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Author Topic: The last Canon crop sensor - ever  (Read 35281 times)

Don Haines

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Re: The last Canon crop sensor - ever
« Reply #210 on: August 15, 2013, 08:19:57 PM »
Obviously, I did not explain myself well. [...]

Got it now.

Quote
If you had a film camera that you could use 35mm (FF) film in or use 110 (APS-C) film in, you could very easily say that the 35MM film has 2 1/2 times the detail of the 110 image. In the digital world, with a great lens, an 18Mpixel FF sensor would have almost the same amount of detail as an APS-C 18Mpixel image with the appropriately scaled great quality lens. <edit: they would be almost the same, the FF would be a bit better than APS-C> In the film world, the quality of each square mm of film would be the same between the two sizes, and in the digital world the quality of the FF pixels would be up totwice as good as the quality of the APS-C pixels (depending on lighting and assuming the same level of technology and processing).

I agree with most but not really with this paragraph. Appropriately scaled (same) great quality lenses just do not exist. You cannot scale the index of refraction, and the lens design must be different. For the same DOF, etc., you have rays which need to be focused more than before (for smaller sensors), etc. There is a reason MF is still alive. The FF resolution near, say, f/2 is dramatically better than the crop one at f/1.4. When you stop down, the advantage decreases but it is there, and is real. I never had a landscape with my crop cameras that I could find acceptable, with all kind of lenses, L or not. Now, even the 24-105 is clearly better.

So while you can scale down the resolution of the sensor but not of the film (your point with which I agree), the same scaling does not work as well with lenses. Lenses for smaller sensor are sharper, indeed, but not enough to compensate. At certain apertures, the difference is huge.

I must admit that I am smiling about your response.

My premise is that things are complicated and there are no easy answers, and you counter with how much more complicated things are than my very simplified statement.

Thanks! We are in agreement.
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Re: The last Canon crop sensor - ever
« Reply #210 on: August 15, 2013, 08:19:57 PM »

Pi

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Re: The last Canon crop sensor - ever
« Reply #211 on: August 15, 2013, 08:30:38 PM »
You cannot scale the index of refraction, and the lens design must be different. For the same DOF, etc., you have rays which need to be focused more than before (for smaller sensors), etc. .... I never had a landscape with my crop cameras that I could find acceptable, with all kind of lenses, L or not. Now, even the 24-105 is clearly better.

So they're not equivalent.   :-X

They are equivalent but not equal.

Jim O

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Re: The last Canon crop sensor - ever
« Reply #212 on: August 16, 2013, 10:22:28 AM »
.... and for some unfathomable reason I still have 4 rolls of Kodachrome64 and a couple packs of polaroid film sitting in the freezer...
I have a freezer with lots of film, and paper, and I haven't had a darkroom since 2002. We don't have basements here in the south... At least most houses near here do not. I have some polaroid also, and I sold my MF polaroid backs a couple of years ago.

I still have a couple of EOS-3 bodies. I sold my EOS-1v and EOS-1n a few years back also. And...  wait for it... wait for it... wait for it...

I have an EOS IX that belonged to my wife - talk about APS! It was the perfect idiot proof camera for her. She has a Rebel 4ti now and it's really too much camera for her. She mostly "shoots" with her iPhone.

Of course I was a late adopter of digital after the fiasco that was the D2000. So I bought a lot of film worried I wouldn't be able to get any going forward. I suppose I overbought.  :P
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Re: The last Canon crop sensor - ever
« Reply #212 on: August 16, 2013, 10:22:28 AM »