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Author Topic: Opinion - What EOS Will Look Like by Photokina  (Read 22177 times)

ecka

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Re: Opinion - What EOS Will Look Like by Photokina
« Reply #45 on: September 25, 2011, 03:53:50 PM »
My crystal ball says:
[Canon EOS, September 2012]

1D5 - $8000 - Oct 2011 (FF high fps)
1Ds3 - $6500
1D4 - $4500
5D3 - $2900 - Oct 2011 (1D5 sensor but less fps)
5D2 - $2400
7D2 - $1800 - Feb 2012 (new APS-C, probably 24mp, 10fps?)
7D - $1600
70D - $1200 - Aug 2012 (7D2 sensor, ~6.5fps)
60D - $1000
650D - $800 - Feb 2012 (7D2 sensor)
600D - $700
550D - $600
1100D - $500

 ;D
FF + primes !

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Re: Opinion - What EOS Will Look Like by Photokina
« Reply #45 on: September 25, 2011, 03:53:50 PM »

jimmy156

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Re: Opinion - What EOS Will Look Like by Photokina
« Reply #46 on: September 25, 2011, 05:23:43 PM »

O/T but this attitude irritates me. I know everyone here will be a gear/tech freak, but that doesent make low end camera's "crappy" This shot for example was taken with an 1000d and 18-55 kit lens... and was highly commended in the prestigous wildlife photographer of the year award.


That's right, and great photo by the way.  Please realize that most people on this forum do know that great photos can be taken with "crappy" cameras.  Very cool photos can be taken with camera phones which most people, including pro photographers, carry around with them.  Most gearheads on this site also have a P&S but probably a pretty good one rather than a crappy one :)

You do touch on a good point.  There is a tendency to begin referring to anything less than the best available or even an ideal soon-to-be-announced camera to be "crappy".  The 7D has been called crappy.  The 5D2 focus has been called crappy.  Etc.  Well, that's just not true in absolute terms... comparatively, there might be some other camera that does a slightly better job at a particular feature but suddenly it's as if there's a night and day difference.  The Sony sensor in the Nikon D7000 had an extra stop of DR at low ISO and suddenly every other camera out there is crap, outdated, etc.  Nonsense.

To be fair, there are many pundits on here for focusing on real world image quality so there's a balance in the discussions.  No one feature or attribute is the best in all situations.  That's not to say each new feature or attribute isn't important.  They all are under certain situations.  Sports shooters need high frame rates, landscape photographers do not.  Everyone can benefit from higher DR at times but not every scene has even 10 stops of DR and in fact some photos look better with less DR so the photographer will clip the shadow details in photoshop to get more contrast and many other examples.

Gear is good.  Technology is good.  And it's cool when camera manufacturers give us something that hasn't been possible in the past.  Every camera has it's use from an iPhone all the way to a 1D4 and medium format.  Film is good so is digital... they each have different benefits and limitations.

It's fun.  No need for anyone to be offended or irritated except if anyone is rude or disrespectful to others and those trolls know who they are.  :)

I agree with all of that :) . Just wanted to point out that the shot i posted isn't mine! Wouldn't want people to think i was trying to pass it off as such! I just thought it illustrated my point particularly well.

As for you last sentence, you're right of course, but its this sort of attitude in forums/at camera clubs etc that can put people off photography in general. Just rubs me up the wrong way! I'll get over it :D

Bob Howland

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Re: Opinion - What EOS Will Look Like by Photokina
« Reply #47 on: September 25, 2011, 05:28:07 PM »
1Ds4 introduced during October or November with 27MP FF

5D3... with a 40MP+ sensor and 3FPS. Cost approximately $3500.

1DsIV at 27 MP and 5DIII at 40+ MP?  I think that's highly unlikely.

The difference:

1Ds4 > 216 Million Pixels/Second with the most rugged body, but otherwise the most balanced of the models listed: second highest resolution, second largest pixels and second highest FPS

6D/3D/9D > 80-96 MP/S

5D3 > 120 MP/S

7D2 > 192 MP/S and the second most rugged body, but also the smallest sensor of the models listed

Zuuyi

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Re: Opinion - What EOS Will Look Like by Photokina
« Reply #48 on: September 25, 2011, 05:32:11 PM »
Why do people complain so much about XXXD & XXXXD Rebels.  If it wasn't for those Income boosters; the XXD & XD cameras would either not exist or cost much more.  They are able to spread R&D cost to the masses.

And 99% of camera needs could be handled by the T3 kit.  So please make tons of XXXD & XXXXD cameras so I can get my XD camera for a reasonable price (not Hasselblad prices).

goodmane

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Re: Opinion - What EOS Will Look Like by Photokina
« Reply #49 on: September 25, 2011, 06:05:52 PM »
The more I think about this, the less I'm beginning to care! Don't get me wrong I like the Canon products I have but I've pretty much grown tired of waiting for Canon to wake up to the fact I want a good small camera.

