July 26, 2014, 03:50:59 PM

Author Topic: Digitalrev speculates on D7100 vs. 7D2  (Read 14421 times)

Dylan777

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Re: Digitalrev speculates on D7100 vs. 7D2
« Reply #30 on: May 29, 2013, 12:46:59 AM »
Keep in mind 7D was designed for speed, not so much high ISO. I can see 7D II might have 61pts AF like 5D III and an increase in frame rate(maybe 10-fps). BUT NOT IN HIGH ISO or LOW LIGHT like 5D III, regardless what the new sensor might be.

Just the opposite, IMO.
It's much more likely that we'll see a big step up in image quality than a big step in features.
See my previous post.

Quote
Canon will not put 7D II in near 5D III  in term of high ISO/LOW LIGHT. 5D III is only 1yr old plus, it still have another 3-4yrs more before we seeing any rumors 5D 4.

I disagree.

The 5DIII needs to differentiate itself much better from both the 6D and the 7DII.
And the only way it can do that is by getting a high-quality ~30MP sensor.

So, I'm actually expecting that the 5DIII will get a replacement sooner than many expect.
Maybe as early as the spring of 2015.

I'll put my 25cents on the line that 7D II will not out perform 5D III in high ISO/low light.

Even Fuji & Sony are not capable to have their crop sensor out performs 5D III FF sensor yet.
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Re: Digitalrev speculates on D7100 vs. 7D2
« Reply #30 on: May 29, 2013, 12:46:59 AM »

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Re: Digitalrev speculates on D7100 vs. 7D2
« Reply #31 on: May 29, 2013, 01:56:54 AM »
I'll put my 25cents on the line that 7D II will not out perform 5D III in high ISO/low light.

OK, outperforming might be a stretch. But being quite close is not unrealistic ... at all.

If you compare Nikon's D7100 with the 5DII (not III) on DxO, you will see that they are very close in every measurement.
The 7DII needs to be only slightly better than the D7100 and it will be in 5DII territory wrt image quality - which in turn is quite close to the 5DIII.

And honestly, if the 7DII is not at least slightly better than the D7100 in image quality, Canon shouldn't bother with an update, thank you very much 8).

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Re: Digitalrev speculates on D7100 vs. 7D2
« Reply #32 on: May 29, 2013, 11:08:58 AM »
I'll put my 25cents on the line that 7D II will not out perform 5D III in high ISO/low light.

OK, outperforming might be a stretch. But being quite close is not unrealistic ... at all.

If you compare Nikon's D7100 with the 5DII (not III) on DxO, you will see that they are very close in every measurement.
The 7DII needs to be only slightly better than the D7100 and it will be in 5DII territory wrt image quality - which in turn is quite close to the 5DIII.

And honestly, if the 7DII is not at least slightly better than the D7100 in image quality, Canon shouldn't bother with an update, thank you very much 8).

according to what i have known, iso improvement only about a stop or less on every single time new canon release a new model (i am talking about raw file, not jpeg file)

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Re: Digitalrev speculates on D7100 vs. 7D2
« Reply #33 on: May 29, 2013, 11:16:35 AM »
I'll put my 25cents on the line that 7D II will not out perform 5D III in high ISO/low light.

OK, outperforming might be a stretch. But being quite close is not unrealistic ... at all.

If you compare Nikon's D7100 with the 5DII (not III) on DxO, you will see that they are very close in every measurement.
The 7DII needs to be only slightly better than the D7100 and it will be in 5DII territory wrt image quality - which in turn is quite close to the 5DIII.

And honestly, if the 7DII is not at least slightly better than the D7100 in image quality, Canon shouldn't bother with an update, thank you very much 8).

according to what i have known, iso improvement only about a stop or less on every single time new canon release a new model (i am talking about raw file, not jpeg file)

yes;  but past peformance is no guarentee of future results :D  as they say.   I think the reason folks are hoping for more than one stop is due to the Allure of Canon's "new mfg process" and the assumption that this will pace or even eclipse  the competition in sensor technology.  This leads to a fair amount of salivating that the 7D2 will be so good that it will approach or even outrun the 5D3 IQ, leading to further salivating that the 5D4 will come soon after the 7D2

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Re: Digitalrev speculates on D7100 vs. 7D2
« Reply #34 on: May 29, 2013, 11:50:18 AM »
If Canon shall compete they must increase the QE up to Sony ,Toshibas level and bring down the read out noise, nothing you do easily with  Canon current sensor architecture.

