Moving to FF Canon vs Nikon - I'm Confused...

[neuroanatomist]

So much so, their supremacy in the SLR lens market is in fact the basis of their marketing leverage in pricing their bodies a smidge higher, and getting away with small annoyances like not including hoods even for some 1K L's (70-200L  f/4 IS for example).

Eh? My 70-200 F4 IS came complete with the hood and soft lens bag. It was back in 2010, granted......

Yeah, I caught that, too.  All L-series lenses come with a hood and pouch/case, including the 70-200/4 IS.  A small number of non-L lenses also include the hood/pouch, such as the 70-300 DO and the 45mm and 90mm TS-E lenses. 

That's in North America and Europe.  In some markets in Asia, a hood and pouch/case are included with all lenses, even the lower end like the 40mm pancake and the 50/1.8 II.

[RustyTheGeek]

I'm researching how I will use the 6D WiFi for tethered shooting and I found this write up about 6D Battery Life.  He details how he set it all up and shoots continuously every 3 seconds with WiFi and GPS active.  Wow.  Impressive!  (Internal WiFi tethered shooting was one reason I got the 6D.)

http://www.p4pictures.com/2012/12/eos-6d-battery-life-with-wifi-gps/

Quote from article...

Some hours later…

2895 pictures on a single LP-E6

I used one of my well used LP-E6 batteries for the test, it shows two green squares in the health section. I’m simply stunned to find that nearly 3,000 actuations and almost two and a half hours later the camera shut down and stopped sending files. I checked the mac, all the files up until then had transferred and had GPS info in them.

[awinphoto]

So much so, their supremacy in the SLR lens market is in fact the basis of their marketing leverage in pricing their bodies a smidge higher, and getting away with small annoyances like not including hoods even for some 1K L's (70-200L  f/4 IS for example).

Eh? My 70-200 F4 IS came complete with the hood and soft lens bag. It was back in 2010, granted......

All L lenses include a hood and case... although the pouch/case leaves a lot to be desired compared to sigma's cases that they include with their lenses...  I think lens hoods should be included in all lens purchases but what do i know... dont want to bankrupt canon =)

[Aglet]

The IQ of the 5DII wasn't the 5DII's problem.  The 5DIII fixes pretty much everything that was a problem with the 5DII - AF, frame rate, VF coverage, etc.  Sorry, but a 5DII owner who doesn't see the 5DIII as an upgrade is blind...and might see better looking through the VF of a D800.

5d2 IQ certainly was and still is a problem for many people.
Did you forget that it showed vertical striped noise patterns in low ISO midtones when it first arrived?  Striped blue skies your preference?.. 

5d3 did little to fix the IQ problem but certainly presented a much better overall camera for event shooters.  Good for them.

For those of us who want the best IQ, in preference to overall system performance, the 5d2 is a failure. It has worse (pattern) noise character than my 40D.
The 5d3 is no improvement for those who still need ultimate IQ rather than overall performance.

The 6d might actually be the viable alternative for unsatisfied 5d2 owners who don't need to pay extra for the unneeded speed and AF of the 5d3 and aren't ready or willing to move to another platform. 
I haven't yet tested it myself but from what I've gathered so far it seems the 6D's IQ does improve noticeably over the 5d2's AFA banding noise issues + it has much improved hi ISO and low light AF ability for those times it's required.

[neuroanatomist]

...for those who still need ultimate IQ rather than overall performance

For them, no dSLR (not even the D800E) will suffice. 

EDIT:  but wait, I just checked DxOMark, and the D800E has a better sensor than the Phase One IQ180.  Now I'm the one who's confused...   

[RLPhoto]

The IQ of the 5DII wasn't the 5DII's problem.  The 5DIII fixes pretty much everything that was a problem with the 5DII - AF, frame rate, VF coverage, etc.  Sorry, but a 5DII owner who doesn't see the 5DIII as an upgrade is blind...and might see better looking through the VF of a D800.

5d2 IQ certainly was and still is a problem for many people.
Did you forget that it showed vertical striped noise patterns in low ISO midtones when it first arrived?  Striped blue skies your preference?.. 

5d3 did little to fix the IQ problem but certainly presented a much better overall camera for event shooters.  Good for them.

For those of us who want the best IQ, in preference to overall system performance, the 5d2 is a failure. It has worse (pattern) noise character than my 40D.
The 5d3 is no improvement for those who still need ultimate IQ rather than overall performance.

The 6d might actually be the viable alternative for unsatisfied 5d2 owners who don't need to pay extra for the unneeded speed and AF of the 5d3 and aren't ready or willing to move to another platform. 
I haven't yet tested it myself but from what I've gathered so far it seems the 6D's IQ does improve noticeably over the 5d2's AFA banding noise issues + it has much improved hi ISO and low light AF ability for those times it's required.

Its only a problem if you miss your exposure 3 stops. 

