Messages

406

EOS Bodies - For Stills / Re: 5D3 & 600ex-rt + AF assist beam = slower focus

« on: November 12, 2012, 09:04:23 AM »

You know, it now occurs to me that perhaps the 6D is Canon's unspoken answer to the 5D3's low light AF problem.  That may be why it has a different sensor and fewer AF points.  Perhaps they are larger AF points and the center cross point is the magic point for low light performance.  Hmmm....

407

EOS Bodies - For Stills / Re: 5D3 & 600ex-rt + AF assist beam = slower focus

« on: November 12, 2012, 08:56:46 AM »

Bottom Line:  My 5D3 low light focus performance SUCKS.  Heck, my 5Dc focuses better in low light.  Aaargh!!

As a potential 5d3 customer I am completely confused by this whole discussion, because it's now moved from slow lock with af assist (even with 600rt) to complaints about general bad low light af performance?!

When posting, I didn't take into account the distinction between of general slow low light AF lock and slow lock with AF assist.  Let me clarify:  If it won't consistently AF lock in low light, regardless of the reason, it sucks.  It makes no difference to me.  Whether the AF assist beam is enabled or not, mine is inconsistent and sucks.

So is the 5d3 now a capable wedding-event camera or isn't it because of these issues? How is it possible that many people seem to get it working, or are they simply lucky and their receptions were better lit?

Based on my performance so far and what I've read from others that actually shoot weddings all the time, I wouldn't trust it at a wedding.  IMO, weddings are 'no failure' events.  In my case, MY 5D3 camera currently isn't up to that task.  However, some folks seem to report no trouble and think the 5D3 walks on the moon so I would love to go shoot with them some time and compare!!  (See 'A Pro Friend's Experience' below...)

If this is a problem and Canon cannot solve it (just like the non-working af indicators in servo, obviously they only will be added to the 1dx) I'm really considering either getting a much cheaper 5d2 or maybe the 6d that is esp. marketed as having better low light af than the "old" 5d3/1dx system.

I was thinking the same thing but if the 1Dx and 5D3 exhibit a similar fundamental problem, what are the chances that the 6D won't also have trouble?  I'm more than a little irritated that I've patiently waited all this time skipping the 5D2 only to entertain the idea of now selling the 5D3 and getting the 5D2 after all with whatever problems it has had for years.  Wow.  Sure glad I have loved my 5Dc so much.  This is a hard reminder that it's the photographer that makes the picture, not the camera, that's for sure!  (And a camera that isn't working well just gets in the way!)

For the record, My settings are typically...

-  One Shot (rarely ever AI Focus or Servo)
-  Center Point Focus (the way I've always shot on every camera)
-  AF Assist Beam OFF (never use it anyway)
-  Daylight, Fluorescent or Tungsten WB depending...
-  Eval Metering mostly, rarely spot or center
-  Shot Priority AF (not Release Priority)
-  General Purpose AF Case (Case 1?)
-  I usually have a RD2000 flash attached that has no AF Assist beam support, turned off or on depending...

I'll edit the list if I think of anything other setting that matters.  However, a $3500 camera should AF well with any setting combination.  I've also found that the lens matters too.

-  24-105L  =  Poor AF in Low Light
-  16-35L    =  ~OK AF in Low Light (not outstanding)
-  24-70L    =  ~OK AF in Low Light (not outstanding)
-  24/1.4-II  =  ~OK AF in Low Light (not outstanding)

A Pro Friend's Experience:  I have a friend who is a 30+ year veteran pro, goes all over the world and shoots beautiful low light stuff all the time.  She does Nat Geo level stuff.  She has two 5D3 bodies she bought back in March and reports NO problems.  She loves them.  She teaches workshops.  She understands photography well and knows her equipment.  So if she is extremely happy, this can't be happening to her.  I asked her specifically.  No problems.  For all I know, she may not even have the firmware update yet.  I'll have to check sometime.  She's in China right now on the way to India and I don't want to bug her any more.

I'm going to keep using this camera and get a feel for how bad it really is with different lenses.  I think we all agree that it is frustratingly intermittent.  However, the simple fact is that I'm not overwhelmingly loving it.  I'm not blown away.  I'm disappointed using it for what I shoot.  Other folks that shoot controlled studio or outdoors may love it.  Or they have a perfect copy perhaps??  So that's that.  It's not a good start to my relationship with this camera.  I buy camera bodies like cars and drive them until the wheels fall off.  I don't upgrade every 6 months.  It's not that this camera never works in low light, I just can't depend on it to work consistently.  It's not a reliable tool I look forward to using yet.  I'll do my best to make this thing work but eventually I'll invest in something else if necessary, another copy or another camera.

