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Author Topic: First paid photo shoot - DATE: 23 March 2013  (Read 17855 times)

stipotle

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Re: First paid photo shoot - DATE: 23 March 2013
« Reply #30 on: March 12, 2013, 10:31:15 PM »
Lots of great advice here, so this is repeat mostly - WickidWombat was on point, and the things you pulled from the whole post are great.
For weddings at least, I would disagree 100% (respectfully of course) that 27-88mm is more useful than 38-168mm at a wedding. The extra stop at f/2.8 is certainly a valid reason, but the extra length of the 24-105 is really going to help you take some meaningful candids without being conspicuous. And you have the 15mm on your other lens if you really need wide.

I wouldn't be afraid of the time it takes to switch lenses (ie - other than as a backup, you don't need a 2nd body), as long as you think ahead a little you'll know when you need to switch lenses, and can plan for it.

Other suggestions already made that I would +1:
- RAW, for sure
- More SD Cards, if at all possible. From experience, running out of space is THE. WORST. If your battery runs low, you can throw the spare in the charger in the background, but weddings move fast and you don't want to be uploading and deleting chips on the fly. You just don't.
- Natural Light 1st, Bounce Flash 2nd, hope you don't need a 3rd option. :)
- "BE IN CONTROL, BUT DON'T LET ANYONE GET IN MY WAY" - Adding to this, it's very important to know and be confident that they are paying for your pictures and not Aunt so-and-so's. So yes - assert yourself if it's an important shot. BUT - don't be the star of the show / center of attention. Let them have their day. Although I don't think you should wear all black (unless you're a ninja too), it's very true that you don't want to be noticed all day.

Lastly, and I don't think I read this one yet:
The proverbial crap will probably hit the fan at least once during the day. It's the name of the game: schedules change, people get difficult, and if you are too prepared for what you think is supposed to happen, you might not be as flexible as you need to be when the plan changes. Any practice and and preparation you do in advance will help greatly - don't get me wrong - but when it's game time you just have to play ball. (Which is why it's great that they love your photos already)

Move fast, and think slowly. Don't rush shots - rush the time in between shots (if you need to).
And I can't tell you how many brownie points you'll get for being an extra bridesmaid (so to speak). Be overly helpful and happy to be there, and your couple (and their guests) will carry the fond memories into your photos.

Good LUCK!

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Re: First paid photo shoot - DATE: 23 March 2013
« Reply #30 on: March 12, 2013, 10:31:15 PM »

Inspiron41

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Re: First paid photo shoot - DATE: 23 March 2013
« Reply #31 on: March 12, 2013, 10:57:37 PM »
first thing, you can shoot any wedding with any gear...even with a smartphone. be confident! you don't need a Canon 1Dx to get stunning pictures or great memorable pictures that'll last a life time.

So far you've been doing a lot of the pre-wedding stuff correct with figuring out the schedule. make sure you talk to your client about the types of photos they want - family pictures, bridal, children, and cousins (all these things can add to a wedding experience or to a photobook). I don't know if you have a particular style (photo-journalistic, artistic, or both), but talk to your client to see which style they like.

On the wedding day, make sure all your gear is all ready and show up early and NEVER NEVER ever be late!!

Wedding day will be hectic! There's tons of pictures you should defiantly get. Detail shots at bride home getting ready, bride alone, bridemaids, groom, groommen, bride+couple, couple+bridal party, family pictures with both sides, cousins, grandparents, etc.. If you have daylight, get that stuff done while you still have daylight. last thing you want to do is take them in dark with a dark background.

if you have time, grab whatever tricks and poses you have in your bag with couple. find different locations to shoot, but not too many. you have limited time with the couple.

