April 23, 2014, 05:38:39 AM

Author Topic: Is it flare, internal reflections or a ghost  (Read 5213 times)

Frodo

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Re: Is it flare, internal reflections or a ghost
« Reply #15 on: September 19, 2013, 11:10:22 PM »
There was a recall of early version of that lens for flare: http://www.luminous-landscape.com/essays/canon-flare.shtml

I have a 24-105 and I find it to be quite ghost resistant.  My 70-200 f4L non-IS was terrible with ghosts when shooting into bright lights, such as the sun - my 24-105 was much better.

The contrast range in your night photos will challenge most lenses, especially zooms with large numbers of lens elements.  Your highlights are completely burnt out (no criticism of the photo), while the skies are relatively dark.  Even so, I've shot night cityscapes with that lens on a 5Dii (e.g. under the Sydney harbour bridge) and I can't remeber ghosts being a problem - I'll check.  Is the sensor of the 6D shinier such that it causes more internal reflections?
If gear matters: 5DII, 7D, G11, Samyang 14/2.8, EF 24-105/4, EF 35/2.0IS, EF 50/2.5 macro, EF 85/1.8, EF 200/2.8II, EF 400/5.6, Ext 1.4x, Lifesize conv, Ext tube EF25, 430EXII, 270EX, Yongnuo 603C

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Re: Is it flare, internal reflections or a ghost
« Reply #15 on: September 19, 2013, 11:10:22 PM »

ejenner

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Re: Is it flare, internal reflections or a ghost
« Reply #16 on: September 19, 2013, 11:13:22 PM »
I was thinking the same thing.  The scene will test any lens for sure, but I find that lens to be quite flare resistant.  Hard to say without comparing the scene with another lens (either the same model, or something similar).

Frodo

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Re: Is it flare, internal reflections or a ghost
« Reply #17 on: September 19, 2013, 11:22:32 PM »
Here is a photo of a nightscape with my 24-105 @ 24mm and f8 (the bridge photos were with a different lens).  Although I've used just the centre of this image, I've looked at the full frame and ghosts, if at all present, are inconspicuous.

If gear matters: 5DII, 7D, G11, Samyang 14/2.8, EF 24-105/4, EF 35/2.0IS, EF 50/2.5 macro, EF 85/1.8, EF 200/2.8II, EF 400/5.6, Ext 1.4x, Lifesize conv, Ext tube EF25, 430EXII, 270EX, Yongnuo 603C

wickidwombat

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Re: Is it flare, internal reflections or a ghost
« Reply #18 on: September 20, 2013, 10:15:05 PM »
Since it is a new lens, I'd exchange it for another.  Sometimes there can be a manufacturing defect that makes internal reflections worse.

I doubt it most 24-105s i've seen and used do this when shooting into hard large spotlights
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Frodo

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Re: Is it flare, internal reflections or a ghost
« Reply #19 on: September 21, 2013, 06:19:58 PM »
Just tidying up some photos from last year and here is a photo of the 24-105 shoot straight into the sun on a 5D @ f11.  I think I would have left my Hoya Pro-1 UV filter attached because of the conditions in Antarctica.  I think that the flare resistance is more than acceptable for a zoom.  The green ghost was easily cloned out.

If gear matters: 5DII, 7D, G11, Samyang 14/2.8, EF 24-105/4, EF 35/2.0IS, EF 50/2.5 macro, EF 85/1.8, EF 200/2.8II, EF 400/5.6, Ext 1.4x, Lifesize conv, Ext tube EF25, 430EXII, 270EX, Yongnuo 603C

jwilton

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Re: Is it flare, internal reflections or a ghost
« Reply #20 on: September 23, 2013, 06:36:43 PM »
Since it is a new lens, I'd exchange it for another.  Sometimes there can be a manufacturing defect that makes internal reflections worse.

I doubt it most 24-105s i've seen and used do this when shooting into hard large spotlights
Met a young chap, DJ, who was taking photos of the bridge early this morning. He had just purchased the same camera as mine. I asked him if he was getting internal reflections, explained why etc. and he was not.  Even composed same photo and could not reproduce the internal reflections.

SO I found at least one example of the lens that does not mis behave.

jwilton

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Re: Is it flare, internal reflections or a ghost
« Reply #21 on: September 23, 2013, 06:38:08 PM »
Just tidying up some photos from last year and here is a photo of the 24-105 shoot straight into the sun on a 5D @ f11.  I think I would have left my Hoya Pro-1 UV filter attached because of the conditions in Antarctica.  I think that the flare resistance is more than acceptable for a zoom.  The green ghost was easily cloned out.



Thanks, love the photo.

