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Author Topic: Nikon's Stock Hit Hard  (Read 4160 times)

ScottyP

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Nikon's Stock Hit Hard
« on: August 09, 2013, 10:01:30 PM »
Not my title; that is from the article on Nikon Rumors.

http://nikonrumors.com/2013/08/09/nikons-stock-hit-hard.aspx/

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Nikon's Stock Hit Hard
« on: August 09, 2013, 10:01:30 PM »

neuroanatomist

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Re: Nikon's Stock Hit Hard
« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2013, 10:37:08 PM »
Canon lowered its forecast as well, but didn't take a hit like that - they're a more diversified business than Nikon.

One could say that Nikon stock took a DRubbing.   How ironic...  :P
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Re: Nikon's Stock Hit Hard
« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2013, 10:37:16 PM »
That is interesting, but the comments that follow are even more interesting.  I can't help but notice that they are similar to complaints that I see here.  Like "The company doesn't listen to the customers, plus stuff unique to Nikon.

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Mt Spokane Photography

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Re: Nikon's Stock Hit Hard
« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2013, 11:18:00 PM »
Its a reflection of the tough financial climate and higher prices.  When the average buyer goes to Best Buy for a camera and sees a Canon DSLR like the 60D for much less money than a D7100, guess which they will buy?  They are not looking so much at the capabilities as the price.  That 60D is nice, looks professional, and its cheaper.
 
Canon's roots stem from producing good but not the best cameras for low prices.  They spend a huge amount of development cost designing a camera / lens to be mass produced at a low target cost.  Even when they are forced to slash prices, there is a little profit.  Their new plan calls for robotic assembly of all their products.  Its hard for me to see how that could be done, but its going to happen in steps over the next several years.
 
That is bad news for the competition if it works.

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Re: Nikon's Stock Hit Hard
« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2013, 11:47:21 PM »
And in related news, Nikon rethinks 1 System and cuts 2013 forecast citing poor sales:

http://www.dpreview.com/news/2013/08/08/nikon-cuts-2013-sales-forecast-citing-poor-mirrorless-camera-sales

Quote
Nikon has lowered its estimates for sales volume, sales amount, and operating income downward for the entire fiscal year, which ends on March 31st, 2014. Reasons for this include slow economic recovery worldwide, even worse compact camera sales than predicted, and slowed growth in mirrorless cameras. 

The actions that Nikon is taking to improve the situation include:

-    'Accelerating shifting newer products in the entry class of DSLR'
-   'Reconsider product planning of Nikon 1. Nikon 1 represents the majority of sales volume reduction of 550,000 interchangeable-lens type digital cameras'
-    'Revise development plan for new compact [cameras]. Although our market share had been expanding in recent years, sales volume will diminish more than the estimated market shrink. Will maintain profitability as is.'

In short, small-sensored MILCs sUx0rs canal water, and Nikon has seen the light and will put up competitors to the Canon SL1 and similar small DSLRs. Then again, we all should be buying D800s anyway, according to the Gospel of St. DxO, patron saint of Banding-Hunting Band of DR Brothers.
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Pi

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Re: Nikon's Stock Hit Hard
« Reply #5 on: August 10, 2013, 12:03:25 AM »
In short, small-sensored MILCs sUx0rs canal water, and Nikon has seen the light and will put up competitors to the Canon SL1 and similar small DSLRs. Then again, we all should be buying D800s anyway, according to the Gospel of St. DxO, patron saint of Banding-Hunting Band of DR Brothers.

To be more precise, we should all hope that Nikon and Canon produce cheap dSLRs and the public buys them so that we can afford cameras like the D800 and the 5D3.

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Re: Nikon's Stock Hit Hard
« Reply #6 on: August 10, 2013, 12:25:16 PM »
In short, small-sensored MILCs sUx0rs canal water, and Nikon has seen the light and will put up competitors to the Canon SL1 and similar small DSLRs. Then again, we all should be buying D800s anyway, according to the Gospel of St. DxO, patron saint of Banding-Hunting Band of DR Brothers.

