April 16, 2014, 10:56:19 AM

Author Topic: Chinese aftermarket guns  (Read 4954 times)

dlleno

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Re: Chinese aftermarket guns
« Reply #15 on: March 06, 2013, 06:31:02 PM »
You're raising an important point, by implication at least.  The value proposition of a $300 Phottix is a bit different from that of a $167 Yongnuo.  At $300 for a 580ex ii-like featureset I think I'd rather have a 580ex ii.  At least the 580 can be repaired/refurbished, I assume. 

There is a price threshold which makes the China-based flash solutions attractive compared to the latest Canon solution.  For me, that threshold is a bit lower than $300.  That said, the Phottex featureset (including their triggers) is attractive, to be sure, which means that your decision point may be more about features than price.  If you value the Phottix featureset and the ability to update the flash in the future, then your decision is pretty much  made -- especially if you are already invested in their triggers and have confidence in the promise of updates.  The assumption here is that investing $300 today in an  updatable Phottix flash will assure compatibiilty with future Canon cameras yet to be announced and which may introduce new things, i.e. a new ETTL version.    that, or it assumes that bug fixes are addressed via firmware updates.  I don't have any experience with Phottix, but something tells me that the inclusion of a USB port is more about bug fixes than adding new functionality to pace the market.  There's no incentive, unless they charge money for firmware updates, for them to add new features to existing hardware.  i would think they would rather sell more hardware . In the Phottix model, you pay more up front and expect hardware quality to be commensurate with a long term investment.  When you update you get new life out of the same hardware.  Kind of like putting new ink into a worn print head. 

The Yongnuo model is different.  Future proofing comes in the form of buying a new flash (the Yongnuos are just over half the cost of the Phottix).  Yongnuo's quality model emphasizes initial quality and hardware repalcement under warranty, instead of firmware updates.   You pay about half the cost up front, compared to Phottix (a third of the cost compared to Canon) leaving dollars on the table to invest in new hardware at a later date.  When you update, you buy new hardware.  kind of like replacing your ink cartridge instead of re-filling it. 

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Re: Chinese aftermarket guns
« Reply #15 on: March 06, 2013, 06:31:02 PM »

Rienzphotoz

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Re: Chinese aftermarket guns
« Reply #16 on: March 07, 2013, 09:58:20 AM »
Sadly I expect Canon's next move will be some sort of digital key authorization mechanism  to lock down the hot-shoe ETTL and HSS communications, preventing the chinese from reverse-engineering their stuff and selling  at 1/4 the cost.   
I thought Yonguo already has HSS
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sandymandy

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Re: Chinese aftermarket guns
« Reply #17 on: March 07, 2013, 11:53:34 AM »
Some Yongnuos have HSS, yes.

dlleno

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Re: Chinese aftermarket guns
« Reply #18 on: March 07, 2013, 12:12:05 PM »
Sadly I expect Canon's next move will be some sort of digital key authorization mechanism  to lock down the hot-shoe ETTL and HSS communications, preventing the chinese from reverse-engineering their stuff and selling  at 1/4 the cost.   
I thought Yonguo already has HSS

Some do, yes.   I don't follow your point yet can you explain what you're driving at?

Rienzphotoz

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Re: Chinese aftermarket guns
« Reply #19 on: March 08, 2013, 02:48:08 AM »
Sadly I expect Canon's next move will be some sort of digital key authorization mechanism  to lock down the hot-shoe ETTL and HSS communications, preventing the chinese from reverse-engineering their stuff and selling  at 1/4 the cost.   
I thought Yonguo already has HSS

Some do, yes.   I don't follow your point yet can you explain what you're driving at?
Not making any point, just checking if one of the Yonguo's had HSS
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Wildfire

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Re: Chinese aftermarket guns
« Reply #20 on: March 09, 2013, 04:02:02 PM »
You're raising an important point, by implication at least.  The value proposition of a $300 Phottix is a bit different from that of a $167 Yongnuo.  At $300 for a 580ex ii-like featureset I think I'd rather have a 580ex ii.  At least the 580 can be repaired/refurbished, I assume. 

