November 23, 2014, 02:00:22 PM

Author Topic: Advice: extension tubes Macro  (Read 10688 times)

rpt

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Re: Advice: extension tubes Macro
« Reply #30 on: September 03, 2013, 09:11:44 AM »
get the kenko tubes. They are relative cheap and give a wide range of extension stacking options
+1 on that!

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Re: Advice: extension tubes Macro
« Reply #30 on: September 03, 2013, 09:11:44 AM »

photonius

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Re: Advice: extension tubes Macro
« Reply #31 on: September 03, 2013, 10:44:13 AM »
One should get a set of close up lens as well extension tube,close up lens normally come in sets of 3

If you talk about the cheap single lens close-up sets, no, they are not recommended. They deliver poor IQ at higher magnifications.
Achromat doublet close-up lenses are much better, see also samples here:
http://photonius.wikispaces.com/Close-up+%26+Macro

Indeed, for an archeological site in the MidEast with presumably lots of dust, a close-up lens on the front may be better than adding/removing extension tubes (the dust issue mentioned).

A set of Raynox lenses (4.8 and 8 diopters) should give good extra magnification on the 100mm macro, and it should have a relatively easy snap-on holder.


eli452

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Re: Advice: extension tubes Macro
« Reply #32 on: September 04, 2013, 03:01:32 AM »
Does anyone have tried connecting the Kenko extension tube to TS-E lens (24 mk II specificly)?
Kenko specify "compatible with Canon EF and EFS lenses"
the Canon original (mk II) state "Compatible with digital EF-S lenses, as well as EF and TS-E lenses"
(the quote is from the B&H site

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neuroanatomist

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Re: Advice: extension tubes Macro
« Reply #33 on: September 04, 2013, 08:29:27 AM »
Does anyone have tried connecting the Kenko extension tube to TS-E lens (24 mk II specificly)?
Kenko specify "compatible with Canon EF and EFS lenses"
the Canon original (mk II) state "Compatible with digital EF-S lenses, as well as EF and TS-E lenses"
(the quote is from the B&H site

Interesting that B&H states that, because I do not recall Canon having stated that the extenders are compatible with TS-E lenses.  In fact, while they are physically compatible, they are not fully electronically compatible in that the TC changes the f/number, and that is not correctly reported in the EXIF (the TS-E lenses lack the additional pins necessary for communication with the TC).

Although I have not tried it, there is no reason a Kenko TC shouldn't work with the TS-E lenses.
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eli452

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Re: Advice: extension tubes Macro
« Reply #34 on: September 04, 2013, 09:39:52 AM »
The canon page for the TS-E 24mm f/3.5L II names the Extension Tube EF 12 II as an "Supplies & Accessories" option.
http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/consumer/products/cameras/ef_lens_lineup/ts_e_24mm_f_3_5l_ii#SuppliesAndAccessories
and the "compatible products" link names all but the 17mm TS-E lens.
7D; 8-15mm f/4L Fisheye; 100mm f/2.8L macro; TS-E 24mm f/3.5L II; 24-105 f/4L; EF-S 10-22mm; 70-300mm f/4-5.6L; 50mm f/1.4, 600EX-RT & ST-E3-RT; lots more stuff.

surapon

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Re: Advice: extension tubes Macro
« Reply #35 on: September 04, 2013, 10:12:32 AM »
Does anyone have tried connecting the Kenko extension tube to TS-E lens (24 mk II specificly)?
Kenko specify "compatible with Canon EF and EFS lenses"
the Canon original (mk II) state "Compatible with digital EF-S lenses, as well as EF and TS-E lenses"
(the quote is from the B&H site

Interesting that B&H states that, because I do not recall Canon having stated that the extenders are compatible with TS-E lenses.  In fact, while they are physically compatible, they are not fully electronically compatible in that the TC changes the f/number, and that is not correctly reported in the EXIF (the TS-E lenses lack the additional pins necessary for communication with the TC).

Although I have not tried it, there is no reason a Kenko TC shouldn't work with the TS-E lenses.


Dear Teacher, Mr. Neuroanatomist.
I just read my Manual Book for my TS-E 24 mm F/ 3.5 L MK II =
"13.  Extension Tubes( Eng-19)
For TS-E 24 mm F 3.5 L II . You can attach extension tube EF 12 II for magnified shot-----The extension tube EF 12 II cannot used  with TS-E 17 mm F/4 L.
Although Extension Tube EF 25 II can be attached on TS-E 24 mm F/ 3.5 L II. It is not recommended because the Lens-to-subject distant will be very short."

