October 24, 2014, 04:46:26 PM

Author Topic: Canon 5d Mark III Shadow recovery  (Read 41753 times)

sach100

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Canon 5d Mark III Shadow recovery
« on: October 08, 2012, 04:34:54 PM »
This shot was taken while i was adjusting for correct exposure. The sky looked okay but the bottom half is obviously underexposed. I wanted to see how much i can push the shadows in post.  I increased the shadow recovery slider to +100 in camera raw keeping everything else unaltered. If i can do this in post then this is plenty of available DR in shadows for me.
 
Left  - Original
Right - With shadow recovery slider set to +100
5D MkIII

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Canon 5d Mark III Shadow recovery
« on: October 08, 2012, 04:34:54 PM »

lintoni

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Re: Canon 5d Mark III Shadow recovery
« Reply #1 on: October 08, 2012, 04:46:22 PM »
Adobe Lightroom?
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ChrisAnderson

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Re: Canon 5d Mark III Shadow recovery
« Reply #2 on: October 08, 2012, 05:11:22 PM »
Yes, it recovered the shadows, but can you actually use this for anything above 600px wide?  How bad is the banding and noise in the shadows at 100% view now?
My 5D3 images look absolutely TERRIBLE when i do this.

Mt Spokane Photography

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Re: Canon 5d Mark III Shadow recovery
« Reply #3 on: October 08, 2012, 05:25:05 PM »
My 5D Mark III seems to be better than my 5D Mark II at this.  I've had two of each, there was quite a bit of difference between the 5D 2's as to sensor noise with the three year newer one being noticibly better.
I just received my 2nd 5D3, so I haven't compared it to my earlier one which was very good.  I also had a D800, and it indeed has more DR at low ISO's, enough to immediately see in a outdoor shot.  However, I do a lot of extreme high ISO work, and there the 5D MK III has a tiny but noticible DR advantage. My D800 struggled at ISO 12800 and produced grainy noisy images that were not very pleasing

David Hull

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Re: Canon 5d Mark III Shadow recovery
« Reply #4 on: October 08, 2012, 07:26:49 PM »
If you do find yourself running up against the pattern noise in the 5DIII (it is there if you look hard enough) it appears to respond well to both the Nik and Topaz noise reduction SW.

killswitch

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Re: Canon 5d Mark III Shadow recovery
« Reply #5 on: October 08, 2012, 10:24:35 PM »
Is there any place where we can get 5d mk iii sample Raw files so we can play around how much detail we can recover from the shadows. And is the ISO level in 5d mk iii superior at 6400 compared let's say d600 or d800? I was trying the raw files from dpreview but some thing from a more natural setting (environment, landscape, outdoor or indoor portrait) would give help clear out how much we can recover without creating those nasty bandings and noise.

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Re: Canon 5d Mark III Shadow recovery
« Reply #6 on: October 08, 2012, 10:45:57 PM »
Is there any place where we can get 5d mk iii sample Raw files so we can play around how much detail we can recover from the shadows. And is the ISO level in 5d mk iii superior at 6400 compared let's say d600 or d800? I was trying the raw files from dpreview but some thing from a more natural setting (environment, landscape, outdoor or indoor portrait) would give help clear out how much we can recover without creating those nasty bandings and noise.
You do not create banding and noise, it is just there, and if you boost the exposure enough, you will see it.  It seldom shows in a print, only when you look at the image at 1:1.
The issue with obtaining raw images is that every image is different, so its easy to manipluate the results by selecting one that shows whatever you want.  Then you make a general statement about how wonderful or how awful it is.
As you raise the ISO, the DR and the ability to recover shadows lessens.  The D800, for example is supurb at ISO 100, but at 12800, the 5D MK III is better.  However, at very high ISO settings, neither will tolerate a poorly exposed shot, it must be right-on.  Forget about pulling up shadows at ISO 12800.

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Re: Canon 5d Mark III Shadow recovery
« Reply #6 on: October 08, 2012, 10:45:57 PM »

killswitch

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Re: Canon 5d Mark III Shadow recovery
« Reply #7 on: October 08, 2012, 10:59:24 PM »
Is there any place where we can get 5d mk iii sample Raw files so we can play around how much detail we can recover from the shadows. And is the ISO level in 5d mk iii superior at 6400 compared let's say d600 or d800? I was trying the raw files from dpreview but some thing from a more natural setting (environment, landscape, outdoor or indoor portrait) would give help clear out how much we can recover without creating those nasty bandings and noise.
You do not create banding and noise, it is just there, and if you boost the exposure enough, you will see it.  It seldom shows in a print, only when you look at the image at 1:1.
The issue with obtaining raw images is that every image is different, so its easy to manipluate the results by selecting one that shows whatever you want.  Then you make a general statement about how wonderful or how awful it is.
As you raise the ISO, the DR and the ability to recover shadows lessens.  The D800, for example is supurb at ISO 100, but at 12800, the 5D MK III is better.  However, at very high ISO settings, neither will tolerate a poorly exposed shot, it must be right-on.  Forget about pulling up shadows at ISO 12800.

