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Author Topic: The next body... (my speculations)  (Read 12533 times)

Redreflex

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Re: The next body... (my speculations)
« Reply #15 on: September 01, 2011, 07:49:35 PM »
[...]
I'll show my backside in Harrods window if a 7D appears this side of Xmas 2011
[...]

I'll hold you to that!

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Re: The next body... (my speculations)
« Reply #15 on: September 01, 2011, 07:49:35 PM »

Dave

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Re: The next body... (my speculations)
« Reply #16 on: September 01, 2011, 07:58:49 PM »
Quote
I'm not sure why people think 7D and 5DMk2 are "outdated". Is it just because they were released in 2008/2009? They are both insanely good cameras, and will continue to be insanely good even after next generation is released. I'm not planning to replace them until they stop taking pictures.

In my case the problem is, that my 350D IS going to stop takting pictures very soon I guess... And I'm waiting for the 7D2 or the 5D3 since I definitley want to have flip screen.

Quote
I'll show my backside in Harrods window if a 7D appears this side of Xmas 2011, in fact, I'd be surprised to see a 7D before the 650D or 70D...

How could Canon improve the 600D without competing the 60D??? And how can they improve the 60D without competing the 7D...

Osiris30

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Re: The next body... (my speculations)
« Reply #17 on: September 01, 2011, 08:30:58 PM »
It doesnt "have to" but if the sensor is outspected by the 650D and/or 70D then its likely many people will buy those models instead.

Nonsense, people don't buy the 7D just for the sensor, by that logic why would anyone pay £1200 for the 18mpx 7D when they can get the 550D with the same 18mpx sensor for just over £500 !

It's like telling me to trade my 450D in for a Sony NEX5 because it's got a better sensor !  The 7D isn't a consumer camera, unlike the entry level models, it doesn't compete in the shop window on pixels per pound, number of fancy picture modes and meaningless word count on the camera body.


I know *a lot* of people that haven't bought the 7D because the 60D was close enough and "the sensor is the same anyway".  I also know an awful lot of people who didn't go xxD because the xxxDs are pretty damned good now (especially the T3i) feature wise.

If you're not a sports shooter there is relatively little that the 60D leaves on the table vs. the 7D.  The same is true for the 600D vs the 60D.  Don't get me wrong, each camera up the ladder *does* have benefits, but the question is how much of the population would notice said benefits in a *meaningful* way... it's getting pretty marginal these days.

neuroanatomist

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Re: The next body... (my speculations)
« Reply #18 on: September 01, 2011, 09:11:50 PM »
How could Canon improve the 600D without competing the 60D??? And how can they improve the 60D without competing the 7D...

Remember earlier this year, when the T2i/550D already had the same sensor as the 7D and 60D, and lots of people wondered how the next entry level body could be released without cutting into 60D territory?  Yet we got a 600D/T3i anyway, right on schedule.

As we saw, there don't have to be big changes in that line. The idea isn't really to induce current 600D owners to upgrade, it's mainly to keep the consumer line 'fresh'.  For example, the xxxD line has used the same AF sensor for a long time. Canon could go from 1 to 5 cross-type points (still 9 total), allowing them to maintain separation from the 60D while touting a 'substantially improved AF system' for the T4i/650D.  The 70D (because the 60D still uses the 40D's AF) would get, say 13 points, and the 7DII would stay the same (oh, sorry...Canon will say 'improved AF algorithms supported by the new Digic V).  That's just one possible roadmap, off the top of my head.

I know *a lot* of people that haven't bought the 7D because the 60D was close enough and "the sensor is the same anyway".  I also know an awful lot of people who didn't go xxD because the xxxDs are pretty damned good now (especially the T3i) feature wise.

How many is that?  The thing is, Canon 'knows' *ALL* the people who have bought their cameras, and sales of the 7D and 60D remain very strong...so unless your 'a lot' numbers in the thousands (or tens of thousands?), they don't seem to be affecting Canon's bottom line. 
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the-ninth

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Re: The next body... (my speculations)
« Reply #19 on: September 02, 2011, 01:14:06 AM »
I'm not sure why people think 7D and 5DMk2 are "outdated". Is it just because they were released in 2008/2009? They are both insanely good cameras, and will continue to be insanely good even after next generation is released. I'm not planning to replace them until they stop taking pictures.