Surapon

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Re: Advice: extension tubes Macro
« Reply #36 on: September 04, 2013, 10:21:08 AM »
The canon page for the TS-E 24mm f/3.5L II names the Extension Tube EF 12 II as an "Supplies & Accessories" option.
http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/consumer/products/cameras/ef_lens_lineup/ts_e_24mm_f_3_5l_ii#SuppliesAndAccessories
and the "compatible products" link names all but the 17mm TS-E lens.

My apologies - you wrote "Kenko extension tube" and I read Kenko extender (aka teleconverter).  Sorry for the confusion!

Pretty much any extension tube is physically compatible with pretty much any lens - an extension tube is just a hollow tube filled with air, and most have pass-through electrical contacts.

The compatibility issue with tubes comes from the fact that they increase magnification by decreasing the minimum focus distance, which also means a decreased working distance (distance from front element to subject).  The added magnification is the ratio of focal length / tube length.  With a longer tube on a shorter lens, it's possible that the MFD is reduced to the point where it's actually behind the front element, meaning you can't focus on the subject at all.  That's why you can't use the EF 12 tube with the TS-E 17mm.

Since the Kenko tubes come as a set, you'll be able to use the shorter one(s) with the TS-E 24mm, but not the 36mm tube, and not with them stacked as you can with longer lenses.
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Re: Advice: extension tubes Macro
« Reply #36 on: September 04, 2013, 10:21:08 AM »

Skatol

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Re: Advice: extension tubes Macro
« Reply #37 on: August 20, 2014, 03:41:21 PM »
Is the air in the Canon tubes better than the air in the Kenko tubes?  For most applications, the Kenko tubes are just fine (the only reason I went with Canon tubes is that my main use is to reduce the MFD of a supertele, and I wanted to be sure of the mount strength - not an issue of concern for macro lenses).
For starters math is not my strong point.  Just curious as to how much the MFD is reduced on a 600mm lens when using extension tubes.  I currently have two setups.
1. 300/2.8 w/ 2x TC, MFD ~ 10ft.
2. 600/4(non-IS), MFD ~ 20ft.
Will an extension tube(s) get my 600 MFD to ~10 ft?
My slight understanding of the math says no.
Thanks for any enlightenment you may provide.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2014, 04:02:48 PM by Skatol »
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mackguyver

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Re: Advice: extension tubes Macro
« Reply #38 on: August 20, 2014, 03:58:51 PM »
Is the air in the Canon tubes better than the air in the Kenko tubes?  For most applications, the Kenko tubes are just fine (the only reason I went with Canon tubes is that my main use is to reduce the MFD of a supertele, and I wanted to be sure of the mount strength - not an issue of concern for macro lenses).
The 180L isn't exactly light...but then again, it lets you use extenders, which along with the included tripod collar is 90% of why I chose it over the 100L.

As for your question, it would help to know what you plan to shoot and where - studio or outdoors?

For the 100L, it looks like the 25mm tube gets you to 1.37x, similar to what I get with my 180 + 1.4x, which is significant enough to be worth the investment.  I'd go with the 5DIII unless you've got a lot of light as you'll generally be stuck using ISO 1600+ even in good natural light at that magnification.  Macro rails are great and I use a RRS Precision Plus Package pano set with pretty good results, but the dedicated RRS or Novoflex rails are much better.  They are also much more expensive :(

Also, that's correct about the TS-E + extenders & tubes.  They work, but are not included in the EXIF and in certain combinations can throw off exposure unless LiveView is used.

tolusina

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Re: Advice: extension tubes Macro
« Reply #39 on: August 20, 2014, 07:57:38 PM »
....Middle East excavation site in progress.......

From
http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/tutorials/macro-extension-tubes-closeup.htm

"An extension tube increases lens magnification by an amount equal to the extension distance divided by the lens focal length. For example, adding a 25 mm extension tube to a 50 mm lens will give a magnification gain of 0.5X. Therefore, if the lens's original magnification was 0.15X, then the new magnification will be 0.15X+0.5X=0.65X. The closest focusing distance will also decrease to ~210 mm."
 
and

"Note how extension tubes provide minimal magnification when used with telephoto lenses — which is unfortunately their main weakness."
 
From
http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/consumer/products/cameras/ef_lens_lineup/ef_100mm_f_2_8l_macro_is_usm#Specifications
 
"Closest Focusing Distance
0.99 ft./0.3m (maximum close-up magnification: 1x)
"
 
So, a full set of Kenko tubes adding up to 68mm will increase the magnification of your 100L macro only from 1.0 to 1.68.
 