[Aglet]

...for those who still need ultimate IQ rather than overall performance

For them, no dSLR (not even the D800E) will suffice. 

EDIT:  but wait, I just checked DxOMark, and the D800E has a better sensor than the Phase One IQ180.  Now I'm the one who's confused...   

Funny, i KNEW you were going to make a snide reference to an MF camera.

[Chuck Alaimo]

I have a canon 550d rebel and was considering the "jump" to FF.

The Canon 6d is in my budget. However the Nikon D800 is available (refurb) for $2,300.

I ask myself - why spend almost the same on the inferior 6d ? Why does canon seem to give less and charge more ?

Ypu know, I am just gonna reply to this OP without reading because --- it's really such a silly statement!!!!!   Comparing a new model to a refurb?  Then saying the trollish "Why does canon seem to give less and charge more ?"   Really man?   I have seen a few refurb and used 5dmk3's in the low 2k area!  It's a rfurb, and you know what, by the time you wait for there to be replies to this q that refurb will be bought cause the d800 is still new!!!!   Refurbs on any of these newer bodies are few and far between, and ususally scooped up by folks that know enough to know they won't be around in a few hours!!!!

Sorry if that sounds harsh, but the wording of this is so trollish...   if you had asked about the 6d vs the d600 and aren't invested in glass then we are in an actual conversation.  But this is just silly, like wondering why a used car is less expensive than a used one...

[kubelik]

Did you forget that it showed vertical striped noise patterns in low ISO midtones when it first arrived?  Striped blue skies your preference?.. 

seriously, show me how to reproduce this in actual shooting. I've never seen anything remotely like banded skies in any of my 5D Mark II shots.

[neuroanatomist]

seriously, show me how to reproduce this in actual shooting. I've never seen anything remotely like banded skies in any of my 5D Mark II shots.

I thought everyone knew. 

• Set your camera to M mode
• Point it at the sky
• From the metered exposure, reduce by 4 or more stops (note, some cameras do not properly display this on the meter in the viewfinder, so you may need to be an experienced enough photographer to calculate a 4-stop underexposure in your head)
• Take the picture
• During post-processing, raise the exposure by 4 or more stops (note, some RAW converters do not allow you to adjust exposure by that much, notably, Canon's own DPP is restricted to just 2 stops - and of course, that's by design, because Canon knows that their sensor performance breaks down when pushed by 4 EV, so they are taking steps to mask their own inadequacies...but I digress).
• Now, look at the image - you'll notice the banding

Once you know the steps, it's easy to be affected by this horribly common problem that destroys the IQ of the 5DII.  That's why I sold that piece of crap camera.  All that horrible banding in the skies when I underexposed my images by 4 stops.



Sorry, I just couldn't help myself...   

[kubelik]

Sorry, I just couldn't help myself...   

guess it's just not my preferred way of shooting, but I learn something new everyday 

[bdunbar79]

Did you forget that it showed vertical striped noise patterns in low ISO midtones when it first arrived?  Striped blue skies your preference?.. 

seriously, show me how to reproduce this in actual shooting. I've never seen anything remotely like banded skies in any of my 5D Mark II shots.

Hmm.  Me neither.

[Stichus III]

I have a canon 550d rebel and was considering the "jump" to FF.

Why does canon seem to give less and charge more ?

It is possible that Canon is cutting fewer corners than Nikon.

Fact is that Nikon put out many D800’s that could not autofocus properly. Fact is also that many D600’s have a flaw that causes the camera to spatter oil over the sensor for the first 3000 shots. Both problem’s were serious  and seemed widespread.

[meli]

I have a canon 550d rebel and was considering the "jump" to FF.

Why does canon seem to give less and charge more ?

It is possible that Canon is cutting fewer corners than Nikon.

Fact is that Nikon put out many D800’s that could not autofocus properly. Fact is also that many D600’s have a flaw that causes the camera to spatter oil over the sensor for the first 3000 shots. Both problem’s were serious  and seemed widespread.

Not really, both companies have about the same track record; AF problems with D800 & 1d3, d600spills, 5d2mirrors, Lens QC for both etc etc.

The're way more complains about overpricing in the canon forums than nikon's though.
Pattern that started a couple of years ago with the 70-200II & IS lenses i think.

[x-vision]

It is possible that Canon is cutting fewer corners than Nikon.

No.

Canon is just overpricing. That's all.

As other posters said, Canon also had issues that they did nor admit.
For example, it took them more than a year to admit the 1D3 focusing issue and provide a fix (which did not work for all, btw).
And the fix for the 'falling 5D mirror' issue was provided after the 5DII was already announced.

To their credit, Canon admitted the 5DII 'black dots' issue right away.
They did the same with the 5DIII 'light leak' issue as well.

The D600 oil/dust issue goes away after a certain number of shots (as shown by LensRentals).
Still, Nikon customers are in their full right to ask Nikon to admit and address the issue.

Overall, both companies have a history of unforeseen issues; no corner cutting.