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Author Topic: Another one of those 5D Mark III soft images threads.  (Read 7841 times)

Kenro

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Another one of those 5D Mark III soft images threads.
« on: April 09, 2013, 07:49:44 AM »
Please move this topic if it belongs somewhere else.

I am a professional photographer based in Australia, who recently upgraded from the 5D Mark II to the mark III, mainly for the autofocusing speed abilities. I also have a 60D in my kit, which works well for sports but some shoots demand the full frame sensor. Most of my clients are big publications, and I have had some bad feedback about "soft" images since upgrading to the MarkIII, which is a huge problem considering this is my main income source (and have magazines relying on shots for DPS', posters and covers). On investigation, I have noticed the 5d Mark III images looks fine zoomed out, but when cropped in 100% are noticeably soft, softer than that of the MarkII (and in some cases, the 60D!).
I have tried extensive image sharpening, but can never get that "tack sharp" photo that I could get with the mark II.
Im shooting in RAW, and process in lightroom. I tried bumping the picture profile sharpness up in-camera which helped a little but still no visible sharp focus point. I have spent alot of time on the autofocus micro adjustment, and thought I had it spot on, but compared to the Mark ii - it still sucked.

Can anyone tell me if its just me suffering from these problems? There seems to be a few on the web, but I would really like to rectify this problem rather than selling the 5d3 and buying a 7D until canon release a good affordable fast full-frame camera.

Any ideas would be greatly appreciated!

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Another one of those 5D Mark III soft images threads.
« on: April 09, 2013, 07:49:44 AM »

neuroanatomist

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Re: Another one of those 5D Mark III soft images threads.
« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2013, 07:58:31 AM »
I have spent alot of time on the autofocus micro adjustment, and thought I had it spot on, but compared to the Mark ii - it still sucked.

Spent time how?  Have you compared phase detect AF to live view AF to 10x manual focusing in live view?  If live you gets you sharper images then phase detect, then AF adjustment is most likely the problem.  If the images are equally soft with all focusing methods, I'd suggest contacting Canon.
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spinworkxroy

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Re: Another one of those 5D Mark III soft images threads.
« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2013, 08:23:37 AM »
Any photos to share for comparisons? It's quite hard to "imagine" your issue without an actual photo to see for ourselves.
Is it the lens?
I've not had any issues with my 5D3 but i've also read of others with soft issues getting their cameras replaced with a better copy… to me, i think it's all down to the lens you use and correct AFMA. (I use Reikan for mine)
However, i do agree that when taking the same picture and really zooming in to crop, the 5d3 is no match for the D800 or the Sony A99..as much as possible i try not to crop too much.
I'm using the 24-70II and Sigma 85F1.4 most of the time for all my portrait works and i never had to complain about not sharp images.

rpt

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Re: Another one of those 5D Mark III soft images threads.
« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2013, 08:24:30 AM »
How did you AFMA? FoCal or other method? May be a stupid question considering you are a professional - was the lighting inadequate?

The top reasons my AFMA failed (in no particular order) were:
  • Center column was raised and it was a bit wobbly
  • Lighting was inadequate
  • Lighting done with CFL bulbs

I use FoCal and the need to manually change the AFMA values can sometimes be tricky.

If it is none of the above and you think the camera was very stable, may be you need to talk to Canon. People on this forum have been very happy with Canon service in Australia. There was a thread on it a few days back...

Mehmetski

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Re: Another one of those 5D Mark III soft images threads.
« Reply #4 on: April 10, 2013, 11:40:55 AM »
Check your in camera noise reduction levels. On the 5d3 this is a little stronger than the 5d2 and this can result in softer images, especially shots above ISO 1600

Nishi Drew

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Re: Another one of those 5D Mark III soft images threads.
« Reply #5 on: April 10, 2013, 12:40:09 PM »
Maybe shoot at F8 more, instead of F1.4  ;)

East Wind Photography

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Re: Another one of those 5D Mark III soft images threads.
« Reply #6 on: April 10, 2013, 01:10:52 PM »
Increasing MP can lead you to believe you are losing "sharpness".  First off try downsizing the 23MP RAW file to the 5D resolution and see if your image "sharpens" up.  Adding more pixels increases the resolution capability of the camera which quite frankly can out resolve many lenses.

2nd, lets not confuse sharpness with resolution.  Sharpness is based on light levels and contrast levels between two adjacent shades or colors.  More light means more sharpness.

Resolution is based on number of pixels/mm and what fine detail can be recorded with a particular lens and camera combo.  Both are important but are not related directly.

Generally with the 5DIII or any other camera to get tack "sharp" images, you have to have strong lighting, good exposure.

