November 28, 2014, 08:31:58 PM

Author Topic: Canon 1Dx in favour of mirrorless  (Read 1650 times)

e17paul

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Canon 1Dx in favour of mirrorless
« on: November 08, 2014, 03:05:03 AM »
https://m.facebook.com/fotoriesel/posts/868721806480562:0

These seems like a fair assessment to me, but one which will change in the next decade.
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Canon 1Dx in favour of mirrorless
« on: November 08, 2014, 03:05:03 AM »

expatinasia

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Re: Canon 1Dx in favour of mirrorless
« Reply #1 on: November 08, 2014, 06:16:26 AM »
I could not read the article as one has to be logged into FB to read it, and if that is the case I am not interested in reading it.

A lot will happen in the next decade, a lot.
1D X + backup + different L lenses etc.

e17paul

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Re: Canon 1Dx in favour of mirrorless
« Reply #2 on: November 08, 2014, 08:52:06 AM »
I could not read the article as one has to be logged into FB to read it, and if that is the case I am not interested in reading it.

A lot will happen in the next decade, a lot.

I will paste the text here. The post is from the account of a great little camera shop in Sydney.

Last night I did a job for a photographer friend of mine who had a booking clash. Back in the day, when film was king, we were both shooting professionally and making a good living. He stayed shooting and I moved on only occasionally shooting the odd job here and there.
Now I have been an advocate for small mirror less cameras for some time but last night I understood why the 1dx exists.
Picture this- dark room, sit down meal, formal black tie, stageshow- focus and lighting nightmare. Enter the 1dx and the trio of 2.8 zooms.
Focus was spot on even in low, very low light. Shutter in S mode was discreet. The thing is built like a tank and needs to be as they take a beating on long jobs like this.
Brilliant workhorse camera.
Woke up the next day with a back pain that proved five hours of carrying this beast is four hours too much but where is the compromise? I honestly don't think LCD viewfinders can cope with really low light in an on the job, got to nail it situation. I am positive the sensors outperform the 1dx but it's not really about that, it's the total package that gives you the confidence you can deliver to a client. If you have ever had to shoot grip and grin social photography the ability to read out frame numbers as the pr person takes names is amazing. It's the hundred little things that make this camera a great workhorse tool.
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Marauder

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Re: Canon 1Dx in favour of mirrorless
« Reply #3 on: November 08, 2014, 10:11:53 AM »
It's a good article.  I think the thing that confuses me the most about mirrorless advocates is how rabidly they seem to detest SLR's.  How passionately they want to believe that "their" camera is the only possible option for all kinds of shooter and shooting.  I see it with the anger that the 7D Mark II isn't mirrorless (fortunately it's not!) and any time an article comes out that praises the benefits that come from using a traditional SLR and an optical viewfinder.  It's peculiar (and more than a little tiresome).

I don't dislike mirrorless cameras, even though I don't own one, at least not yet.  I do think they are amazing creations, capable of taking on many roles that have long been the domain of SLR's.  I like the innovation that companies like Fuji, Panasonic, Sony and Olympus have poured into making them better.  But it's tedious when I read things that sound like there is almost a religious war to perpetuate the mirrorless camera as being the ONLY kind of ICL camera that should be made or used by anyone.  Its just plain silly.

Traditional SLR's still have a whole host of benefits, especially for low-light and fast action, as there are still downsides to mirrorless.  EVF lag is becoming less obtrusive but it's still present, especially under poor light.  The resolution of EVF's is improving, but it still cannot match the clarity of a good pentaprism OVF.  Mirrorless AF systems are improving, but they are still not up to the standard of a good SLR's phase detection AF.  As a photographer who shoots birds and wildlife, the benefits of the SLR will continue to make it my 'go to' choice for action photography. 

Another factor that is ostensibly in the favour of mirrorless cameras -- their smaller size and weight  -- pretty much vanishes when using large telephoto lenses.  Which is why mirrorless cameras that are attempts to compete with higher end SLR's are growing in size, negating their supposed size advantage!  :o

All that being said, I do think mirrorless cameras are quite interesting.  Great for low impact street photography and portraiture, as they're less intimidating to the subject.  Awesome to be able to see the end result in the EVF, which requires live view to do in an SLR.  Slick and beautiful little pieces of technology, and I can see why people love them so passionately.  I just don't understand why their advocates take that passion as meaning mirrorless is the only option for every scenario?? Seems to me that the best camera is the one that is suited to the subject and shooting conditions.  For some of those, it's mirrorless and for other's, it's the SLR. 

What will it take to change the mind of SLR shooters that mirrorless is the best type of camera for all scenarios?

1.  Lag so slight it's essentially non-existent compared to an OVF under virtually all shooting conditions. And this isn't something that will be illustrated with some showy short test--it will take extensive testing under many conditions to prove that concept.

2.  Image so clear that the differences between the EVF and the OVF are imperceptible under all shooting conditions.  Same caveat regarding the rigorousness of the testing to prove that concept.

3.  AI Servo performance that can match the speed and accuracy of the best phase detection AF systems.  Same rigorousness required for testing as mentioned above.  NX15 is being touted as having a great AF system, but only time will tell how it really performs vis a vis the best AF systems in SLR's.


So there you have it.  The next 10 years will bring improvements, but I'm not sure they will achieve the goals I've listed.  The problem is, it seems many mirrorless advocates will continue to push their agenda (of making mirrorless the only option) forward even if these goals are not met--and that's just absurd. 
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sanj

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Re: Canon 1Dx in favour of mirrorless
« Reply #4 on: November 08, 2014, 10:35:10 AM »
I adore my 1dc and my Xe2. Both fill different needs.
I like both the optical and EVF. Both fill different needs.