Depending how the day goes, you might have 30 minutes or 2hrs to get that done. you never know what'll happen (long ceremonies, bride running late, grooms too drunk, lost limo, etc).

when the reception starts, it's pretty much the same as much other wedding. make sure you're in the loop if anything out of the ordinary occurs.


key photo tips -
- understand your light
- understand your white balance (this will save you a ton time processing)
- learn to spot meter correctly
- make sure you have the right ISO, Shutter Speed and Aperture. 
- Do not be rapid firing your camera like crazy. Know what you want and frame it
- Learn to read your histogram, especially for novice.   


each wedding photographer takes their own certain number of pictures. i normally do around 800-1000. i can take 2k or 3k photos if i wanted to, but do i really want to process that many photos? each is their own. I shoot mainly in JPG, but since camera has dual memory slots, i can record JPG and RAW separately. but since i understand my white balance and lighting, i never had to touch my RAW for post processing. anyway, you'll be surprise how often photographers forget to check their camera settings when they change environments and just start shooting away.

good luck! you certainly have your work cut out for you if you're a beginner! i've been there before, but i trained as a second photographer to learn the ropes before i transition to the next level.
« Last Edit: March 12, 2013, 11:17:27 PM by Inspiron41 »

blaydese

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Re: First paid photo shoot - DATE: 23 March 2013
« Reply #32 on: March 13, 2013, 05:17:14 AM »
'Better' is relative....'more useful for you' would be the appropriate phrase.  Don't get the 24-105 by itself, get it as a kit lens when you go FF.  I think you'll do an excellent job with this shoot and that the 60D will soon be a backup to a 6D.

I'll never buy a "Kit" again.    >:(   :'(

It'll be a long long long time before I can afford another body.   :-[ 

Got $2,600.00 I can have?  ;D

Peace! 8)

ewg963

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Re: First paid photo shoot - DATE: 23 March 2013
« Reply #33 on: March 13, 2013, 07:01:00 AM »
This is my first post in CR :D.
I'm not a pro photographer either but I do have couple of dozens weddings in my belt.
I'll give you some do's and don'ts. Your 60D will be sufficient enough to cover the entire event. Make sure just carry the batteries and cards with you at all times. If the light permits, shoot without flash, natural light most times look more pleasing plus people tend to get annoyed with flash a lot. If 420ex is the only flash you can get then use it wisely and be careful of bouncing it. At times it'll bounce unwanted tints to your subject.
If you can get the 50mm 1.8 II before the wedding. Do it. That will be your portrait lens, however since you only have 1 body be ready to switch lenses a lot, or just move a lot.
Shoot at lot of frames and shoot RAW, I don't care what everyone says. It's your first gig, it doesn't matter if you have to go through 1000s of pics, at least for now this way you have a lot of material to use and give to your client.
Learn some posing techniques for couple. This is a must. Your client is expecting you to know how to pose them and tell them if they're smiling correctly or have their eyes closed, check your shots thoroughly but quickly.
Meet all the family members. Get a lot of facetime. They will be pleased that you took shots of a lot of their guest. Theyre gonna be looking back at the album, saying, oh I remember them, blah blah blah.
You can ditch the tripods and other heavy accessories, if you really wanna take em and use em, wouldn't hurt bringing another friend with you to help you carry gear.
Back up your stuff.  If you have some downtime in between events, please back up your cards.
Last but not least, have a blast.
+1 :)
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Orangutan

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Re: First paid photo shoot - DATE: 23 March 2013
« Reply #34 on: March 13, 2013, 09:42:54 AM »
Here's my advice from a previous thread, it's mostly applicable here.  Good luck, and enjoy!


* Talk to the bride, in person, and make sure she understands the expectations.  The fact that your friend says it's OK is not good enough.  Her needs/wants/expectations may be different from his.

* Weddings move fast, so simplify as much as you can.  Don't expect to have lots of time to change gear.

* Better to know a few items of gear well, than take a lot of stuff and lose track.  Take one good low/medium zoom, and one long zoom.  No other lenses are needed.

