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Author Topic: Cheap manual flash to use for fill lighting...  (Read 7397 times)

jdramirez

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Cheap manual flash to use for fill lighting...
« on: September 19, 2013, 09:24:20 AM »
 so I have been side lighting photos of my infant daughter using a 580 exii,  an umbrella,  and a  yongnuo 622c...  and even though I can't access all the ettl  features immediately (I'm pretty sure it is operator error), I think the shadows from  being side lit aren't exactly what I'm looking for. 

 so I wasn't too get a cheap manual flash that I  can couple with my rouge flash bender  to add some fill flash or maybe even side lit fromtheother side using a wire  that attached to the hot shoe.

I  was  thinking about one of the newer brand flashes for 40  bucks,  but once I nut it it will only be worth twenty bucks if I sell it.  I  hate losing money on gear...  it drives me nuts.   so I was thinking,  maybe I should buy something like a 430 ex ii  which will retain its value,  but 200 v 40   seems like a  bad use of resources. 

I  see really old manual speed lites  on  craigslist,  but the head doesn't articulate backwards...

 so the question is...  what is the right price to pay for a manual flash  that will only be used inside the home for fill light.
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100 f/2.8L->85mm f/1.8 USM->135L -> 8mm ->100L

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Cheap manual flash to use for fill lighting...
« on: September 19, 2013, 09:24:20 AM »

jdramirez

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Re: Cheap manual flash to use for fill lighting...
« Reply #1 on: September 19, 2013, 09:52:39 AM »
 it just occurred to me that I like to shoot at f 1.8 so I use high speed sync to raise my shutter speed so it is properly exposed...  and a cheap manual flash won't hss,  so that won't work...  unless I invest in a nd  filter.
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100 f/2.8L->85mm f/1.8 USM->135L -> 8mm ->100L

Skirball

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Re: Cheap manual flash to use for fill lighting...
« Reply #2 on: September 19, 2013, 11:09:12 AM »
What's the right price to pay?  As cheap as possible?  Kind of a subjective question.  Personally I'd go for the cheapo, if I already had a decent flash like the 580.  In fact, that's exactly what I did when I had just a 580.  But many would argue that you should get a 600.  You're really worrying about resale value of a $40 flash? 

I don't know much about Newer, but Yongnuo has a variety of flashes from full manual no zoom, to their 580 knockoff.  Choose the features you want and grab one.  I have one of the ultra basic models, I usually just use it to light backgrounds or as a hair light (snooted).  It works fine, it cost me next to nothing, and if I need more features I just use one of my other flashes.

Also a personal preference, but with something as sedentary as an infant I'd definitely be shooting manual anyway.

In the mean time: with a subject as small, and as stationary as an infant you should be able to use a reflector quite successfully for fill light.

Skirball

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Re: Cheap manual flash to use for fill lighting...
« Reply #3 on: September 19, 2013, 11:12:12 AM »
I don't understand where the ND filter comes in.

7enderbender

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Re: Cheap manual flash to use for fill lighting...
« Reply #4 on: September 19, 2013, 11:36:55 AM »
so I have been side lighting photos of my infant daughter using a 580 exii,  an umbrella,  and a  yongnuo 622c...  and even though I can't access all the ettl  features immediately (I'm pretty sure it is operator error), I think the shadows from  being side lit aren't exactly what I'm looking for. 

 so I wasn't too get a cheap manual flash that I  can couple with my rouge flash bender  to add some fill flash or maybe even side lit fromtheother side using a wire  that attached to the hot shoe.

I  was  thinking about one of the newer brand flashes for 40  bucks,  but once I nut it it will only be worth twenty bucks if I sell it.  I  hate losing money on gear...  it drives me nuts.   so I was thinking,  maybe I should buy something like a 430 ex ii  which will retain its value,  but 200 v 40   seems like a  bad use of resources. 

I  see really old manual speed lites  on  craigslist,  but the head doesn't articulate backwards...

 so the question is...  what is the right price to pay for a manual flash  that will only be used inside the home for fill light.



Here's my take (based on some experience and experimentation with Speedlites - something I was completely new to not even 3 years ago). It's always great to have options. Having ETTL and Hi Speed Sync can be very beneficial. You may find that setting things manually is preferable. But even then it's nice to be able to control things via the camera menu. So there's you're answer if another Canon flash or fully compatible third party (such as Metz) is better than a cheap manual flash that doesn't support that nor Hi Speed sync for those saturated outdoor shoots in bright daylight.

BUT: if the goal is just to have nice fill I would start with adding a reflector to your existing setup. That usually works really well even with just one flash.

There is some good reading material available on the web and in books (e.g. Sil Arena's books or the basics covered on http://strobist.blogspot.com/ )
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Re: Cheap manual flash to use for fill lighting...
« Reply #5 on: September 19, 2013, 11:46:03 AM »
as far as I know, the cheap flashes for canon are manual only.  No E-ttl.  YOu will need to set the power down - trial and error.

jdramirez

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Re: Cheap manual flash to use for fill lighting...
« Reply #6 on: September 19, 2013, 11:50:59 AM »
You're really worrying about resale value of a $40 flash? 
worry about the pennies and soon you won't have any... you'll have dollars.
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100 f/2.8L->85mm f/1.8 USM->135L -> 8mm ->100L

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Re: Cheap manual flash to use for fill lighting...
« Reply #6 on: September 19, 2013, 11:50:59 AM »

bvukich

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Re: Cheap manual flash to use for fill lighting...
« Reply #7 on: September 19, 2013, 11:51:31 AM »
I don't understand where the ND filter comes in.