There is a price threshold which makes the China-based flash solutions attractive compared to the latest Canon solution.  For me, that threshold is a bit lower than $300.  That said, the Phottex featureset (including their triggers) is attractive, to be sure, which means that your decision point may be more about features than price.  If you value the Phottix featureset and the ability to update the flash in the future, then your decision is pretty much  made -- especially if you are already invested in their triggers and have confidence in the promise of updates.  The assumption here is that investing $300 today in an  updatable Phottix flash will assure compatibiilty with future Canon cameras yet to be announced and which may introduce new things, i.e. a new ETTL version.    that, or it assumes that bug fixes are addressed via firmware updates.  I don't have any experience with Phottix, but something tells me that the inclusion of a USB port is more about bug fixes than adding new functionality to pace the market.  There's no incentive, unless they charge money for firmware updates, for them to add new features to existing hardware.  i would think they would rather sell more hardware . In the Phottix model, you pay more up front and expect hardware quality to be commensurate with a long term investment.  When you update you get new life out of the same hardware.  Kind of like putting new ink into a worn print head. 

The Yongnuo model is different.  Future proofing comes in the form of buying a new flash (the Yongnuos are just over half the cost of the Phottix).  Yongnuo's quality model emphasizes initial quality and hardware repalcement under warranty, instead of firmware updates.   You pay about half the cost up front, compared to Phottix (a third of the cost compared to Canon) leaving dollars on the table to invest in new hardware at a later date.  When you update, you buy new hardware.  kind of like replacing your ink cartridge instead of re-filling it.

I doubt Phottix would add features via the USB port -- my guess is they will only use it to update the flash to be compatible with new cameras/triggers.

However, Phottix stuff is durable and reliable, and I believe their customer service is good as well (though I've never had to test that out for myself). I trust the Phottix brand to the point where if a Phottix flash's features match a Canon flash but at a lower price, I would just buy the Phottix and not feel like I was settling for an inferior product.

Whereas with Yongnuo, I'd prefer to have the Canon if I could afford it.

smithy

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Re: Chinese aftermarket guns
« Reply #21 on: March 09, 2013, 04:36:57 PM »
I've never actually owned a Canon branded speedlite - just a Sigma EF-500 DG Super and the Yongnuo 568EX (the one with HSS).

The Sigma feels like a cheap plastic toy next to the Yongnuo.

If I were shooting weddings professionally I'd probably buy Canon speedlites, but as I'm merely a serious hobbyist Canon would have to drop their prices by at least 50% to entice me to buy their flashes.  I just can't see the value proposition of the 600EX-RT at nearly 5 times the price of the 568EX (in my country anyway).
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Re: Chinese aftermarket guns
« Reply #21 on: March 09, 2013, 04:36:57 PM »

Jel_55

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Re: Chinese aftermarket guns
« Reply #22 on: March 12, 2013, 09:49:42 PM »
I personally can't speak about the Yongnuo, but until recently I used to have a couple of Meike 580. Basically Chinese 580ex copies but with most of the advance functionality removed (and reduced power it seems).

Like a few other people, I initialy just couldn't rationalise the cost difference between these flash units and Canon's.

But, in my personal opinion, the old adage "you get what you pay for" is especially pertinent when it comes to flash guns. The Mieke’s I had were horribly inconsistent and unreliable. They rarely worked with other third party radio triggers (in this instance Pixel Kings). I got phenomenally frustrated with the whole set up and nearly lost interest in flash photography as I found the kit so problematic.

In the end, I sold the lot, saved up the extra cash and bought myself the new 600EX-RT and ST-E3-RT. There is now no pain or anguish – things just work everytime.

It seems from the forum that others have had better success than I with third party flash equipment. But from my experience, my conclusion was simple - putting a third party flashgun on my 5d Mk III, was like adding a luggage-roof-rack to an Aston Martin – cheap and does the job, but looks ugly and you’d never know what state your luggage (photos) would end up in and you’d always feel like it’s ruining/limiting the performance of the car (camera).

Not the greatest analogy but hopefully you get the idea!
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bycostello

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Re: Chinese aftermarket guns
« Reply #23 on: March 12, 2013, 11:40:44 PM »
i like my nissin ones... but not as good as recycle time as me canon ones

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Re: Chinese aftermarket guns
« Reply #23 on: March 12, 2013, 11:40:44 PM »