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Messages - LetTheRightLensIn

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EOS Bodies / Re: Sample Images From the EOS 7D Mark II
« on: September 19, 2014, 05:27:52 PM »
We'll have to wait and see what happens with DxO testing and elsewhere to see if there is any banding evident

One thing taht DxO doesn't do much is test for banding.

Anyway some of us have already looked at the masked area of the 7D2 RAW files and banding seems to be entirely fixed on the 7D2. Granted the masked area is small, so we can't be 100% sure yet, but I'd bet that it will prove to be the case that the 7D2 has extremely little to zero banding.

EOS Bodies / Re: Sample Images From the EOS 7D Mark II
« on: September 19, 2014, 05:24:12 PM »
I'm stunned.  The 7DII matches or nearly matches the 5DIII even at ISO 12,800!  Wow.  It's still no match for the 1D X at higher ISOs, but I can't believe they have pulled this out of an APS-C chip.  It looks like I might have to get into the pre-order line after all.
I am anxious to see if you would consider this as the backup of your 1DX. Let us know if you decide to go for it. I am currently use a 5DIII as back up but if it is close to the 5D I would consider the 10fps as a serious candidate.

The 7DII samples look substantially worse than the 5DIII samples. I'm betting the RAWs would be even farther apart.

That's to be expected though. The 5D3 has 2.6x the surface area to collect light. That's pretty hard to make up, especially since these cams were like all 40-65% efficient to begin with.

EOS Bodies / Re: Sample Images From the EOS 7D Mark II
« on: September 19, 2014, 05:20:49 PM »
In the grand scheme of things, I don't think the 7D II will live up to many peoples prior expectations that it would be a "5D III high ISO killer"...simply isn't going to happen.

In the grander scheme of things that was never a realistic expectation though.

I straighten stuff that I need to, but I just pull the crop down and align it to horizon and as soon as it looks close on both far ends I'm done with the rotation, if it is some fraction of a degree off I really don't care.

Sometimes regular cropping can drive me crazy, since it canbe so hard to decided between version A vs B vs C in some cases. Although creating each option usuallydoesnt' take too long at all.

EOS Bodies / Re: A New EOS Pro Body With 46mp Next Month? [CR1]
« on: September 19, 2014, 03:09:18 PM »
Some rumors from US and asian visitors: In the near and far next month there will be some new bodies announced. A mid priced competitor to the D810 with an much better AF system and a new sensor (no recycled one with a little bit more MP). Low light noise will be improved.

What about low ISO, high light shadow noise? It's THERE where Canon is miles behind, not at high ISO.

And what about video QUALITY. Canon has fallen way behind there. Look at the A7S, for instance, with a Ninja addition it's much better than even the 1DC for video and less than half the price and without the Ninja it's only $2500 and has better internally recorded 1080p than any Canon DSLR, far better than the new 7D2 for instance.

A Panny GH4 4k downsampled to 1080p also looks much better than any 1080p from Canon (only possible exception is the 5D3 with RAW hack), plus it of course can be left at native 4k (not the world's best 4k, but 4k and not the worst.)

EOS Bodies / Re: Will Canon answer Sony's new cinema cameras
« on: September 19, 2014, 03:06:38 PM »
PLus it is only a matter of time before an A7S2 arrives that doesn't even need the Ninja to record 4k.

EOS Bodies / Re: Will Canon answer Sony's new cinema cameras
« on: September 19, 2014, 03:00:31 PM »
Sony seems on a roll with video cameras:

1.  The A7s ... a tiny FF low-light monster that can do 4K with a recorder, and almost fit in your pocket.

2.  The Upcoming PXW-X70 which seems to beat Canons new XF200 on every spec, and adds goodies like HD-SDI, full size HDMI, wifi control and more ... for $1200 less!

3.  The upcoming PXW-FS7 which seems set to clobber the C300 in every way at nearly half the price. Reviewers are saying that this camera will even compete against Sony's own very expensive, and much larger, F5 and F55 cameras.

Can Canon afford to wait? Or will Sony eat their cinema lunch? What do you think Canon will offer against these formidable Sony cams?

Canon had it all in the bag, but seems intent and giving it all away due being too conservative these days, having too much fear of internal cannibalization and too little fear of outside, too focused on milking things for too long.

The 7D2 is a prime example. The image quality is already completely out of date and the camera is not even on the shelves yet.

The worst thing that ever happened to Canon video is the second Canon marketing realized their engineers had accidentally stumbled onto something big (and I saw accidentally, because they were so out of touch that they didn't even imagine anyone would possible want manual controls for video on a 5 series camera! they have these tight little focus groups so all they heard from was some PJ who wanted ultra automatic, easy run and gun video and totally missed the clearly obvious bigger picture, but as soon as marketing realzied the bigger picture they went into we better make some new high end stuff and make sure to cripple the DSLR video as much as possible and proceed as slowly as we can to milk, milk, milk). And now, as you say SOny has a serious movie camera for the price of a 1DC that utterly blows the 1DC out of the water for serious filming. They have the A7S that blow away every single Canon DSLR for in camera 1080p quality (if you want to deal with RAW, the 5D3 with Magic Lantern RAW is good though, but that is only because of some brilliant hackers) and with a $2000 add-on can record a nicer 4k than the 1DC (so that is $4900 for A7S+NinjaShogun+Metabones lens adapter vs $10,000 and the lower priced SONY option gives you better video quality)!

