December 18, 2014, 01:16:39 AM

Author Topic: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software  (Read 61616 times)

LetTheRightLensIn

  • Canon EF 400mm f/2.8L IS II
  • *********
  • Posts: 4053
    • View Profile
Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #120 on: May 07, 2013, 01:09:41 PM »

Onward and upward dudes!  To the cloud!

Yeah how much did you get paid to parrot that silly slogan hah.
Such a silly name too, makes something very old in the world of computing sound new and fresh and exciting (OK maybe not a silly name, but a sneaky one).

canon rumors FORUM

Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #120 on: May 07, 2013, 01:09:41 PM »

lilmsmaggie

  • EOS M2
  • ****
  • Posts: 192
    • View Profile
Re: Alternatives to Adobe Software
« Reply #121 on: May 07, 2013, 01:14:22 PM »
oh contraire mon ami  - you had to download it from their server.  That's the whole point of "Software as a Service."  Either way you look at it, you will pay to play, stay with what you have or look for a more palatable alternative.    Google will eventually move to the model for the Nik Collection.  Most of their service offerings are already based on it.

And yes, software piracy does come into play in this game.  Companies like Apple, Microsoft and Adobe that write software need to protect their revenues.  Sure it won't stop piracy but it does allow the software companies to stay one step ahead of the pirates.  Think about it:  you ever download an evaluation or "trial version," of any software and have it stop working after the trial period expired. 

No buy license - no ticket to ride.

oh contraire mon ami ...  just you wait and see.




I hate to be the harbinger of bad news but its not just Adobe.  It didn't start with Adobe and probably won't end with Adobe.  Enter Microsoft, Apple, Salesforce, Google (downloaded Nik Collection recently?), state government and private IT datacenters, Drop-Box, etc. etc.
                             ;)

Err....yes, I bought the NIK Collection, but it isn't a service, and I don't have to pay more than once.
I downloaded the plugins, they work, and I don't have to pay again for them....
6D, 5DMKII, Samyang 14 2.8 IF ED UMC, 24 1.4L, 24-105L, 100 2.8L Macro, 70-300 4-5.6L

LetTheRightLensIn

  • Canon EF 400mm f/2.8L IS II
  • *********
  • Posts: 4053
    • View Profile
Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #122 on: May 07, 2013, 01:15:10 PM »
I'm thinking Adobe hired that ex-ceo from Netflix ;)

More like JC Penney!

They both tried to change the business model, cost their companies billions, and lost their jobs.

The ironic thing is that in JC Penny's case the change in business plan was actually better (well assuming it had worked) for both the company AND the customer. Unfortunately shoppers who shop at those types of stores are not rational and love to see ridiculous fake sale and suggest retail prices and waste time playing all sorts of games.

Lloyd

  • Rebel SL1
  • ***
  • Posts: 98
    • View Profile
    • BRRLaw
Re: Alternatives to Adobe Software
« Reply #123 on: May 07, 2013, 01:15:47 PM »
Fasten yer wallets boys - its gonna be a bumpy ride.   They are the Borg -- Resistance is futile.  You will be assimilated.

I think you are correct they are the Borg.  They seem to be even below the Ferengi in their business model as even the Ferengi know the importance of customers.  Perhaps in their assimilation of the Ferengi they confused employee with customer in Rule 211 of the Rules of Aquistion which is as follows:

211. Employees are the rungs on the ladder of success. Don't hesitate to step on them.

 :)
5D mkIII, 60D, 20D; 24-70mm f/2.8L; 24-105mm F4L; 70-200mm f/2.8L IS;  TS-E 17mm f/4L; Canon FD 800mm 5.6L; Canon FD 55mm f/1.2;  10-22mm f/3.5-4.5; Canon extenders 1.4X II and 2X II; Canon  580EX and 430EX

Maui5150

  • Canon 7D MK II
  • *****
  • Posts: 499
    • View Profile
Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #124 on: May 07, 2013, 01:16:07 PM »
Here is CNET's take on the matter:

http://news.cnet.com/8301-1001_3-57582735-92/adobe-kills-creative-suite-goes-subscription-only/

"Customers "overwhelmingly" prefer it.

"But those who've carped about the Creative Cloud are a minority, Morris said.