* using bounce flash in the reception (or at the ceremony, with the agreement of the couple and officiant) is not that hard.  You can spend 30 minutes with a couple friends in a dimly lit room to figure out the settings you need.  (hint: use manual with flash)  Don't get creative with flash until you know what you're doing.

* Get the "script" of the wedding in advance.  You'll need to anticipate the action to be in position.

* For the reception, couple pictures, and other photos for which you have time, don't be afraid to take a little time to set up a shot, or do a little directing of the action.  Yes, it's their wedding, but they'll be happy to let you guide them to a better shot, for example to get a better background, nicer lighting, etc.

* If it's a big "family and friends" wedding, try to get photos of everyone, especially older relatives and close friends.  No one knows how much time great-Aunt Helen has left, and they will appreciate photos of her dressed well and with a big smile.

* Take a few cute photos of kids.

* If the wedding is on Sunday, see if there's a local wedding on Saturday, then offer the pro photographer to be his/her free assistant for that gig.  Seeing behind the scenes just once can make  a difference.

* Take your time with the group photos.  Use a tripod, live view and check your depth-of-field charts (in advance) to make sure you do your best.  Don't use flash here unless you can bounce off a high ceiling or back wall.  Be willing to turn the flash off and make do if needed.

When in doubt, turn off the flash, set to P, and go for composition rather than technique.  Your 6D will do well in low light compare to all the P&S in the crowd.


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Re: First paid photo shoot - DATE: 23 March 2013
« Reply #35 on: March 13, 2013, 11:46:06 AM »
first thing, you can shoot any wedding with any gear...even with a smartphone. be confident! you don't need a Canon 1Dx to get stunning pictures or great memorable pictures that'll last a life time.



I agree that the gear doesn't really matter to produce great photo's, but once you start to take on paid and serious work, you'll need the basic kit. Kinda reminds me of this....

wickidwombat

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Re: First paid photo shoot - DATE: 23 March 2013
« Reply #36 on: March 13, 2013, 09:07:09 PM »
regarding shooting weddings with any gear, I disagree and so does judge joe brown :P
(i know i've posted this before but its just so funny) I like the nat geo cartoon too RL

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Re: First paid photo shoot - DATE: 23 March 2013
« Reply #36 on: March 13, 2013, 09:07:09 PM »

Forceflow

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Re: First paid photo shoot - DATE: 23 March 2013
« Reply #37 on: March 14, 2013, 09:06:38 AM »
Well, I've done a couple of wedding shoots as an unpaid amateur and so far I am still friends with all the couples. so it can be done, but never the less it WILL be stressful.

I've written a small journal about doing wedding photography as a non-pro:
http://christophmaier.deviantart.com/journal/Wedding-Photography-243847778
(If you are a deviantArt member comments are highly welcome) For all those not being part of deviantArt here is the journal:


