October 01, 2014, 04:35:28 PM

Author Topic: EOS 7D Mark II Talk [CR1]  (Read 25915 times)

ICE

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Talk [CR1]
« Reply #30 on: October 09, 2013, 08:01:53 AM »
Quote
Yeah I don't use the video function on mine. But, as long as they don't compromise stills features in favour of video it doesn't bother me. Show me an improvement in ISO perf, a healthy burst and an upgrade to the focus system and I'll be sold.


Quote
I want more pixels, improved dynamic range, higher fps, improved AF, improved silent mode, ruggedness and weather sealing, plus a few more. I prefer FF, but could well be interested in a good APS-C or APS-H body.

+1 and WiFi

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Talk [CR1]
« Reply #30 on: October 09, 2013, 08:01:53 AM »

xps

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Talk [CR1]
« Reply #31 on: October 09, 2013, 08:07:40 AM »
Canon should ask ML how to make their products better. ML seems to be superior in creating firmwares

I'm sure the Canon people are also very able, but they only put it to work on the 1d series ... for the cheaper cameras, it's all about stability and recycling the older fw (no updates, no support cost). Plus they are very busy crippling the cameras and adding things like playing music along the slide show :-p
Indeed. You are right.
Maybe Canon will cover up the not so good IQ with good music, when you lokk at your photos or videos. Like when you go shopping.  ::)

gjones5252

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Talk [CR1]
« Reply #32 on: October 09, 2013, 08:22:55 AM »
Wow. lots of frustration about the video feature. Before you get to frustrated you should realize that DSLR became extremely more profitable when it increased its customer base. People everywhere are buying dslrs now that they can do both. People who also want a cheaper interchangeable lens system would gladly buy these over similar priced camcorder of far lesser quality.
Also if they get a new person to come on board the canon boat that is a whole new set of lenses, cameras and toys. If a current user buys one new camera its valuable and they love it but the margin difference is massive.
Be happy a bunch of video people decided to pump fountains of money into the R+D the help benefit your picture quality. Now feature wise it does seem that most features are coming out for video but look at the cameras that are out there 1dx and 5d3 are top of the line image producing machines.
We will soon have a megapixelmonster.
Both Photo and Video features have a huge dollar sign. I think it is silly to complain about something that will not disappear and according to historical pricing has not dramatically affected what either party is paying.
Long term this is awesome. More customers to canon=more canon product=more product compatible with canon=more customers to canon.
Its good for all of us. Don't get wadded up on the fact video features are part of the team now too.

Chosenbydestiny

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Talk [CR1]
« Reply #33 on: October 09, 2013, 09:06:19 AM »
Wow. lots of frustration about the video feature. Before you get to frustrated you should realize that DSLR became extremely more profitable when it increased its customer base. People everywhere are buying dslrs now that they can do both. People who also want a cheaper interchangeable lens system would gladly buy these over similar priced camcorder of far lesser quality.
Also if they get a new person to come on board the canon boat that is a whole new set of lenses, cameras and toys. If a current user buys one new camera its valuable and they love it but the margin difference is massive.
Be happy a bunch of video people decided to pump fountains of money into the R+D the help benefit your picture quality. Now feature wise it does seem that most features are coming out for video but look at the cameras that are out there 1dx and 5d3 are top of the line image producing machines.
We will soon have a megapixelmonster.
Both Photo and Video features have a huge dollar sign. I think it is silly to complain about something that will not disappear and according to historical pricing has not dramatically affected what either party is paying.
Long term this is awesome. More customers to canon=more canon product=more product compatible with canon=more customers to canon.
Its good for all of us. Don't get wadded up on the fact video features are part of the team now too.

+1 people whine way too much about video on a dslr and have very selfish reasons to do so. If you don't like it, simply don't use it.
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neuroanatomist

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Talk [CR1]
« Reply #34 on: October 09, 2013, 09:16:19 AM »
Add me to the list of people sick of paying all that extra cash for a function I don't want.

