October 21, 2014, 11:27:07 PM

Author Topic: Video Editing Work Flow?  (Read 1611 times)

eninja

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Re: Video Editing Work Flow?
« Reply #15 on: September 30, 2014, 09:13:20 PM »
Thanks. I don't know how to ask the correct question. So I started this thread.
A lot of thanks..
Alright, so lets go through some basic questions.

1. Mac or PC
2. Do you already have editing software? If so, what is it?
3. What type of video are you shooting (of your travels? of events? of your kids? of sports?)
4. Where would you be putting the video? (DVD? Youtube or Vimeo? Just on your computer?)

Once we have that info, we can walk you through a workflow. It will be heavily dependent on the editing software you have (some you need to convert, some you dont), and where you are putting that final video.

For example, for work, I edit on Macs with Final Cut. I convert all my footage to ProRes, edit, and export usually to Youtube or Vimeo. Both have standard settings (h.264, 5000kpbs, etc) and I tend to export at 720p. For stuff outside work, especially if I just use a GoPro, I might just edit in GoPro Studio with the original files. Simpler workflow because it doesnt need to be complex. So, it depends on what you have.

1. PC
2. I don't have editing software yet. Still looking on the market. I need something that could "cut the film", "piece together" and "multiplex in some music and voice" and could "sync audio"
     - a nice editing software for beginner (not to advance) is a good place to start learning.
3. This kind of video: https://youtu.be/h4xF2qtMuLk
4. Online Quality Viewing? any online site that can play high quality clip. -> does this refer to 1080p usually? some website I know only play HD (not full HD).
Is HD quality good enough to show sharp photos??
What online website can play high quality? then I can refer to as my baseline.

h.264 refers to mp4 format right?
mp4 format is good enough format for my local storage and back up? right?

Thanks.

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Re: Video Editing Work Flow?
« Reply #15 on: September 30, 2014, 09:13:20 PM »

eninja

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Re: Video Editing Work Flow?
« Reply #16 on: September 30, 2014, 09:19:57 PM »
Paid professional video, and like all of you guys, I'm a one man team.
We don't want the final video to be choppy or the voice like too close or too far from someone's mouth.

https://youtu.be/h4xF2qtMuLk
Ok, so a lot of this is fairly basic editing. 90% of that finished product is dependent on how well they shot their footage. They are doing fairly simple cut edits, their video isnt choppy because they shot it smoothly.

Quote
Glidecam is a must???!
External mic is a must???!

I got a 6D and will have 70D soon. I may set 70D, due to easy control via touch screen.
I am looking for a Lens: 24mm equivalent, got IS, and good at still at the same time. Couldn't find at the moment. and Less barrel distortion at 24mm.
Yes on external mic (Rode makes a good $100ish one), Glidecam will depend on your shooting style. Something to stabilize off your shoulder is probably worth it. Also looks like they do a decent amount of tripod based shooting.

As for your lenses, IS will be required. I wouldnt consider any lens that doesnt have it, as that is a run-and-gun style of shooting, and you dont want to spend time stabilizing in post.

Lots of IS lens options from Canon (24, 28, 35, etc), and there are 3rd party options that would be good as well. Something like the new 16-35L IS would be a good lens for both cameras; it'd be a good walk-around lens on the 70D for that style of shooting, and a nice wide angle for your 6D. Combo'd with a prime or two for closeups and you'd be off to a good start.

I think I will dedicate 70D for video. The swivel screen and touch screen will make it easier. Save the 6D for my still.

True, 90% of the final product be base on how well did I shoot it. Means, I must give priority to hardware first, then software. I need stabilize set up, mic with monitor output (headphone jack), hope i can look for cheap one.

eninja

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Re: Video Editing Work Flow?
« Reply #17 on: September 30, 2014, 11:52:51 PM »
I got one good question.

Lets say I want to use external audio recorder.

It is possible to remove audio component of .mov file, is it? (never mind I can google for this)

If YES, wow.. they can actually do that..