Sorry for the length of these posts, I'm just trying to get it all out there to help both myself and others get this sorted out.

Last Point:  I buy cameras at this level so they will work for me rock solid so I can concentrate on shooting and make my shooting easier.  If I wanted to tweak settings to trick the camera into achieving semi-OK performance, I would just get Rebels.  'nuff said.

408

EOS Bodies - For Stills / Re: 5D3 & 600ex-rt + AF assist beam = slower focus

« on: November 12, 2012, 12:35:06 AM »

Too small AF pts makes some sense.  I'll sell it soon if nothing changes.  I can always buy it again down the road if/when things improve.  The pictures I have made are stellar but I don't normally shoot still adults, I shoot kids running around campfires, etc.  What a huge disappointment.  I've waited years for this upgrade (skipped the Mk II).  Grrr!  Maybe the 6D will be better???  Geez.

409

EOS Bodies - For Stills / Re: 5D3 & 600ex-rt + AF assist beam = slower focus

« on: November 11, 2012, 10:49:51 PM »

Honestly, I find it very disappointing that up until now, I have never even considered focus assist to be a part of my photography.  And I shoot a lot of indoor available light, indoor swimming, outdoor evening and night campouts, low light parties, campfire shots and all kinds of impossible situations.  (With a 5Dc, 40D, 60D, etc.)  Sure, I've had to switch to manual focus occasionally but all my cameras are several years old.  Even still, I've never had the AF challenges I'm having with the 5D3.  I noticed it almost immediately after I had been shooting for about 30 minutes.  Hell, my wife even asked me about it when she borrowed my camera for a bit.

I love/hate the comment about a guest walking up and getting the shot right away with a Point and Shoot.  That's priceless!  And pathetic!!  Ouch!

I use Canon 580 or 580-II flashes occasionally for wedding-like stuff (not weddings per se but still church sanctuary and church reception halls) but 90% of the time I am using a simple SunPak RD2000 with/without diffuser as fill indoors, outdoors, night and day.  The RD2000 doesn't have a focus assist feature.  It's never been much of an issue.  I've never thought about it until now.  Heck, now I want to play with focus assist more on my older cameras and see how well it works.  I'd completely forgotten about it since my most common flash doesn't even support it.

So the 5D3 is literally holding me back.  This issue is a real drag for me.  Given the fact that the camera has been out 6 months and already has a firmware update released, I don't anticipate this problem being addressed for quite a while.  The red viewfinder focus indicator issue seems to be the big deal at the moment.  Heck, if the camera won't focus in the first place, who cares what the indicator does at that point?

410

EOS Bodies - For Stills / Re: 5D3 & 600ex-rt + AF assist beam = slower focus

« on: November 11, 2012, 07:42:47 PM »

I am also sad but relieved that others have this problem.  I'm not crazy.  Good.

Now... perhaps I mis-read something about the 5D3.  My perception from the hype and many posts from 5D3 users is that it focuses in low light very, very well.  -2EV or better to be exact.  When I hear 'focus in low light', I don't consider a focus assist beam to be part of the equation.  I would expect any camera to focus with assistance.  If I wanted to attach a big expensive flash to my new $3000 state of the art camera, I would just turn on the damned thing, dial it back, gel it and use it.

Let me be clear, I don't want to blind, distract or freak people out with a focus assist beam, I want to take low available light pictures that AF quickly and accurately.  (I don't want to trade AF embarrassment for AF Beam distraction/embarrassment!)  I don't want to figure out a work around or buy a different flash to help the camera do what it's supposed to do already, I want the camera to live up to expectations/promises and do what it is supposed to do on its own.

Why are a lot of people saying it does exactly that and then others (including myself) not seeing this performance, even with AF Beam assistance to boot?  Something really has got to be wrong here and I want to hear Canon say something is indeed wrong and they have a solution or will have one soon.

I thought after 6+ months, most of the problems and bugs would be revealed and/or solved.  How did I miss the discussions on this problem before I bought mine?

I feel cheated!  Waaaah!  I want my mommy!   

411

EOS Bodies - For Stills / Re: 5D3 & 600ex-rt + AF assist beam = slower focus

« on: November 11, 2012, 06:49:24 PM »

I have the low light Auto-Focus problem too.  Others noticed last night and wondered if I had forgotten how to take pictures.