1) Expectations of the couple:
Does the couple want professional pictures without paying the price? There is a reason why pro wedding photographers are expensive. You don't get any do-overs, no 'smile-agains' and certainly no 'lets-say-our-vows-agains'. If you miss a special event it's gone, period. Being a non-pro will most likely mean you'll miss on some things, or wont be able to capture some perfectly, that's why you do it for free (or at least much less than any pro would). If they know this and you feel that they truly understand this you are good to proceed. Now a lot of folks will tell you differently, but I have done 6 weddings now and all of them were satisfied with my work even though it was far from professional. They all knew what they were getting into when choosing me and I believed them when they said so. (Note, there are some weddings that I would not do because I know those folks just have different standards) Also, make sure you get a list from them of all the must-have events and people. Carry that list with you and cross things off as you go.
2) Equipment:
Make sure you have plenty of backup. Two bodies are an absolute must. You do not want to show up on a wedding and have your gear fail halfway through the show. Plus it's always good to have two bodies with different lenses available. The less you change lenses the more pictures you'll be able to take. (And the less danger of breaking something while juggling two lenses and a body without any place to put anything down) also, multiple memory cards are a must and it goes without saying that each body should have at least one spare battery. (And all of them should be charged the night before) You should also have at least one flash with plenty of batteries as well. I would also recommend to have a tripod ready and to make use of a second flash. Depending on the location and shooting you want to do you might want to consider a spare set of clothes as well. Sometimes you'll have to work in a field, kneel or lay down in order to get a good shot. Always good to have something else to change into then.
3) Location:
Check it out beforehand. Where is it exactly, where can you park your car and how far do you have to carry around your gear. Will there be lot's of indoor or more outdoor shooting. Where would be a good place for a group shot (make sure you know how many guests are expected) Where are some good spots for family photos (bride and groom plus parents, plus brides maids, only parents, only brides maids, etc) And where are some good locations to have some special photos taken of just the couple. (Made a lovely shot with a couple walking away from me through a wine-field and then running towards me for example) If possible try to find at least some time where you and the couple is alone. (Either before the ceremony or maybe between the ceremony and the reception)
4) Guest list:
Get a guest list beforehand and make sure you know who are the important people besides the couple. (Family, extended family, special guests) Try to get at least one shot of every guest. (See 'Guest book' for some advice on that) Have a long lens to make 'sneaky' pictures of people. The best portraits on events like that are done when people do not see you taking the picture.
5) Special Events:
Contact the best man and maid of honor to see if and what special events are planned. (Fireworks, surprise band, letting go balloons, etc) The couple will not necessarily know all the events that will need to be photographed and you might need to do some special preparations as well.
6) Guest book:
This is something I've done a couple of times and that has been very well received. It also helps immensely with keeping track of who has already been photographed as well. Get a small picture printer (Canon Selphy is my choice) and set it up somewhere on the main location. Get an empty picture frame and photograph everybody while they hold the frame. (Do try to do small groups like couples, work colleagues, families etc) Print out the photo and hand it to them together with the guest book. Idea is that they stick the photo into the book and write their wishes to the couple. Have the guest list ready and make sure people mark it when they've done it. Be aware though that you can't do this alone! You'll be busy photographing everything else, but since those pics don't need to be of the best quality it can be handed down to someone else. A good bet would be some close friends of the couple or maybe some relatives. (Cousins are a good choice as well) Do make sure that they know how to use a camera though. (Ask around in advance, but there's a good bet you'll find plenty of people glad to help and there's no need that only one person does it) This is a wonderful present to give the couple right after the wedding to take to the honeymoon.
7) Work:
Don't take the job lightly. Photographing a wedding is a lot of work. Not only is it stressful but it's also physically demanding. You will carry around a lot of gear throughout the day and you will do a lot or running around as well. Once I did a shoot outside for several hours in 38°C (100.4 ºF) Since I had to take pictures of all the folks standing in the shade I ended up standing in the sun a lot. (Luckily I had a hotel room there so I was able to change and shower during the day) So be prepared for that. Also make sure you get some food before everything start because chances are that you will not have a lot of time to eat during the event. And last but not least there will be the post-processing. Simply sifting through your images to see what is good and what is bad might take a while and then editing whatever picture you want to use will take an even longer time. Make sure you either have some free days right after the event or prepare the couple that they might need to wait a while until they see the final product. (Once I shot a wedding in both RAW and JPG and transferred all JPGs to the grooms laptop after the wedding to give them an idea of what to expect once I was done) If you regularly do a lot of pictures you might also look into something like Adobe Lightroom (or Aperture if you are a Mac user). It will let you mass edit and process photos very easily. I don't personally use it, but then I don't shoot weddings that often. It can be a real time saver though!
