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Author Topic: Medical joint overload by heavy dlsr?  (Read 6308 times)

John MARK

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Re: Medical joint overload by heavy dlsr?
« Reply #15 on: June 27, 2013, 07:05:01 AM »
Thanks for the CR self portrait Marsu!

Makes it much clearer now, at least for me !

Does my assumption that your finger has to compensate for ROTATIONAL TORQUE rather than overall weight sound right to you ?

If such is the case, this is where holding the flash unit freely in one hand and the (admittedly heavy) camera in the other hand might be helpful.

Point is, submit your body to various postures instead of just one, to minimize stress.

Just like hikers swapping shoes every two hours or so, to lessen foot pain during very long walks.

Cheers  :)



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Re: Medical joint overload by heavy dlsr?
« Reply #15 on: June 27, 2013, 07:05:01 AM »

Marsu42

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Re: Medical joint overload by heavy dlsr?
« Reply #16 on: June 27, 2013, 07:48:27 AM »
First off a lot of thanks to you all, this is really helping :-)

Yes, the grip will help. That's why I don't shoot with another bodies other than 1-series and Hasselblad.

I suspect as much, but only recently I can imagine how large of a difference it could make to have the little finger on the camera and not below it :-\

Probably the FB could be shifted over to the tripod mount  ring so you can ad a handstrap.

I tried that, unfortunately the bracket isn't build for that, and it hasn't got a drill hole so I could attach the stap under it when it's on the camera....

Does my assumption that your finger has to compensate for ROTATIONAL TORQUE rather than overall weight sound right to you ?

Yes, that's exactly it! ... at least when holding the camera in landscape orientation.

If such is the case, this is where holding the flash unit freely in one hand and the (admittedly heavy) camera in the other hand might be helpful. Point is, submit your body to various postures instead of just one, to minimize stress.

Good idea in general, and I'll see if I'll really purchase one of Syl's famous "extra long ettr cords"... but the advantage of a fixed bracket is that it's all in one piece and you can move, that's necessary for what I'm currently shooting...

I also thought about a that kind of support system bringing the weight to your chest video people sometimes use to get steadier.

... against my usual habit two thumbnails because it might make my point clearer why inflexible equipment isn't usable here.... quak. neigh. But for other purposes I might buy some body strap after all, though I really hate these.


Camerajah

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Re: Medical joint overload by heavy dlsr?
« Reply #17 on: June 27, 2013, 07:57:11 AM »
When shooting for long hours a support should be used ie mono pod or tripod failing that one should hold gear with left hand palm facing upwards thumb and first finger on focusing or zoom ring with left elbow tucked into body most of weight is on the left hand regardless if your left or right handed
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Harry Muff

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Re: Medical joint overload by heavy dlsr?
« Reply #18 on: June 27, 2013, 07:58:00 AM »
If you're not going to mount it on a monopod, then lose the tripod collar and get a good hold with your left hand under the lens. The way you you are holding it in those photos looks like how anyone that has no idea how to hold a camera does.
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Re: Medical joint overload by heavy dlsr?
« Reply #19 on: June 27, 2013, 08:04:39 AM »
Some cameras… With Canon written on them. Oh, and some lenses… Also with Canon written on them. Oh, and a shiny camera with Fuji written on it too...

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schill

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Re: Medical joint overload by heavy dlsr?
« Reply #20 on: June 27, 2013, 08:04:53 AM »

I "lay" the camera and lens into my left hand (with hand underneath, palm facing upward). The right hand doesn't carry much weight. I use my index finger to tweak focus and my thumb+pinky to change zoom. I've held the camera for 15+ hours and don't feel any fatigue from it (other than in my shoulders from having my arms up more than usual).

This is essentially what I do as well.  My left hand is usually under the lens (or camera and lens if the lens is small) and my left arm is taking most of the weight - and it's not concentrated on a few fingers.  I rarely ever support the weight in my right hand.  I'm typically shooting with a 7D and 70-200/2.8 and this works well for me.