OK, I received my 5D3 a couple weeks ago but just started using it recently in the last couple days.  I went to a party last night and church this morning.  I tried several lenses, 16-35L, 24-70L and 24-105L.  All lenses exhibited the problem but the 24-105L was the worst offender.  Turning off AF Assist didn't make much difference.

Bottom Line:  My 5D3 low light focus performance SUCKS.  Heck, my 5Dc focuses better in low light.  Aaargh!!

I am very concerned about this since some do and some don't seem have this problem with their cameras.  Some forum posts state their low light AF works great.  This doesn't confirm the problem across the board so it means only a subset of cameras are faulty based on a lot of AF complaint posts.  I guess I have one of the faulty ones.  Grrrr!

I guess this means that the mfr QC of the Canon line is not consistent and/or they received some bad parts and released a lot of cameras with this problem.  What really sucks is it seems Canon isn't admitting a problem exists.  Well it exists on my camera!!  Mine has the current firmware and a serial high enough to be past the light leak so it should have most fixes applied that would have possibly addressed a focus issue, admitted or not.  So I guess there is no fix yet or it's a hardware problem.

Either way, the camera is worthless to me if it won't focus in low light since that it the main reason I got it in the 1st place.  I would NOT use this in a professional setting.  It's embarrassing!  FYI - This was a $2899 Beach Camera eBay deal from a few weeks back.  If I hadn't gotten such a good deal, I would probably already be selling it right now.  Still might.  A lot of my shooting is low light.  I don't really want to use it the way it is now.  It's a PITA.  So why keep a $3000+ camera just laying around in case a fix comes along that I have to send it off to have fixed?

Anyone else have a fix that worked for them?  (I already disabled the flash assist.  Didn't seem to make a significant difference.)

412

EOS Bodies / Re: got a 5d mark iii offer for 2980, jump in or not?

« on: November 09, 2012, 10:56:02 PM »

Ditto on the Beach Camera deal for me as well.  ($2899)  Even if it dropped lower than your price, it won't go very far below that for quite a while.  Either buy now (with hopefully a reliable dealer) or wait until maybe next spring or summer.  Good luck!

413

Lenses / Re: How long do you think the 24-70 2.8 Mk 2 will remain over 2300.00?

« on: November 09, 2012, 03:34:29 PM »

Keep in mind that this season Canon is trying to reign in the price wars (like Apple) and encourage more price consistency between dealers.

The reality is very simple - Canon will lower prices of new lenses and other new equipment when they stop selling.  If everyone would simply put off these purchases for 6 months, the prices will be lower because Canon needs their products to sell well and appear to be popular and well accepted.

It's not just about profit, it's also a reputation issue when products are/aren't in high demand.  Low demand for whatever reason is bad, it means that a company isn't in touch with its market.  IMO, Canon isn't in touch with their market (me) with sky high prices like these.

I'm finding a new appreciation for my existing 24-70 and other great lenses.  I look at the images I took in the past year and I don't see much that $2300 will improve or fix.

Take a few dollars out of that $2300 you were planning to spend on the 24-70-II or other lenses/equipment and go out on the town with friends & family, enjoy the holiday and new year.  Worry about this next spring or summer.  Seriously.  It will be here before you know it!!   

414

Software & Accessories / Re: Lightroom 4.3 & Camera Raw 7.3 Release Candidates Available

« on: November 09, 2012, 01:36:34 PM »

Adobe has great software for the end user.  From the software development and technical support side, their software is hard to work with, install, upgrade and configure.  Adobe arbitrarily does things in the background during upgrades/installs that are undocumented and uncontrollable.  It can be maddening.  Don't even get me started on the endless list of migrating bugs during regular use, CPU and memory management headaches.  Let's just say everyone has gotten used to rebooting often, whether it's a mac or a PC.  Buy or build the best fastest computer for Adobe to run on and it will run like crap anyway.  I wish I had a nickel for every time I heard the words, "What the F were they thinking!?  Why!?  Why!!??? Why does this software suck so much!!??"  Can be frustrating at times to say the least.  Then there are the other times where you actually do hear, "Wow!  This software rocks!!  I love this feature!"  So it's not all bad but it's just a crap shoot what you will be yelling from day to day.  Suffice to say that I don't upgrade anything from Adobe until it's been out for at least a month.