8) Church wedding
Should there be a religious ceremony involved make sure you know how much is allowed inside the church or wherever it is being performed. In one of my wedding shoots the priest forbid all photography during the actual ceremony. (The couple wasn't too happy about it but his house, his rules.) Also, not all couples want pictures of this moment because it can be distracting. (In order to get a good view you would have to either set up a remote camera or run around in plain view. Often also in areas that are 'off-limits' to regular folks) Talk to them about this a couple of days before the wedding so that they also have time to ask the priest what is acceptable and what is not. If you are allowed to take pictures but cannot use a flash make sure you have some fast glass available. Canon's 50mm 1.8 is a cheap but good lens to do that. Everything else will cost you a lot of money, so consider renting equipment for shoots like this. Canon's 50mm 1.4 or Sigma's 85mm 1.4 would come to mind. Else there's an amazing 50mm 1.2 from Canon, but be sure to rent them beforehand so you can actually work with them first. Shooting with such wide apertures will result in a very slim depth-of-field and it's not as easy to use! (Especially when all you normally use is an aperture of 2.8 or smaller)
9) Be the photographer
Should you be the main photographer you should have the couple announce this and set some ground rules. A lot of folks tend to be there doing photos themselves but everybody should know that you come first when it comes to the important shots. Also helps for group shots when everybody knows who to look at and who to listen to. (Had that problem recently where I was nearly drowned in other 'photographers' and everybody was looking at a different camera) The couple might also want to limit some events to be photographed just by you and ask everybody else to refrain from taking pictures. (Especially during any ceremonies things can get very distracting and noisy if a lot of people try to get some pictures) Also, especially when doing group shots do not be afraid to yell. Lot's of people make lot's of noise and the bigger the group the farther away you'll end up as well. Tell the people what you want. If some huge wrestler stands in front of the brides maids it's not going to be a good picture. Tell him to get behind the people where he can still be seen. Speaking of being seen, tell the people the simple rule, they can't see you? Then they wont be in the picture! (Amazing how many people appear to not grasp that concept)
10) Don't take one, take two!
... or more pictures. Things mess up, people look stupid and lighting might not be the best. Last wedding I did a lot of shooting with my flash, but I tried to do two shots of each photograph in quick succession so that the second shot was without the flash. (Sometimes had to do three for that) Some photos look better with flash, some without and I for once can never tell in advance what it will be. If I do portraits I very often do two shots in quick succession as well, a small change of expression sometimes makes all the difference between an average and wonderful shot. Does certainly add a whole lot of work to it though. (See point 7 ;) ) And do check your work often, you don't want to realize the day after that you had a bad setting on your camera. (Once did a whole shoot with ISO 1600 without noticing, thankfully it was just some outdoor work I did for myself, pretty much threw all of those out...)
11) Contract and model release form
Now, while this is mostly geared towards the non-pro who does it for free this should still be mentioned. A contract is never a bad thing, and as soon as money starts changing hands it's an absolute must. As the laws differ from country to country (and then even from state to state) I wont go into detail here, but only state a few points. See if there is a photography club somewhere in your are and ask them for advice on contracts. What is needed by law, what should and should not be included. Either way be sure to have a very clear description of what is expected of you. Things like pre-wedding shoots, engagement shoots, additional portraits, etc should all be written into the contract if you are expected to do them. It should also be clear if you provide full-res digital pictures or if you will provide the prints for a fee. (Something that is very often done by wedding photographers) Also the question how much editing is expected from you and if there are any must-have moments that need to be photographed in order to be paid. (And I would certainly rule out any penalty payments should something not work out) If you wish to publish the photographs you did during the wedding be sure to also get a model release form from the couple. Again, laws differ extremely so be sure to ask someone who knows the rules and regulations when it comes to release forms. In Germany for example it would not be enough to simply get the couples agreement but you would absolutely need a model release form from everybody who's picture will be published. (Minus group shots, but the definition is somewhat unclear in Germany) As a rule of thumb I simply do not publish photographs from weddings.
12) Assist in a wedding shoot (Okay, obviously not happening in this case)
Now again, as a non-pro who plans to do only a single shoot this might not be suitable. But if you plan on doing this as a pro you should absolutely try and find a pro wedding photographer who will let you tag along on a few weddings. This will certainly be the best preparation possible and depending on the deal you make with the photographer might even make you some cash.


