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Author Topic: 70-200 IS2 + Canon 1.4x teleconverter question  (Read 3941 times)

skitron

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70-200 IS2 + Canon 1.4x teleconverter question
« on: January 22, 2013, 09:19:15 PM »
I have the 70-200 IS2 and just ordered the Canon 1.4x teleconverter, should be here next week some time. I looked at the chart shots of this combo at http://www.the-digital-picture.com/ and liked what I saw. However, the shots are only at 200mm plus the converter. I read the info on the converter and it says its only compatible with 135mm and longer.

So my question is what to expect out of this pairing when zoomed under native 135mm? I am assuming it will not be very good on the short end. Is that what owners of this combo have found? Or is it still good IQ even on the short end with the converter?

Of course I'll find out for myself next week, but knowing what to expect will help me evaluate if its a good copy, so thanks in advance for sharing what you know.
5D3, 70-200 f/2.8L IS II, 100L, 24-105L, Sigma 50/1.4 DG, Canon TC 1.4x III

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70-200 IS2 + Canon 1.4x teleconverter question
« on: January 22, 2013, 09:19:15 PM »

RMC33

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Re: 70-200 IS2 + Canon 1.4x teleconverter question
« Reply #1 on: January 22, 2013, 10:01:55 PM »
I have the 70-200 IS2 and just ordered the Canon 1.4x teleconverter, should be here next week some time. I looked at the chart shots of this combo at http://www.the-digital-picture.com/ and liked what I saw. However, the shots are only at 200mm plus the converter. I read the info on the converter and it says its only compatible with 135mm and longer.

So my question is what to expect out of this pairing when zoomed under native 135mm? I am assuming it will not be very good on the short end. Is that what owners of this combo have found? Or is it still good IQ even on the short end with the converter?

Of course I'll find out for myself next week, but knowing what to expect will help me evaluate if its a good copy, so thanks in advance for sharing what you know.

For the converter being only compatible, it is with Lenses 135mm and longer (I THINK it works with some of the TSE and other specialty lenses). The lens + TC becomes a 100-280mm. The IQ should stay the same throughout the zoom range with a little loss (depending on if MkII or III).

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Re: 70-200 IS2 + Canon 1.4x teleconverter question
« Reply #2 on: January 22, 2013, 10:57:46 PM »
I have the 70-200 IS2 and just ordered the Canon 1.4x teleconverter, should be here next week some time. I looked at the chart shots of this combo at http://www.the-digital-picture.com/ and liked what I saw. However, the shots are only at 200mm plus the converter. I read the info on the converter and it says its only compatible with 135mm and longer.

So my question is what to expect out of this pairing when zoomed under native 135mm? I am assuming it will not be very good on the short end. Is that what owners of this combo have found? Or is it still good IQ even on the short end with the converter?

Of course I'll find out for myself next week, but knowing what to expect will help me evaluate if its a good copy, so thanks in advance for sharing what you know.

For the converter being only compatible, it is with Lenses 135mm and longer (I THINK it works with some of the TSE and other specialty lenses). The lens + TC becomes a 100-280mm. The IQ should stay the same throughout the zoom range with a little loss (depending on if MkII or III).

Sort of.  Traditionally, Canon TCs are compatible with zooms starting with 70-xxx and with primes at 135 and above.  That said, people have used TCs on the TS-Es and TDP has reported that Canon TCs can be used on the 70-300L and the 28-300L past a certain focal length.

The 70-200 f/2.8 L IS II works well with TCs and it can be used over the entire range as RMC33 noted.  Just be sure to AFMA the lens + TC combination (i.e. don't expect the AFMA for the lens to be carried to the combo).  The bare lens will be better than the TC, but the 1.4x gives good results compared to the bare lens that you won't notice much of a difference.

neuroanatomist

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Re: 70-200 IS2 + Canon 1.4x teleconverter question
« Reply #3 on: January 22, 2013, 11:01:34 PM »
A 70-200mm f/2.8 lens with a 1.4x TC becomes a 98-280mm f/4 lens.  With a 2x TC, it becomes a 140-400mm f/5.6 lens.  A TC doesn't change the minimum focus distance, so it increases the maximum magnification of the lens by the TC factor (1.4x or 2x).
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wickidwombat

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Re: 70-200 IS2 + Canon 1.4x teleconverter question
« Reply #4 on: January 22, 2013, 11:20:53 PM »
i think you are confusing what the canon brand TC will phyisically fit onto with its optical compatability

for example the kenko 1.4Tc can be used and works perfectly on the 28-300 on a 1D body with f8 AF
however the canon 1.4TC cannot physically be mounted to this lens as the canon TC have the rubber shaft which gets inserted into the back of the host lens. the 28-300 like many non tele lenses has glass much closer to the back
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skitron

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Re: 70-200 IS2 + Canon 1.4x teleconverter question
« Reply #5 on: January 23, 2013, 09:41:18 AM »
i think you are confusing what the canon brand TC will phyisically fit onto with its optical compatability.

