August 01, 2014, 09:01:45 AM

Author Topic: New Macpro teased at Mac Conference  (Read 7957 times)

paul13walnut5

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Re: New Macpro teased at Mac Conference
« Reply #30 on: June 11, 2013, 10:39:14 AM »

paul13walnut5, I'm sorry to hear you've had issues with your MacPro's RAID and graphics card, but those are distinct from the computer itself. I've had no problems with my MacPro, any of its third-party parts, or any of the over 30 other Macs I've purchased over the years. They've proven their reliability again and again in a heavy-use work environment. Finally, opinions on FCPX vary. I personally don't do video (yet), but I know a lot of folks who at first didn't like the X version of FCP, but with its updates have come around to loving it. Either way, these machines are not just video editors.


I am just a video editor though, and Apples USP for me was FCP.  I know Apple aren't building a machine just for me.  And there's a lot of video editors on the same boat :)
The only thing realistically that specifically only Apple could do for me was FCP.

Had they at least been able to spec a mercury engine card without adding $1500 on to the price of a tower then I may have been tempted to stay with Apple as a platform.

The RAID was a G raid, and the graphics card was the stock part supplied (then replaced at cost, despite later recall, by apple) and what is a tower other than the sum of it's parts?  I'm not expecting apple to apologise, or for you to apologise on apples behalf, no more than I expect you, as somebody who hasn't personally done any video, to tell me, a video editor with 12 years final cut experience, what I should be editing on.

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Re: New Macpro teased at Mac Conference
« Reply #30 on: June 11, 2013, 10:39:14 AM »

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Re: New Macpro teased at Mac Conference
« Reply #31 on: June 11, 2013, 11:26:26 AM »
I need to upgrade. I've just realized my machine still has an Intel E6600 from 2006. 7 years of PC service. :|

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Re: New Macpro teased at Mac Conference
« Reply #32 on: June 11, 2013, 11:54:42 AM »
As an audio engineer relying on pci-express expansion cards and working on pro tools this new mac pro without any expansion card slots is a pile of crap. :(

I can see lots of studios moving to windows because of this.

form cripples function.


http://eshop.macsales.com/shop/Thunderbolt/PCIe_Chassis/Mercury_Helios


I know this exists but we are also using raid storage for example and I can't see why i should get a ton of extra cases / expansion chassis instead of checking out the PC world.

Niterider

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Re: New Macpro teased at Mac Conference
« Reply #33 on: June 11, 2013, 11:55:08 AM »
So it is a workstation with the ability to be customized similar to a laptop. Great thinking Apple.... I'll pass

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Re: New Macpro teased at Mac Conference
« Reply #34 on: June 11, 2013, 12:06:03 PM »
I don't need a designed machine in my studio, I need a tool, that works and runs Logic Pro and Pro Tools and the Adobe CC.

An upgradeable computer is the strict basis, this MacPro is far away from beeing a professional tool.
Based upon the cycle of life of a SSD, we can pretty much guess that the hard drives will be dead within 3-4 years (shorter life cycle).
This is not a professional computer, but a design "thing" that does not comply with what's needed in a proper studio with recording, video rendering and so on (yes it will do on short term, but in 2017, I would'nt like to put €€, €€€ in another machine just because that one is outdated).
What about my old soundcard? Graphic cards?
I don't want "thunderbolt ports", they are specific to Apple and 50€ for adaptators are just a big insult to people working on multiple platform.

PS: I am an Apple fan, but stop all the hype around any product they make.
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Re: New Macpro teased at Mac Conference
« Reply #35 on: June 11, 2013, 12:24:50 PM »
Cost could derail the purchase for me.  Not only the cost of the tube, but the extra expense of having thunderbolt accessories.  Current monitors are use DVI (I think - NEC spectraview) so unless they can be connected, will be a very hard decision to go with the Mac Pro for me

cayenne

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Re: New Macpro teased at Mac Conference
« Reply #36 on: June 11, 2013, 01:31:57 PM »
Interesting design, but it's a workstation - and if there was ever a use-application where the size of the box was not a primary concern, it's workstations.  All those custom parts means you can pretty much forget expandability.  No displayport or DVI, so you are pretty much limited to thunderbolt displays (or HDMI).  Performance sounds pretty great for the size.  Built-in bluetooth 4.0 and ac wifi is nice.  What'll it cost?  I assume unreasonable amounts of money.
I currently use a Thunderbolt to Displayport adapter to run my Dell U2711 monitor from my macbookpro (late 2011).

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Re: New Macpro teased at Mac Conference
« Reply #36 on: June 11, 2013, 01:31:57 PM »

cayenne

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Re: New Macpro teased at Mac Conference
« Reply #37 on: June 11, 2013, 01:41:19 PM »
As an audio engineer relying on pci-express expansion cards and working on pro tools this new mac pro without any expansion card slots is a pile of crap. :(

I can see lots of studios moving to windows because of this.

form cripples function.


http://eshop.macsales.com/shop/Thunderbolt/PCIe_Chassis/Mercury_Helios


I know this exists but we are also using raid storage for example and I can't see why i should get a ton of extra cases / expansion chassis instead of checking out the PC world.