I currently have a 30D and there are two main things I am not happy with: the focal lenghts of Canon prime lenses in general and also of those that I own "fit" better to a FF camera, and the AF performance in low light is bad.

Currently there is no Canon camera available that solves this within my budget (1Ds is out of question for me). So I am waiting for the 5DIII to see if it combines the FF with a decent AF. I am not asking for a 7 or 1 series AF, a 50D AF with 9 cross-type sensors would probably already satisfy me.

Cheers, Robert

pedro

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Re: The next body... (my speculations)
« Reply #20 on: September 02, 2011, 07:02:47 AM »
currently have a 30D myself. hoping for fine ISO 12800...I do quite some moonless nightsky photography...and low light photography in general...
30D, EF-S 10-22/ 5DIII, 16-35 F/2.8 L USM II, 28 F/2.8, 50 F/1.4, 85 F/1.8, 70-200 F/2.8 classic,
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canon50duser

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Re: The next body... (my speculations)
« Reply #21 on: September 02, 2011, 07:30:57 AM »
I've been shooting canon digital for 6 years now.. first with a 350D which i loved and now the 50D, which i am very dissapointed with the amount of noise from the sensor at reasonable ISO..

I nearly bought a 5D mkii last xmas when the price was very good.. however i am waiting to buy the newest tech.. until then if i need full frame i reach for my film EOS 5.

Until i upgrade my camera body i won't invest another penny in Canon glass..

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Re: The next body... (my speculations)
« Reply #21 on: September 02, 2011, 07:30:57 AM »

sb

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Re: The next body... (my speculations)
« Reply #22 on: September 02, 2011, 09:48:47 AM »
In my case the problem is, that my 350D IS going to stop takting pictures very soon I guess... And I'm waiting for the 7D2 or the 5D3 since I definitley want to have flip screen.

Flip screen is a consumer feature and I'd be shocked if they put it in 7D and 5D. I really hope they don't, because I'd then have to move up to 1D line just to get rid of it.

Dave

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Re: The next body... (my speculations)
« Reply #23 on: September 02, 2011, 12:40:44 PM »
Quote
Flip screen is a consumer feature and I'd be shocked if they put it in 7D and 5D. I really hope they don't,

I really hope - and I'm quite(!!!) sure - they will. This is the future every SLR release in the past months has one  and I'm sure the new 5D will go in line with it.

I know the discussion in our German forum. Some people are whining around... But imo that is kind of ridiculous, to resign a cam because of a flip screen.
It's like like resigning a car because it has air condition that you don't need.

If you don't want flip screen: Don't use it! It's that simple! And I would count on the new 1D.

It's the same like the discussion 30 years ago: "Ughhhh who needs autofocus? I'm a professionel I focous by hand!"

regards, Dave

Gothmoth

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Re: The next body... (my speculations)
« Reply #24 on: September 02, 2011, 12:55:19 PM »
Quote
Flip screen is a consumer feature and I'd be shocked if they put it in 7D and 5D. I really hope they don't,

I really hope - and I'm quite(!!!) sure - they will. This is the future every SLR release in the past months has one  and I'm sure the new 5D will go in line with it.

I know the discussion in our German forum. Some people are whining around... But imo that is kind of ridiculous, to resign a cam because of a flip screen.
It's like like resigning a car because it has air condition that you don't need.

If you don't want flip screen: Don't use it! It's that simple! And I would count on the new 1D.

It's the same like the discussion 30 years ago: "Ughhhh who needs autofocus? I'm a professionel I focous by hand!"


no it´s not exactly the same discussion.
have a look at ebay, search for broken cameras.

look for example at the G5... what is broken?
most of the time the swivel LCD screen.

swivel displays are always a weak point in the design.
i see the use of a swivel LCD but im not sure if i would want it on a PRO body that has to suffer some abuse.