How much extra cash do you think you're paying?
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AvTvM

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Talk [CR1]
« Reply #35 on: October 09, 2013, 09:27:34 AM »
it is fine with me that
* Canon camcorders are available with a lens mount compatible with EF lenses
* Canon has a wide range of video-optimized cameras on offer, both in the shape of classical camcorders (C100/300/500) and in DSLR-shape (1Dc)
* videographers are happy to buy and use all sorts of Canon equipment 

BUT ... I am really pissed off that
* Canon has not a single stills-optimized camera in its entire current lineup 
* Canon optimizes all camera sensors to capture hours and hours of video at a time which undoubtedly comes at the expense of highest quality stills capture   
* No Canon sensor is able to yield stills images that match and surpass competitor's products in terms of resolution and dynamic range and low noise/no banding at low and hi ISO settings any longer
* 18+ MP sensors in stills cameras being wasted on capturing video @2MP of resolution (Full HD, 1920x1080x)
* Canon puts a marked-in-red "Record video" buttons in a prime ergonomic location on every camera
* this button is not even user-assignable to do something useful for stills capture
* Canon menu systems getting bloated with lots of video-related stuff
* and all the many other - partially hidden - compromises forced upon stills photographers

And all of this only because Canon decides to charge a f*cking ton of money for video gear and significantly less money for video-compromised stills cameras.


PS: this is not "whining", this is a proper rant!
« Last Edit: October 09, 2013, 09:34:55 AM by AvTvM »

Woody

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Talk [CR1]
« Reply #36 on: October 09, 2013, 09:28:03 AM »
Its good for all of us. Don't get wadded up on the fact video features are part of the team now too.

It all sounds good except Canon seems to be crippling the video capability on their DSLRs... Don't believe? Just look at what MagicLantern did with video features on Canon DSLRs. Ironic isn't it? They are afraid DSLR sales will eat into their camcorder business. ;)

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Talk [CR1]
« Reply #36 on: October 09, 2013, 09:28:03 AM »

Marsu42

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Talk [CR1]
« Reply #37 on: October 09, 2013, 09:39:49 AM »
It all sounds good except Canon seems to be crippling the video capability on their DSLRs

There's a difference between "crippling" and "not implementing": removing features like afma 50d->60d, removing save sources on hdr/multlexpo 5d3->6d = crippling; not adding raw capability that has never been there is something else.

Problem is that there is a fine line between those though, you can see the moiré on the 20mp ff 6d sensor or the limited sd card write speed as "crippling" or not, according to personal views.

vlim

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Talk [CR1]
« Reply #38 on: October 09, 2013, 09:54:22 AM »
I'm glad to have buy a new 70d for 892 € (and don't wait for the 7D II) and be happy about how it performs !

Don Haines

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Talk [CR1]
« Reply #39 on: October 09, 2013, 10:04:03 AM »
Add me to the list of people sick of paying all that extra cash for a function I don't want.

It's not that easy... yes, it does cost more to develop the firmware features for video, but the addition of video increases the sales, which gets you better economy of scale pricing.... the balance point is anyone's guess...
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pedro

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Talk [CR1]
« Reply #40 on: October 09, 2013, 10:05:51 AM »
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<p><strong>Canon EOS 7D Mark II<br />

</strong> 2014.</p>
<p></p>
<p>We’re also told any follow-up to the EOS 7D will get a new sensor and not use the 20.2mp sensor that is found in the EOS 70D.</p>
<p><strong><span style=\"color: #ff0000;\">c</span>r</strong></p>

New sensor: what would that mean? techwise, nm-wise? any guesses?
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AvTvM

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Talk [CR1]
« Reply #41 on: October 09, 2013, 10:33:24 AM »
New sensor: what would that mean? techwise, nm-wise? any guesses?

my guess: 24 MP, dual-pixel AF and IQ, DR, noise/banding ... like 70D and just a bit below next Nikon [D7200]. :-) 

pierlux

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Talk [CR1]
« Reply #42 on: October 09, 2013, 10:36:22 AM »
Add me to the list of people sick of paying all that extra cash for a function I don't want.