415

Pricewatch Deals / Re: EF 24-70 f/4L IS & EF 35 f/2 IS Preorders

« on: November 06, 2012, 02:12:56 PM »

Do remember that Canon is not your only lens option. .... To me it's a no-brainer but then, I don't feel wedded to Canon lenses.

AdamJ, you make a good point.  Like I said, the competition - esp for lenses, is loving it.

With their recently announced strategy, Sigma is undergoing a sea-change from a price-driven proposition to a quality-driven proposition. I believe this is at least partly a response to the gap in the market that Canon's pricing is opening up. Sigma can develop premium products now because they know they can pitch them at the premium-but-not-inflated price level that Canon has vacated.

This is a very interesting observation Adam.  Canon is creating a price gap vacuum that will encourage a higher quality alternative to fill it at a previously acceptable price point (but probably still slightly less).  And if the alternative is good and receives rave reviews, it will succeed.  The fickle enthusiasts will flock in droves.  Hell, I might even be one of them.  If I can have a quality lens for half the price of the Canon L, I can afford to even replace it if I wear it out and still come out ahead.  Time will tell!!

416

Lenses / Re: Canon Announces New Lens Caps!

« on: November 06, 2012, 01:57:19 PM »

OK everyone...

You know that it must be a pretty slow and boring day if 5 pages of forum posts are generated over a new lens cap release.

Man, I gotta get motivated to do some actual work today....

417

Lenses / Re: Canon Announces New Lens Caps!

« on: November 06, 2012, 01:54:16 PM »

When was the last time you even saw a soccer mom with the lens cap hanging from the lens of their Rebel?  That is so... '70's to me.

I hear the 70's are coming back (and I suppose technically they will, later this century). 

You're right, I don't really see dangling lens caps on dSLRs anymore.  What I do see are people leaving a CPL on the lens...all the time, even indoors at night.

Oh crap!!  So that was my problem!  Now I can send the 5D3 back!  I don't need the extra ISO anymore!!  Yippee!!!  Dude, you just saved me 3 grand!   

418

Lenses / Re: Canon Announces New Lens Caps!

« on: November 06, 2012, 01:51:41 PM »

-  OK seriously... they really put a lanyard hole in it and actually include a lanyard?  Really!?  Who does that these days?  When was the last time you even saw a soccer mom with the lens cap hanging from the lens of their Rebel?  That is so... '70's to me.

Ahh, that was fun...

You misunderstood my post.  The image is of Chinese caps that are sold on ebay for $1.59 including shipping.  I bought a assortment of them a while back.
The new Canon caps look very much the same.  I really doubt that they are the same though.  For $1.59 for a 82mm cap, its not a bad deal.  I suspect that I did not have the cap completely snapped innto place when it cam off in my bag, I haven't had another come off since.  Still, I'm very concerned if they do pop off in my bag, it could be a expensive repair.

Ha!  OK, I admit it.  You got me on that one.  Keys in motion before brain in gear!   

419

Lenses / Re: Canon Announces New Lens Caps!

« on: November 06, 2012, 01:42:32 PM »

They are going for about ten bucks each.   Hey hey!   

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/883410-REG/Canon_6315b001_E_52_II_Lens_Cap.html

OK, seriously... Tamron has to be hating this.  For once the shoe is on the other foot!  Canon is undercutting Tamron!  Take THAT Tamron!   Canon is sooo p'owning Tamron now in the highly competitive lens cap market.  Finally!  Now I can stop buying Tamron caps and putting black gaffer tape on them. 

420

Lenses / Re: Canon Announces New Lens Caps!

« on: November 06, 2012, 01:37:19 PM »

I use lens caps 'off and on'.  (Heh, heh.)  Mostly for storage.  Here are my bullet points with regard to this announcement...

-  The Canon lens caps up to now have been worthless and stayed in the box.  I substitute w Tamrons.
-  Sort of like Apple, Canon releases this revolutionary, fancy, innovative pinch design with their name on it... Wow!!  Amazing!
-  Also like Apple, Canon will likely charge a premium price for what is essentially a Tamron (or Nikon, or Bower) lens cap.
-  Using the same premium and state of the art plastic as Canon Lens Hoods as justification, Canon will likely charge accordingly,  the same premium prices.
-  OK seriously... they really put a lanyard hole in it and actually include a lanyard?  Really!?  Who does that these days?  When was the last time you even saw a soccer mom with the lens cap hanging from the lens of their Rebel?  That is so... '70's to me.

Ahh, that was fun...