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Author Topic: Why are Zeiss lenses manual?  (Read 10258 times)

Sporgon

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Re: Why are Zeiss lenses manual?
« Reply #15 on: September 12, 2013, 03:28:43 PM »


I can't see good enough close up with my contacts on....so, I rely on the AF when out and about shooting.

That's why my videos shot for my cooking vids all have me with my glasses on. I have to wear those so that it is quick and easy for me to pull them up and look with my VERY nearsighted eyes on live view and be able to manual focus there with the zoom feature.

But I rarely wear my glasses when out...so, I really can't do manual focus when out and shooting something requiring fast accurate focus from shot to shot.

When I used to wear contacts they would mist the viewfinder so I couldn't see a darn thing anyway ! I use a dioptre view finder lens now: much better. But I was never really very good a manual focus, probably because of my eye sight. Give me good AF accuracy and BBF and I'm happy.

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Re: Why are Zeiss lenses manual?
« Reply #15 on: September 12, 2013, 03:28:43 PM »

neuroanatomist

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Re: Why are Zeiss lenses manual?
« Reply #16 on: September 12, 2013, 03:29:15 PM »
There will always be those few who want a proper manual focus for the pleasure of using it, but they are few and far between.

I wonder if there are people who use an abacus to calculate their tax forms, just for the pleasure of it?  ::)

You mean there's another way ?  :(

Get with the times...use a slide rule like everyone else!
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7enderbender

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Re: Why are Zeiss lenses manual?
« Reply #17 on: September 12, 2013, 04:05:52 PM »
I hear about the great Zeiss lenses, and read the great reviews on them.

My question is, why do they ONLY seem to do manual focus lenses? Could they not really clean up on the high end market by making them work with the Canon/Nikon AF systems???

Thanks in advance,

cayenne


It would change the way they provide such high mechanical quality. Dare I say that for me it's really the other way round: why doesn't Canon provide any digital full frame body that works reliably as a full time manual focus camera only? Answer: very few people would be buying something like this in this day and age. But I'd still prefer it.

I'm still bummed out by the fact that in order to go digital I had to go AF. Never wanted the EOS system because of the flimsiness that comes with anything AF. My dream camera remains a full frame digital version of the F1n with an updated range of FD lenses.

Here's one reason why I'm sticking with my 5DmkII for now. Its viewfinder isn't perfect for use with MF but the EF-S screen and AF confirmation are a great help.


That's a good point - if it works for you. I tried the EF-S screen and it didn't make enough of a difference for me to justify the degraded view when using my 24-105 f/4. So I've basically caved and given in to AF as the only viable alternative - except when messing around with my old FD 500 reflex lens with the Ed Mika adapter.
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7enderbender

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Re: Why are Zeiss lenses manual?
« Reply #18 on: September 12, 2013, 04:07:10 PM »
It would change the way they provide such high mechanical quality. Dare I say that for me it's really the other way round: why doesn't Canon provide any digital full frame body that works reliably as a full time manual focus camera only? Answer: very few people would be buying something like this in this day and age. But I'd still prefer it.

You don't use live view for manual focus?

No. Never. I can't stand it. If live view was gone I wouldn't know it.
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7enderbender

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Re: Why are Zeiss lenses manual?
« Reply #19 on: September 12, 2013, 04:11:59 PM »
There will always be those few who want a proper manual focus for the pleasure of using it, but they are few and far between.

I wonder if there are people who use an abacus to calculate their tax forms, just for the pleasure of it?  ::)


I suppose only in Massachusetts will you ever find the terms "taxes" and "pleasure" in one sentence ;-)
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mrsfotografie

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Re: Why are Zeiss lenses manual?
« Reply #20 on: September 12, 2013, 04:12:50 PM »
It would change the way they provide such high mechanical quality. Dare I say that for me it's really the other way round: why doesn't Canon provide any digital full frame body that works reliably as a full time manual focus camera only? Answer: very few people would be buying something like this in this day and age. But I'd still prefer it.

You don't use live view for manual focus?

No. Never. I can't stand it. If live view was gone I wouldn't know it.

