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Messages - Orangutan

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166
Third Party Manufacturers / Re: DXO uh-oh?
« on: July 29, 2014, 11:27:30 AM »
"That advantage disappears at the higher ISOs"

That's a myth, and I'm not sure where it started.
Can you cite sources, or is this your personal opinion?

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The Mk3 to me always had this 'painterly' look at 800 and beyond. That's the best word I can think of.
Again, not objective.  Personal impressions are not authoritative.

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Web tests expose both cams the same, and that's stupid. If one cam holds on to it's shadows so much better, you can expose differently in the real world.
How would one objectively determine the proper exposure for each sensor?

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It's not something you can be told, it's something you have to see for yourself.
This is 100% unpersuasive to me, as are nearly all appeals to personal experience.  If it can't be demonstrated in double-blind experiments, there's no reason to be believe it's real.

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After all, there is nothing that replaces using two types of tools yourself and pushing them to the limit.
Except reproducible double-blind experiments.

As an example of how "experts" can be fooled: http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2011/10/you-are-not-so-smart-why-we-cant-tell-good-wine-from-bad/247240/

These types of experiments have been replicated many times, and the summary is that you can't trust your own perceptions.  Show me objective tests, or you've shown me nothing.

167
Third Party Manufacturers / Re: DXO uh-oh?
« on: July 29, 2014, 10:10:30 AM »
I went to the D800 and spent 12 grand switching, and I never looked back. Crop modes, clean shadows and highlights and DR were the main attractions.

Images from my D800 look like drum scans from MF/LF film, and that's the first time I'd seen a digital camera hit that goal.

I'll let Neuro defend himself, he's usually pretty good at that, but I have a few comments.

I don't think anyone disputes that the D800 sensor is better at base ISO.  That advantage disappears at the higher ISOs.  If you only need base ISO then the D800 might help you.

Your entire post is from personal experience: religious wars have been fought over personal experience, with each side being certain it was right.   As the saying goes "a pile of anecdotes do not constitute data."  Personal experiences may make you feel good about your purchase, but do not provide objective evidence.

How many photos have you missed due to poor focus?

Depending on time of day, I believe my 60D could have made those photos you linked.  (but that's just opinion, not  proven fact)

I'm glad you're happy with your Nikon kit: in the end, that's all that matters.  I doesn't prove anything objectively.

Keep making images you enjoy.


168
EOS Bodies / Re: One other hoped-for feature on the 7D2
« on: July 28, 2014, 08:36:55 PM »
Auto ISO works on the 60D and 7D in manual mode.

Almost.  EC doesn't work for auto-ISO on my 60D.

True, But I did not say the 60D had EC. Actually, I was corroborating neuro's statement "Recent bodies, I believe including the 70D (not certain) have a functional Auto ISO in M mode".

In my my style of shooting there have been rare instances where overriding the metering system for backlighting might have been helpful - otherwise manual with auto ISO and a carefully selected metering mode gets you very close in functionality.

Didn't mean to criticize, just putting in my 2 cents.  I've been trying to use my 60D for birds; for that, Manual + AutoISO + EC would be very helpful.

169
EOS Bodies / Re: One other hoped-for feature on the 7D2
« on: July 28, 2014, 06:42:44 PM »
Auto ISO works on the 60D and 7D in manual mode.

Almost.  EC doesn't work for auto-ISO on my 60D.

170
Canon General / Re: When a Woman is Fed Up...
« on: July 28, 2014, 12:08:57 AM »
Why jump to the conclusion that it was irrational?  Maybe he deserved it.

171
Third Party Manufacturers / Re: DXO uh-oh?
« on: July 27, 2014, 07:46:08 PM »
You can read about the methodology of their scores here:
http://www.dxomark.com/About/Sensor-scores

I'm sorry, could you point out where the formula is given?  I see a few hints about what's considered important, but not the actual formula for the score.  All I was able to find was this:

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How is Sensor Overall Score measured?The Sensor Overall Score is an average of the Portrait Score based on color depth, the Landscape Score based on dynamic range, and the Sports Score based on low-light ISO.



It says "an average:" presumably that's a weighted average, but they don't give the weightings.

Thanks.

172
Third Party Manufacturers / Re: DXO uh-oh?
« on: July 27, 2014, 05:18:54 PM »
as a multi-system user I have to agree with DXO guys, they are honest, much more so than DPR or any other unscientific review sites online.

The problem is that DXO's "science" is in dispute. How can you trust something that produces inconsistent and obviously incorrect results?

I agree.  Science demands transparency so the measurements can be replicated by others.  Little about their process is transparent.  It's not scientific, it's almost pseudo-scientific.

