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Author Topic: That's my money you are profiting from Canon!!!  (Read 8898 times)

J.R.

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That's my money you are profiting from Canon!!!
« on: April 24, 2013, 07:06:51 AM »
From the net - http://in.reuters.com/article/2013/04/24/canon-earnings-idINDEE93N05I20130424

"Canon Inc raised its full-year operating profit forecast by $300 million as a weakening yen triggered by Japan's latest deflation-fighting policies inflates its overseas earnings, despite smartphones sapping compact camera sales."

So much for people who were anticipating a fall in prices of Canon products due to JPY devaluation.

Interestingly smartphones have started eating into the P&S sales. I am not surprised.
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That's my money you are profiting from Canon!!!
« on: April 24, 2013, 07:06:51 AM »

unfocused

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Re: That's my money you are profiting from Canon!!!
« Reply #1 on: April 24, 2013, 09:55:09 AM »
No. It's not.

Unless you own stock in Canon, you traded them your money for that long list of toys you so proudly display at the bottom of your post. You own that stuff now and can do whatever you want with it. It's yours. It's also now Canon's money and they are free to do what they want with it. So, No. It's not your money.

Secondly, why do people post stories without bothering to read them? Or in this case, even reading the headline.

Canon is adjusting their earnings estimates because the Japanese government's monetary policies have resulted in some inflation at home and some loss in value of the Yen against other currencies in international trade. It's an accounting adjustment.

Finally, I never understand why people get upset when Canon makes money. Do you think they would have more money to invest in research and development if they were losing money? Do you think they would be able to cut their prices if they were losing money?
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awinphoto

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Re: That's my money you are profiting from Canon!!!
« Reply #2 on: April 24, 2013, 10:32:33 AM »
No. It's not.

Unless you own stock in Canon, you traded them your money for that long list of toys you so proudly display at the bottom of your post. You own that stuff now and can do whatever you want with it. It's yours. It's also now Canon's money and they are free to do what they want with it. So, No. It's not your money.

Secondly, why do people post stories without bothering to read them? Or in this case, even reading the headline.

Canon is adjusting their earnings estimates because the Japanese government's monetary policies have resulted in some inflation at home and some loss in value of the Yen against other currencies in international trade. It's an accounting adjustment.

Finally, I never understand why people get upset when Canon makes money. Do you think they would have more money to invest in research and development if they were losing money? Do you think they would be able to cut their prices if they were losing money?

Couldn't agree more... JR if your upset that canon is turning a high profit, stop buying their stuff... simple... i'm sure canon is shaking in their boots...  Hell i shoot professionally and I have half your gear...  People get hot and bothered with any one company or individual earns a lot of money or capital... Why?  They worked their butt off to earn that...  Sue Bryce said we need to check our attitudes about money and being rich.  If we get offended about those who are rich and big profitable company, we ourselves will carry that same mentality towards money and push it away psychologically.  In the mean time I hope to use my gear to make my studio have a profitable year this year... hope you dont get offended by me. 
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Efka76

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Re: That's my money you are profiting from Canon!!!
« Reply #3 on: April 24, 2013, 11:30:10 AM »
This article shows that Canon is making much more money despite the fact that P&S sales are decreasing (smartphones are occupying P&S cameras market). In this site more than 95% of readers (of course, it is my subjective opinion) are DSLR owners / users. Myself and other readers are really upset as Canon is making profits, however, does not invest such profits into R&D and does not introduce n/.ew cameras or lenses with significant improvements. For example 7D is 4 years old - it means that this model is a cash cow. Newly introduced models lack of really substantial improvements, basically Canon is using old platforms.

Regarding lenses - Canon lenses are good quality, however, they are very expensive comparing to third parties. When looking at Tamron's and Sigma's performance in market we see substantial improvements in their lenses quality (which now approximates to Canon) for significantly lower price. Canon is loosing ground in this area.

Also, many customers really expects reductions of prices of Canon  production due to Yen's performance in the market, however, Canon is making significant profits and disappointing customers who would like to buy cheaper Canon cameras or lenses. Such approach is very dangerous as many customers are dissatisfied and are buying third party lenses as well as changing Canon religion to others.