You'll have a very shallow depth of field which focus stacking can overcome.
To focus stack you'll need a sturdy tripod and either a macro rail or tethered focusing control, or manual focus steps as you determine by eye, preferably in live view.
If you're shooting artifacts in situ rather than on a work bench or table, your tripod will have to be configured to mount the camera very low to the ground such as is possible with an inverted post. Manual focusing with the ground level mounted camera will be awkward and uncomfortable at best, a total failure at the worst.
I suggest tethered control.

If dust can or will be a factor, that may compromise effectiveness and longevity of a focusing rail will all its exposed components, same for a bellows.
 
I like Helicon Focus for processing the stacked frames.
 
The Canon MP-E 65mm f/2.8 1-5x Macro Photo lens magnifies between 1X and 5X but must be focused manually which rules it out of tethered focus control is desired. Might be just what you seek if you'll manually focus (and stack) while live viewing tethered.

 
There's a thread here, "first attempts at macro stacking, let's see some stuff. (beginners only please)"
 
 
 
 
.
40 on 6

neuroanatomist

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Re: Advice: extension tubes Macro
« Reply #40 on: August 20, 2014, 08:11:31 PM »
Is the air in the Canon tubes better than the air in the Kenko tubes?  For most applications, the Kenko tubes are just fine (the only reason I went with Canon tubes is that my main use is to reduce the MFD of a supertele, and I wanted to be sure of the mount strength - not an issue of concern for macro lenses).
For starters math is not my strong point.  Just curious as to how much the MFD is reduced on a 600mm lens when using extension tubes.  I currently have two setups.
1. 300/2.8 w/ 2x TC, MFD ~ 10ft.
2. 600/4(non-IS), MFD ~ 20ft.
Will an extension tube(s) get my 600 MFD to ~10 ft?
My slight understanding of the math says no.
Thanks for any enlightenment you may provide.

An EF 25 tube will get your 600/4 to an MFD of ~15 feet.
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Skatol

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Re: Advice: extension tubes Macro
« Reply #41 on: August 20, 2014, 09:30:50 PM »
Is the air in the Canon tubes better than the air in the Kenko tubes?  For most applications, the Kenko tubes are just fine (the only reason I went with Canon tubes is that my main use is to reduce the MFD of a supertele, and I wanted to be sure of the mount strength - not an issue of concern for macro lenses).
For starters math is not my strong point.  Just curious as to how much the MFD is reduced on a 600mm lens when using extension tubes.  I currently have two setups.
1. 300/2.8 w/ 2x TC, MFD ~ 10ft.
2. 600/4(non-IS), MFD ~ 20ft.
Will an extension tube(s) get my 600 MFD to ~10 ft?
My slight understanding of the math says no.
Thanks for any enlightenment you may provide.

An EF 25 tube will get your 600/4 to an MFD of ~15 feet.
Thanks Neuro, exactly what I was looking for.  So the Kenko 36 would get me to about 12?
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mackguyver

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Re: Advice: extension tubes Macro
« Reply #42 on: August 20, 2014, 10:05:49 PM »

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Re: Advice: extension tubes Macro
« Reply #42 on: August 20, 2014, 10:05:49 PM »

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Re: Advice: extension tubes Macro
« Reply #43 on: August 20, 2014, 10:20:42 PM »
I decided to refresh my experiences with extension tubes and extenders on my 5D MK III and 100L.  I used a cheap 13mm extender and a Canon 1.4X MK III on my 100L.  It would not autofocus at all, it just went into a high speed hunt mode, almost a vibration.

Then, I tried live view with live AF.  It slowly focused, sometimes, but was only suitable for use with a tripod.

Just using the extender was much better, no issues focusing, but still difficult when hand held.  Obviously, I got the best results with the bare lens.  In the end, I just deleted all the shots, I wasn't happy with any of them.  I'm impatient, and do not want to setup a tripod or slider.  A thunderstorm was brewing in any event, so I gave up.

I was playing around with my old but newly acquired 5D classic this morning and my 24-70L MK II.  Its not particularly good for close-ups. a moth flew right in front of the lens as I was trying to focus on a bumble bee, so it got in the photo.


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Re: Advice: extension tubes Macro
« Reply #44 on: August 21, 2014, 01:18:43 AM »
Here's the 300 with a 36 Kenko at maybe 4-5 feet and F4, very slightly cropped to reframe.  Just goofing off here.  Depth of field is certainly shallow but sometimes that's OK... or not.

These white breasted nuthatches are not a big bird, about 5 1/2 inches tip to tip.

I like the 300 2.8 as my general outdoor lense for macro type shots of bugs and flowers but sometimes the MFD is an issue and then the extension tube helps.  I don't like the floppiness of the stacked Kenko tubes with the 300.

Jack
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Re: Advice: extension tubes Macro
« Reply #44 on: August 21, 2014, 01:18:43 AM »