Lol, yeah meant to say revealing those banding. I felt it was considerably less in 5d mk iii version of the raw file.

Mt Spokane Photography

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Re: Canon 5d Mark III Shadow recovery
« Reply #8 on: October 08, 2012, 11:50:37 PM »
Is there any place where we can get 5d mk iii sample Raw files so we can play around how much detail we can recover from the shadows. And is the ISO level in 5d mk iii superior at 6400 compared let's say d600 or d800? I was trying the raw files from dpreview but some thing from a more natural setting (environment, landscape, outdoor or indoor portrait) would give help clear out how much we can recover without creating those nasty bandings and noise.
You do not create banding and noise, it is just there, and if you boost the exposure enough, you will see it.  It seldom shows in a print, only when you look at the image at 1:1.
The issue with obtaining raw images is that every image is different, so its easy to manipluate the results by selecting one that shows whatever you want.  Then you make a general statement about how wonderful or how awful it is.
As you raise the ISO, the DR and the ability to recover shadows lessens.  The D800, for example is supurb at ISO 100, but at 12800, the 5D MK III is better.  However, at very high ISO settings, neither will tolerate a poorly exposed shot, it must be right-on.  Forget about pulling up shadows at ISO 12800.

Lol, yeah meant to say revealing those banding. I felt it was considerably less in 5d mk iii version of the raw file.
I've never seen one on either of my 5D MK II's or my two 5D MK III's with a normal photo.  You have to Create the setup to show it.  You can pull up a image several stops and see it, no doubt, but that is pretty extreme.  I'd seldom pull a image up by more than a stop.  its much better to slightly overexpose and pull the image exposure down slightly.
 

sach100

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Re: Canon 5d Mark III Shadow recovery
« Reply #9 on: October 08, 2012, 11:52:08 PM »
Adobe Lightroom?

I used camera raw 7.1 in PS

Yes, it recovered the shadows, but can you actually use this for anything above 600px wide?  How bad is the banding and noise in the shadows at 100% view now?
My 5D3 images look absolutely TERRIBLE when i do this.

I don't print images but if you look for it i am sure it is there.. Sorry, you will have to look elsewhere in the forum for a technical feedback :)

However, I do a lot of extreme high ISO work, and there the 5D MK III has a tiny but noticible DR advantage.

I've seen some of your shots posted in this forum - No doubt one of the Gurus around here.

5D MkIII

Octavian

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Re: Canon 5d Mark III Shadow recovery
« Reply #10 on: October 10, 2012, 08:46:06 AM »
If you cross your eye on the two images, focus on the one 'created' in the middle you get a 3D HDR image!    :P

Luciano Nova

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Re: Canon 5d Mark III Shadow recovery
« Reply #11 on: October 10, 2012, 09:50:30 AM »
My 5D3 images look absolutely TERRIBLE when i do this.

Chris,

Could you show us one of this images?

Thanks

Marsu42

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Re: Canon 5d Mark III Shadow recovery
« Reply #12 on: October 10, 2012, 11:02:43 AM »
If i can do this in post then this is plenty of available DR in shadows for me.

This was no high contrast scene, no direct sunlight and no hard shadows - that's when added dr would make a difference. Btw, pushing shadows in LR/CR imho isn't really a substitute for +ev (with the adjustment brush or graduated filters) because it looks often artificial to me if shadows go over +50 in PV2012. And if you +ev a shot then some added dr helps.

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Re: Canon 5d Mark III Shadow recovery
« Reply #12 on: October 10, 2012, 11:02:43 AM »

jrista

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Re: Canon 5d Mark III Shadow recovery
« Reply #13 on: October 10, 2012, 12:06:58 PM »
This shot was taken while i was adjusting for correct exposure. The sky looked okay but the bottom half is obviously underexposed. I wanted to see how much i can push the shadows in post.  I increased the shadow recovery slider to +100 in camera raw keeping everything else unaltered. If i can do this in post then this is plenty of available DR in shadows for me.
 
Left  - Original
Right - With shadow recovery slider set to +100

I think you could lift a LOT more than that. Try boosting the exposure slider by at least one stop, if not two. I push around my 7D shots a lot, sometimes a +80 shadow lift on top of a +1, +1.33, or +1.5 exposure lift (and usually some negative black shift to maintain contrast) when I botch a shot, and experience zero banding. Granted, I usually shoot above ISO 400, so you might not have quite that much leeway at ISO 100. I'd still give it a try, though...33 electrons worth of read noise out of a maximum saturation of 67531 electrons is still a very small percentage. Were talking a ratio of 2046. Read noise (which includes FPN and banding) is only the bottom 0.05% of the signal.
« Last Edit: October 10, 2012, 12:08:29 PM by jrista »

Cgdillan

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Re: Canon 5d Mark III Shadow recovery
« Reply #14 on: October 10, 2012, 12:47:13 PM »
If you cross your eye on the two images, focus on the one 'created' in the middle you get a 3D HDR image!    :P

HAHA! it does! +1
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Re: Canon 5d Mark III Shadow recovery
« Reply #14 on: October 10, 2012, 12:47:13 PM »