When I look how significant improvements are made in electronics (computer chips, computers, TVs etc.) photography area is lacking innovations. 4-5 year old sensors, DIGIC V are used. What I would really expect that Canon would make really serious investments into sensors, camera chip area, would renew its lenses line and become progressive company. Now I see only stagnant company which is milking the same almost dead cow and enjoying short term profits.

Also, I did not mention mirrorless cameras market, which is supposed to replace DSLRs in the future. Canon completely lost this market to competitors and passively watching what others are doing. I doubt that somebody knows Canon's brand after 10-15 years if the follow current strategy.
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StepBack

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Re: That's my money you are profiting from Canon!!!
« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2013, 11:50:52 AM »
to think a multi-national has "your" money is a joke. They wouldn't know if u were dead or alive unless u owned at least 5% of the common. So much for your L list.

J.R.

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Re: That's my money you are profiting from Canon!!!
« Reply #5 on: April 24, 2013, 11:59:00 AM »
OMG ... Looks like I've written something blasphemous that given the bible brigade a howling spree. Let's see 

No. It's not.

So you mean to say that Canon didn't profit from the purchases you and I made in the last year? BTW, did I say I had a problem with it?

Unless you own stock in Canon, you traded them your money for that long list of toys you so proudly display at the bottom of your post. You own that stuff now and can do whatever you want with it. It's yours. It's also now Canon's money and they are free to do what they want with it. So, No. It's not your money.

Did I say I had a problem with Canon making money? Where did you get that from?

Secondly, why do people post stories without bothering to read them? Or in this case, even reading the headline.

Canon is adjusting their earnings estimates because the Japanese government's monetary policies have resulted in some inflation at home and some loss in value of the Yen against other currencies in international trade. It's an accounting adjustment.

Did YOU bother to read that I wrote? I mentioned specifically that the reduction in prices people were expecting due to devaluation of the JPY will not materialize. Why, because Canon has revised its profit guidance.

FWIW, I am a qualified CPA and know fully well what accounting adjustments and guidance means.

Finally, I never understand why people get upset when Canon makes money. Do you think they would have more money to invest in research and development if they were losing money? Do you think they would be able to cut their prices if they were losing money?

Where do you get the idea that I am upset that Canon is making money? I've taken the trouble to re-read my post about 5 times and still can't figure out where you got that from.

Jeez ... one can't even mention something that appeared in the news without paranoid people trying to find some sort of an angle or intention. For your own sake, I hope you are not so quick to criticize people you actually meet only based on your own assumptions and imagination. 
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J.R.

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Re: That's my money you are profiting from Canon!!!
« Reply #6 on: April 24, 2013, 12:08:05 PM »

Couldn't agree more... JR if your upset that canon is turning a high profit, stop buying their stuff... simple... i'm sure canon is shaking in their boots...  Hell i shoot professionally and I have half your gear...  People get hot and bothered with any one company or individual earns a lot of money or capital... Why?  They worked their butt off to earn that...  Sue Bryce said we need to check our attitudes about money and being rich.  If we get offended about those who are rich and big profitable company, we ourselves will carry that same mentality towards money and push it away psychologically.  In the mean time I hope to use my gear to make my studio have a profitable year this year...

What gives you the idea that I'm upset? Did I say anywhere in my post that I had a problem that Canon was making a profit? Do you think I expect that Canon would sell their products to me at cost / loss?

It was simply news + humor on my part which probably doesn't go down well with CR posters who come out to defend Canon when it's not even being attacked ::) ::) ::)

hope you dont get offended by me.

No problem. However, I'm sure I offended you by posting the ... well ... news. Sorry if it causes so much angst. 
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Re: That's my money you are profiting from Canon!!!
« Reply #6 on: April 24, 2013, 12:08:05 PM »

J.R.

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Re: That's my money you are profiting from Canon!!!
« Reply #7 on: April 24, 2013, 12:12:08 PM »
to think a multi-national has "your" money is a joke. They wouldn't know if u were dead or alive unless u owned at least 5% of the common. So much for your L list.

More evidence of unintelligent life in the CR space. Did you even bother to read what I wrote in the post?

At the cost of repetition, does Canon not make a profit when you buy Canon products? If you think otherwise, you are the "joke".