173
Photography Technique / Re: Getting photos home from overseas
« on: July 26, 2014, 10:43:38 PM »

Considering the notable point raised earlier that getting to a post office daily might eat up a lot of time (if they aren't convenient to train stations etc.) this is worth investigating. 

I don't mind the postage - potentially a variety of interesting stamps when I get home - but the adventure of finding a post office could well turn into a chore pretty quickly.

Jim

Depending on your plans, you may be able to locate post offices in advance, and work that into your schedule.

174
Photography Technique / Re: Getting photos home from overseas
« on: July 26, 2014, 09:16:03 PM »

Nothing thorny about it, you're absolutely right.  I just thought I'd throw out something you might not have considered.

Enjoy your trip, and I hope it's not the only time you're able to travel to Europe.

It wasn't your input which sat wrong  :)  It is being patronized which does, and I think that is a pretty universal reaction.

In any case I have some new ideas to consider, and I appreciate them.

Jim

I apologize if I sounded patronizing, I didn't intend to.

175
Photography Technique / Re: Getting photos home from overseas
« on: July 26, 2014, 08:04:41 PM »
To get a thorny issue out of the way first, where I travel and for how long is my business.

Nothing thorny about it, you're absolutely right.  I just thought I'd throw out something you might not have considered.

Enjoy your trip, and I hope it's not the only time you're able to travel to Europe.

176
Photography Technique / Re: Getting photos home from overseas
« on: July 26, 2014, 11:12:47 AM »
If so, I'd say don't do a 50-day trip, do a 14-day trip this year, and another one next year...

I dislike short trips, and to me 14 days is short.  Our international trips are generally a month or so.

If I had the time and money that's probably what I'd do for much the same reasons you mentioned.  On the other hand, there are people I know who start getting very homesick after 10 days.  That's why I wrote that if this was his first trip to Europe or first international trip he should consider making it shorter, and also why I say traveling well is a learned skill-set.  Each person travels differently, and each couple or group is a set of compromises and enhancements for the experience.  For any first time traveler, I suggest a shorter trip.  If it flew by too quickly, then go longer next time.

177
Photography Technique / Re: Getting photos home from overseas
« on: July 26, 2014, 09:53:39 AM »
Unless you will be staying in hotels that could take care of this for you, I'm concerned that you could use a lot of your valuable vacation time trying to find a post office and then standing in line waiting to mail your items.
+1

I strongly recommend that you take some time to see the sights of Europe without your view being constrained by a viewfinder.   ;)
+1

Is this your first trip to Europe?  First trip overseas?  If so, I'd say don't do a 50-day trip, do a 14-day trip this year, and another one next year, etc.  It would be a shame to get 10-days into your trip and find that you don't really like being away from home that long, or that you misjudged your interests or stamina, etc.  Traveling well is a learned skill-set.

178
Third Party Manufacturers / Re: DXO uh-oh?
« on: July 25, 2014, 12:55:19 AM »
I've been racking my brain for a way to describe how organizations and companies have "hips", conjure up some kind of...evidence, for that...but I'm at a loss for...anything...here...... :P

Well, the US Supreme Court has ruled that corporations can have religious values, so presumably they also have all other aspects of human experience, including physical bodies.  I'm sure if you ask one of the majority voters, *cough* Scalia *cough*, he could conjure up some hocus-pocus-juris-prudence to support hips on a corporation.

</snark>

Yeah...not gonna touch that...not on these forums...

A guy tries to start a pleasant flame war and you just have to spray halon 1301 all over it.   :P

179
Third Party Manufacturers / Re: DXO uh-oh?
« on: July 25, 2014, 12:51:48 AM »
Well you're the one making the claim so what I'm doing is asking you to provide evidence to back up your claim.

You're making the prior claim, as yet unsubstantiated by other independent testers, that DxO's "overall score" has legitimacy.  Given that DxO doesn't publish their weighting, you may have a harder time with your task than jrista does proving corporations have hips.

P.S. I believe Shakira is a corporation.  ;D

180
Third Party Manufacturers / Re: DXO uh-oh?
« on: July 25, 2014, 12:47:31 AM »
I've been racking my brain for a way to describe how organizations and companies have "hips", conjure up some kind of...evidence, for that...but I'm at a loss for...anything...here...... :P

Well, the US Supreme Court has ruled that corporations can have religious values, so presumably they also have all other aspects of human experience, including physical bodies.  I'm sure if you ask one of the majority voters, *cough* Scalia *cough*, he could conjure up some hocus-pocus-juris-prudence to support hips on a corporation.

</snark>

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