk to a banker that specializes in small business.

In other words, before starting anything, research all the business aspects. Develop a formal business plan. Most small businesses fail. Yes. That is just a fact. They fail not because the owners are not talented in their profession, but because they didn't have a solid business plan to begin with.

Oh, and one more thing: be flexible. I don't know how many small business people I have met over the years who start a business thinking they are going to focus on one area and then find, six months or so into it, that customers want something else entirely. Darwinism is alive and well in the business world. All businesses either evolve or die. Be prepared for that.

EOS Bodies / Re: 4 More DSLRs Coming in 2012? [CR2]
« on: June 13, 2012, 01:29:23 PM »
exactly. Canon has never hinted that APS-H is dead . that came from this site

No. Actually it didn't. It came from Canon announcing the merger of the two 1D models into one, which included statements that said that up-sampling images from the new 1DX would result in a quality comparable to the APS-H crop. They later made statements about keeping their options open and general statements about their commitment to professional sports and wildlife photographers.

Now, if you wish to keep the hope alive, that's fine. But let's be realistic about things. We are talking about a transitional technology that only one manufacturer used and even that manufacturer never supported with a single lens.

It's true, Canon has never made a clear "close the door" statement saying they are dropping APS-H. But, such statements are rare in the business world. 

I'm not arguing the quality of the format. But, if you travel the technology highway you'll see the ditches are filled with products that were of higher quality than those that ran them off the road.

EOS Bodies / Re: 4 More DSLRs Coming in 2012? [CR2]
« on: June 13, 2012, 11:16:08 AM »
Four DSLRs are not hard to imagine:

Entry-Level Full Frame (Rebel FX?)

Canon seems to have a dilemma with the 60D. Its price and specs are too close to the t4i. The upgrade path is pretty clear: put the features of the 7D in a composite body with a swivel touchscreen and call it good. But, what does that do to the 7D? The body alone might be enough to protect the 7D for a few months, if the 70D gets the same 18mp sensor as the t4i. But, that's not a long term strategy.

I can see Canon deciding to release the 7DII and 70D in tandem. Both get a new sensor. 7DII is essentially a 5dIII with an APS-C sensor. 70D is as described above (7D features in 60D body)

5DHD (High Definition) is identical to the 5DIII (including price) but uses a 46mp sensor (essentially an 18mp APS-C sensor upsized). Canon has three years' experience with the 18mp sensor, so they can put what they've learned to work in a high-resolution 5D without risking any unpleasant surprises. As long as the sensor is the only difference between the bodies, production costs are minimal and there is little risk that one body cannibalizes the other. They just switch out sensors on the production line depending on which model they need the most of. You want low light, low noise -- buy the 5DIII. You want high definition -- buy the 5DHD. What does Canon care? They get your money either way.

That just leaves the "entry" level full frame. What that looks like will depend largely on what Nikon's comparable model looks like (if it materializes). I'm guessing something in a composite body, swivel touchscreen, scaled-down or recycled 5DII autofocus, SD card only, perhaps no micro-focus adjustment. If Nikon produces a more full-featured body, the specs may be improved to compete.


70D – Not sure. Needs to be above the t4i, but not too much above to encourage potential buyers to "step up."
7DII – $1,600 - $2,000
5DHD – $3,500
Rebel FX (full frame entry level camera) – $1,500 - $2,000) like the features, pricing may be determined by Nikon's offering.

I can hear the cries now: "You can't price the 7DII and a full frame Rebel so closely!"  Of course you can. Some people want the perceived advantages of the full frame, others want a fully-tricked out DSLR with a 1.6 crop factor. Both markets are sufficiently sophisticated to know what they want.

Oh... and one more thing: Canon is no doubt watching their 5DIII sales figures. If they decide the $500 difference between the 5DIII and the D800 is costing them sales (not sure it is), they may make a minor price adjustment (I'd guess around $200). They might then offer registered 5DIII customers a $200 rebate on any "L" lens as a loyalty reward. (Which, of course, also boosts lens sales)

Just remember. You heard it here first.

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