Did I say that I have a problem that Canon is making a profit? Did I say that Canon has "my money"??? ::) ::) ::)

Anyhow, what does my L list have to do with it?
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RMC33

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Re: That's my money you are profiting from Canon!!!
« Reply #8 on: April 24, 2013, 12:16:53 PM »
This article shows that Canon is making much more money despite the fact that P&S sales are decreasing (smartphones are occupying P&S cameras market). In this site more than 95% of readers (of course, it is my subjective opinion) are DSLR owners / users. Myself and other readers are really upset as Canon is making profits, however, does not invest such profits into R&D and does not introduce n/.ew cameras or lenses with significant improvements. For example 7D is 4 years old - it means that this model is a cash cow. Newly introduced models lack of really substantial improvements, basically Canon is using old platforms.

Regarding lenses - Canon lenses are good quality, however, they are very expensive comparing to third parties. When looking at Tamron's and Sigma's performance in market we see substantial improvements in their lenses quality (which now approximates to Canon) for significantly lower price. Canon is loosing ground in this area.

Canon's largest division in terms of revenue is its multifunction copier division, not cameras. If you are so dissatisfied move to Nikon or something else. Also, how can you be upset at a company doing exactly what they are designed to do, Make money.

No improvements in lens or camera tech? Thats a load of hooey, I can Handhold my 400 f/2.8 II for 20-30 minutes before I need to toss it back on the monopod for a quick rest. Losing ground to 3rd party lenses? Does Sigma/Tamron offer a 70-200 2.8 that performs as well as the Canon? Nope. How bout a 24-70? 2.8? Hardly. The cost (R&D, tooling, marketing, advertising etc.) of the 7D was most likely recovered about 12-18 months into the run. The new 7D2 needs all these things so yes, Canon will continue to produce this amazing camera to fund better products.

Also, many customers really expects reductions of prices of Canon  production due to Yen's performance in the market, however, Canon is making significant profits and disappointing customers who would like to buy cheaper Canon cameras or lenses. Such approach is very dangerous as many customers are dissatisfied and are buying third party lenses as well as changing Canon religion to others.

Im not disappointed in the least. The quality is improved, so I expect to pay more. Also, most people don't follow what the currency markets do so the de-valuation is not why they want lower prices. They want lower prices because that is human nature.

When I look how significant improvements are made in electronics (computer chips, computers, TVs etc.) photography area is lacking innovations. 4-5 year old sensors, DIGIC V are used. What I would really expect that Canon would make really serious investments into sensors, camera chip area, would renew its lenses line and become progressive company. Now I see only stagnant company which is milking the same almost dead cow and enjoying short term profits.

Also, I did not mention mirrorless cameras market, which is supposed to replace DSLRs in the future. Canon completely lost this market to competitors and passively watching what others are doing. I doubt that somebody knows Canon's brand after 10-15 years if the follow current strategy.

Digic 5 is a year old. Pretttttty sure the sensor in the 1dX, 5d3 and 6d are not 4-5 years old~ Renew its lens line? Uh, They do that constantly hence MkII/III versions of some of the glass. See above about my comment on the 400 f/2.8 II.

Mirror-less will not replace DLSR any time soon. Try shooting a moving object with a mirror-less.

Hate to break it to you but Canon is here to stay. As I said, Canon's largest division in terms of revenue is its multifunction copier division, not cameras. If you are so dissatisfied move to Nikon or something else.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2013, 12:20:30 PM by RMC33 »

J.R.

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Re: That's my money you are profiting from Canon!!!
« Reply #9 on: April 24, 2013, 12:30:30 PM »
This article shows that Canon is making much more money despite the fact that P&S sales are decreasing (smartphones are occupying P&S cameras market). In this site more than 95% of readers (of course, it is my subjective opinion) are DSLR owners / users. Myself and other readers are really upset as Canon is making profits, however, does not invest such profits into R&D and does not introduce n/.ew cameras or lenses with significant improvements. For example 7D is 4 years old - it means that this model is a cash cow. Newly introduced models lack of really substantial improvements, basically Canon is using old platforms.

Unless you are employed in the Canon's finance and accounting department how would you know what Canon is spending on R&D? Conjecture? The trouble is that the current generation of DSLRs is quite good and improvement appear insignificant.

Regarding lenses - Canon lenses are good quality, however, they are very expensive comparing to third parties. When looking at Tamron's and Sigma's performance in market we see substantial improvements in their lenses quality (which now approximates to Canon) for significantly lower price. Canon is loosing ground in this area.

