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Author Topic: 100mm macro L on a 7d  (Read 9968 times)

azezal

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Re: 100mm macro L on a 7d
« Reply #30 on: December 13, 2012, 12:07:21 PM »

I'm not literally 10 years away from ff its more like 6-7 and I'm bitten by the L bug,but all your replies have been really helpful please tell me what you guys think about the 50 1.4 and 100 f2 setup or suggest a similar one I constantly see myself shooting between the 100-250 range


As you alreadave 50 f1.8, given your preferences I see no point in upgrading to the 50 f1.4 - the latter may be more robust, but I doubt you'll notice much difference, if any, in the photos you take.  If you're mostly shooting 100-250 AND want/need a fast lens, you may want to get a 135 L instead of 50 f1.4 + 100 f2 (it costs about the same as the 100L); it's a stunningly good lens.  Or consider a non-IS 70-200 f2.8 or, if you want/need IS and are willing to compromise on speed, the 70-200 f4 IS.
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Re: 100mm macro L on a 7d
« Reply #30 on: December 13, 2012, 12:07:21 PM »

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Re: 100mm macro L on a 7d
« Reply #31 on: December 13, 2012, 12:24:05 PM »

Though I have nothing my 7d has mounted several fantastic lenses including the 200 f2,of all lenses I liked the 100mm the mistake have constantly been using my friend's 100 L(i can probably compose with my eyes closed)

Since you have used and like the 100L, trust your own judgement, its what counts.  Each person views things according to his method of photography, but its what you like that should determine what you buy.

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Re: 100mm macro L on a 7d
« Reply #32 on: December 13, 2012, 01:27:56 PM »
Hi everyone,I have been using a 7d for about a year now and I know its limitations quite well.I am sure ff is the way to go for the future though I am pretty sure a 6d isn't the answer for a 7d user (atleast me).

 I'm 17, still a student and 10 years away from a ff upgrade the 100 macro might as well be my last lens so I was wondering if its the right choice for a portrait/lowish light lens with a macro bonus.or should I consider something else within that budget (not the non l version I'm pretty sure about that too)

P.S- I  love taking shots in low light and light painting (i know, 7d is a perfect camera for that) so I am pretty frustrated on being limited to bright daylight shots so any tips are welcome,after all in 10 years point and shoots will have better ISO performance so i'll make the switch then

Thanks in advance

P.P.S- this is my first post ,really interested on what neuro has to say

The 100L is an excellent lens, but....

First of all, macro shooting doesn't sound very high on your priority list. You seem more concerned about shooting low light, light painting and portraitts. Second, the 100L is the single most expensive lens in a focal length and category that's stuffed full of excellent alternatives (including other Canons). Third, I'm not really a big fan of using a macro for portraiture... a macro lens can be too sharp, too "clinical". Not everyone is an 18 year old model with perfect skin and a $200 an hour makeup artist prepping them for the shoot. Finally, for your purposes the IS of the 100L is pretty much unnecessary. What you want to shoot either can be done fine handheld without IS or you'll be putting the camera and lens on a tripod anyway, so likely won't find it necessary. IS is of limited value for high magnifcation macro work, anyway. It's of the most use with non-macro uses of the lens. And there you are "limited" to f2.8 with most macro lenses.

Finally, 100L definitely wouldn't be my choice as my only lens... on a crop camera or anything else.   

For portraiture, you would likely be better served with an 85/1.8 or 100/2. The 135L is superb, too... but fairly long focal length for portraiture on a crop camera like the 7D. If you still want some macro capabilities for occasional use, you can add macro extension tubes (the Kenko set is probably the best value/quality overall) to any of these lenses or even to your existing 50/1.8.

If you really want a macro lens, plan to shoot a lot of macro shots... Consider other possibilities.... many of them half the cost or less than the 100L...