EOS Bodies / Re: A New EOS Pro Body With 46mp Next Month? [CR1]
« on: September 19, 2014, 02:15:34 AM »
It would need like 10fps at 46MP FF mode and better video than the 1DC all around every which way and Exmor-like low ISO DR. If it managed all of that then it certainly could justify 8k-9k. That would be the best DSLR ever made.

Not going to happen. Keep dreaming... you have totally lost it... 46MP alone is already dreaming... then everything else you ask as well... Might as well throw all the existing 1DX and 1DC in the thrash compacter and sell this camera alone. Do you think Canon plans on throwing its existing cameras (the ones in their inventory) like the 1DX and the 1DC in the thrash? Do you think that they are going to reduce the price of the 1DX or 1DC to the point that its close to or as affordable as the 5DIII? You can find the 1DsIV for $4500-$5000 still... so without dreaming... what do you think will really happen, given the past and present tech.?
Even still, with the specs that you are dreaming about it would be the best DSLR ever made, until someone else comes up with something better. Then you guys will be b!tching about something else.

Maybe so, but who would buy a 36MP, non-Exmor DR, 5fps, worse than 1DC video, bulky 1 series cam for $9000 when you could get the same and better for a fraction of that price from other brands???

Or even say it has exmor DR, why pay $9000 for a bulky 36MP exmor-quality 5fps 1080p camera when you get the same thing for Nikon for like what $2500 or something? You can buy the D810 and three key lenses AND keep your Canon lenses and perhaps current Canon body and still have spent no more than after selling your current Canon body and adding the new $9000 1DsX.

You can get an A7S+Ninja 4k recorder+metabones adapter for Canon lenses+Nikon D810+two Nikon lenses for $9000! So why on Earth would you spend $9000 for a bulky 1DsX that gives 36MP with DR but 5fps and no 4k video?

You can get an A7S+Ninja 4k recorder+A7R+metabones adapter for Canon lenses for like $7000. $2000 less.

This thing either needs to be with the spec I list or forget it.

And at some point the 1DX and 1DC have to go to the trash. I mean do they still sell the D30 and 1D as their top models or are they in the trash? The current stuff makes those look silly. (not that using the term "in the trash" is how I'd have chosen to put it, since they still take pictures and people can get good use out of stuff that is not the latest)

And the 1DC is really about to make zero sense. A7S+Ninja4k costs half the price and gives better quality. The new SOny videocamera blows away the 1DC for video and is the same price.

EOS Bodies / Re: A New EOS Pro Body With 46mp Next Month? [CR1]
« on: September 19, 2014, 02:10:02 AM »
Potential Layered sensor...
1. I assume Canon counts their pixels spatially, i.e. not 46/(3 layers) = 15.3, or 46/(5 layers) = 9.2
2. 46 spatial pixels then no more AA filter. You can just pixel bin for video
3. No more color noise!
4. 5 Layers.. BGYM(IR)?????

High MP...
I hope that the new TS-E lenses 60(45) and 135(90) would be launched in conjunction with a high megapixel body. Shift stitch with the new TS-E lenses gives you an effective medium format digital sized sensor and all the pixels to match. Combined with accurate color that would be ideal for Landscape/Studio work. An EF 11-24mm USM with autofocus would be nice though.

15.3MP foveon-style still needs an AA filter on FF for sure

Yes 15.3MP could definitely use an AA filter, but I was hoping it would be:

 46MP x (3 layers) = 138 (Three-veon-style)   :P

well that would interesting  ;D

EOS Bodies / Re: Chuck Westfall Talks Canon EOS 7D Mark II
« on: September 19, 2014, 12:54:42 AM »
Sadly, it sounds like moving the 7Dii to video is more important to Canon.
Very disappointed.

I have no idea why one would think this camera suggests "video is more important to Canon." Because honestly I see this camera as living proof that Canon actually couldn't care less about video. The video capabilities of this camera would have been interesting about four years ago. As it is now, for cinematographers, this camera is dead on arrival.

You're wrong - Canon cares a lot about video. Canon especially cares a lot about the folks in video that have money to spend. And Canon wants as much of that money as they can get (Canon is a corporation afterall.)

So why would Canon sell you a $1800 DSLR to do video when they have a $10000 video camera that they'd rather you buy instead?

Because just keeping your current 5D3 is better than the $1800 7D2 for video (unless you must have DPAF) and $0 is less than $1800 or $10000. Because a GH4 or especially A7S are much better for video (other than DPAF) than the 7D2 and both are less than $10000, even with a Ninja Shogun 4k recorder that plus an A7S is still far less than $10000. A whole lot of people have enough money to manage the Samsung and Panny and Sony and so on, but not the Cxx or 1DC for $10000 (and the A7S+NS is both better and less $$$ than the 1DC anyway).