"Overwhelmingly, when you compare the people who've complained about the new model to the people who loved it, it definitely skewed heavily to the new model," he said. "Obviously we would not be making a decision this big if the percentage of people in that category was so big it was the wrong thing for us to do." "

 ;D ;D ;D ;D :D :D :D ;) ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ::) ::) ::) :P :P ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D :'( ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D :o ::) ;D ;D ;D

Yeah because that is why every single thread on every single forum on the net is, for the first time in the history of the internet, at 99% agreement levels on something (and hint the something is not 'overwhelmingly' in support) and barely even bickering at all.

Lets look at a few things here:

1)  A great many of the people who already OWN Adope (and yes, I have formally renamed them A-Dope-E) CS Suite or similar batch of products, makes little sense to go to the cloud, especially if you already OWN all the products... so not sure the ranks, but I am willing to be a large number of Cloud users currently are those with little investment or installation base to begin with.

2)  Their own logic is flawed:

Saw this quoted:

According to the company, it was just too hard on its engineering ranks to support products that get upgraded constantly as well as separate, packaged versions that only get upgraded roughly every two years.

yet two paragraphs later

It remains to be seen how customers, particularly slow-moving large businesses, react to seeing the software move to a more constantly changing service. Morris said that Adobe is creating a product that will allow the stodgiest of customers to stay on a particular version of the service (though they will still be paying on a monthly basis).

So if stodgy customers are still staying on older versions, hmmm they have the same support issues.

It is ALL ABOUT THE MONEY with Adope

LetTheRightLensIn

  • Canon EF 400mm f/2.8L IS II
  • *********
  • Posts: 4053
    • View Profile
Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #125 on: May 07, 2013, 01:17:13 PM »
I GUARANTEE you, that as they add features or "upgrades" you can expect $75 - $100/ month for Creative Cloud.

Guarantee? That's pretty bold.  But ok, it is reasonable to expect that prices go up over time but if that's your assumption then the cost of one-time version upgrades would also go up.  At the end of the day the financial comparison is what you're paying now versus what you'll be under the new model.

If you're a PS only user your upgrade cost every two years was $300 (do I have that right or was it $200?) so your average monthly cost was $12.50 (more if an upgrade came out after 18 months).  Now you're paying $20 per month for PS... which is more and not insignificant but you're getting constant upgrades with new features instead of Adobe having to hold them back for a full new release, some cloud storage, and the right to install on two computers.  So there is extra value.  Whether those extras are worth an extra $7.50 per month to any particular user is hard to say.

EDIT... and there are reports they are planning to reduce the single app price to $10 per month.

Last upgrade was $199, and almost certain there was an early bird or sale at one point... Could have sworn I paid $149. 

The big difference is... Once I have paid, I get to use that software as long as my system runs.  I think my 4 year cost on Photoshop is in the neighborhood of $450.  I skipped one of the upgrades in there.  With the CC, that is looking like $960 outlay over 4 years if the $20/month sticks. 

But again... If I don't think the upgrade is worth it, I don't pay.  I can still use the software this year.  Next year, and with as cludgy as their install is, chances are even if I build a new machine, I can get it installed. 

That is also not to say as OS changes, you also don't pay for software you don't need.  Take Lightroom.  Many people still run Windows 98.  They don't need 7 and looksy, Lightroom 4 does not run on it. 

So for those running PS CS 6 on Windows 7 for example, 2 years from now whether it is Win 8 or what ever is next, if the PS CS 8 only runs on this new OS, you are stuck paying for a subscription for software you can't use, where the hard copy model, you save money.

Rent-Only software sucks!

Man excellent point the stupid 'cloud' stuff could even force you to use OS you don't even feel like using yet. Wht if the next version requires Windows 9 and it still stinks and you don't want to change from 7 until Windows 10 or something?

hamada

  • Rebel T5i
  • ****
  • Posts: 120
    • View Profile
Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #126 on: May 07, 2013, 01:18:48 PM »
recieved a newsletter fom x-force..... "we are working on a solution"   ;) :P

honestly, that will drive some customer away from adobe.
and i think that is GOOD for the industry.

i love to see more software and fresh ideas.

let adobe follow kodak!!!

nokia learned it the hard way too.... don´t ignore your customers.

canon rumors FORUM

Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #126 on: May 07, 2013, 01:18:48 PM »

meli

  • EOS M2
  • ****
  • Posts: 166
    • View Profile
Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #127 on: May 07, 2013, 01:18:57 PM »
There are still people running XP machines for the last 12years and judging by win8 adoption rates, some people will run win7s for another good 7 yrs. So CS6 can serve someone for quite a while. Actually the only problem in the long run might be the advent of affordable highres panels.

drjlo

  • 5D Mark III
  • ******
  • Posts: 661
    • View Profile
Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #128 on: May 07, 2013, 01:20:08 PM »
Okay, one more thing. We can complain all we want on this forum, but please, also go to one or more of the public Facebook pages for Adobe, such as https://www.facebook.com/Photoshop?fref=ts and post a comment there.

