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Author Topic: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software  (Read 57066 times)

alexanderferdinand

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Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #285 on: May 13, 2013, 02:13:38 AM »
I own (a license) for PS CS6.
I dont like the monthly fee, because I want to decide if I need the latest s* or not.

Like someone mentioned before: its like Canon forces you to have the latest model.
(I´m still happy with my 1D4).
And I want to decide to pay the package once when I want.

Its not the money, I have enough. I simply dont like to be pushed in the "rental" path.

My 2 €- cents.

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Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #285 on: May 13, 2013, 02:13:38 AM »

Ladislav

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Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #286 on: May 13, 2013, 04:35:33 AM »
I hate cloud software. I have a PC only for the internet and not willing to go online with a pc with all my images on the harddisc.

Looks like you don't understand a difference between cloud software / storage and just subscription with cloud server to validate your software license. You don't have to put any of your PSDs to cloud. You even don't have to be always online to use CC products. You just need to download the product, install it and occasionally get connected to internet to get updates and validate license.
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Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #287 on: May 13, 2013, 06:58:28 AM »
I hate cloud software. I have a PC only for the internet and not willing to go online with a pc with all my images on the harddisc.

Looks like you don't understand a difference between cloud software / storage and just subscription with cloud server to validate your software license. You don't have to put any of your PSDs to cloud. You even don't have to be always online to use CC products. You just need to download the product, install it and occasionally get connected to internet to get updates and validate license.
i think he got it, it was probably more of a general statement. I agree with him on that one.

smithy

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Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #288 on: May 13, 2013, 07:14:40 AM »
Hmm... in 2008 I bought CS4 Design Premium for around $400 (as a student).  I still use it five years on.

With the new CC subscription, the cost of ownership by now would have been around $1800.  If I had remained a student from 2008 until now it would have cost me $720 (they offer 60% discount for students).  But I was only a student for one year (mid-life crisis), meaning the price from then until now would have been $1584.

I know which model I prefer.

As a side note: to those that had CS4, but now use CS6, are there many improvements between the two versions?  If there's enough incentive, I'll just buy a student copy of CS6 DP while I still can (my wife's now the student)... it's still $400...
« Last Edit: May 13, 2013, 07:28:13 AM by smithy »
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Meh

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Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #289 on: May 13, 2013, 08:45:00 AM »
I'm not really sure why this matters though. Can't people just use CS6? I bet that most people could do their photoshopping using the old & now free CS2.

If Adobe is not willing to bring offline software like Photoshop CS6 Extended on the market and enables the download for the new camera raw updates then I change to another product.

Why? Why not just use CS6? Is there something superior offered by another company?

Yes, they can keep using CS6 for years to come.  No, there is nothing superior offered by another company.  Despite some people's claims about how Adobe has bungled every release and will be out of business soon, PS is the undisputed champ of photo editing software.

Meh

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Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #290 on: May 13, 2013, 08:48:30 AM »
Hmm... in 2008 I bought CS4 Design Premium for around $400 (as a student).  I still use it five years on.

With the new CC subscription, the cost of ownership by now would have been around $1800.  If I had remained a student from 2008 until now it would have cost me $720 (they offer 60% discount for students).  But I was only a student for one year (mid-life crisis), meaning the price from then until now would have been $1584.

I know which model I prefer.

As a side note: to those that had CS4, but now use CS6, are there many improvements between the two versions?  If there's enough incentive, I'll just buy a student copy of CS6 DP while I still can (my wife's now the student)... it's still $400...

Having your wife buy PS at the student price for you, who is not a student, is essentially pirating the software.  If you're willing to pirate the software part way, why not just go all the way and download it from the net for free. 

Harry Muff

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Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #291 on: May 13, 2013, 09:47:02 AM »
Hmm... in 2008 I bought CS4 Design Premium for around $400 (as a student).  I still use it five years on.

With the new CC subscription, the cost of ownership by now would have been around $1800.  If I had remained a student from 2008 until now it would have cost me $720 (they offer 60% discount for students).  But I was only a student for one year (mid-life crisis), meaning the price from then until now would have been $1584.