 
« Last Edit: September 02, 2011, 01:00:41 PM by Gothmoth »

iaind

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Re: The next body... (my speculations)
« Reply #25 on: September 02, 2011, 01:04:30 PM »
In my case the problem is, that my 350D IS going to stop takting pictures very soon I guess... And I'm waiting for the 7D2 or the 5D3 since I definitley want to have flip screen.

Flip screen is a consumer feature and I'd be shocked if they put it in 7D and 5D. I really hope they don't, because I'd then have to move up to 1D line just to get rid of it.

If you dont want video are you going to revert to 1D(s)III?
Only possible use for tilt screen is shooting over a crowd when you forgot to bring a stepladder.
You pay for the features you need on a body unfortunately Canon dont do pick and mix.

How about 5dIII with AF,card slots and built in grip from 1D IV plus  upgrades in. sensor and dual chips.




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neuroanatomist

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Re: The next body... (my speculations)
« Reply #26 on: September 02, 2011, 01:46:28 PM »
How about 5dIII with AF,card slots and built in grip from 1D IV plus  upgrades in. sensor and dual chips.

Sounds good - but, you've just described the 1DsIV.
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sb

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Re: The next body... (my speculations)
« Reply #27 on: September 02, 2011, 01:48:11 PM »
Quote
Flip screen is a consumer feature and I'd be shocked if they put it in 7D and 5D. I really hope they don't,

I really hope - and I'm quite(!!!) sure - they will. This is the future every SLR release in the past months has one  and I'm sure the new 5D will go in line with it.

I know the discussion in our German forum. Some people are whining around... But imo that is kind of ridiculous, to resign a cam because of a flip screen.
It's like like resigning a car because it has air condition that you don't need.

If you don't want flip screen: Don't use it! It's that simple! And I would count on the new 1D.

It's the same like the discussion 30 years ago: "Ughhhh who needs autofocus? I'm a professionel I focous by hand!"


no it´s not exactly the same discussion.
have a look at ebay, search for broken cameras.

look for example at the G5... what is broken?
most of the time the swivel LCD screen.

swivel displays are always a weak point in the design.
i see the use of a swivel LCD but im not sure if i would want it on a PRO body that has to suffer some abuse.


Thank you Gothmoth, that's exactly right. Flip screen is flimsy and will be the first thing to break. I need a workhorse camera that can take a beating, so movable parts are a big no no.

Flip screens are hardly "the future" because they've existed in the past on consumer cameras. The reason they work well for typical consumers is because they are used to using live view because of point-and-shoots.

I will agree that it's moderately useful for video in some situations (low shots off of a slider for example), but then again, pros will often use a dedicated external monitor anyway.

If you dont want video are you going to revert to 1D(s)III?

No because if I don't want video, I dont have to touch it and it doesn't affect my life. But if the swivel screen accidentally gets caught on something, and it breaks, that affects me.

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Re: The next body... (my speculations)
« Reply #27 on: September 02, 2011, 01:48:11 PM »

mjbehnke

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Re: The next body... (my speculations)
« Reply #28 on: September 02, 2011, 02:11:02 PM »
I don't think you will see a swivel screen on the 1D or the 7d series. I don't think they would be in line with the weather sealing and durability of the cameras. The 5D... Maybe, as canon seems to have that camera set in line as a Video\photo camera. Just mho. :)
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dkyeah

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Re: The next body... (my speculations)
« Reply #29 on: September 02, 2011, 04:09:23 PM »
In my case the problem is, that my 350D IS going to stop takting pictures very soon I guess... And I'm waiting for the 7D2 or the 5D3 since I definitley want to have flip screen.

Flip screen is a consumer feature and I'd be shocked if they put it in 7D and 5D. I really hope they don't, because I'd then have to move up to 1D line just to get rid of it.
I feel the same way, I really hope they won't put a flip screen on the 5/7D.

Not only it would be the first thing to break but also the layout of the camera would need to be totally redesigned. Look at the 60D, you have absolutely no buttons on the left! Perhaps I'm the only one here, but when I tried a 60D I quite disliked it. I don't like having almost all the buttons on the same side, it just doesn't feel right  ???

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Re: The next body... (my speculations)
« Reply #29 on: September 02, 2011, 04:09:23 PM »