Companies don't like public humiliation and in this era of the Internet and social media, it can be the most effective tool. Please, go post your opinion and urge others to do so as well.

Good idea.  Left my comment on their FB page as well. 

LetTheRightLensIn

  • Canon EF 400mm f/2.8L IS II
  • *********
  • Posts: 4053
    • View Profile
Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #129 on: May 07, 2013, 01:22:15 PM »
And no, you won't have any warning they are going away, unless you are an insider.  They DO go poof in the middle of the night.

Outside of the financial industry, it is very rare that a major corporation suddenly and without warning shuts it doors and leaves all customers out in the cold.

Hah! Do you know how many game companies and other software companies have gone under??
When it comes to that most are too bedraggled and desperate to even care about trying to toss out patches to remove protection (or still hoping that someone will buy them or certain items out inthe future and too afraid of losing out on that chance).

Same for music. Music Giants went under. Anyone who wasn't lucky enough to have updated the license on all their songs before they went under got stuck with tens, hundreds of useless music files (and even those files will go away unless you losslessly burn them and then losslessly re-capture them from disc before your current computer changes too much and the rights go away again). RIAA never bothered to help anyone get what they had bought back either, they were just like cool haha now they all have to buy stuff a second time.





hamada

  • Rebel T5i
  • ****
  • Posts: 120
    • View Profile
Re: Alternatives to Adobe Software
« Reply #130 on: May 07, 2013, 01:23:05 PM »
And yes, software piracy does come into play in this game.  Companies like Apple, Microsoft and Adobe that write software need to protect their revenues.  Sure it won't stop piracy but it does allow the software companies to stay one step ahead of the pirates.  Think about it:  you ever download an evaluation or "trial version," of any software and have it stop working after the trial period expired. 

lol.. warez user will have the CC and don´t have to bother about connecting every 30 days.. wager a bet?

a worthless protection but annoying for legal customers...that will be the reallity.
just like NO-DVD cracks for games. legal customers have to bother about inserting the original  DVD... warez user just start a game.

the cloud will change nothing about that.
don´t be naive....
you don´t need a constant connection to adobe, so a crack will be made in no time.

just look at M$ and cracked local KMS server.

not that i justify piracy.. but these are the facts.
« Last Edit: May 07, 2013, 01:34:56 PM by hamada »

ablearcher

  • Rebel T5i
  • ****
  • Posts: 141
    • View Profile
Re: Alternatives to Adobe Software
« Reply #131 on: May 07, 2013, 01:41:27 PM »
And yes, software piracy does come into play in this game.  Companies like Apple, Microsoft and Adobe that write software need to protect their revenues.  Sure it won't stop piracy but it does allow the software companies to stay one step ahead of the pirates.  Think about it:  you ever download an evaluation or "trial version," of any software and have it stop working after the trial period expired. 

lol.. warez user will have the CC and don´t have to bother about connecting every 30 days.. wager a bet?

a worthless protection but annoying for legal customers...that will be the reallity.
just like NO-DVD cracks for games. legal customers have to bother about inserting the original  DVD... warez user just start a game.

the cloud will change nothing about that.
don´t be naive....
you don´t need a constant connection to adobe, so a crack will be made in no time.

just look at M$ and cracked local KMS server.

not that i justify piracy.. but these are the facts.

Spot on! This is exactly what is going to happen. Nothing to add here..
Canon 7D; Canon 5D MKIII; Canon EF-S 10-22mm; Canon 50mm 1.8; Canon 28mm 1.8; Canon 85mm 1.8; Canon 24-105mm 4.0 L; Canon 70-200mm f/2.8 L II IS; Canon 135mm 2.0 L; Canon 35mm 1.4 L.

unfocused

  • Canon EF 300mm f/2.8L IS II
  • ********
  • Posts: 2208
    • View Profile
    • Unfocused: A photo website
Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #132 on: May 07, 2013, 02:07:36 PM »
Can't stop commenting on this thread -- sorry.