I'm very close to ditching my Canon SLR gear and picking up a Fuji X100 and maybe eventually a Leica. I don't like that Canon are being so slow to market, they don't impress me with innovation that I care about any more, that will help me take better family photos, videos and studio shots. I want either an affordable, smallish, superfast, 45 point AF FF SLR with a flash built-in, or a small rangefinder style camera.

JonJT

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Re: Opinion - What EOS Will Look Like by Photokina
« Reply #50 on: September 25, 2011, 06:57:22 PM »
The more I think about this, the less I'm beginning to care! Don't get me wrong I like the Canon products I have but I've pretty much grown tired of waiting for Canon to wake up to the fact I want a good small camera.

I'm very close to ditching my Canon SLR gear and picking up a Fuji X100 and maybe eventually a Leica. I don't like that Canon are being so slow to market, they don't impress me with innovation that I care about any more, that will help me take better family photos, videos and studio shots. I want either an affordable, smallish, superfast, 45 point AF FF SLR with a flash built-in, or a small rangefinder style camera.
A small EOS FF camera would still have large lenses though.

elflord

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Re: Opinion - What EOS Will Look Like by Photokina
« Reply #51 on: September 25, 2011, 07:09:03 PM »
The more I think about this, the less I'm beginning to care! Don't get me wrong I like the Canon products I have but I've pretty much grown tired of waiting for Canon to wake up to the fact I want a good small camera.

I'm very close to ditching my Canon SLR gear and picking up a Fuji X100 and maybe eventually a Leica. I don't like that Canon are being so slow to market, they don't impress me with innovation that I care about any more, that will help me take better family photos, videos and studio shots. I want either an affordable, smallish, superfast, 45 point AF FF SLR with a flash built-in, or a small rangefinder style camera.

If someone said to you "I want a small camera with decent image quality, I don't care very much for shallow depth of field, and I want something compact and not too expensive", would you tell them to get the 5D with the 24-70mm f/2.8 ? Why not just sell it all and get the EP3 or the GH2  ? Even if/when Canon do announce a mirrorless product, their lens lineup will be 3-4 years behind micro 4/3.

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Re: Opinion - What EOS Will Look Like by Photokina
« Reply #51 on: September 25, 2011, 07:09:03 PM »

Meh

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Re: Opinion - What EOS Will Look Like by Photokina
« Reply #52 on: September 25, 2011, 08:05:09 PM »
The more I think about this, the less I'm beginning to care! Don't get me wrong I like the Canon products I have but I've pretty much grown tired of waiting for Canon to wake up to the fact I want a good small camera.

Canon cares about what the market wants and what they think they can sell.  Frankly, there's nothing wrong with a company deciding not to enter a particular market segment.  Maybe Canon is getting it right by waiting for everyone else to get it wrong and see where the market goes.  Personally, I don't quite get the interchangeable lens compact segment... it's hot, people are buying them, but is it just a fad?  Canon has the size and depth to wait it out.

I'm very close to ditching my Canon SLR gear and picking up a Fuji X100 and maybe eventually a Leica. I don't like that Canon are being so slow to market, they don't impress me with innovation that I care about any more, that will help me take better family photos, videos and studio shots. I want either an affordable, smallish, superfast, 45 point AF FF SLR with a flash built-in, or a small rangefinder style camera.

If you're thinking of ditching your SLR gear for an X100 or Leica then just do it you probably don't need the SLR for what it is best at.  Two very different products for different photography.  They don't really overlap.  Are you suggesting you'll be taking studio shots with an X100?  I don't think so.

Affordable, small, and pop-up flash... but also superfast and 45 point AF?  Not sure all that goes together... maybe one day, not just yet.

The new Nikon V1 sounds perfect for what you need... get the pink one.  Sorry, just kidding about the pink but seriously given what you said you want (other than the studio work) it just about meets your requirements.

« Last Edit: September 25, 2011, 08:09:25 PM by Meh »

neuroanatomist

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Re: Opinion - What EOS Will Look Like by Photokina
« Reply #53 on: September 25, 2011, 09:12:17 PM »
The difference:

1Ds4 > 216 Million Pixels/Second with the most rugged body, but otherwise the most balanced of the models listed: second highest resolution, second largest pixels and second highest FPS

Sorry, Bob - I still don't see it.  What's the tagline, "The Canon EOS 1-series - second-best at a bunch of stuff," or, "The 1DsIV - the most MP/s of any Canon camera!" (They'll need to put out a white paper on the critical importance of MP/s to photographers, first, of course...)
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Bob Howland

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Re: Opinion - What EOS Will Look Like by Photokina
« Reply #54 on: September 25, 2011, 09:59:01 PM »
The difference:

1Ds4 > 216 Million Pixels/Second with the most rugged body, but otherwise the most balanced of the models listed: second highest resolution, second largest pixels and second highest FPS

Sorry, Bob - I still don't see it.  What's the tagline, "The Canon EOS 1-series - second-best at a bunch of stuff," or, "The 1DsIV - the most MP/s of any Canon camera!" (They'll need to put out a white paper on the critical importance of MP/s to photographers, first, of course...)