Not confused, just trying to understand what it is that Canon is trying to convey in their info. The reason I bring it up is because the Kenko Pro 1.4x specifically states that for optical reasons their converter is not recommended with lenses under 100mm focal length. I tried it with a 50mm and saw exactly why they made the statement. LOL, I tried it with a 100mm and wondered why they didn'y say "not compatible with under 200mm" instead...though better than with the 50mm it wasn't very good with a 100 imo.

So just trying to read between the lines of what exactly Canon is trying to convey with the language about "not compatible with primes under 135mm". I realize there is a mechanical component to the incomaptibility due to the protrusion, but also am wondering is there an optical component as well like the Kenko that would come into play with the 70-200 short end.

I suppose a better way to ask my question is "I notice very little, if any IQ differences throughout the zoom range on the 70-200 IS2. Is this also going to be true with the 70-200 IS2 + TC 1.4x 3 combination? Or is the combo not as good on the short end as it is on the long end?"
« Last Edit: January 23, 2013, 09:52:14 AM by skitron »
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neuroanatomist

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Re: 70-200 IS2 + Canon 1.4x teleconverter question
« Reply #6 on: January 23, 2013, 10:59:12 AM »
I suppose a better way to ask my question is "I notice very little, if any IQ differences throughout the zoom range on the 70-200 IS2. Is this also going to be true with the 70-200 IS2 + TC 1.4x 3 combination? Or is the combo not as good on the short end as it is on the long end?"

The combo is good throughout the range.  Here's a test at ~100mm, that includes both the 70-200 II + 1.4x and the bare 70-200 II set to ~100mm. 
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Re: 70-200 IS2 + Canon 1.4x teleconverter question
« Reply #6 on: January 23, 2013, 10:59:12 AM »

skitron

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Re: 70-200 IS2 + Canon 1.4x teleconverter question
« Reply #7 on: January 23, 2013, 03:08:38 PM »
The combo is good throughout the range.  Here's a test at ~100mm, that includes both the 70-200 II + 1.4x and the bare 70-200 II set to ~100mm.

Many thanks!
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wickidwombat

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Re: 70-200 IS2 + Canon 1.4x teleconverter question
« Reply #8 on: January 24, 2013, 12:47:18 AM »
i think you are confusing what the canon brand TC will phyisically fit onto with its optical compatability.

Not confused, just trying to understand what it is that Canon is trying to convey in their info. The reason I bring it up is because the Kenko Pro 1.4x specifically states that for optical reasons their converter is not recommended with lenses under 100mm focal length. I tried it with a 50mm and saw exactly why they made the statement. LOL, I tried it with a 100mm and wondered why they didn'y say "not compatible with under 200mm" instead...though better than with the 50mm it wasn't very good with a 100 imo.

So just trying to read between the lines of what exactly Canon is trying to convey with the language about "not compatible with primes under 135mm". I realize there is a mechanical component to the incomaptibility due to the protrusion, but also am wondering is there an optical component as well like the Kenko that would come into play with the 70-200 short end.

I suppose a better way to ask my question is "I notice very little, if any IQ differences throughout the zoom range on the 70-200 IS2. Is this also going to be true with the 70-200 IS2 + TC 1.4x 3 combination? Or is the combo not as good on the short end as it is on the long end?"

which 100? i think its fine with the 100L to be honest i can't see any reason to use it with any lens wider than this anyway
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skitron

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Re: 70-200 IS2 + Canon 1.4x teleconverter question
« Reply #9 on: January 24, 2013, 01:38:37 PM »
which 100? i think its fine with the 100L to be honest i can't see any reason to use it with any lens wider than this anyway

I wouldn't see a use for it with shorter lenses either, I just wanted to see what Kenko was refering to when they said "not good for under 100mm".