I know which model I prefer.

As a side note: to those that had CS4, but now use CS6, are there many improvements between the two versions?  If there's enough incentive, I'll just buy a student copy of CS6 DP while I still can (my wife's now the student)... it's still $400...

Having your wife buy PS at the student price for you, who is not a student, is essentially pirating the software.  If you're willing to pirate the software part way, why not just go all the way and download it from the net for free.


Oh, FFS…
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Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #291 on: May 13, 2013, 09:47:02 AM »

smithy

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Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #292 on: May 13, 2013, 09:58:25 AM »
Hmm... in 2008 I bought CS4 Design Premium for around $400 (as a student).  I still use it five years on.

With the new CC subscription, the cost of ownership by now would have been around $1800.  If I had remained a student from 2008 until now it would have cost me $720 (they offer 60% discount for students).  But I was only a student for one year (mid-life crisis), meaning the price from then until now would have been $1584.

I know which model I prefer.

As a side note: to those that had CS4, but now use CS6, are there many improvements between the two versions?  If there's enough incentive, I'll just buy a student copy of CS6 DP while I still can (my wife's now the student)... it's still $400...

Having your wife buy PS at the student price for you, who is not a student, is essentially pirating the software.  If you're willing to pirate the software part way, why not just go all the way and download it from the net for free.
Honestly?  So you're saying that if you came to my house and logged onto my computer and used my student copy of CS4, which I purchased LEGITIMATELY, you are pirating the software?  My wife and I live in the same house and share the same computer... I have the license for Windows 7 and Office on my computer, but my wife also uses that software - is she pirating from Microsoft now?  I think you've got it really quite wrong.
5D Mark III, 40D, 1V.  Bunch of strobes, lenses and other bits.
They're, their, there, it's, its, too, to, than, then, you're, your.  One lens, two lenses, the lens's aperture.

cayenne

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Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #293 on: May 13, 2013, 10:05:54 AM »

People don't like changes and subscription model is a big change in the way how we get SW. It will become more common in the future and people will accept it eventually.

I sincerely hope not.

By having a consumer revolt, and not just letting this 'go' as many seem to want to do.....we might just let the corporations know this is not a path the consumer wants to be forced down.

Believe it or not, the one thing even large companies listen to is....the loud voice of the consumer pocketbook opening or closing.

If enough people unite against this....the voice will be heard.

A recent example, is the latest release of the game Sim City, which required an always 'on' internet connection to play what is essentially at its heart, a single player game.

Sales of that game were WAY below what was projected. People simply refused to be forced down that road on that game. Possibly EA will listen next time? If this type thing happens enough, well, they DO want to make $$ off you and that's the bottom line.

If you simple take it as a given and roll over, then sure...Adobe and other will go down this path.

Vote with your wallet, it is plain and simple.

C

You chose probably the worst example. EA is the symbol of companies not looking at customers feedback. Just go through their releases in past few years. A lot of them were disappointments with pretty negative feedback - Orgin included. The sales problem of Sim City was not in the "always online" but in the quality of the game. Gamers already showed many times that "always on" is not actually a problem (even you can read about it all over the internet).  We can put another example - Diablo III which shows that even with such "a big problem" like always on the game can have a huge commercial success.

As a side note I own about two hundreds games for PC (physical media and Steam) and XBox360. I really wish I could get them through some sort of subscription instead. It would save me a lot of $$$. End of off-topic ...

Subscription model is already visible in business environment where whole products are offered as a service and it slowly creeps into customer environment with different subscription based services or even products - for example Office 365. There are also subscription based products where you own the product at the end of the subscription but then you generally pay almost the whole product (or upgrade) every release cycle so its more like software assurance then a real subscription. So far I see subscription as more affordable way to get an expensive software even if it means paying more in the long term.

You know, I'm seeing several posters with extremely LOW numbers of posts.

I have to think we have some 'shills' on the list here, they seem to be endlessly promoting the merits of this new Adobe plan.

Just my suspicions.