Only the Sigma 35mm comes close to or beats the comparable Canon's L offerings. There is no reason to believe that a 35mm 1.4L II won't be released in future.

Also, many customers really expects reductions of prices of Canon  production due to Yen's performance in the market, however, Canon is making significant profits and disappointing customers who would like to buy cheaper Canon cameras or lenses. Such approach is very dangerous as many customers are dissatisfied and are buying third party lenses as well as changing Canon religion to others.

As I mentioned in my earlier posts ... WHY? Why do you feel entitled to a price reduction if the USD is translating into more JPY? If it ain't broke, don't fix it. The only reason Canon would reduce prices is if sales were not going strong.

When I look how significant improvements are made in electronics (computer chips, computers, TVs etc.) photography area is lacking innovations. 4-5 year old sensors, DIGIC V are used. What I would really expect that Canon would make really serious investments into sensors, camera chip area, would renew its lenses line and become progressive company. Now I see only stagnant company which is milking the same almost dead cow and enjoying short term profits.

Tried the 1DX and the 24-70 II / 600mm II?
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Efka76

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Re: That's my money you are profiting from Canon!!!
« Reply #10 on: April 24, 2013, 12:45:08 PM »
Does Sigma/Tamron offer a 70-200 2.8 that performs as well as the Canon? Nope. How bout a 24-70? 2.8? Hardly. The cost (R&D, tooling, marketing, advertising etc.) of the 7D was most likely recovered about 12-18 months into the run. The new 7D2 needs all these things so yes, Canon will continue to produce this amazing camera to fund better products.

Answer is yes! Take a look at  Tamron SP 24-70 2.8 which is direct competitor of Canon EF 24-70 2.8L MKII. Tamron's quality is slighty less worse than Canon's, however, Tamron has stabilisation. Also, try Tamron SP 70-200 2.8 which quality is very good as well. Both Tamron lenses are much cheaper. That why I told that third party manufacturers are taking quite significant part of Canon's lens market.

Also, most people don't follow what the currency markets do so the de-valuation is not why they want lower prices. They want lower prices because that is human nature.

Here you are also wrong. Everybody is looking what competitors are doing. If competitors can offer similar quality products for much lower price that means that Canon is doing something wrong: 1) Maybe they have issues in supply chain 2) Maybe they invest very heavily into R&D (which is not the case) 3) Using Yen's devaluation for their own profit (when competitors using this factor for lowering prices and increasing market share). Also, if you are not well educated and do not understand how changes in currencies rates affect different economies, please do not comment on matters which you do not understand (by the way, are you American? )

Mirror-less will not replace DLSR any time soon. Try shooting a moving object with a mirror-less.

Here you might be wrong as well. Take a look how quckly digital cameras overtook film cameras. The same could happen with DSLRs and mirrorless cameras. You are stating your very subjective opinion based on emotions and not facts.

I hope that I clearly explained everything to you.
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emag

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Re: That's my money you are profiting from Canon!!!
« Reply #11 on: April 24, 2013, 01:00:56 PM »
Now you've done it, J.R.  You smacked that fire ant mound with a shovel. :D

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Re: That's my money you are profiting from Canon!!!
« Reply #12 on: April 24, 2013, 01:01:32 PM »
Yes you do have to be careful with off beat humour humor on CR.

What we need is a little 'tongue-in-cheek' face icon !  ;)

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Re: That's my money you are profiting from Canon!!!
« Reply #12 on: April 24, 2013, 01:01:32 PM »

neuroanatomist

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Re: That's my money you are profiting from Canon!!!
« Reply #13 on: April 24, 2013, 01:03:30 PM »
I hope that I clearly explained everything to you.

Well, you did clearly explain that you apparently have a poor understanding of the relevant facts. Beyond that...   ::)
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Efka76

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Re: That's my money you are profiting from Canon!!!
« Reply #14 on: April 24, 2013, 01:09:11 PM »
Neuro, I value your opinion very much! Could you please explain where I was wrong. By the way, I am qualified CPA (FCCA) and not photographer. Accounting and financial statement analysis are the areas where I have really deep understanding  ;)
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Re: That's my money you are profiting from Canon!!!
« Reply #14 on: April 24, 2013, 01:09:11 PM »