That said, does the Canon 1.4x 3 with it's protrusion physically fit on a 100L? If so, looking forward to trying it out in macro mode when the lens gets back from service.
5D3, 70-200 f/2.8L IS II, 100L, 24-105L, Sigma 50/1.4 DG, Canon TC 1.4x III

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Re: 70-200 IS2 + Canon 1.4x teleconverter question
« Reply #10 on: January 24, 2013, 01:48:19 PM »
which 100? i think its fine with the 100L to be honest i can't see any reason to use it with any lens wider than this anyway

I wouldn't see a use for it with shorter lenses either, I just wanted to see what Kenko was refering to when they said "not good for under 100mm".

That said, does the Canon 1.4x 3 with it's protrusion physically fit on a 100L? If so, looking forward to trying it out in macro mode when the lens gets back from service.

No, the Canon 1.4x III does not fit the 100L.

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Re: 70-200 IS2 + Canon 1.4x teleconverter question
« Reply #11 on: January 24, 2013, 04:17:08 PM »
All TC Manufacturers recommend focal lengths of 100mm or longer for their TC's.  I believe its due to the better optics of telephoto lenses.  A TC magnifies any flaws in a lens, so using one with a shorter focal length (assuming it fits) may result in images of lower quality.
 
A exception is the Canon Tilt-Shift lenses which have a very high quality and work very well with TC's.
I wish there were a TC that worked with the 100mmL.  Canon TC's won't physically fit, and the Kenko unit fits, but locks up a 5D MK III when used with the 100L.  You have to remove the camera battery to get the TC working again after that.  The Kenko/100L combination does work with most other bodies though.

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Re: 70-200 IS2 + Canon 1.4x teleconverter question
« Reply #12 on: January 24, 2013, 10:02:14 PM »
which 100? i think its fine with the 100L to be honest i can't see any reason to use it with any lens wider than this anyway

I wouldn't see a use for it with shorter lenses either, I just wanted to see what Kenko was refering to when they said "not good for under 100mm".

That said, does the Canon 1.4x 3 with it's protrusion physically fit on a 100L? If so, looking forward to trying it out in macro mode when the lens gets back from service.
it will if you put a 12mm or 25mm extension tube in between the TC and the lens (which is an even bigger benefit for macro anyway but it wont fit straight up

my 100L and kenko 300DGX dont lock up my mk3s
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Re: 70-200 IS2 + Canon 1.4x teleconverter question
« Reply #12 on: January 24, 2013, 10:02:14 PM »

skitron

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Re: 70-200 IS2 + Canon 1.4x teleconverter question
« Reply #13 on: January 25, 2013, 02:22:57 PM »
which 100? i think its fine with the 100L to be honest i can't see any reason to use it with any lens wider than this anyway

I wouldn't see a use for it with shorter lenses either, I just wanted to see what Kenko was refering to when they said "not good for under 100mm".

That said, does the Canon 1.4x 3 with it's protrusion physically fit on a 100L? If so, looking forward to trying it out in macro mode when the lens gets back from service.
it will if you put a 12mm or 25mm extension tube in between the TC and the lens (which is an even bigger benefit for macro anyway but it wont fit straight up

my 100L and kenko 300DGX dont lock up my mk3s

Thanks for the info, I'll give that a try.
5D3, 70-200 f/2.8L IS II, 100L, 24-105L, Sigma 50/1.4 DG, Canon TC 1.4x III

skitron

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Re: 70-200 IS2 + Canon 1.4x teleconverter question
« Reply #14 on: January 29, 2013, 08:01:21 PM »
Just received the Canon 1.4x TC3 and been trying it with the 70-200 IS2 and have to agree, the combo is very good thru out the zoom range. Pretty amazing just how little the IQ degrades...as in probably not detectable in most blind A/B's of pictures of actual subject matter.

It's the same thing with the 200L f/2.8. Having this kind of IQ @280 f/4 in such a compact, light weight, black package warrants keeping the 200L even though I have the 70-200. Especially if I add a crop body and something this small shoots at 448 equivalent.

Glad I sprung for the Canon piece, nice build, guaranteed compatibility, registers the combo for AFMA. Had some B&H bucks from buying the 70-200 so between that and the current rebate, scored this for $335.  :) :)

Thanks again for fielding my questions and what to expect from it.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2013, 03:38:16 PM by skitron »
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Re: 70-200 IS2 + Canon 1.4x teleconverter question
« Reply #14 on: January 29, 2013, 08:01:21 PM »