Marauder

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Re: Canon 1Dx in favour of mirrorless
« Reply #5 on: November 08, 2014, 10:58:56 AM »
I adore my 1dc and my Xe2. Both fill different needs.
I like both the optical and EVF. Both fill different needs.

Precisely!
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Dylan777

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Re: Canon 1Dx in favour of mirrorless
« Reply #6 on: November 08, 2014, 11:18:31 AM »
With all the gear I have, I still find FF mirrorless is useful in certain situations.

Few weeks back, my wife and I attended our cousin wedding. I didn't carry 5D or 1DX, instead, I brought just RX1.

However, when shooting my kids playing sports, 1DX is my #1 choice.
« Last Edit: November 08, 2014, 11:24:09 AM by Dylan777 »
Bodies: 1DX -- 5D III
Zooms: 16-35L f4 IS -- 24-70L II -- 70-200L f2.8 IS II
Primes: 40mm -- 85L II -- 135L -- 200L f2 IS -- 400L f2.8 IS II

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Re: Canon 1Dx in favour of mirrorless
« Reply #6 on: November 08, 2014, 11:18:31 AM »

Mt Spokane Photography

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Re: Canon 1Dx in favour of mirrorless
« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2014, 12:46:25 PM »
I'm watching mirrorless cameras progress, and am considering renting a A7r for my next ultra low light job, bring both it and my 5D MK III.
 
I won't be able to do it until after Christmas, but it might be interesting to see how they compare at ISO 25600 as far as detail, color, etc.  The A7r should be a easy winner, but I've been fooled by the hype too many times to lay down good money based on others opinions who may have not took the same type of photos.

Marauder

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Re: Canon 1Dx in favour of mirrorless
« Reply #8 on: November 08, 2014, 12:48:43 PM »
With all the gear I have, I still find FF mirrorless is useful in certain situations.

Few weeks back, my wife and I attended our cousin wedding. I didn't carry 5D or 1DX, instead, I brought just RX1.

However, when shooting my kids playing sports, 1DX is my #1 choice.

Yeah a mirrorless would be a great camera for that purpose.  As are premium compacts like the RX1.  I have a Fuji X10 that I use as my "bar and restaurant" camera rather than lugging my SLR.  I have a couple of superzooms from Panasonic and Canon that I use when I hiking is my primary goal, rather than photography.  But nothing beats the SLR when it comes to getting a BIF or some other fast moving or elusive subject.  I certainly see the benefit of different cameras for different shooters, or even for the same shooter in different conditions.  I might be tempted into a mirrorless camera at some point--but it would be a supplement to, rather than a replacement for my DSLR.  :D
« Last Edit: November 08, 2014, 01:25:25 PM by Marauder »
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ecka

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Re: Canon 1Dx in favour of mirrorless
« Reply #9 on: November 08, 2014, 01:00:51 PM »
I'm watching mirrorless cameras progress, and am considering renting a A7r for my next ultra low light job, bring both it and my 5D MK III.
 
I won't be able to do it until after Christmas, but it might be interesting to see how they compare at ISO 25600 as far as detail, color, etc.  The A7r should be a easy winner, but I've been fooled by the hype too many times to lay down good money based on others opinions who may have not took the same type of photos.

"... ultra low light job..." - Why not A7s then?
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Dylan777

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Re: Canon 1Dx in favour of mirrorless
« Reply #10 on: November 08, 2014, 03:38:38 PM »
I'm watching mirrorless cameras progress, and am considering renting a A7r for my next ultra low light job, bring both it and my 5D MK III.

It doesn't look good at 6400ISO. On top of that, high MP took the fun away in PP(in my case).

If you want high quality 25000ISO, a7s is your answer. I took over 200photos with a7s + Sony FE 55mm f1.8(native lens). 12800-25000ISO looks very-very close to 1DX 6400ISO.

Note: in lower/darker light, catching moving subject is almost impossible. I missed a lot of shots last Halloween. For still, then yes, A7s is a nice little camera for low light shooting.

Many claimed 12MP is little low for landscape. I don't agree with that either. I feel 12MP is good, as long as you don't crop 30-40% from RAW.

For many times, I wanted to reduce my Canon DSLR to half. However, every times I looked back the photos taken with 5D III + 1DX combo, I feel good about them. Yes...it's a bit bulky and heavy, however, they delivered it every times.
« Last Edit: November 08, 2014, 03:47:43 PM by Dylan777 »
Bodies: 1DX -- 5D III
Zooms: 16-35L f4 IS -- 24-70L II -- 70-200L f2.8 IS II
Primes: 40mm -- 85L II -- 135L -- 200L f2 IS -- 400L f2.8 IS II

ecka

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Re: Canon 1Dx in favour of mirrorless
« Reply #11 on: November 08, 2014, 03:58:55 PM »
Many claimed 12MP is little low for landscape. I don't agree with that either. I feel 12MP is good, as long as you don't crop 30-40% from RAW.

Well, A7s is not as bad as X-T1, but 16+mp wouldn't hurt.
FF + primes !

johnf3f

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Re: Canon 1Dx in favour of mirrorless
« Reply #12 on: November 08, 2014, 07:30:14 PM »
I have been looking at some of the mirror-less cameras simply for their sensors and light weight. However the only use I can think of for one is landscape and a little macro. Unfortunately they are of no use for about 90% of my photography so when I can afford a second/bacup body it has to be a DSLR.
When they produce a mirror-less camera with a big 11.1 volt battery, VERY fast AF, a big grip and a good optical viewfinder, decent frame rate, large buffer etc,etc I will buy one - oops! That is a DSLR!

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Re: Canon 1Dx in favour of mirrorless
« Reply #12 on: November 08, 2014, 07:30:14 PM »