+1
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TexasBadger

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Re: Why are Zeiss lenses manual?
« Reply #21 on: September 12, 2013, 05:14:08 PM »
Canon would have to license their EF technology to Zeiss.  So far that hasn't happened.  Tamron and Sigma reverse engineer the AF.  That is why there can be compatibility problems with third party lenses.  Zeiss does work with Canon on the lens reporting to the camera body.  So far they have not come to an agreement on EF.
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Re: Why are Zeiss lenses manual?
« Reply #21 on: September 12, 2013, 05:14:08 PM »

ajfotofilmagem

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Re: Why are Zeiss lenses manual?
« Reply #22 on: September 12, 2013, 05:20:58 PM »
I'm sure Zeiss makes great manual focus lenses. Perhaps the best lenses for DSLR Canon bayonet. Why do not they try to AF lenses? The answer is simpler than it seems. Lens with high quality optics "denounce" small errors of focus. The new Zeiss 55mm is a sharper lens that humans have ever made. However, the current electronic technology is not able to make an AF system on the same level of precision optics, and still focus quickly. Sounds like a joke, but if the new Zeiss 55mm had AF, there would be many complaints of "errors" of focus, simply because the ability to sharpness exceed the accuracy of the AF. :o I believe if forego speed AF, can greatly enhance the accuracy of focus. But how many people would be willing to pay a fortune for a lens with AF slow? ::)
« Last Edit: September 12, 2013, 05:25:14 PM by ajfotofilmagem »

jcns

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Re: Why are Zeiss lenses manual?
« Reply #23 on: September 12, 2013, 05:38:53 PM »
it's not unlike car transmissions.
Today there are plenty of options from excellent torque converter automatics, to dual clutch automated manuals, to single clutch automated manuals, to multi clutch plate autos.  They are all excellent and do the job really really well and often are faster changing than any human could dream of.  However, driving a manual transmission and getting it right, honing your skill is still an immense pleasure to many.  Zeiss provides the user with the pleasure of something mechanical that's incredibly well engineered, designed, and built and the opportunity for the user to get it right himself.
You propose Zeiss could clean up the high end market.  They already do.  They don't have much competition.  It's a small market.  Zeiss already sells every lens they make.  Sometimes it's not all about profit, sometimes it's about making more than enough, closing the doors for the day, go out and enjoy life.

Mr Bean

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Re: Why are Zeiss lenses manual?
« Reply #24 on: September 12, 2013, 06:56:25 PM »
it's not unlike car transmissions.
Today there are plenty of options from excellent torque converter automatics, to dual clutch automated manuals, to single clutch automated manuals, to multi clutch plate autos.  They are all excellent and do the job really really well and often are faster changing than any human could dream of.  However, driving a manual transmission and getting it right, honing your skill is still an immense pleasure to many.  Zeiss provides the user with the pleasure of something mechanical that's incredibly well engineered, designed, and built and the opportunity for the user to get it right himself.
You propose Zeiss could clean up the high end market.  They already do.  They don't have much competition.  It's a small market.  Zeiss already sells every lens they make.  Sometimes it's not all about profit, sometimes it's about making more than enough, closing the doors for the day, go out and enjoy life.
+1

And as an owner of a Zeiss lens, I bought it for its excellent optics and mechanical robustness.

I grew up with manual focus lenses. My cupboard at home is the current resting place for half a dozen FD lenses, an A1, F1 and EF body. So, manual focus is not really an issue. In fact, compared to the FD lenses, the Zeiss is easier to focus because the camera body has a focus confirmation light. Won't find that in an F1 body ;)

Sure, the lens doesn't get used much. But that's simply the nature of the UWA lens I have. And besides, landscapes don't move much to demand AF :)
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mrsfotografie

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Re: Why are Zeiss lenses manual?
« Reply #25 on: September 13, 2013, 01:32:28 AM »
I hear about the great Zeiss lenses, and read the great reviews on them.

My question is, why do they ONLY seem to do manual focus lenses? Could they not really clean up on the high end market by making them work with the Canon/Nikon AF systems???

Thanks in advance,

cayenne


It would change the way they provide such high mechanical quality. Dare I say that for me it's really the other way round: why doesn't Canon provide any digital full frame body that works reliably as a full time manual focus camera only? Answer: very few people would be buying something like this in this day and age. But I'd still prefer it.

I'm still bummed out by the fact that in order to go digital I had to go AF. Never wanted the EOS system because of the flimsiness that comes with anything AF. My dream camera remains a full frame digital version of the F1n with an updated range of FD lenses.

Here's one reason why I'm sticking with my 5DmkII for now. Its viewfinder isn't perfect for use with MF but the EF-S screen and AF confirmation are a great help.

That's a good point - if it works for you. I tried the EF-S screen and it didn't make enough of a difference for me to justify the degraded view when using my 24-105 f/4. So I've basically caved and given in to AF as the only viable alternative - except when messing around with my old FD 500 reflex lens with the Ed Mika adapter.