I hope that helps. Be very, very sure about the expectations from the couple however! There are some friends of mine where I would never be the photographer because I know they would expect the full pro package. (And I know I am nowhere near good enough for that) But if their expectations match up with your skill I see no reason not to do it. (Other than the fact that it will be a lot of work and you'll pretty much miss the wedding even though you are there all the time)
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distant.star

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Re: First paid photo shoot - DATE: 23 March 2013
« Reply #38 on: March 14, 2013, 10:55:48 AM »
.
That's funny. Reminds me of the time I hired a young man as an editor. I based my decision largely on his having worked for National Geographic. How could I go wrong if he'd worked with them as an editorial employee? Turns out he was dreadful -- he couldn't find his own desk each morning without asking someone where he should sit. He didn't last long. I think he may have gone back to National Geo!!



I agree that the gear doesn't really matter to produce great photo's, but once you start to take on paid and serious work, you'll need the basic kit. Kinda reminds me of this....
Walter: Were you listening to The Dude's story? Donny: I was bowling. Walter: So you have no frame of reference here, Donny. You're like a child who wanders into the middle of a movie and wants to know...

blaydese

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Re: First paid photo shoot - DATE: 23 March 2013
« Reply #39 on: March 18, 2013, 05:36:47 AM »
Well, I've done a couple of wedding shoots as an unpaid amateur and so far I am still friends with all the couples. so it can be done, but never the less it WILL be stressful.

I've written a small journal about doing wedding photography as a non-pro:
http://christophmaier.deviantart.com/journal/Wedding-Photography-243847778
(If you are a deviantArt member comments are highly welcome) For all those not being part of deviantArt here is the journal:

 

That does help and thanks for the info !

Peace! 8)   ;D

Northstar

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Re: First paid photo shoot - DATE: 23 March 2013
« Reply #40 on: March 18, 2013, 06:50:24 AM »
regarding shooting weddings with any gear, I disagree and so does judge joe brown :P
(i know i've posted this before but its just so funny) I like the nat geo cartoon too RL

Judge Joe Brown - Cheap wedding photographer


Judge Joe nailed it!
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blaydese

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Re: First paid photo shoot - DATE: 23 March 2013
« Reply #41 on: March 23, 2013, 07:07:23 PM »
Shoot is over... now to process the pictures.. :P

Until then, we'll see how it....GOES !!


Wedding Photography Fail

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Peace! 8)

Northstar

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Re: First paid photo shoot - DATE: 23 March 2013
« Reply #42 on: March 24, 2013, 11:20:06 AM »
Shoot is over... now to process the pictures.. :P

Until then, we'll see how it....GOES !!


Wedding Photography Fail

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Peace! 8)

incredible video...wow.
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Re: First paid photo shoot - DATE: 23 March 2013
« Reply #42 on: March 24, 2013, 11:20:06 AM »

danski0224

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Re: First paid photo shoot - DATE: 23 March 2013
« Reply #43 on: March 24, 2013, 12:27:31 PM »
regarding shooting weddings with any gear, I disagree and so does judge joe brown :P
(i know i've posted this before but its just so funny) I like the nat geo cartoon too RL


Damn, he ripped them a new one.

 :)
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cayenne

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Re: First paid photo shoot - DATE: 23 March 2013
« Reply #44 on: March 24, 2013, 06:58:41 PM »
regarding shooting weddings with any gear, I disagree and so does judge joe brown :P
(i know i've posted this before but its just so funny) I like the nat geo cartoon too RL


Damn, he ripped them a new one.

 :)

Yep...sounded like the Judge knew his way around a camera too....that didn't help the "professionals' a bit....
:)


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Re: First paid photo shoot - DATE: 23 March 2013
« Reply #44 on: March 24, 2013, 06:58:41 PM »