I basically operate as if I have a lens with a camera hanging off the back, rather than as if I have a camera with a lens in the front.  Support the lens and operate the camera.  If I am carrying this arrangement (not shooting), I hold the lens, not the camera.

If I shoot vertically, I like my right hand above the camera rather than below.  The left hand is still holding the weight.  For shooting vertically, I find this more comfortable than using a grip (although I haven't used one since my film days long ago :) ).

schill

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Re: Medical joint overload by heavy dlsr?
« Reply #21 on: June 27, 2013, 08:09:04 AM »
If you're not going to mount it on a monopod, then lose the tripod collar and get a good hold with your left hand under the lens

I usually rotate the collar up (so that it is in front of the flash) as long as that doesn't interfere with anything else.  I find this is ok when holding the camera either horizontally or vertically.

I know several people who are most comfortable supporting the camera with their left hand under the base of the tripod collar.  The weight is supported by the collar on their palm and their fingers are free to operate the lens without bearing any of the weight.  I find that to be a bit awkward (and maybe not quite as stable) but I can't really see anything wrong with it.

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Re: Medical joint overload by heavy dlsr?
« Reply #21 on: June 27, 2013, 08:09:04 AM »

neuroanatomist

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Re: Medical joint overload by heavy dlsr?
« Reply #22 on: June 27, 2013, 08:20:22 AM »
A good start would be to support the weight with your left hand under the lens. With the 70-300L, I find the tripod ring helps with that and places my fingertips at the zoom ring (not the focus ring, which is where they want to go since that's the zoom ring position on all my other L-series zooms).

A battery grip would help in that you wouldn't be able have a finger under the camera. But it also adds more weight...  I think it's a good idea - I used grips before getting a 1-series.

My advice would be a new flash bracket and a hand strap. The strap transfers the weight to your hand/wrist.  Get the Really Right Stuff L-plate for the 60D - it's one of their newer modular designs that converts from base plate to full L bracket (but you have to pick for no grip vs grip).  The base plate has a lug for a hand strap.  Get the RRS wedding pro (WPF-QR) flash bracket. Like most brackets (unlike yours), it extends up the left-hand side of the camera, and it allows an easy flip for use in portrait orientation.
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Marsu42

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Re: Medical joint overload by heavy dlsr?
« Reply #23 on: June 27, 2013, 08:32:30 AM »
If you're not going to mount it on a monopod, then lose the tripod collar and get a good hold with your left hand under the lens.

Thanks a lot for the handling advice and the "how to" picture, that might a good part of my problem! The other part is that I too often walk around with the camera just in my right hand when not shooting.

I looked at my own mirror shots again and I am indeed usually holding the camera somewhat differently than here pressed against the wall, but nevertheless *holding* isn't the same as really putting the *weight* into the left arm.

Please do note I'm just a humble amateur mind you and just recently got this heavy stuff ... though it's complicated to get the weight to the left arm when lying on the ground or in awkward positions I shot a lot in during the last time.

I usually rotate the collar up (so that it is in front of the flash) as long as that doesn't interfere with anything else.  I find this is ok when holding the camera either horizontally or vertically.

Unfortunately with my flash bracket the collar is in the way in for either landscape/portrait all but the downward position, that might be the reason other people use the "L" bracket type instead of my Demb version... but I could remove the collar alltogether when I don't need it or try to put it in my palm.

Get the Really Right Stuff L-plate for the 60D - it's one of their newer modular designs that converts from base plate to full L bracket (but you have to pick for no grip vs grip).  The base plate has a lug for a hand strap.  Get the RRS wedding pro (WPF-QR) flash bracket. Like most brackets (unlike yours), it extends up the left-hand side of the camera, and it allows an easy flip for use in portrait orientation.