This thought just open my imagination, that the .mov is actually a container, with different data inside, and a "timing driver" much like a "director" of a movie coordinates the synchronization of data (audio, video, maybe other things unknown to me, as well).

If YES, are we dealing with different file like .psd file for photoshop to save all these environment data.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2014, 11:59:56 PM by eninja »

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Re: Video Editing Work Flow?
« Reply #18 on: October 02, 2014, 09:50:19 PM »
1. PC
2. I don't have editing software yet. Still looking on the market. I need something that could "cut the film", "piece together" and "multiplex in some music and voice" and could "sync audio"
     - a nice editing software for beginner (not to advance) is a good place to start learning.
3. This kind of video: https://youtu.be/h4xF2qtMuLk
4. Online Quality Viewing? any online site that can play high quality clip. -> does this refer to 1080p usually? some website I know only play HD (not full HD).
Is HD quality good enough to show sharp photos??
What online website can play high quality? then I can refer to as my baseline.

h.264 refers to mp4 format right?
mp4 format is good enough format for my local storage and back up? right?

Thanks.

With PC, you would go with Adobe Premiere or Sony Vegas, I hear all the professionals prefer Premier, but don't take my word for it.

Whatever you choose just don't go for beginner and find a cheap video editing software, and then later want to switch to something more advance only to relearn the software. All video editing is relatively the same, its 1 to n video tracks or timelines; you just cut, chop and paste, crop, rotate, zoom, color correct, etc.
Same with audio track, you may want to adjust levels so its mastered - not clipping. Multi-layer the audio tracks so it sounds natural, or isolate so that the audience can focus on a particular sound like foot steps.

There are a bunch of video tutorials on YouTube for newcomers.

As for "Online Quality Video," I prefer Vimeo over YouTube (in terms of quality) but if you want more viewers, then YouTube is the way to go...

h.264 is a codec, and all current models of Canon cameras record with that codec.
But the end file is a MOV file. Pro Res is a friendlier version and its easier to work with compared to h.264, but it too is going to be MOV file. All these are really MAC friendly. For you, download QuickTime so you can view your files. You may want to transform your MOV files that are PC and/or whatever your video editing software finds to be friendly. DnXHD is another format like Pro Res... look up the benefits of one over the other.

I got one good question.

Lets say I want to use external audio recorder.

It is possible to remove audio component of .mov file, is it? (never mind I can google for this)

If YES, wow.. they can actually do that..

This thought just open my imagination, that the .mov is actually a container, with different data inside, and a "timing driver" much like a "director" of a movie coordinates the synchronization of data (audio, video, maybe other things unknown to me, as well).

If YES, are we dealing with different file like .psd file for photoshop to save all these environment data.

The Video editor will always separate video in one timeline and audio in another. Highlight the audio and press delete. Sometimes the audio is attached to the video and if you highlight one, it highlights both video and audio, this is where you need to learn the ins and outs of your editing software. For example, there are a couple of ways to unlinking the video from audio on Final Cut Pro, you can lock the video and press delete and only the audio will delete or there is something like an unlinking button to detach the two.

https://youtu.be/h4xF2qtMuLk

Glidecam is a must???!
External mic is a must???!


That's pretty decent. It could be better, only problem is that its always motionless or panned video.
Look into a slider and/or crane/jib. Because a Glidecam really needs a lot of practice, every lens has a different weight and you are really changing balance often.

You can also do handheld... the wider the lens the better, IS (Image Stabilization) also helps a lot. Shaky cam gives you a different perspective... but wide lens + IS + video editing can add IS... and it looks pretty decent.

External Mic is only needed if you want clean and clear audio...
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Re: Video Editing Work Flow?
« Reply #19 on: October 03, 2014, 12:13:08 AM »
Surprisingly you are going to find that early on that audio is a bigger deal than you would think.  People will watch a so-so video with good sound, but they won't watch any of a video if the audio is bad.  Internal camera microphones are very poor and the wind screen is about worthless.  We use audio recorded using the camera microphone only as a reference audio.  So you will need to use an external microphone with great wind protection, and also keep it away from the lens motor.  There's lots of alternatives, you will need  to determine which is best for your situation. 