Canon EF-S 60/2.8  IS
Canon 100/2.8 USM (non-L, non-IS, build quality is identical to 180L macro, but the 100mm focuses faster)
Tamron 60/2.0 (the biggest aperture macro lens currently avail., might be more useful for portraits)
Sigma 70/2.8
Tamron 90/2.8
Tokina 100/2.8
Sigma 105/2.8 OS

Didn't mention the 50mm macro lenses, since they duplicate focal length you already have. The 60mm and 70mm lenses might be too close to the 50mm focal length, too, for someone with so few lenses to work with.

The two Canon lenses listed above and the 100L have USM and the Siggy 105 has HSM, which help with focus speed. The other lenses will be slower focusing. However, even with faster types of focus mechanisms, no macro lens will give ultra fast focus that some non-macro lenses can offer. The reason is that a macro lens has to move a focus group all the way from infinity to 1:1 magnification, far more than a non-macro lens. Macro lenses are designed for precision, anyway, not for focus speed. Some macro lenses have a focus limiter that can help, too. On the other hand, the lenses you have now are not USM and not all that fast focusing anyway... so you might be just fine with these other lenses' focus speeds.  Macro and much portraiture don't generally demand all that fast focus, anyway.

Don't be an "L-coholic". A red stripe and an L designation don't necessarily mean all that much. There are great lenses that are not Ls and there have been a few less than stellar L-series. Sure, most are fine lenses... but some are virtually no different. According to Canon, all that the red stripe and L designation means is that the lens is: 1. compatible with all EOS cameras past, present and future (thus, no EF-S lens will ever be an L, no matter how good it is). 2. Built to the highest current standards and with the best possible materials. 3. Incorporates some form of exotic lens element(s).

There have been some superb lenses that simply didn't need exotic glass to do their job very, very well, so never got a red stripe painted on them. For example, the 100/2.8 USM macro is identical in build quality and functionality to the 180/3.5L... even better in some ways (it's 2/3 stop faster and focuses faster, so is probably more useful for non-macro purposes). Yet it doesn't have exotic glass in it, so it's not an L. Or, look at the TS-E lenses... The original 24/3.5 is an L, as are the 17/4L and 24/3.5L II. But the 45/2.8 and 90/2.8 are not, though they are virtually identical build quality, image quality and functionality. Again, they just don't need exotic glass.

Finally, an L might not be the best choice for someone for a number of reasons... consider the 50/1.2L and the 85/1.2L... both spectacular lenses. But they are somewhat specialized. They are not only more far more expensive, bigger and heavier, they are also slower focusing than far less expensive 50/1.4 and 85/1.8. These two Ls are designed with longer throw, slower focus purposefully... they emphasize precision over speed (especially the 85mm). That makes them superb portrait lenses, but perhaps a bit less capable for sports or any other sort of action photography.

Some of my lenses are Ls... Others are not. In general, I don't care whether a lens has a red stripe painted on it or not. I consider the features of the lens, it's general utility and how it meets my needs. That's what decides for me whether or not I buy it and add it to my kit. I don't really care what color Canon paints it (within reason) or what designations they put on it.

Good luck with your decision. I think you need to do more research and keep looking. The 100L caught your eye because you've had a chance to use it... but if you have stated your intended purposes well, might not be the best lens for you. Especially if you end up with it as your only lens, selling your others to purchase it. There are far cheaper macro lenses that can do macro very nearly as well, and other lenses more suitable for your intended purposes. So don't get stuck on the 100L as your only option.   

P.S. You might be interested to know that the 7D has a special feature just for macro shooting, when it's used with Canon USM macro lenses. Canon has not promoted or documented it very well, but when fitted with the EF-S 60mm, either of the EF 100mm with USM, or the EF 180/3.5L and focused close, in AI Servo the camera will increase subject distance sampling to 4X as frequently as usual. This is automatic, not something you can set, and only works with those particular lenses. And it only does this in AI Servo focus mode, which is a fairly unusual focusing mode to use with macro photography (I usually focus manually, sometimes use One Shot, but had been using a pair of 7Ds for three years before I even heard about this special macro focusing feature... don't know why Canon hasn't mentioned in the manual at all or elsewhere more often). I suspect the 5D Mark III and 1DX also have this feature, but don't know for certain. In effect, this feature acts a little like IS along a third axis (up/down axis and side-to-side axis of movement are handled by a normal lens-based IS, on lenses that have IS... this feature provides sort of a nearer/farther axis of correction.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2012, 01:52:16 PM by amfoto1 »