Must they?  If you mean, compete in terms of sensor performance, certainly.  But as has been stated many times, Canon and Nikon sell cameras, not naked sensors.  The D7000 has a better sensor than the 7D, but the 7D sold rings around the D7000.  I don't expect the D7100 vs. 7DII story to be any different.
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Re: Digitalrev speculates on D7100 vs. 7D2
« Reply #35 on: May 29, 2013, 02:22:40 PM »
aha , you are talking sales, and Im talking about QE , be in front of research, colors, DR, noise, etc , you have all parameters at DXO sensor ranking. If you are  tourist shooting you can buy a good compact camera, why bother about a SLR at all ?.
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No, I'm talking cameras.  Shutter lag, AF performance, frame rate...things that help make sure the image you want the sensor to capture is the one the sensor actually captures.  A shot with less noise and more DR that's slightly OOF and  a fraction of a second after the peak of action is a throwaway.  It still baffles me that people fail to understand that there's  more to capturing a moment than the sensor inside the camera.
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3kramd5

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Re: Digitalrev speculates on D7100 vs. 7D2
« Reply #36 on: May 29, 2013, 02:30:14 PM »
A shot with less noise and more DR that's slightly OOF and  a fraction of a second after the peak of action is a throwaway [compared to one with more noise, less DR, proper focus and timed correctly]

Absolutely.

When I take multiple images of the same subject with more-or-less the same framing (these days most often my son), I look first to focus and exposure. If all of them are equal, I'd then look to noise. With my moving target, I'd rather shoot ISO320 1/400 than ISO160 1/200, that's for sure.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2013, 02:33:25 PM by 3kramd5 »
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Re: Digitalrev speculates on D7100 vs. 7D2
« Reply #36 on: May 29, 2013, 02:30:14 PM »

sanj

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Re: Digitalrev speculates on D7100 vs. 7D2
« Reply #37 on: May 29, 2013, 02:38:31 PM »
Keep in mind 7D was designed for speed, not so much high ISO. I can see 7D II might have 61pts AF like 5D III and an increase in frame rate(maybe 10-fps). BUT NOT IN HIGH ISO or LOW LIGHT like 5D III, regardless what the new sensor might be.

Just the opposite, IMO.
It's much more likely that we'll see a big step up in image quality than a big step in features.
See my previous post.

Quote
Canon will not put 7D II in near 5D III  in term of high ISO/LOW LIGHT. 5D III is only 1yr old plus, it still have another 3-4yrs more before we seeing any rumors 5D 4.

I disagree.

The 5DIII needs to differentiate itself much better from both the 6D and the 7DII.
And the only way it can do that is by getting a high-quality ~30MP sensor.

So, I'm actually expecting that the 5DIII will get a replacement sooner than many expect.
Maybe as early as the spring of 2015.

I'll put my 25cents on the line that 7D II will not out perform 5D III in high ISO/low light.

Even Fuji & Sony are not capable to have their crop sensor out performs 5D III FF sensor yet.

Absolutely. Obviously. Size matters!

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Re: Digitalrev speculates on D7100 vs. 7D2
« Reply #38 on: May 29, 2013, 02:57:28 PM »
If the 7D MKII will have a crop sensor, I do not understand how the camera will have as good of high ISO performance as the full frame 5D MKIII. 

Does anyone think the speculation of the 7D MKII high ISO performance is based on the in camera jpeg processing, or are they actually talking about the RAW files?

Thanks

That will never happen.  WHY? - You can't hold 1 gallon of water in 1/2 gallon bucket.

Yeah you don't.....

but you can process the first 1/2 and re-fill another half for one whole gallon.

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Re: Digitalrev speculates on D7100 vs. 7D2
« Reply #39 on: May 29, 2013, 03:00:04 PM »
Pro body style 7D, 12 volt battery (faster lens drive), 50-55 point AF, ISO on par with 5d3/1Dx (1 stop less would be good  on par and Ill buy one the day it comes out), C-FN similar to the 1Dx, weather sealing similar to the 1Dx and dual CF. Start the price at $3500-4000 and it will sell. If you can't afford it or think "Oh thats too expensive" then don't buy it and wait, as we have seen over the last few generations of cameras the price drops quickly.