And SOny is just about to release a serious video cam for 1DC price that will utterly blow it away for video. They are gonna be squeezed on the lower high-end and be left behind on the super upper low end which they had created themselves.

EOS Bodies / Re: 7D Mark II Video Tested By Gizmodo
« on: September 18, 2014, 07:59:25 PM »
Watching a documentary in a true large format IMAX theater is impressive visually.  For most everything else, whether it's on the big screen or on my SDTV makes essentially no difference to me.

I find the difference between ML raw video and native 5D3 video to be entirely immaterial.


No difference seen in detail and texture between waxy 5D3 native video and richly textured ML RAW and no difference in blown highlights and crushed black detail between the two?

No difference between 4k and 1080i and 480i even for nature?

I guess people sure see things differently. To me the difference is almost unimagineably great.

In all seriousness are you sure you are not slightly near sighted and perhaps just not seeing any resolution and detail differences so the only thing that impresses you is raw screen size or when something is blown up soooo large that you can finally start to see fine details?

EOS Bodies / Re: 7D Mark II Video Tested By Gizmodo
« on: September 18, 2014, 07:50:12 PM »
Let me be frank.  Image quality matters much, much less for videos than for stills.  Videos have many more frames, audio, and all of it in time sequence to provide more information than the viewer of a single still can get from a single still frame.

The reason I wanted 4k, even if it was low end 4k, was for stabilization in post, which can cost you 3/4 of your pixels in some cases.  The reason I want digital zoom is so I can get more zoom range out of a cheaper and better narrower zoom lens (18-135 versus 18-300, for example).

But, for properly framed shots, this performance is more than acceptable.

That all depends. The difference in detail and quality between ML RAW 5D3 video and regular 5D3 video is pretty intense to me. And A7S 4k video, wow, it's like looking out a window. The difference is pretty darn easy to see. Easier to see than most web stills image differences.

Of course it also depends a bit what you are shooting. Nature/scenics footage it probably matters than for a scripted story.

EOS Bodies / Re: 7D Mark II Video Tested By Gizmodo
« on: September 18, 2014, 07:04:27 PM »
Although, on the plus side, since it doesn't line skip, in a year or so, when Magic Lantern comes out for it, it should be able to produce an excellent 1080p so long as you are willing to deal with RAW and Magic Lantern proves possible to write for it. So in a year or so you might get to notch 1080p RAW out of it for less money than a 5D3. So given time it might be an awesome 1080p camera (for those not scared off by RAW video).

EOS Bodies / Re: 7D Mark II Video Tested By Gizmodo
« on: September 18, 2014, 06:21:47 PM »
My big question is, what were the recording settings? Was this the clean HDMI out to a quality recorder and then transcoded with a professional package? I assume (given I'm not a pro) that output at 4:2:2 via uncompressed HDMI will probably make a pretty big difference. Otherwise, probably not too big a surprise if they used the same codec to save out from 7d2 & 5d3. Canon probably didn't really change that around.

No clean HDMI out recording makes barely any difference. I tried it on the 5D3 and it was the same mess, you could barely tell any difference whatsoever, only on frames where the entire frame changed and even then only compared to non-ALLI basically. ML RAW made a HUGE difference though. That's really good quality.

It's not the codec that does the damage, it's something in the de-bayer or later processing stage where they ruin it all. Either DIGIC utterly stinks at debayer and image processing or they chose to use really amateurish large radius sharpening with a ton of DR and use DIGIC badly, or marketing has them apply a blurring filter at the last stage. The proof is in the HDMI uncompressed recording looks almost the same, but the ML RAW recording looks infinitely better.

EOS Bodies / Re: 7D Mark II Video Tested By Gizmodo
« on: September 18, 2014, 06:18:26 PM »
Basically it looks like they stopped line skipping on the 7D2 so it won't get the nasty aliasing and moire of the 70D or 7D and it will have a good one stop or more SNR advantage over those (due to not line skipping), BUT it's still the same waxy, blurry looking mess. A 5D3 with ML RAW will utterly blow it away for color, detail, editing latitude and usability.

A VERY feeble video effort this late in the game.

It figures that the second Canon realized that they accidentally had something huge with DSLR video the bean counters went and ruined it and crippled it and tries to push people to 1DC and Cxx for anything solid. (thankfully ML saved the 5D3, and so long as you are willing to deal with the troubles of RAW, it makes that a very fine 1080p cam indeed).

They didn't even give it a zoomed video mode! Despite it seemingly reading the entire sensor and having dual digic 6 power! And it being the reach/wildlife body!

Panny GH4 video totally destroys this, so does internal A7S video (never even mind A7S to 4k Ninja Shogun), so does 5D3 with ML RAW, so does SONY 4k camcorder, so most likely will the new new Samsung and anything else arriving soon.

Other than for those for whom DPAF is key, I think they will be very disappointed in the video sales this brings in. A day late and two dollars short.

The AF should be awesome and the fps are great, so to the sports/wildlife shooters it should sell very well though, but they blew it for the video crowd.

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