C

Meh

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Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #294 on: May 13, 2013, 10:06:30 AM »
Hmm... in 2008 I bought CS4 Design Premium for around $400 (as a student).  I still use it five years on.

With the new CC subscription, the cost of ownership by now would have been around $1800.  If I had remained a student from 2008 until now it would have cost me $720 (they offer 60% discount for students).  But I was only a student for one year (mid-life crisis), meaning the price from then until now would have been $1584.

I know which model I prefer.

As a side note: to those that had CS4, but now use CS6, are there many improvements between the two versions?  If there's enough incentive, I'll just buy a student copy of CS6 DP while I still can (my wife's now the student)... it's still $400...

Having your wife buy PS at the student price for you, who is not a student, is essentially pirating the software.  If you're willing to pirate the software part way, why not just go all the way and download it from the net for free.
Honestly?  So you're saying that if you came to my house and logged onto my computer and used my student copy of CS4, which I purchased LEGITIMATELY, you are pirating the software?  My wife and I live in the same house and share the same computer... I have the license for Windows 7 and Office on my computer, but my wife also uses that software - is she pirating from Microsoft now?  I think you've got it really quite wrong.

I don't have it wrong at all... using someone elses software on their computer that they legitimately purchased is typically allowed under licencing agreements.  But having someone else, regardless of whether it is a family member, buy a student version intended for your use, when you are not a student, is not allowed.

In this case, your wife may have purchased the student version legitimately you YOU didn't.  You are not a student and are not using the software in the capacity of a student.


cayenne

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Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #295 on: May 13, 2013, 10:09:22 AM »
Hmm... in 2008 I bought CS4 Design Premium for around $400 (as a student).  I still use it five years on.

With the new CC subscription, the cost of ownership by now would have been around $1800.  If I had remained a student from 2008 until now it would have cost me $720 (they offer 60% discount for students).  But I was only a student for one year (mid-life crisis), meaning the price from then until now would have been $1584.

I know which model I prefer.

As a side note: to those that had CS4, but now use CS6, are there many improvements between the two versions?  If there's enough incentive, I'll just buy a student copy of CS6 DP while I still can (my wife's now the student)... it's still $400...

Having your wife buy PS at the student price for you, who is not a student, is essentially pirating the software.  If you're willing to pirate the software part way, why not just go all the way and download it from the net for free.

Geez Man,

How long have you been working for Adobe....?

C

Meh

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Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #296 on: May 13, 2013, 10:13:02 AM »
Hmm... in 2008 I bought CS4 Design Premium for around $400 (as a student).  I still use it five years on.

With the new CC subscription, the cost of ownership by now would have been around $1800.  If I had remained a student from 2008 until now it would have cost me $720 (they offer 60% discount for students).  But I was only a student for one year (mid-life crisis), meaning the price from then until now would have been $1584.

I know which model I prefer.

As a side note: to those that had CS4, but now use CS6, are there many improvements between the two versions?  If there's enough incentive, I'll just buy a student copy of CS6 DP while I still can (my wife's now the student)... it's still $400...

Having your wife buy PS at the student price for you, who is not a student, is essentially pirating the software.  If you're willing to pirate the software part way, why not just go all the way and download it from the net for free.


Oh, FFS…

How should I take your comment... "Oh, FFS" you didn't realize that... or "Oh, FFS"... I'm being too technical...

My point is meant to be illustrative... people are whining on and on about the new CC model and the higher costs and in some cases are claiming Adobe will lose customers and because they don't like it here's how they're going to get around it.  Frankly, I don't care and don't judge anyone who buys a student version when they are not a student or outright pirates it.... but don't take some solice in the fact that you're only somewhat violating the license terms.  If you know you're not a student but go out of your way to get a student copy just to save some money and not pay Adobe's price... then you're halfway pirating it... so go all the way and download it for free.  It's quite easy.
« Last Edit: May 13, 2013, 10:18:53 AM by Meh »

Meh

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Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #297 on: May 13, 2013, 10:16:50 AM »
Hmm... in 2008 I bought CS4 Design Premium for around $400 (as a student).  I still use it five years on.