Hmmmyeswell, the price tag is the reason why I went for my type - but seeing my current problems I'll probably have to bite the bullet and get the proper stuff - thanks for the advice!
« Last Edit: June 27, 2013, 08:34:32 AM by Marsu42 »

tron

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Re: Medical joint overload by heavy dlsr?
« Reply #24 on: June 27, 2013, 08:32:36 AM »
Now that you uploaded the pictures I understand the need for APS-C/70-300L/flash/no tripod combination.
But, how about a gorilla pod or a big bean bag (at least for the subset of your pictures you take by crawling...)?

SteenerMe

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Re: Medical joint overload by heavy dlsr?
« Reply #25 on: June 27, 2013, 08:46:11 AM »
You shoot 8-10hours a day with a 60D....why?!
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Re: Medical joint overload by heavy dlsr?
« Reply #26 on: June 27, 2013, 08:49:04 AM »
Get a battery grip.

I hand hold the canon 1D X with the 70-200mm 2.8 IS II for very long periods at a time and i have no problems because it has a grip that allows my whole hand sit on..

I had a 5D Mark II and it was always uncomfortable to hold. It is a bad idea to have a small camera and a heavy lens.

Did i already say get a battery grip?

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Re: Medical joint overload by heavy dlsr?
« Reply #27 on: June 27, 2013, 08:54:12 AM »
Honestly, I would shop for a bracket that supports a handstrap to start with. 

I have 2 of the Canon handstraps and an arca-swiss plate on each body (which also allows for the grips) and I have to say, dollar-for-dollar, they've been the best accessory for my cameras.  It totally changes the load on your hand.
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Re: Medical joint overload by heavy dlsr?
« Reply #27 on: June 27, 2013, 08:54:12 AM »

Marsu42

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Re: Medical joint overload by heavy dlsr?
« Reply #28 on: June 27, 2013, 09:16:59 AM »
You shoot 8-10hours a day with a 60D....why?!

Because it's fun and you have to be patient with animals, frogs quak or yawn only so many times a day, wild horses run or relax only for some minutes, butterflies are in perfect light and position only for so many seconds, ...

Plus I'm learning how to do it and thus am not getting paid for it - hence I can either shoot or earn money :-p ... and 8-10h is not 365d/y but only in the peak summer season when I'm on holiday and the weather is good.

Get a battery grip.

I was always hesitant to buy more stuff that only fits my (old) 60d and cuts away the 60d's main advantage - size & weight... but well, I'll have to think about it I guess.

Fyi all: I Just looked up two pages on how to hold a dslr :-p and now I know why I have gotten around to do it otherwise - I lie flat on the ground a lot (handheld macro, animals) with the camera near ground level and putting the wrist under the camera isn't possible this way...

http://improvephotography.com/1365/how-to-properly-hold-a-dslr-camera/

http://godigitalslr.com/hold-dlsr/

viggen61

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Re: Medical joint overload by heavy dlsr?
« Reply #29 on: June 27, 2013, 09:21:02 AM »
I use a Canon grip on my 7D. It's the only way I can grasp the camera with all my fingers. Otherwise, my right pinky is left underneath it, and that is uncomfortable.

I typically use the Gripped 7D with a 100-400L, and when I handhold that, my right hand is on the camera and grip, and my left hand is under the lens, supporting the majority of the weight. Same thing if I get out the 430EXII and Better Beamer.

Your right hand should be bearing very little of the rig's weight. Your left hand should be holding it all up, either from the bottom of a longer lens, or with the palm supporting the base of the camera/grip, and fingers on the lens.

Oh, if the tripod collar foot is too small or uncomfortable, get a mount plate like an Arca-Swiss style. I have a Wimberley P20 on my 100-400 and it makes holding it a lot more comfortable.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2013, 09:26:53 AM by viggen61 »
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Re: Medical joint overload by heavy dlsr?
« Reply #29 on: June 27, 2013, 09:21:02 AM »