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Re: Video Editing Work Flow?
« Reply #20 on: October 03, 2014, 05:03:10 AM »
Hi Eninja,
Throwing my 2c worth in.
I have learnt so much from a web site called http://www.lynda.com/member.aspx .. they have so many tutorials on any sort of computer program as well as all sorts of other topics .... They use only Adobe Certified instructors ...   Forget Youtube....
Over the years I have learnt to use pretty much every Adobe program, and others there is, Illustrator, Photoshop, Dreamweaver, Flash ... I am proficient in HTML CSS, my youngest Son now operates his own web site business from learning through Lynda.com  .. and most importantly to this thread I learnt to use Premier Pro .. and even further to this AFTER EFFECTS ... I highly recommend this site for info, I am a member and subscribe to it, it's only $25 a month.
With Adobe CC now you can also become a monthly member so purchasing Premier Pro outright is no longer an issue.
Premier Pro is the best editing program by far in my opinion. Though it is fully PRO .. you can also just use the basic tools to do a very pro looking video ... if you are familiar with any Adobe programs then using it is seamless .. and importing other assets from any other Adobe program is easy as .. they all talk with each other using the same key strokes etc, any vector file from Illustrator, or an image from Photoshop imports right in ...
Prem Pro can handle any file format when importing, and out put to any file format once edited.

I would now also suggest to familiarise yourself with AFTER EFFECTS ... it is the icing on your video cake.
it is such an amazing program .. it would be the one used in pretty much 99% of all advertising, where you see your logo and texts etc spinning and doing all sorts of amazing things.
I can import a vector file from Illustrator and with one click of a pre set, have it shatter into a million bits, or shatter like glass ... the effects are endless.

So got to Lynda.com sign up ... then sign up to Adobe CC .. and get going learning with Adobe certified instructors.

+1 to an external mic ...
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Re: Video Editing Work Flow?
« Reply #21 on: October 03, 2014, 12:07:10 PM »
Surprisingly you are going to find that early on that audio is a bigger deal than you would think.  People will watch a so-so video with good sound, but they won't watch any of a video if the audio is bad.  Internal camera microphones are very poor and the wind screen is about worthless.  We use audio recorded using the camera microphone only as a reference audio.  So you will need to use an external microphone with great wind protection, and also keep it away from the lens motor.  There's lots of alternatives, you will need  to determine which is best for your situation.
+1
To my taste, 50% is audio, 50% video. For paid work it would be appropriate not to use internally recorded audio.
Using an external audio allows you to interrupt your video recordings any time you want to, it allows you to synchronize multiple sources, in particular photos.
You could use tools like Plural Eyes to sync them later. Makes the job a lot easier. As specified above, use the microphone as a reference audio.

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Re: Video Editing Work Flow?
« Reply #21 on: October 03, 2014, 12:07:10 PM »

eninja

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Re: Video Editing Work Flow?
« Reply #22 on: October 07, 2014, 05:32:10 AM »
Thanks guys.

From reading, I will go towards these direction:
    . Research and study about Adobe Premiere
    . Use external mic with recorder: I only found this: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/966010-REG/shure_vp83f_condenser_shotgun_mic.html - Shure VP83F. Is there any cheaper alternative than this.

    . I think camera slide and crane does not suit.. I need to do some testing, if glide really is needed in contrast to hand held only..

what do you think guys? Do I really need glide?

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Re: Video Editing Work Flow?
« Reply #23 on: October 07, 2014, 05:56:13 AM »
Thanks guys.

From reading, I will go towards these direction:
    . Research and study about Adobe Premiere
    . Use external mic with recorder: I only found this: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/966010-REG/shure_vp83f_condenser_shotgun_mic.html - Shure VP83F. Is there any cheaper alternative than this.