azezal

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Re: 100mm macro L on a 7d
« Reply #33 on: December 14, 2012, 04:38:34 AM »
Hi everyone,I have been using a 7d for about a year now and I know its limitations quite well.I am sure ff is the way to go for the future though I am pretty sure a 6d isn't the answer for a 7d user (atleast me).

 I'm 17, still a student and 10 years away from a ff upgrade the 100 macro might as well be my last lens so I was wondering if its the right choice for a portraith light lens with a macro bonus.or should I consider something else within that budget (not the non l version I'm pretty sure about that too)

P.S- I  love taking shots in low light and light painting (i know, 7d is a perfect camera for that) so I am pretty frustrated on being limited to bright daylight shots so any tips are welcome,after all in 10 years point and shoots will have better ISO performance so i'll make the switch then

Thanks in advance

P.P.S- this is my first post ,really interested on what neuro has to say

Thanks for the advice I am almost convinced I don't need to buy the 100 L and am currently debating a 50 1.4/1.8 with a 100 f/2 setup
The 100L is an excellent lens, but....

First of all, macro shooting doesn't sound very high on your priority list. You seem more concerned about shooting low light, light painting and portraitts. Second, the 100L is the single most expensive lens in a focal length and category that's stuffed full of excellent alternatives (including other Canons). Third, I'm not really a big fan of using a macro for portraiture... a macro lens can be too sharp, too "clinical". Not everyone is an 18 year old model with perfect skin and a $200 an hour makeup artist prepping them for the shoot. Finally, for your purposes the IS of the 100L is pretty much unnecessary. What you want to shoot either can be done fine handheld without IS or you'll be putting the camera and lens on a tripod anyway, so likely won't find it necessary. IS is of limited value for high magnifcation macro work, anyway. It's of the most use with non-macro uses of the lens. And there you are "limited" to f2.8 with most macro lenses.

Finally, 100L definitely wouldn't be my choice as my only lens... on a crop camera or anything else.   

For portraiture, you would likely be better served with an 85/1.8 or 100/2. The 135L is superb, too... but fairly long focal length for portraiture on a crop camera like the 7D. If you still want some macro capabilities for occasional use, you can add macro extension tubes (the Kenko set is probably the best value/quality overall) to any of these lenses or even to your existing 50/1.8.

If you really want a macro lens, plan to shoot a lot of macro shots... Consider other possibilities.... many of them half the cost or less than the 100L...

Canon EF-S 60/2.8  IS
Canon 100/2.8 USM (non-L, non-IS, build quality is identical to 180L macro, but the 100mm focuses faster)
Tamron 60/2.0 (the biggest aperture macro lens currently avail., might be more useful for portraits)
Sigma 70/2.8
Tamron 90/2.8
Tokina 100/2.8
Sigma 105/2.8 OS

Didn't mention the 50mm macro lenses, since they duplicate focal length you already have. The 60mm and 70mm lenses might be too close to the 50mm focal length, too, for someone with so few lenses to work with.

The two Canon lenses listed above and the 100L have USM and the Siggy 105 has HSM, which help with focus speed. The other lenses will be slower focusing. However, even with faster types of focus mechanisms, no macro lens will give ultra fast focus that some non-macro lenses can offer. The reason is that a macro lens has to move a focus group all the way from infinity to 1:1 magnification, far more than a non-macro lens. Macro lenses are designed for precision, anyway, not for focus speed. Some macro lenses have a focus limiter that can help, too. On the other hand, the lenses you have now are not USM and not all that fast focusing anyway... so you might be just fine with these other lenses' focus speeds.  Macro and much portraiture don't generally demand all that fast focus, anyway.

