7d or Mark II for filming?

[Jedifarce]

sony A65 autofocus-during-video-recodring test:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3XsgytiAhEI
no other DSLR will come anywhere close to these new sonys in this area...

Why would you want to? That footage looks pretty bad, as soon as the kid leaves the frame the autofocus snaps back like a rubberband to focusing in on the background.

 It's funny when you see other videos of people using autofocus trying to film a street performer, the autofocus becomes confused whenever a pedestrian walks into the foreground. Depth of field while filming becomes simply impossible with autofocus.

[Jedifarce]

Canon 600D/60D have the same movie recording specs with 7D and also a swivel screen, which is very useful for video (given that you don't want to invest on a seperate screen).

I don't see the benefit of a swivel screen. I have a 5D and if I don't utilize an external monitor for filiming, you simply aren't able to pull focus effectively. I start to go cross-eyed trying to focus on that small screen at the back of the camera.

[Jedifarce]

I have 5D Mark II and 7D as well as a recently acquired 1D Mark IV (though have not yet used the latter for video other than a quick test).

Holy cow!! LOL.

[Jedifarce]

If you want to take serious videos handheld, a Canon DSLR is probably not the best.  Having to twist the focus ring while holding the camera out in front of you is difficult and frustrating.

I don't agree with that, you can purchase redrock micro products that will compensate for those focusing issues. The real problem is expense and if you can afford it.

As much as I dislike Sony as a company, their newest DSLR does seem to be a big step ahead for making videos over the 7D or other Canon DSLR's.  It will autofocus as well as do some of the things video makers want. 

I don't know too many videographers that would count 'autofocus' as one of their top concerns, rolling shutter is a bigger problem. If that were the case, you'd just use a prosumer video camcorder.

[Jedifarce]

Well, I got around 2100€ to spend on a body and on lenses. I was thinking in getting a 5DII body and a 50 mm 1.8. My other option is a 7D with the kit lense (18-135 IS if Im not mistaken) and  a 50 1.8. The reason Im willing to buy a 50mm 1.8 is because I've heard/seen it gives very nice shallow depth of field on videos and stills.  What do you think?

Problem with the 18-135mm is you're going to find that it's a not going to be the sharpest lens in town. It will produce soft images - unless you like that sort of thing - most people eventually move on to an 'L' lens. IS -image stabilization is nice for video which is what you always want, but with f/3.5-5.6 your ISO will constantly have to be adjusted through focal range as you zoom in or out and you really don't want that.

 You'll want a lense with a constant aperture of F/2.8 - very expensive or F/4 - reasonable, L lenses for sharpness and don't forget the IS. I use the 70-200mm L F/4 IS USM, the USM or autofocus is usually part of the package but it's not something you need for filming in manual. 

And you don't have to buy new, Adorama is a great site for buying refurbished lenses, that's where I purchased my 70-200mm and I've never regretted it. In addition, you can save more money by buying a refurbished 5D Mark II. Downside with buying refurbished is you don't have a good as warranty as you would with a new product.

[Dave]

If you don't depend on full frame, I think the 600D is the best video SLR at the moment. The 7D is a superior camera but it lacks a flip screen and the new digital video crop zoom thingie from the 600D. If you are primary filming all the cool features of the 7D carry not much weight.

[FunkyJam]

Thanks for all the replies. After alot of thinking I'll pick a 5d mark ii and a 50mm 1.8 or even 1.4 if I find a cheap one. Later on, when I have more cash I'll buy more lenses and some other stuff needed.

So, 5D mark ii + 50 1.8(or 1.4) is a good combo to start, what do you think?


Bye.

[thejoyofsobe]

i'd go the 50mm f/1.4 route instead of the 50mm f/1.8 if you can afford it and are only looking for one prime lens. it's two-thirds of a stop faster, the bokeh's better with 8 blades vs. 5 blades and the manual focus ring is much more usable.

though i guess for what you're going to pay for the 50mm f/1.4 you could always go for a little more variety and pick up both the 50mm f/1.8 and the 35mm f/2.0.

[Jedifarce]

Thanks for all the replies. After alot of thinking I'll pick a 5d mark ii and a 50mm 1.8 or even 1.4 if I find a cheap one. Later on, when I have more cash I'll buy more lenses and some other stuff needed.

So, 5D mark ii + 50 1.8(or 1.4) is a good combo to start, what do you think?


Bye.

I can tell you, although a 5D produces superior image quality and vibrant colors (assuming you're not going for the 'Flat' look) for video, it has a very steep learning curve when compared to a prosumer video camcorder. You might be shocked how terrible your early footage will come out.
 