To be more precise, we should all hope that Nikon and Canon produce cheap dSLRs and the public buys them so that we can afford cameras like the D800 and the 5D3.

Right now, its working by the law of supply and demand.  Supply is high, demand is low, so we see a lot of inventory clearing limited time sales.  That allows manufacturers to keep high MSRP's for better times.
 
Japanese culture frowns on laying off employees, so its often less expensive to keep churning out more products than needed and cutting prices to increase demand.  You can also shift production to different products as Nikon is doing,  The result is that the most efficient manufacturer is in a good spot to severely cut prices while others suffer.
 
As far as body prices, they are not the big factor to me, its lens prices.  I have 10 X invested in lenses over my bodies.  Lens sales are pretty good, so we are not seeing big cuts in high end lenses.  The low cost consumer lenses are made in Taiwan, and Canon does not have to worry so much about cutting jobs if sales drop.

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Re: Nikon's Stock Hit Hard
« Reply #6 on: August 10, 2013, 12:25:16 PM »

drjlo

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Re: Nikon's Stock Hit Hard
« Reply #7 on: August 10, 2013, 12:33:41 PM »
I sure hope Nikon stays successful and viable, giving competition to Canon.  Otherwise, Canon would have much lower incentive to invest in R&D to improve their products, a bad news to consumers like us  :'(

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Re: Nikon's Stock Hit Hard
« Reply #8 on: August 10, 2013, 03:25:54 PM »
I sure hope Nikon stays successful and viable, giving competition to Canon.  Otherwise, Canon would have much lower incentive to invest in R&D to improve their products, a bad news to consumers like us  :'(

+1  Competition is good.  We want all the camera makers to keep on and be successful.

MLfan3

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Re: Nikon's Stock Hit Hard
« Reply #9 on: August 11, 2013, 02:05:17 AM »
That is interesting, but the comments that follow are even more interesting.  I can't help but notice that they are similar to complaints that I see here.  Like "The company doesn't listen to the customers, plus stuff unique to Nikon.

sek

well, as a long time Nikon user recently went dual system I must say negative effects on QC dept  on Nikon products are obvious and it is because they are trying very hard to make it  as cheap as they can.
they are now going out of Thailand plant and planning to make almost 70 percent of their D-SLRs  in Laos.
they should have priced the D800 around 4k , but they managed to make it cheap , with some annoying design flaws.

we had horrible left-side AF issue with our D800E and now dust issue with the D600 and D7100.
the D800 feels much cheaper , plastic and AF is not as reliable as that of the D700.
and there is no real successor to the D700, if there was a proper D700 successor. to be honest , I 'd never bought a couple of Canons.
the D800 is potentially a good camera but for very specific apps such as landscape,in which I am not interested at all, studio , product or location.
so many of us (Nikon users)do not consider it as a proper D700 successor.
but their main problem is wasting too much R and D and marketing money on an entry level cameras such as the One system and D3100, D5200 ,etc.
oh and  they should not have wasted too much money on Aston Kutcher.



MLfan3

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Re: Nikon's Stock Hit Hard
« Reply #10 on: August 11, 2013, 02:11:18 AM »
In short, small-sensored MILCs sUx0rs canal water, and Nikon has seen the light and will put up competitors to the Canon SL1 and similar small DSLRs. Then again, we all should be buying D800s anyway, according to the Gospel of St. DxO, patron saint of Banding-Hunting Band of DR Brothers.

To be more precise, we should all hope that Nikon and Canon produce cheap dSLRs and the public buys them so that we can afford cameras like the D800 and the 5D3.

Right now, its working by the law of supply and demand.  Supply is high, demand is low, so we see a lot of inventory clearing limited time sales.  That allows manufacturers to keep high MSRP's for better times.
 
Japanese culture frowns on laying off employees, so its often less expensive to keep churning out more products than needed and cutting prices to increase demand.  You can also shift production to different products as Nikon is doing,  The result is that the most efficient manufacturer is in a good spot to severely cut prices while others suffer.
 