One thing people need to understand is that to Adobe, "Cloud" is just a marketing name. This is not a true "cloud" application. Ironic for a software company, but apparently somebody in marketing thought "cloud" sounded cool and modern.

As others have pointed out, the software gets downloaded on your machine just like today. The only difference is that if you stop paying, they nuke it.

Also, when people do their calculations, many here are comparing the subscription price to the full version costs. And, yes, it can look like a good deal if you are new to the applications and have to buy a brand new full version. But, I suspect most people are "upgraders" like myself, who bought a full version years ago and upgraded and expanded their options when Adobe offered deals.

I think I probably started with one license for Pagemaker, got that converted to InDesign and then, as Adobe started offering bundles, they gave owners of individual products a decent (but still steep) price to expand. Point is, you should compare the price of this subscription to the upgrade price, not the full retail price. Second point on this, Adobe only upgraded a "full" step every two years - Release version 1 in year one, version 1.5 in year two and then version 2 in year three. The cost for the .5 versions was usually much smaller and Adobe considered the full number versions as the true upgrades. So, you really only needed to pay every two years to remain current.

So, if you want to get an accurate picture of just how much more this is costing, take the cost of a two-year subscription and compare that to the cost of an upgrade. CS6 Design and Web Premium Upgrade right now is $375. Two year cost would be less than $16/month. So, even those on the "bargain" $20/month plan will be paying more and Adobe is only promising the $20/month price for one year.

Yeah, I'll probably go ahead and pony up for the $20 month plan in the first year. But I will be watching the market, watching what competition emerges and really evaluating my needs. As it stands now, I seldom use anything but Dreamweaver and Photoshop, with the occasional use of InDesign. Flash is dead, so that's of no use. I've kept buying because I figured it was worth the investment to stay current for the times when I do need one of the other programs, but now I will use the next year to take a serious look at what I do use and how often. Dreamweaver is fast becoming unnecessary with the growth of PHP. For the little I use InDesign, I can keep the CSS6 version pretty much forever. So the deciding factor will be what Photoshop competitors emerge.

Sorry for the long winded rant.
pictures sharp. life not so much. www.unfocusedmg.com

canon rumors FORUM

Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #132 on: May 07, 2013, 02:07:36 PM »

xps

  • Canon 6D
  • *****
  • Posts: 404
    • View Profile
Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #133 on: May 07, 2013, 02:40:47 PM »
The Wall Street Journal is stating that Adobe is abandoning the packaged software model in favor of Creative Cloud, and plans no further release of Creative Suit after the current 6.0.
If I'm not wrong its been a year since they started Adobe Creative Cloud, but it is still not available in my region http://www.adobe.com/mena_en/products/creativecloud.html?promoid=JFQGY

Where do you live? I just know the Rienz, a river in the south tyrol... esp Itay

Maui5150

  • Canon 7D MK II
  • *****
  • Posts: 499
    • View Profile
Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #134 on: May 07, 2013, 02:44:50 PM »
Man excellent point the stupid 'cloud' stuff could even force you to use OS you don't even feel like using yet. Wht if the next version requires Windows 9 and it still stinks and you don't want to change from 7 until Windows 10 or something?

Well yes and no.  They would not FORCE you to change OS.... you would be forced to pay for basically an upgrade you may never use.

What I have seen in the IT world is a lot slower adoption of Software.  There are still windows XP and 98 machines in the wild, especially XP as well as look at Office and even though there is not only 2007 and 2010... a ton of people are still on 2003.

So the key for Adobe, is to get people to pay, regardless of whether they use the software.  Even if Adobe does not jack up their prices,

5 year outlay = $2760
10 year outlay = $5760

What Adobe wants is for people to sign up for the larger package, find uses for products they may not use because they are there, and then SLOWLY and CONSISTENTLY take more money.

It is far easier to get $50/month out of someone that $3,000, and by selling the $30/mo first, most will forget when the price goes up since it will be just jammed in the middle of the Credit Card statement.

As well.  Ever notice.

Creative Cloud = CC

Credit Card = CC

Basically this is Adobe Credit Card Charging Consortium

canon rumors FORUM

Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #134 on: May 07, 2013, 02:44:50 PM »