You don't have any NAS disk systems running RAID outside of your computers' cases???

That's pretty common these days, rarely do you depend on the disk drives internal to the computer case....at least in my experience with anyone doing serious data storage, redundancy and even backup (mirrored RAID disk systems, tape, etc).

Niterider

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Re: New Macpro teased at Mac Conference
« Reply #38 on: June 11, 2013, 03:13:36 PM »
As an audio engineer relying on pci-express expansion cards and working on pro tools this new mac pro without any expansion card slots is a pile of crap. :(

I can see lots of studios moving to windows because of this.

form cripples function.


http://eshop.macsales.com/shop/Thunderbolt/PCIe_Chassis/Mercury_Helios


I know this exists but we are also using raid storage for example and I can't see why i should get a ton of extra cases / expansion chassis instead of checking out the PC world.


You don't have any NAS disk systems running RAID outside of your computers' cases???

That's pretty common these days, rarely do you depend on the disk drives internal to the computer case....at least in my experience with anyone doing serious data storage, redundancy and even backup (mirrored RAID disk systems, tape, etc).


NAS Systems are more for the home user, not for professional use. If this is a professional workstation as it is marketed to be, no one in their right mind would use an external raid array. Too much too loose. Much better off getting a workstation that has advanced raid controllers in order to adequately support a large internal hd array. Anyways, my bet would be the mainboard in this computer wont support past raid 5.

But then again, anyone serious about doing "serious data storage" uses server racks. Totally different ballpark and not applicable to this thread.

All this computer is is a overpriced cylinder with decent components and NO ability to expand in the future. But hey if you want to throw away $3-4k be my guest. I could build a computer with a Xeon E5-2687W for considerably less than this costs.

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Re: New Macpro teased at Mac Conference
« Reply #39 on: June 11, 2013, 03:25:29 PM »
It's a gorgeous and well-spec'd piece of hardware, impressive.

I don't accept the gripes people make about it not being internally capable of holding all their (old) add-ons.  Serious users usually have serious hardware OUTside of the CPU box; now you just HAVE to do it that way.. not that big a deal. (it's only money)  This new machine is just a processing pipe.

What would make me hot for this hardware is if it would actually boot Snow Leopard! The various lions all suck in comparison and I'm not holding out a lot of optimism for Mavericks getting back to anywhere near the power-user-friendly abilities of 10.6.x.
I've been working with, and on, macs since '85 and agree with many of the other old dogs who swear by 10.6; and swear at Apple for taking away so many useful features from those older OSes in the later versions.

Those of you new to the Apple experience don't know what you're missing.

I'll still plug away on my 2010 27" iMac running 10.6 for a few more years of stills editing and my i7 mini server is adept at handling the various other tasks, including day-to-day usage and running 10.8 for what few applications need the newer OS.

I'll likely get a hankering for a nice 4k display tho, and then I'll have to decide what platform I'll use at that time.

woodymirag

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Re: New Macpro teased at Mac Conference
« Reply #40 on: June 11, 2013, 03:36:41 PM »
I purchased a Mac Pro back in 2007. I pretty much maxed it out at the time with dual quad-core Xeons, 4 SATA 750GB drives and the Apple RAID card. Editing video (FCP), audio (Adobe Audition from CS5.5), and of course RAW photos (Adobe Camera Raw) from my 5DIII, what is shocking to me is how fast, reliable, and robust this machine has turned out to be, even to this day. Yeah, at the time of purchase, I was planning on doing video card upgrades and other expansion over the years, but I really haven't done it. It hasn't been that necessary.

Sure, I dropped upwards of $8K on this machine at the time, but it has lasted me 6 years and continues to perform quite admirably. It has never needed repair, and it's running all the time. I like that!

So, I am not that concerned about the new Mac Pro and expandability. If I decide to pillage my bank account for an upgrade (maybe after Canon releases a high megapixel SLR!), I will just try to max out everything I can afford, then leave the machine plugging away for hopefully another 6-7 years. I do require a CD/DVD drive for media creation, but otherwise, it's hard to complain with credibly about the specifications and myriad port flexibility.

I am by no means purely in the Apple camp having run an IT department for over a decade with mixed Windows flavors and Macs. I see (and hear from users!) both sides. What we've noticed is that even to this day, even our fastest Windows units still benefit from a Symantec Ghost re-imaging of the hard drive every 18 months or so. Maybe this isn't as necessary with Windows 8, but it is with previous flavors. We have not had this kind of issue with the MacOS, particularly the second half releases of Snow Leopard and Mountain Lion. Anyway, the Win/Mac thing is a tired old argument, and few in one camp are ever convinced by folks in the other camp. Personally, I don't care. But I think Apple has the edge at the moment with OS technology, performance, and reliability. If Mavericks is stable, the new Mac Pro is pretty compelling.