As far as body prices, they are not the big factor to me, its lens prices.  I have 10 X invested in lenses over my bodies.  Lens sales are pretty good, so we are not seeing big cuts in high end lenses.  The low cost consumer lenses are made in Taiwan, and Canon does not have to worry so much about cutting jobs if sales drop.


>Japanese culture frowns on laying off employees, so its often less expensive to keep churning out more products than needed and cutting prices to increase demand.

this is very true , I think this is exactly what they did and may still be doing, it seems to me is like intentionally throwing the money.

actually Taiwan is a very developed country already and made in Taiwan is nothing wrong.
but going made in Laos is a big mistake of Nikon.

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Re: Nikon's Stock Hit Hard
« Reply #11 on: August 14, 2013, 10:30:47 PM »
Canon's roots stem from producing good but not the best cameras for low prices.  They spend a huge amount of development cost designing a camera / lens to be mass produced at a low target cost.  Even when they are forced to slash prices, there is a little profit.  Their new plan calls for robotic assembly of all their products.  Its hard for me to see how that could be done, but its going to happen in steps over the next several years.

I'm shocked that their current lenses aren't robot-built.  Just about everything else in the consumer electronics space seems to be these days....  :)

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Re: Nikon's Stock Hit Hard
« Reply #12 on: August 14, 2013, 10:38:52 PM »


>Japanese culture frowns on laying off employees, so its often less expensive to keep churning out more products than needed and cutting prices to increase demand.

this is very true , I think this is exactly what they did and may still be doing, it seems to me is like intentionally throwing the money.

Not necessarily.  If you have to keep on paying (unemployment) to laid off highly skilled employees even though they are producing nothing, that's a waste of both money and human dignity.

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Re: Nikon's Stock Hit Hard
« Reply #12 on: August 14, 2013, 10:38:52 PM »

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Re: Nikon's Stock Hit Hard
« Reply #13 on: August 14, 2013, 11:46:47 PM »
Its a reflection of the tough financial climate and higher prices.  When the average buyer goes to Best Buy for a camera and sees a Canon DSLR like the 60D for much less money than a D7100, guess which they will buy?  They are not looking so much at the capabilities as the price.  That 60D is nice, looks professional, and its cheaper.
 
Canon's roots stem from producing good but not the best cameras for low prices.  They spend a huge amount of development cost designing a camera / lens to be mass produced at a low target cost.  Even when they are forced to slash prices, there is a little profit.  Their new plan calls for robotic assembly of all their products.  Its hard for me to see how that could be done, but its going to happen in steps over the next several years.
 
That is bad news for the competition if it works.

Which is bad news for us since they will be able to get away with 2005 sensors in 2025 and marketing dribbling out things over 20 years (so far it's been more than 10 years and they still haven't finished dribbling out something as simple, basic, and zero cost as a truly functional AutoISO, certainly not for anything less than 1 series).

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Re: Nikon's Stock Hit Hard
« Reply #14 on: September 03, 2013, 11:43:06 AM »


To be more precise, we should all hope that Nikon and Canon produce cheap dSLRs and the public buys them so that we can afford cameras like the D800 and the 5D3.

That's exactly right. I've taken heat in the past for this but we should be grateful for the fabulous times in which we live. After film died and a period of expensive, crappy small sensor cameras we now have (relatively) affordable top notch digital gear at hand.

But given the still ongoing digital revolution and the turmoil its causing for some of my favorite things to spend my time (music and photography) we may see more significant changes coming our way - some of which may not work in our favor given how small a market segment we live with for our hobbies/side businesses/even professions.

Canon and Nikon develop and sell professional and semi professional gear mostly as a marketing tool to sell to the huge consumer segment. Problem is that segment is dying in many ways.

So it'll be interesting to see what happens going forward. Mergers? Companies selling off their consumer camera segments? New companies catering to pros only (for a premium price)? The only thing I'm sure about is that things won't stay as they are and we should enjoy things more while they last.
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Re: Nikon's Stock Hit Hard
« Reply #14 on: September 03, 2013, 11:43:06 AM »