These links might help you out ->

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/find/hdslr.jsp

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/indepth/category/tags/hdslr-online-guide?cm_sp=HDSLR-_-HDSLR`Guide-_-HDSLR`Go2Guide

http://philipbloom.net/education/

[leGreve]

If you can afford it, go prosumer cam corder instead... the MKII and 7D are old tech by now, and their shortcomings are getting noticed. Thus is the game of the late arriver a hard one.

Rolling shutter, jello'ing and the lack of proper sound, makes for nothing more than a hobby camera, and as soon as clients learn that it was fun for a while with all that shallow depth of field crap, what they loose in return when buying projects from dslr videographers outweighs the fun side of it.

If you wanna stick with Canon... wait around for the october announcement and see if it at all competes with what Sony and Pana has put out. Canon still rules the still world imo, but in the video world they are falling behind again.

Did I mention the crappy sound??? Sound is atleast 50% of any video / film project.

[CJRodgers]

Hi Jedifarce,

I checked out them links on B&H educational series things. Found it helpful. On epsisode 1 or two he showed a gear that is attatched to the still lens. Do you know how he has done that and where to get them from, or do you need to send you lens somewhere to have it customised?

Thanks,

Craig

[Chicorob]

If you can learn the 7D/5DII in and outs and use them in the right way,  you will get much better results that a prosumer camcorder.  Color and constrast are simply better in the DLSR's.  In bright situations you will get acceptable/good results from a prosumer cam but they will not have the "pro" feel.  In low light situations, you just cannot compare the 5DII/7D results to a camcorder.    We had 2 cameras recently at a wedding and during the first dance under VERY low light we shot a 5DII at ISO 1600/F2.8 with a LED video light which resulted in a clean/bright image.  Under the same situation with a Canon HF G10 and the image was noisy, the colors were flat, and it was really unusable footage.  There was a small amount of rolling shutter and jello from the 5D but it was minimal.

Use the right tool for the right shot but if I were given a choice between a G10/7D/5D I would go for the 5DII in an instant.  That will a 50 f1.4 will get you about anything you need.  A cheap shoulder rig and LCD Loupe will help with stabilization and focus.

[Chaos411vm]

The unfortunate thing now and days is that people all want auto focus which doesn't work with creating movies anyway. If you are filming as you appear to be doing. Auto-focus on any camera would be completely useless. Shoot with the 5D as you would shoot with an actual film camera. Pull focus and purchase manual lenses and build up your experience eying focus. Due to the extreme shallow depth of field it can be quite a challenge at first but the results of a proper pull definitely are worth it.

A kit of old Nikon Primes with adapters work amazingly well on the 5D mark II and is quite cheaper. Plus you can control your F-stops manually and not electronically which is worth the purchase right there.

[beardofzeus]

I just want to add I've heard about some issues regarding filming with the 7d for extended periods of time.  One friend of mine says his sensor overheats after a while and my old roommate had his shutter get stuck open from filming for so long.

Also, that same roommate is a very successful wedding videographer here in hawaii, and he uses a 60d and a 7d ...so there is no point arguing about whether or not a DSLR is suitable for filming.  I will add that it takes alot more investment in other rigs to make filming with a DSLR successful, i.e. steady cam, fluid head tripod, cinevate slider, proper sound recording, etc.  which can easily add up to the cost of a prosumer video system.
He also loves the swivel screen of the 60d and prefers it over his 7d.

[Jedifarce]

If you can learn the 7D/5DII in and outs and use them in the right way,  you will get much better results that a prosumer camcorder.  Color and constrast are simply better in the DLSR's.  In bright situations you will get acceptable/good results from a prosumer cam but they will not have the "pro" feel.  In low light situations, you just cannot compare the 5DII/7D results to a camcorder.    We had 2 cameras recently at a wedding and during the first dance under VERY low light we shot a 5DII at ISO 1600/F2.8 with a LED video light which resulted in a clean/bright image.  Under the same situation with a Canon HF G10 and the image was noisy, the colors were flat, and it was really unusable footage.  There was a small amount of rolling shutter and jello from the 5D but it was minimal.

Use the right tool for the right shot but if I were given a choice between a G10/7D/5D I would go for the 5DII in an instant.  That will a 50 f1.4 will get you about anything you need.  A cheap shoulder rig and LCD Loupe will help with stabilization and focus.

I have to agree. I used to have a JVC GY-HM100 which is considered a "prosumer" camcorder. In terms of image quality, theres no comparison between the JVC and a 5D, the 5D kicks its ass. When you stop to consider that the JVC depreciated by more than a $1000 before I sold it while the 5D hasn't says a lot.

 Of course we're talking about image quality, not action. Any fast panning or quick movement, the 5D is your worst enemy.