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Re: Is it flare, internal reflections or a ghost
« Reply #21 on: September 23, 2013, 06:38:08 PM »

Skirball

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Re: Is it flare, internal reflections or a ghost
« Reply #22 on: September 23, 2013, 07:03:24 PM »
I'm putting my money on it being ghosts.  Your best bet is to return the lens, or buy a shirt that says "My camera sees dead people".

jwilton

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Re: Is it flare, internal reflections or a ghost
« Reply #23 on: September 23, 2013, 07:09:48 PM »
 
I'm putting my money on it being ghosts.  Your best bet is to return the lens, or buy a shirt that says "My camera sees dead people".

 :)

Pi

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Re: Is it flare, internal reflections or a ghost
« Reply #24 on: September 23, 2013, 07:26:17 PM »
The lights are extremely bright for the exposure. I have taken many night shots with this lens without visible problems. Still, with extremely bright light sources, you will see ghosts symmetric to the light sources about the center, like the green flare right here, in the lower left corner.


 

On the other hand, the next shots seems to be OK, the "flare" around the highlights are due to the high humidity and pollution:


The Shanghai oriental pearl tower

surapon

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Re: Is it flare, internal reflections or a ghost
« Reply #25 on: September 23, 2013, 09:06:20 PM »
These are reflections, could be internal...

+1

Great Engineer's Thinking, Dear Arjay
In my Idea, and It happend to me long time ago.  just 1 small reflective dust on the  front of UV. filter, that create the UFOs  on the dark sky for me. I hope that are the real UFOs, that I can sell to the Newspaper for millions Us Dollars.----Ha, Ha, Ha.
Surapon

OH-O-----I might wrong again---Sorry  "  just 1 small reflective dust on the  front of UV. filter, that create the UFOs  on the dark sky for me. "---Sorry for my Low tech of Photographic undestanding.
« Last Edit: September 23, 2013, 09:39:32 PM by surapon »

Frodo

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Re: Is it flare, internal reflections or a ghost
« Reply #26 on: September 23, 2013, 09:11:03 PM »
These are reflections, could be internal...

+1

Great Engineer's Thinking, Dear Arjay
In my Idea, and It happend to me long time ago.  just 1 small reflective dust on the  front of UV. filter, that create the UFOs  on the dark sky for me. I hope that are the real UFOs, that I can sell to the Newspaper for millions Us Dollars.----Ha, Ha, Ha.
Surapon

Dust on the filter would not cause "UFOs".  More likely dust on the sensor.  A filter will increase the chance of ghosts, a dirty filter will increase the chance of veiling (a lack of contrast).
If gear matters: 5DII, 7D, G11, Samyang 14/2.8, EF 24-105/4, EF 35/2.0IS, EF 50/2.5 macro, EF 85/1.8, EF 200/2.8II, EF 400/5.6, Ext 1.4x, Lifesize conv, Ext tube EF25, 430EXII, 270EX, Yongnuo 603C

Pi

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Re: Is it flare, internal reflections or a ghost
« Reply #27 on: September 23, 2013, 09:19:21 PM »
Dust on the filter would not cause "UFOs".  More likely dust on the sensor.  A filter will increase the chance of ghosts, a dirty filter will increase the chance of veiling (a lack of contrast).


In the OP case, those are reflections from the sensor reflected back by the lens. See this, for example:

http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1120319

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Re: Is it flare, internal reflections or a ghost
« Reply #27 on: September 23, 2013, 09:19:21 PM »

surapon

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Re: Is it flare, internal reflections or a ghost
« Reply #28 on: September 23, 2013, 09:41:34 PM »
These are reflections, could be internal...

+1

Great Engineer's Thinking, Dear Arjay
In my Idea, and It happend to me long time ago.  just 1 small reflective dust on the  front of UV. filter, that create the UFOs  on the dark sky for me. I hope that are the real UFOs, that I can sell to the Newspaper for millions Us Dollars.----Ha, Ha, Ha.
Surapon

Dust on the filter would not cause "UFOs".  More likely dust on the sensor.  A filter will increase the chance of ghosts, a dirty filter will increase the chance of veiling (a lack of contrast).
Thanks you, Sir, Dear Frodo. Sorry, I make the mistake and Misunderstanding of the UFOs.
Surapon

mackguyver

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Re: Is it flare, internal reflections or a ghost
« Reply #29 on: September 27, 2013, 11:06:45 AM »
I found that my 50 1.4 did this same thing a lot, so I put a high quality multi-coated filter (like Hoya or B+W) and it took care of it.  It won't fix flare from the sun or really bright lights, but should work in the example you posted. 
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Re: Is it flare, internal reflections or a ghost
« Reply #29 on: September 27, 2013, 11:06:45 AM »