With the new CC subscription, the cost of ownership by now would have been around $1800.  If I had remained a student from 2008 until now it would have cost me $720 (they offer 60% discount for students).  But I was only a student for one year (mid-life crisis), meaning the price from then until now would have been $1584.

I know which model I prefer.

As a side note: to those that had CS4, but now use CS6, are there many improvements between the two versions?  If there's enough incentive, I'll just buy a student copy of CS6 DP while I still can (my wife's now the student)... it's still $400...

Having your wife buy PS at the student price for you, who is not a student, is essentially pirating the software.  If you're willing to pirate the software part way, why not just go all the way and download it from the net for free.

Geez Man,

How long have you been working for Adobe....?

C

I don't and per my other response just posted my point is meant to be illustrative...  a person is either playing by the rules or they aren't... if you're willing and comfortable going around the rules to save some money then just download it for free.  People tend to legitimize and justify their behavior as long as it's "not too bad" or "I had no choice" or "it's not my fault" etc.  But that's BS.

Edit:  just another though on this topic... it's rather interesting to discuss copyright issues in relation to photography... I've often wondered if Adobe (for example) suffers less piracy than other software companies because photographers in general are going to be more sensitive to copyright due to self interest... we all depend on copyright to protect our work so perhaps it's less likely that photographers would pirate photo software?
« Last Edit: May 13, 2013, 10:32:01 AM by Meh »

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Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #297 on: May 13, 2013, 10:16:50 AM »

unfocused

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Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #298 on: May 13, 2013, 10:46:08 AM »
Regarding Student-Teacher Software licenses, does anyone know what the licensing agreement actually says, or are we just having a bar stool legal discussion?

I've never purchased the educational version. I wonder what the agreement actually requires. Does it prohibit other household members from using the software? Does one need to be registered in a course that requires the software? Can you purchase software not related to the classes you are taking (for example, if a taking an HTML course, can you only purchase Dreamweaver, or are you eligible to purchase the entire suite?)

I always thought part of the purpose of educational software was to promote the product by establishing a base of students who know and use the program and then, when they leave school, they will be more inclined to a) encourage their employers to use that software program and b) when they advance to the point where they are making purchasing decisions for their employers they will be more likely to select the software.

In other words, I always thought it was as much a marketing tool as anything. That was, I assumed, one reason why the purchasing rules are rather lax, but the company offers no upgrade path.

Following Meh's logic, it seems that a student who buys CS6 to use a part of a hobby that is unrelated to school work might also be guilty of pirating the software.
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Meh

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Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #299 on: May 13, 2013, 11:16:59 AM »
@unfocused you're absolutely correct, it is a marketing tactic... to build a base as you said but also simple "segmented marketing" in which you charge a lower price to certain groups (students, seniors, etc.) who are less likely to buy at full price.  But it only works if there is a clear and enforceable differentiating factor among those groups.  Age works well because it's unambiguous but it's only enforceable for certain things like movie tickets... it doesn't work well for software.    "Personal" vs. "Business" actually doesn't work well because it's not always clear so what usually is done is to omit business features form a home version.   "Student" works well for software because you can require a valid registration at at an accredited school but you still need to put some protection which can be leaving out certain functions or not being able to upgrade.

Software is almost never transferable.  It is only valid for the person who licenses it (not necessarily who pays) and you can not transfer to another person or company if you decide you don't need it.  You can buy used software but it's technically not allowed... it's just very difficult to enforce.   

It should be pretty plain that it is not allowed to have a student buy you a discounted version if you are not a student.  The argument that "your wife" is a student might seem valid because you might think of it is a "family purchase" but it's not.   Anyone can use the software that's installed on one machine but should the "family" pay for the license according to the lowest priced user or the highest.  I didn't go read the Adobe license agreement to confirm so if someone knows better please speak up but I think the answer is the "highest".
« Last Edit: May 13, 2013, 11:19:16 AM by Meh »

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Re: Adobe to Stop Making Packaged Software
« Reply #299 on: May 13, 2013, 11:16:59 AM »