He wants to shoot his 85/1.8 wide open.  To keep the shutter speed below xsync, in many situations, he'd need an ND filter to achieve this.

jdramirez

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Re: Cheap manual flash to use for fill lighting...
« Reply #8 on: September 19, 2013, 12:07:25 PM »
I don't understand where the ND filter comes in.

He wants to shoot his 85/1.8 wide open.  To keep the shutter speed below xsync, in many situations, he'd need an ND filter to achieve this.

 that's exactly it...  so the  sync  speed for the mkiii  is 1/200  of a second... I  was  shooting at 1/2500  the other day,  so I think I would need a 16x nd  filter..  or  somewhere close to get  to 1/200. 

 so maybe I just buy a 430 ii.   Damn it.
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100 f/2.8L->85mm f/1.8 USM->135L -> 8mm ->100L

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Re: Cheap manual flash to use for fill lighting...
« Reply #9 on: September 19, 2013, 12:10:50 PM »

 so I wasn't too get a cheap manual flash that I  can couple with my rouge flash bender  to add some fill flash or maybe even side lit fromtheother side using a wire  that attached to the hot shoe.

Try this ... costs only $43 http://yn.eachshot.com/product/yongnuo-yn-460-yn460-flash-speedlight-for_canon/
OR if you are willing to pay another $30 more, you can get one with a metal hot shoe, like this one http://yn.eachshot.com/product/yongnuo-yn560iii-yn-560-iii-ultra-long-range-wireless-flash-speedlite_canon/

Happy shopping
« Last Edit: September 19, 2013, 12:12:26 PM by Rienzphotoz »
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jdramirez

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Re: Cheap manual flash to use for fill lighting...
« Reply #10 on: September 19, 2013, 12:30:14 PM »
 for the record, I hate typing on my phone.   it is amazing y'all could make sense of the gibberish.
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100 f/2.8L->85mm f/1.8 USM->135L -> 8mm ->100L

Skirball

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Re: Cheap manual flash to use for fill lighting...
« Reply #11 on: September 19, 2013, 12:32:16 PM »
I don't understand where the ND filter comes in.

He wants to shoot his 85/1.8 wide open.  To keep the shutter speed below xsync, in many situations, he'd need an ND filter to achieve this.

 that's exactly it...  so the  sync  speed for the mkiii  is 1/200  of a second... I  was  shooting at 1/2500  the other day,  so I think I would need a 16x nd  filter..  or  somewhere close to get  to 1/200. 

 so maybe I just buy a 430 ii.   Damn it.

Ok.  You mentioned umbrellas, infants and sidelighting with a strobe and a modifier...  I assumed you were in an indoors studio situation.

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Re: Cheap manual flash to use for fill lighting...
« Reply #12 on: September 19, 2013, 12:33:43 PM »
for the record, I hate typing on my phone.   it is amazing y'all could make sense of the gibberish.

It's not easy.

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Re: Cheap manual flash to use for fill lighting...
« Reply #12 on: September 19, 2013, 12:33:43 PM »

jdramirez

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Re: Cheap manual flash to use for fill lighting...
« Reply #13 on: September 19, 2013, 12:39:28 PM »
I don't understand where the ND filter comes in.

He wants to shoot his 85/1.8 wide open.  To keep the shutter speed below xsync, in many situations, he'd need an ND filter to achieve this.

 that's exactly it...  so the  sync  speed for the mkiii  is 1/200  of a second... I  was  shooting at 1/2500  the other day,  so I think I would need a 16x nd  filter..  or  somewhere close to get  to 1/200. 

 so maybe I just buy a 430 ii.   Damn it.

Ok.  You mentioned umbrellas, infants and sidelighting with a strobe and a modifier...  I assumed you were in an indoors studio situation.

 it is the living room,  but the wife reneged  on her agreement,  so now it is called the billiard room out of spite.
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100 f/2.8L->85mm f/1.8 USM->135L -> 8mm ->100L

Skirball

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Re: Cheap manual flash to use for fill lighting...
« Reply #14 on: September 19, 2013, 12:44:36 PM »
I don't understand where the ND filter comes in.

He wants to shoot his 85/1.8 wide open.  To keep the shutter speed below xsync, in many situations, he'd need an ND filter to achieve this.

 that's exactly it...  so the  sync  speed for the mkiii  is 1/200  of a second... I  was  shooting at 1/2500  the other day,  so I think I would need a 16x nd  filter..  or  somewhere close to get  to 1/200. 

 so maybe I just buy a 430 ii.   Damn it.

Ok.  You mentioned umbrellas, infants and sidelighting with a strobe and a modifier...  I assumed you were in an indoors studio situation.

 it is the living room,  but the wife reneged  on her agreement,  so now it is called the billiard room out of spite.

I feel your pain.  I just moved all my camera equipment out of my ‘studio’ to put a crib in it.

So you’re shooting indoors and still pulling 1/2500?  If you have (presumably sun) light that bright in your “studio” then why aren’t you using your 580 for fill light?

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Re: Cheap manual flash to use for fill lighting...
« Reply #14 on: September 19, 2013, 12:44:36 PM »