    . I think camera slide and crane does not suit.. I need to do some testing, if glide really is needed in contrast to hand held only..

what do you think guys? Do I really need glide?

You don't need a glidecam. You lose a lot of flexibility with a glidecam and in many situations that trade-off isn't worth it.

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Re: Video Editing Work Flow?
« Reply #24 on: October 07, 2014, 07:16:39 AM »
Thanks guys.

From reading, I will go towards these direction:
    . Research and study about Adobe Premiere
    . Use external mic with recorder: I only found this: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/966010-REG/shure_vp83f_condenser_shotgun_mic.html - Shure VP83F. Is there any cheaper alternative than this.

    . I think camera slide and crane does not suit.. I need to do some testing, if glide really is needed in contrast to hand held only..

what do you think guys? Do I really need glide?


You don't NEED to use glide or slide or jib. These are all gear that can boost production value in specific situations.
Just like hand held also isn't the natural choice.... it comes down to style as well as what you are trying to communicate.

Fx, if you are doing an interview where the subject is sitting down, a handheld camera will most likely look like S___, because it gives the impression that you are interrogating the subject or you are being impatient ready to move on.
But in an interview walking down the street, handheld just might be the thing to do.
Learn to do handheld well.... it can be done not so pretty and pretty, all boils down to experience.

In terms of sound.... if you plan to do interviews the classic way, that Shure mic or Røde Videomic Pro for that matter, will not give you proper sound... it will give you better sync sound.
A mic like that is suitable for one situation and that is run & gun.

If you want proper sound in terms of interviews, you should:

A. Hire a proper sound guy (yes I know.... expensive, but I had to place it on top, because that is the best way to record sound)
B. Buy a micro port kit and lav up the subject.
C. Buy a light stand, a boom buddy and a boom and a shotgun mic like fx. AT4053b or Røde NTG-3.

The micro port kit has its place. I think a lot of people end up using them, because it takes a lot out of the equation... less gear to worry about since you just plug the micro port receiver into the camera. Disable auto gain and adjust the sound properly. But it is also versatile because you can use it pretty much anywhere...

The boom option is obviously best when you have the time and the setting to do it properly, but has a better sound than a lav. One could argue though that lava can end up sounding better because mic placement is paramount in any situation. The closer to the subject the better..... which is also why a mic on a camera is a baaaaad option.

Dialog is mono by the way, so don't use stereo mics for anything other than environment recordings and so on.


Video editing workflow
If you are going the Premiere way, then you could start with getting ClipWrap to wrap the clips in a ProRes codec instead. .h264 is demanding on system resources. ProRes less so....

Bring in the clips in Premiere.

Open each in the source window and trim them roughly and drag them to the time line.

Once you have done it with all of them, you can start organising the flow of the movie.
Maybe some clips need to be shorter, maybe you want to put something back into them. Maybe this clip needs to go before that clip.... that is all just dragging around.

The sound will most likely determine how you story goes along. Once that is in place, you can start putting fill shots on top of the main video (which could be a sit down interview) and then cut to those shots now and again for some dynamics.

Once you edited the movie the way you are happy with it, lock it down mentally, and start looking at the colours, contrast, white balance and so on.

The reason you wait with that part is because adding filters also puts stress on the system resources. So might as well add them to the trimmed clips instead of the full length clips.

Then go research about managing sound. Of course being a photographer you won't be an expert at this. But learn the basics to clean up the sound a bit... like removing noise and so on.

When sound is done, then export it out in a small size. I normally do a 720p version to review my work and to send to the client. I prefer using either our workplace's Vimeo Pro account, since it's a nice way to not give them the concrete file but let them see what they can expect and send feed back on.

To deliver, we use WeTransfer Pro, because that will give us download confirmations and is WAY faster than fx. DropBox.

Best of luck...


OH.... about the sound.... an old saying is that sound is 50% of any movie.
You can save poor footage with great sound, but great footage will never save poor sound.
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Re: Video Editing Work Flow?
« Reply #24 on: October 07, 2014, 07:16:39 AM »