The viewfinder does get darker when used with slower lenses, but I don't find that to be a problem. It may be down to eyesight and personal preference though.
5D3, 5D2, Sony α6000, G16 | SY14 f/2.8, Ʃ20 f/1.8, 24 f/2.8, 35 f/2, Ʃ35 f/1.4A, 50 f/1.8 I, Ʃ50 f/1.4 EX, 100L Macro, 17-40L, 24-105L, 70-200 f/2.8L IS II, 1.4x II, 70-300L, 100-400L | E-mount: SY12 f/2, Ʃ19 & 30 f/2.8 EX DN, 16-70 ZA OSS, 55-210 OSS, Metabones SB | FT-QL, AE-1P | FD(n) & FL lenses

RGomezPhotos

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Re: Why are Zeiss lenses manual?
« Reply #26 on: September 13, 2013, 03:12:37 AM »
it's not unlike car transmissions.
Today there are plenty of options from excellent torque converter automatics, to dual clutch automated manuals, to single clutch automated manuals, to multi clutch plate autos.  They are all excellent and do the job really really well and often are faster changing than any human could dream of.  However, driving a manual transmission and getting it right, honing your skill is still an immense pleasure to many.  Zeiss provides the user with the pleasure of something mechanical that's incredibly well engineered, designed, and built and the opportunity for the user to get it right himself.
You propose Zeiss could clean up the high end market.  They already do.  They don't have much competition.  It's a small market.  Zeiss already sells every lens they make.  Sometimes it's not all about profit, sometimes it's about making more than enough, closing the doors for the day, go out and enjoy life.

++1

You know, I've been a serious photographer for just over two years.  Possibly a fraction from what the average is on this group.  The only camera I used lots of before I got my DSLR was my beautiful Panasonic LX3.  Manual focus?

But soon after I discovered I wanted to be a fashion photographer, a colleague suggested I try Zeiss lenses.  I bought the Canon 28-135mm f3.5 lens that the guy who I bought my used Canon 50D from.  I had also rented a Canon 24-105 f4 L and Canon 35mm f1.4L  So this is where I started from.

The Zeiss was a revelation.  I found out that I love contrasty images.  Canon couldn't touch the bokeh of the Zeiss.  The sharpness from the 35mm f1.4 Zeiss was un-touchable.  Though in all fairness, the Zeiss is 50% more money than the Canon equivalent.  Still, it's a superior lens.

Auto Focus.  Never miss it.  It does come in handy when shooting in mid-upper telephoto range.  Which I rarely do.  Hell, I shoot dancing events in MF.  Works just fine. 

I can totally understand when someone with poor eyesight would love or need AF.  And that's okay.  I don't get into these arguments on what's better or worse.  What's important is what's best FOR YOU.  And maybe that's Zeiss's philosophy too.  They love what they do because they do it THEIR way.  And not what the market wants.  And that's how you should do your photography.  Isn't it?
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RGF

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Re: Why are Zeiss lenses manual?
« Reply #27 on: September 13, 2013, 03:36:35 AM »
There will always be those few who want a proper manual focus for the pleasure of using it, but they are few and far between.

I wonder if there are people who use an abacus to calculate their tax forms, just for the pleasure of it?  ::)

You mean there's another way ?  :(

Get with the times...use a slide rule like everyone else!

slide rule - why so advanced (I still have and know how to use it)?  how about an abacus?

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Re: Why are Zeiss lenses manual?
« Reply #27 on: September 13, 2013, 03:36:35 AM »

RGF

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Re: Why are Zeiss lenses manual?
« Reply #28 on: September 13, 2013, 03:38:11 AM »
There will always be those few who want a proper manual focus for the pleasure of using it, but they are few and far between.

I wonder if there are people who use an abacus to calculate their tax forms, just for the pleasure of it?  ::)

You mean there's another way ?  :(

can I do my taxes in hexidecimal?

aj1575

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Re: Why are Zeiss lenses manual?
« Reply #29 on: September 13, 2013, 06:10:18 AM »
I hear about the great Zeiss lenses, and read the great reviews on them.

My question is, why do they ONLY seem to do manual focus lenses? Could they not really clean up on the high end market by making them work with the Canon/Nikon AF systems???

Thanks in advance,

cayenne

Here is the real reason why Zeiss does not make AF-Lenses for Canon and Nikon:
http://diglloyd.com/articles/ZeissTouit/ZeissTouit-overview-optics.html
From the Zeiss Q&A:
Because of the patent situation, it is not currently possible to offer a ZEISS AF lens for the other camera systems with EF and F mounts
And also:
In its collaboration with Canon and Nikon, ZEISS currently is not even licensed to use the autofocus interface on the camera.

As I read in other places, it is not possible for a company outside of Japan to build AF-Lenses for Nikon and Canon cameras, due to patent rights.

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Re: Why are Zeiss lenses manual?
« Reply #29 on: September 13, 2013, 06:10:18 AM »