Next you can compare lenses and IQ using a tool such as the following.

http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/ISO-12233-Sample-Crops.aspx?Lens=745&Camera=453&Sample=0&FLI=1&API=0&LensComp=748&CameraComp=453&SampleComp=0&FLIComp=0&APIComp=0


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Re: Another one of those 5D Mark III soft images threads.
« Reply #6 on: April 10, 2013, 01:10:52 PM »

Mt Spokane Photography

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Re: Another one of those 5D Mark III soft images threads.
« Reply #7 on: April 10, 2013, 01:31:55 PM »
Careful testing at DXO shows that with the same lens, the 5D MK III has 15% better resolution than the 5D MK II.  Thats quite a bit for a tiny number of additional pixels.
 
Its hard to know why you are seeing this, but somewhere along the line, something is wrong.
As Neuro said, live autofocus is done by contrast detection and should be near perfect.  Reikan Focal has a focus algorithm that will focus your camera better than liveview, and can be used to check images as well.

Don Haines

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Re: Another one of those 5D Mark III soft images threads.
« Reply #8 on: April 10, 2013, 01:45:43 PM »
What lens are you using? Is that lens sharp on other cameras?

If you set up on a tripod and manually focus with live view, zoomed in, can you get a sharp image?
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East Wind Photography

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Re: Another one of those 5D Mark III soft images threads.
« Reply #9 on: April 10, 2013, 02:09:40 PM »
But it doesnt work with the 5DIII (reikan af algorythm).

Careful testing at DXO shows that with the same lens, the 5D MK III has 15% better resolution than the 5D MK II.  Thats quite a bit for a tiny number of additional pixels.
 
Its hard to know why you are seeing this, but somewhere along the line, something is wrong.
As Neuro said, live autofocus is done by contrast detection and should be near perfect.  Reikan Focal has a focus algorithm that will focus your camera better than liveview, and can be used to check images as well.

Mt Spokane Photography

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Re: Another one of those 5D Mark III soft images threads.
« Reply #10 on: April 10, 2013, 02:15:23 PM »
But it doesnt work with the 5DIII (reikan af algorythm).


Works just fine with my 5D MK III!

East Wind Photography

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Re: Another one of those 5D Mark III soft images threads.
« Reply #11 on: April 10, 2013, 02:21:15 PM »
Crazy.  Every time I tried it the program would crash and I would have to manually restore my settings.  Maybe I'll uninstall it, reboot, and re-install again.

But it doesnt work with the 5DIII (reikan af algorythm).


Works just fine with my 5D MK III!

Viggo

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Re: Another one of those 5D Mark III soft images threads.
« Reply #12 on: April 10, 2013, 02:26:28 PM »
I'll cut to the chase here. I think your camera and afma is fine, the 5d3 IS softer than the 5d2. If it is ONLY the AA-filter that makes it so soft your customer notices I'm not sure about. However, if your clients uses their own designers and editors to work the picture before a release of a magazine for example, I can easily see that they would notice.

This issue was pointed out two days after the 5d3 hit the shelves, and people screamed bloody murder about it being soft,  and now suddenly everybody loves it.

I had the 5d2 and 1d4, and upgraded to the 5d3 and I absolutley loved everything except the image quality. And a bit higher iso's it's much cleaner than the 5d2, but use a bit of fill flash at iso 100 and the 5d2 files are sharper. It annoyed me to the point where I tried the 1dX more seriously to see if it was any better, and I sold the 5d3 as soon as I got hold of a 1dX. It's that big of an issue for me, and clearly others, including a couple of friends of mine who didn't know about this until they had tried the 5d3 for a couple a weeks and they came to me asking about it. 
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Re: Another one of those 5D Mark III soft images threads.
« Reply #12 on: April 10, 2013, 02:26:28 PM »

Viggo

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Re: Another one of those 5D Mark III soft images threads.
« Reply #13 on: April 10, 2013, 02:27:12 PM »
Crazy.  Every time I tried it the program would crash and I would have to manually restore my settings.  Maybe I'll uninstall it, reboot, and re-install again.

But it doesnt work with the 5DIII (reikan af algorythm).


Works just fine with my 5D MK III!

Be sure to use the new version, they fixed those crashes now.
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East Wind Photography

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Re: Another one of those 5D Mark III soft images threads.
« Reply #14 on: April 10, 2013, 02:30:32 PM »
Yep I'm using the new version already.

Crazy.  Every time I tried it the program would crash and I would have to manually restore my settings.  Maybe I'll uninstall it, reboot, and re-install again.

But it doesnt work with the 5DIII (reikan af algorythm).


Works just fine with my 5D MK III!

Be sure to use the new version, they fixed those crashes now.

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Re: Another one of those 5D Mark III soft images threads.
« Reply #14 on: April 10, 2013, 02:30:32 PM »