Don't be an "L-coholic". A red stripe and an L designation don't necessarily mean all that much. There are great lenses that are not Ls and there have been a few less than stellar L-series. Sure, most are fine lenses... but some are virtually no different. According to Canon, all that the red stripe and L designation means is that the lens is: 1. compatible with all EOS cameras past, present and future (thus, no EF-S lens will ever be an L, no matter how good it is). 2. Built to the highest current standards and with the best possible materials. 3. Incorporates some form of exotic lens element(s).

There have been some superb lenses that simply didn't need exotic glass to do their job very, very well, so never got a red stripe painted on them. For example, the 100/2.8 USM macro is identical in build quality and functionality to the 180/3.5L... even better in some ways (it's 2/3 stop faster and focuses faster, so is probably more useful for non-macro purposes). Yet it doesn't have exotic glass in it, so it's not an L. Or, look at the TS-E lenses... The original 24/3.5 is an L, as are the 17/4L and 24/3.5L II. But the 45/2.8 and 90/2.8 are not, though they are virtually identical build quality, image quality and functionality. Again, they just don't need exotic glass.

Finally, an L might not be the best choice for someone for a number of reasons... consider the 50/1.2L and the 85/1.2L... both spectacular lenses. But they are somewhat specialized. They are not only more far more expensive, bigger and heavier, they are also slower focusing than far less expensive 50/1.4 and 85/1.8. These two Ls are designed with longer throw, slower focus purposefully... they emphasize precision over speed (especially the 85mm). That makes them superb portrait lenses, but perhaps a bit less capable for sports or any other sort of action photography.

Some of my lenses are Ls... Others are not. In general, I don't care whether a lens has a red stripe painted on it or not. I consider the features of the lens, it's general utility and how it meets my needs. That's what decides for me whether or not I buy it and add it to my kit. I don't really care what color Canon paints it (within reason) or what designations they put on it.

Good luck with your decision. I think you need to do more research and keep looking. The 100L caught your eye because you've had a chance to use it... but if you have stated your intended purposes well, might not be the best lens for you. Especially if you end up with it as your only lens, selling your others to purchase it. There are far cheaper macro lenses that can do macro very nearly as well, and other lenses more suitable for your intended purposes. So don't get stuck on the 100L as your only option.   

P.S. You might be interested to know that the 7D has a special feature just for macro shooting, when it's used with Canon USM macro lenses. Canon has not promoted or documented it very well, but when fitted with the EF-S 60mm, either of the EF 100mm with USM, or the EF 180/3.5L and focused close, in AI Servo the camera will increase subject distance sampling to 4X as frequently as usual. This is automatic, not something you can set, and only works with those particular lenses. And it only does this in AI Servo focus mode, which is a fairly unusual focusing mode to use with macro photography (I usually focus manually, sometimes use One Shot, but had been using a pair of 7Ds for three years before I even heard about this special macro focusing feature... don't know why Canon hasn't mentioned in the manual at all or elsewhere more often). I suspect the 5D Mark III and 1DX also have this feature, but don't know for certain. In effect, this feature acts a little like IS along a third axis (up/down axis and side-to-side axis of movement are handled by a normal lens-based IS, on lenses that have IS... this feature provides sort of a nearer/farther axis of correction.

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Re: 100mm macro L on a 7d
« Reply #34 on: December 16, 2012, 04:47:36 AM »
Personally, I kind of like the 50 1.8, that lens has to be the best bang for the buck of any dslr lens from any company, and it is so inexpensive that selling it is more trouble than what you would get for it.

As to the 100L, I find that when greatly changing the focus distance, no matter what the distance switch is set for, you have to manually tweak to get it close, but then autofocus takes over and it tracks well. It tracks butterflies in flight WAY better than the non L version.... I like the IS for handheld macro work, nowhere near as good as using a tripod, but sometime a tripod is not an option.