I know pro sports shooters who still use the 7D and 1DIV over the 1Dx due to the crop factor. Honestly comparing the 7D to the 6D is apples and oranges, one is intended for action while the other is geared more towards wedding photographers and people getting into studio or making the jump from APS-C to FF.

And to answer the question, how do you fit a gallon into a half gallon bucket? Pressurize it.

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Re: Digitalrev speculates on D7100 vs. 7D2
« Reply #40 on: May 29, 2013, 03:12:06 PM »
If the 70D can compete with D7100, I guess will never see a 7D II

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Re: Digitalrev speculates on D7100 vs. 7D2
« Reply #41 on: May 29, 2013, 04:15:42 PM »
Im not bothered what Nikon does. I invested in Canon, love their products, think the new lens's are mind blowing so im staying put. As for the 7D, its still an excellent camera. I sold mine recently as i do sports and wildlife to stay with the 1D4 whilst prices stay up. Perhaps the new 7D and from a marketing perspective and there will be a new 7D, is pretty easy to see where it will be and what its specs will be. An autofocus as good as a 5D3 if not a touch faster, no pop up screen, a build same as the last one, functions pretty much the same, frame rate 8 to a possible 10 in essance a faster crop sensored 5D3. As for sensor performance, Canons latest are excellent and that tech will trickle down to the 7D. Low to mid 20 million ish pixels , better noise performance maybe a stop or two. That would bring it closer to a 1D4 performance not 5D3 as its to slow and doesnt have the reach I need. Im getting one when it breaks cover so i have aps-c-h and FF. All bases covered. As for performance, i shot a recent demo with a full frame, aps-h and aps-c. same time same place same lens. All are excellent but as the sensor size grows, you do see the quality increase but thats what id expect.
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Re: Digitalrev speculates on D7100 vs. 7D2
« Reply #42 on: May 29, 2013, 04:56:46 PM »
And to answer the question, how do you fit a gallon into a half gallon bucket? Pressurize it.

I think nuclear fusion would occur before your attempt succeeded.  ;)

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Re: Digitalrev speculates on D7100 vs. 7D2
« Reply #42 on: May 29, 2013, 04:56:46 PM »

Don Haines

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Re: Digitalrev speculates on D7100 vs. 7D2
« Reply #43 on: May 29, 2013, 05:15:46 PM »
aha , you are talking sales, and Im talking about QE , be in front of research, colors, DR, noise, etc , you have all parameters at DXO sensor ranking. If you are  tourist shooting you can buy a good compact camera, why bother about a SLR at all ?.
Toyota sales most cars in the world, Im not driving a Toyota but many are.I think there are better cars
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There is a Toyota in my driveway..... have you ever tried to carry two canoes on a roof-rack on the top of a Lamborghini? :)
« Last Edit: May 29, 2013, 06:07:22 PM by Don Haines »
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Re: Digitalrev speculates on D7100 vs. 7D2
« Reply #44 on: May 29, 2013, 05:25:41 PM »
aha , you are talking sales, and Im talking about QE , be in front of research, colors, DR, noise, etc , you have all parameters at DXO sensor ranking. If you are  tourist shooting you can buy a good compact camera, why bother about a SLR at all ?.
Toyota sales most cars in the world, Im not driving a Toyota but many are.I think there are better cars
How about you?


No, I'm talking cameras.  Shutter lag, AF performance, frame rate...things that help make sure the image you want the sensor to capture is the one the sensor actually captures.  A shot with less noise and more DR that's slightly OOF and  a fraction of a second after the peak of action is a throwaway.  It still baffles me that people fail to understand that there's  more to capturing a moment than the sensor inside the camera.


Exactly! Look at the image below.... it is a pileated woodpecker hoping along a fence. It is the timing that makes it an interesting picture.... a mid-air capture that is in focus... not dynamic range or iso performance.

The best camera is the one in your hands

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Re: Digitalrev speculates on D7100 vs. 7D2
« Reply #44 on: May 29, 2013, 05:25:41 PM »