One other item on the new Mac Pro: Someone in the thread mentioned rack-mountability (or lack thereof). Funny, I thought of that the moment I saw the black cylinder form factor. I bet right now there are companies out there figuring out ways to get this into a rack. First one to market will make a bundle!
« Last Edit: June 11, 2013, 03:39:37 PM by woodymirag »

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Re: New Macpro teased at Mac Conference
« Reply #41 on: June 11, 2013, 04:27:42 PM »
Even if Apple had decided to make the new Mac Pro more adaptable and customizable, it would still be A LOT cheaper to build a custom PC. I definitely prefer OS X to Windows, but for a video/graphics workstation computer, all I care is that the operating system is stable.

I've been spec'ing custom PC builds. It takes a bit of work and research for someone who has never assembled a computer from scratch (me). But I can build a monster video workstation for under $4k. I can build EXACTLY what I want without arbitrary limitations. Hell, I could even do a Hacktintosh if I couldn't live without OS X.

BTW, I also still rock that late-2011 17" MBP. Unfortunately, that is not something I can build myself ;-)

cayenne

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Re: New Macpro teased at Mac Conference
« Reply #42 on: June 11, 2013, 04:49:23 PM »
As an audio engineer relying on pci-express expansion cards and working on pro tools this new mac pro without any expansion card slots is a pile of crap. :(

I can see lots of studios moving to windows because of this.

form cripples function.


http://eshop.macsales.com/shop/Thunderbolt/PCIe_Chassis/Mercury_Helios


I know this exists but we are also using raid storage for example and I can't see why i should get a ton of extra cases / expansion chassis instead of checking out the PC world.


You don't have any NAS disk systems running RAID outside of your computers' cases???

That's pretty common these days, rarely do you depend on the disk drives internal to the computer case....at least in my experience with anyone doing serious data storage, redundancy and even backup (mirrored RAID disk systems, tape, etc).


NAS Systems are more for the home user, not for professional use. If this is a professional workstation as it is marketed to be, no one in their right mind would use an external raid array. Too much too loose. Much better off getting a workstation that has advanced raid controllers in order to adequately support a large internal hd array. Anyways, my bet would be the mainboard in this computer wont support past raid 5.


Funny, in my server environments...we have SAN storage...effectively NAS....

Very seldom n the high end systems I work on for my day job, do I rely on servers with internal storage....and I'm talking multi-multi-terrabytes of data. Per server.

I'm quite used to using off server storage, with different RAID levels....different filesystems, etc. I'd say it certainly is professional in level to have your storage external to your CPUs.

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Re: New Macpro teased at Mac Conference
« Reply #42 on: June 11, 2013, 04:49:23 PM »

Niterider

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Re: New Macpro teased at Mac Conference
« Reply #43 on: June 11, 2013, 05:51:39 PM »
As an audio engineer relying on pci-express expansion cards and working on pro tools this new mac pro without any expansion card slots is a pile of crap. :(

I can see lots of studios moving to windows because of this.

form cripples function.


http://eshop.macsales.com/shop/Thunderbolt/PCIe_Chassis/Mercury_Helios


I know this exists but we are also using raid storage for example and I can't see why i should get a ton of extra cases / expansion chassis instead of checking out the PC world.


You don't have any NAS disk systems running RAID outside of your computers' cases???

That's pretty common these days, rarely do you depend on the disk drives internal to the computer case....at least in my experience with anyone doing serious data storage, redundancy and even backup (mirrored RAID disk systems, tape, etc).


NAS Systems are more for the home user, not for professional use. If this is a professional workstation as it is marketed to be, no one in their right mind would use an external raid array. Too much too loose. Much better off getting a workstation that has advanced raid controllers in order to adequately support a large internal hd array. Anyways, my bet would be the mainboard in this computer wont support past raid 5.


Funny, in my server environments...we have SAN storage...effectively NAS....

Very seldom n the high end systems I work on for my day job, do I rely on servers with internal storage....and I'm talking multi-multi-terrabytes of data. Per server.

I'm quite used to using off server storage, with different RAID levels....different filesystems, etc. I'd say it certainly is professional in level to have your storage external to your CPUs.



Kinda funny when you omit my comment about how this is not applicable to servers and your entire response is about servers...

There is no use arguing apples and oranges. 

AudioGlenn

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Re: New Macpro teased at Mac Conference
« Reply #44 on: June 11, 2013, 07:36:55 PM »
As an audio engineer relying on pci-express expansion cards and working on pro tools this new mac pro without any expansion card slots is a pile of crap. :(

I can see lots of studios moving to windows because of this.

form cripples function.

In some ways I agree.  I'm running a Pro Tools HD Native Rig (PCIe card, not thunderbolt) and I don't want to have to buy an external PCIe chassis to hook up.  If I ever move up to HDX, I'd have no choice.  Moving to PC is not an option for me as I run Final Cut X as well.

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Re: New Macpro teased at Mac Conference
« Reply #44 on: June 11, 2013, 07:36:55 PM »