I have used the 100L for portraits of musicians in poorly lit bars and got some wonderful shots, but I was really wishing I had the 5DII with me as the better performance at higher ISO makes more difference than a faster lens would have made.... It's got to be at least 2 stops better..... And the 6D and the 5DIII are even better, but beyond my current budget.
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Re: 100mm macro L on a 7d
« Reply #35 on: December 16, 2012, 05:10:46 AM »
Personally, I kind of like the 50 1.8, that lens has to be the best bang for the buck of any dslr lens from any company

I've also got the 50/1.8 but never use it because it's has such a crappy build quality and a very loud af I feel like it'd be the 80s again ... for shallow dof or low light shooting (small prints only because of very mediocre sharpness) it might do - but I'd everyone to "try before buy" if spending a little more $$$ isn't worth it.

I have used the 100L for portraits of musicians in poorly lit bars and got some wonderful shots, but I was really wishing I had the 5DII with me as the better performance at higher ISO makes more difference than a faster lens would have made.

+1 ... f2.8 on current least on crop simply isn't enough for dim light shooting esp. when something is moving, the whole f2.8 religion only makes some sense when on full frame with higher iso capability and esp. a f2.8-tuned af system like on the 5d3 ... for crop only fast primes wide open reach accaptable iso values.

azezal

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Re: 100mm macro L on a 7d
« Reply #36 on: December 16, 2012, 10:46:43 AM »
Sorry amfoto1 I wrote a long reply and all it displayed was than of thanks

Guess I won't be getting the 100L after all ,got my eye on the sigma 35 1.4 doubt I'll get that either :(

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Re: 100mm macro L on a 7d
« Reply #36 on: December 16, 2012, 10:46:43 AM »

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Re: 100mm macro L on a 7d
« Reply #37 on: February 02, 2013, 06:19:00 PM »
Just bought the 100mm 2.8 L Macro for my 5Dmkii. It's too much fun.

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Re: 100mm macro L on a 7d
« Reply #38 on: February 04, 2013, 10:02:37 PM »
Everyone is happy to recommend their favourite lens. No one mentions or cares about the cost of filters. The 100 L
Macro IS USM is great on my 7D. At 67mm thread mount, my filters go on my 70-200 F4 IS USM and my 17-85 F4-5.6
IS USM Zooms so no need for me to duplicate filters or buy step up rings. All reviews I read of 7D said you need good glass. I was pleasantly surprised to find my 17-85 worked just fine. I bought a used 50 mm 1.8 nifty fifty Mark l so my 52 mm filters from my Canon AE1's 50 mm lens would work on it. I hope to have your expertise with my 7D at the end of this Summer. LOL
Canon 7D | EFS 17-85mm f/4-5.6 IS USM - EF 50mm f/1.8 Mark l - EF 100mm f/2.8 IS USM Macro - EF 70-200mm   f/4 L IS USM- EF 100-400    f4.5-5.6 IS USM - 1.4 ll and 2X ll Extenders

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Re: 100mm macro L on a 7d
« Reply #39 on: February 05, 2013, 05:04:38 AM »
I've reread my post and my LOL falls flat. Sorry. Why not buy the 100 IS USM L Macro and after using it for awhile you
will know if you want more from a lens. you have been given lots of suggestions to research. Macro Photography is a fun
learning experience. With the 160mm focal length on a crop sensor it will make a great portrait lens for Portraits of people and pics of Flowers. My research on the 100 mm L Macro makes me think it's a must have lens. The 70-200 2.8 ll is another very popular lens. Although 77 mm filters are more costly to buy. I like my 70-200 F4 IS USM and usually mount it on my 7D before going out to take pics. As BIF are my first priority, I want to be ready to shoot. I have C1 set for this. C2 for Flash and C3is going to be set for bracketing for HDR.
Spring isn't here yet so there is still time to do more research before you buy.
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Re: 100mm macro L on a 7d
« Reply #39 on: February 05, 2013, 05:04:38 AM »