How much extra cash do you think you're paying?

Exactly. Nearly nothing.

And let me say, just implementing the dual pixel CMOS AF, regardless of any other video feature which might be added to the 7DII, would suffice for considering it "more video oriented" than the current 7D. Anyway, Magic Lantern docet, there's plenty of functions Canon could introduce in the next bodies, if only they felt doing so does not impair their Cinema EOS cameras' sales.

Talking about sensor and pixel density, I'm still hoping for a (relatively) low MP count 7DII, in the range of 14 - 16. Let me explain. Today, the reasons for choosing an APS-C body are: price, compactness and reach. According to rumors, the 7DII is not going to be a cheap cam, it may even be a "baby 1DX" with integrated grip; if so, price and compactness are ruled out. Pricewise, a better choice could be either the 6D or the 5DIII. Reach? Assuming we all care about IQ, it's a consolidated opinion by now that a cropped image taken with the 5DII looks better than one taken with the 7D. Better still, it's more than an opinion, it's a fact. So, IQ-wise, I'm not going to spend as much money as the 5DIII costs on a hi-MP 7DII if I could not take advantage of the only advantage I'd care about: reach.

I'm hoping Canon to bring on a lo-MP, monster-framerate, good hi-ISO IQ, as-much-as-they-want-video-oriented (I don't care, but I know I'm not spending any extra cash on it), pro-grade weather sealed 7DII.

Cheers!

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Talk [CR1]
« Reply #42 on: October 09, 2013, 10:36:22 AM »

Marsu42

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Talk [CR1]
« Reply #43 on: October 09, 2013, 11:51:57 AM »
And let me say, just implementing the dual pixel CMOS AF, regardless of any other video feature which might be added to the 7DII, would suffice for considering it "more video oriented" than the current 7D.

You probably will change your mind because dual pixel (only usable in lv) af goes along with a touch screen, which might mean less weight will be put into the vf and phase af ...

... and since you're supposed to use the comfort of the touch screen, they could very well change the ergonomics like reducing the wheel size or less old-school buttons.

pierlux

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Talk [CR1]
« Reply #44 on: October 09, 2013, 12:59:20 PM »
And let me say, just implementing the dual pixel CMOS AF, regardless of any other video feature which might be added to the 7DII, would suffice for considering it "more video oriented" than the current 7D.

You probably will change your mind because dual pixel (only usable in lv) af goes along with a touch screen, which might mean less weight will be put into the vf and phase af ...

... and since you're supposed to use the comfort of the touch screen, they could very well change the ergonomics like reducing the wheel size or less old-school buttons.

Good points! You're perfectly right, nevertheless I don't see Canon dropping the dual pixel AF tech in any of their future cams, provided they are video capable, which means probably all of them. If your statement refers to the fact that I, like many others, don't care much about video, I'm with you on this one generally speaking, except that in the specific case of the 7DII I don't see both the situations you fear will occur. In particular,

...might mean less weight will be put into the vf and phase af ...
not necessarily, and certainly not in a classy 7DII as it is rumored to be. Since both the 70D viewfinder and phase AF have been improved with respect to the 60D, I can't imagine this not happening in the 7D --> 7DII transition also.

...they could very well change the ergonomics like reducing the wheel size or less old-school buttons.
I'm a little more concerned on this one because it's exactly what happened along the 50D-->60D-->70D pathway. It must be noticed, however, that the ergonomics change, and particularly the wheel size reduction, came together with a reduction of the overall body size; I'm not expecting a smaller 7DII, I'd rather expect it to grow in size and weight (maybe 100% wf and integrated grip), so I hope no change for the worse in the ergonomics.

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Talk [CR1]
« Reply #44 on: October 09, 2013, 12:59:20 PM »