I'm pretty sure that most of the target market are sophisticated enough to not need a tagline. We're not talking about a FF Rebel here.

unfocused

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Re: Opinion - What EOS Will Look Like by Photokina
« Reply #55 on: September 25, 2011, 10:03:13 PM »
1Ds4 introduced during October or November with 27MP FF

5D3... with a 40MP+ sensor and 3FPS. Cost approximately $3500.

1DsIV at 27 MP and 5DIII at 40+ MP?  I think that's highly unlikely.

I think that's putting it mildly. I think you've got the Megapixel counts reversed. I can see a 5D in the 25-30 range and a 1Ds in the 40-50 range.

The difference:

1Ds4 > 216 Million Pixels/Second with the most rugged body, but otherwise the most balanced of the models listed: second highest resolution, second largest pixels and second highest FPS

Sorry, Bob - I still don't see it.  What's the tagline, "The Canon EOS 1-series - second-best at a bunch of stuff," or, "The 1DsIV - the most MP/s of any Canon camera!" (They'll need to put out a white paper on the critical importance of MP/s to photographers, first, of course...)

+1, although I doubt if Canon will be pushing just the Megapixels with the 1DsIV. I imagine something like: highest resolution of any SLR with industry leading low-light sensitivity, frame rate and superior dynamic range.

I always have problems differentiating between what I want and what I think will happen, but here goes

7D2 - Introduced at Photokina and still APS-C. Moved upmarket to replace the 1D4 as the professional sports photographers' crop camera. Body is similar to the 5D3 and 3D/6D/9D bodies, but more rugged. 12FPS and 16MP with dual Digic 5 processors. Cost: $2200.

You had me until I got to the 16MP and the price. I'm thinking somewhere in the 21-26 megapixel range and I don't see Canon jacking up the price that much. There are a lot more enthusiasts than there are professional sports photographers. Personally, I'd be happy with the same 18 mp and some small improvements in noise, dynamic range and low light sensitivity, (Plus faster, weathersealed lenses at the wide end) but I think Canon won't want to have that much of a gap between their sensor and the competition.

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c.d.embrey

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Re: Opinion - What EOS Will Look Like by Photokina
« Reply #56 on: September 25, 2011, 10:36:57 PM »
Why do people complain so much about XXXD & XXXXD Rebels.  If it wasn't for those Income boosters; the XXD & XD cameras would either not exist or cost much more.  They are able to spread R&D cost to the masses.

And 99% of camera needs could be handled by the T3 kit.  So please make tons of XXXD & XXXXD cameras so I can get my XD camera for a reasonable price (not Hasselblad prices).

Photographers take photos, NOT CAMERAS! I've had photos published that were taken with a Film Rebel.

c.d.embrey

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Re: Opinion - What EOS Will Look Like by Photokina
« Reply #57 on: September 25, 2011, 10:45:28 PM »

 Are you suggesting you'll be taking studio shots with an X100?  I don't think so.


Terry Richardson did studio work with a Yashica T4 Film P&S. The right tool isn't always a Canon 1Ds, sometimes it's a Fuji X100 or aSony NEX 7.

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Re: Opinion - What EOS Will Look Like by Photokina
« Reply #57 on: September 25, 2011, 10:45:28 PM »

Zuuyi

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Re: Opinion - What EOS Will Look Like by Photokina
« Reply #58 on: September 25, 2011, 10:56:08 PM »
5d 40MP & 1Ds 27MP.  NO CHANCE.

Why would I pay 7k for a 1Ds when the 5D would out spec it for 4500 (your thought 3500) less.  I don't see 1.1 fps as anything important in studio photography, how fast are the lights refreshing.  And the better metering is extremely nice but not $4500 nice (Again the 1Ds is for a studio where lighting is controlled).   

I could see a 50MP 1Ds & 30MP 5D.  But the 5D already eats at the 1Ds sales, your prediction would make the 1Ds useless.

vk

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Re: Opinion - What EOS Will Look Like by Photokina
« Reply #59 on: September 25, 2011, 10:57:19 PM »
The next year is the Olympic year, and my guess is that Canon is going to update 1D-series by April in the run-up to the Olympics. Perhaps at PMA in Las Vegas in January 2012. Canon experiences a lot of competition from Nikon in PJ sector, and they just cannot afford losing in the lucrative market of 1D-series and white supertele lenses...

1Ds Mk IV is long overdue, so it must be slotted for update in 2012 as well (perhaps at Photokina after Olympics rush is over).

There is going to be no 5D Mk III until 1Ds Mk IV is released. 5D Mk II sells like hotcakes, and there is really no serious competition in the prosumer full-frame segment. On the other hand Canon would not want new 5D Mk III to affect sales of 1D/1Ds series. So the 5D Mk III must be significantly inferior the upcoming 1Ds IV / 1D V (have poorer autofocus, slower fps, etc), and thus come after the pro cameras are updated.

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Re: Opinion - What EOS Will Look Like by Photokina
« Reply #59 on: September 25, 2011, 10:57:19 PM »