December 18, 2014, 12:57:15 AM

Author Topic: Protective filter for 24-70 II - standard or thin?  (Read 10791 times)

Rienzphotoz

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Re: Protective filter for 24-70 II - standard or thin?
« Reply #45 on: November 29, 2013, 05:56:25 AM »
It's interesting how the same thread can give two individuals entirely different suggestions. I guess it shows that the answer one seeks is really within one's mind, and they view the world accordingly to suit that answer...  ::) ::) ::)
???
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Re: Protective filter for 24-70 II - standard or thin?
« Reply #45 on: November 29, 2013, 05:56:25 AM »

sagittariansrock

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Re: Protective filter for 24-70 II - standard or thin?
« Reply #46 on: November 29, 2013, 11:39:42 AM »
It's interesting how the same thread can give two individuals entirely different suggestions. I guess it shows that the answer one seeks is really within one's mind, and they view the world accordingly to suit that answer...  ::) ::) ::)
???

Oh, never mind. I was just amused how while I figured from the post F-Pro will be fine for my 24-70 II, while digitalpuppy went with the XS-Pro based on the same thread.
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Re: Protective filter for 24-70 II - standard or thin?
« Reply #47 on: November 29, 2013, 01:15:39 PM »
It's interesting how the same thread can give two individuals entirely different suggestions. I guess it shows that the answer one seeks is really within one's mind, and they view the world accordingly to suit that answer...  ::) ::) ::)
???

Oh, never mind. I was just amused how while I figured from the post F-Pro will be fine for my 24-70 II, while digitalpuppy went with the XS-Pro based on the same thread.
OK, I get it now. Cheers
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Re: Protective filter for 24-70 II - standard or thin?
« Reply #48 on: November 29, 2013, 05:16:36 PM »
I can´t recommend to use a protective filter.

The only filters you need are polfilters, ND filters and ND grad filters.

But if you want a filter buy a slim filter from B+W.

thanks,for this, but can you say why do you have any reasoning to go with your statement?

entlassen

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Re: Protective filter for 24-70 II - standard or thin?
« Reply #49 on: December 03, 2013, 12:02:56 AM »
I'm reading through this thread and have some questions about the B+W line of 82mm Clear filters, of which I see three on B&H:

(A) B+W 82mm XS-Pro Clear MRC-Nano 007 [$121.95]
(B) B+W 82mm 007M Clear MRC Filter [$100.66]
(C) B+W 82mm Clear Slim MRC 007M filter [$139.99]


My questions are:
1) I know that (C) is "thin."  I know that (B) is "standard."  But what is (A), thin or standard?
2) I see this warning in the item description for (A) on B&H's site:
Quote
This filter ring's outside diameter is slightly larger than the actual thread size, and because of this you may be unable to attach the lens manufacturer's bayonet-mounted lens hood to the lens while using this filter. This is dependent on your specific lens and how thick the front rim of the lens is; with thinner, low-profile lenses usually being affected more.
Does this lens hood problem affect the 82mm XS-Pro on the 24-70 f/2.8 II?  And is this a problem with the 77mm  XS-Pro on the 70-200 f/2.8 II?
3) I see people in the thread mentioning a 82mm "F-Pro" filter.  Is that referring to (B), or something else entirely?  I can't seem to find a mention of "F-Pro" on B&H.
4) Is stacking a circular polarizer filter on top of an existing Clear/UV filter something that people commonly do?  Or are you supposed to take off the Clear/UV filter first, then screw on the circular polarizer?
5) Is (A) too thin to stack another filter on top of it?
« Last Edit: December 03, 2013, 12:46:29 AM by entlassen »

neuroanatomist

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Re: Protective filter for 24-70 II - standard or thin?
« Reply #50 on: December 03, 2013, 12:21:42 AM »
I'm reading through this thread and have some questions about the B+W line of 82mm Clear filters, of which I see three on B&H:

(A) B+W 82mm XS-Pro Clear MRC-Nano 007 [$121.95]
(B) B+W 82mm 007M Clear MRC Filter [$100.66]
(C) B+W 82mm Clear Slim MRC 007M filter [$170]

My questions are:
1) I know that (C) is "thin."  I know that (B) is "standard."  But what is (A), thin or standard?
2) I see this warning in the item description for (A) on B&H's site:
Quote
This filter ring's outside diameter is slightly larger than the actual thread size, and because of this you may be unable to attach the lens manufacturer's bayonet-mounted lens hood to the lens while using this filter. This is dependent on your specific lens and how thick the front rim of the lens is; with thinner, low-profile lenses usually being affected more.
Does this lens hood problem affect the 82mm XS-Pro on the 24-70 f/2.8 II?  And is this a problem with the 77mm  XS-Pro on the 70-200 f/2.8 II?
3) I see people in the thread mentioning a 82mm "F-Pro" filter.  Is that referring to (B), or something else entirely?  I can't seem to find a mention of "F-Pro" on B&H.
4) Is stacking a circular polarizer filter on top of an existing Clear/UV filter something that people commonly do?  Or are you supposed to take off the Clear/UV filter first, then screw on the circular polarizer?
5) Is (A) too thin to stack another filter on top of it?

1) 'A' (XS-Pro) is thin, but has front threads whereas the Slim does not, meaning the standard lens cap doesn't work (it comes with a slip-on).  By the numbers, for non-CPL filters:  F-Pro (the official name of the 'standard' mount) is 5mm thick, XS-Pro is 3.4mm thick, and Slim is 3mm thick.

2) Ignore the 'warning'.  I've got XS-Pro filters in many sizes, no issues with hoods.

3) Yes, F-Pro is 'B'.  In addition to XS-Pro and Slim, you may also see Extra-Wide - those have bigger glass to avoid vignetting (e.g., the 77mm EW has 77mm threads but an 82mm filter - those do often cause hood problems).

4) Stacking provides no benefit (other than speed). Conventional wisdom is it hurts IQ, I haven't tested it...but I don't stack unless I'm in a big hurry. I do stack a CPL on an ND, though, to get combined effects.

5) Since 'A' (XS-Pro) is thin but has a front thread, that's the one you want if you're going to stack - a thinner stack means less chance of vignetting. You can't stack another filter onto a Slim filter.
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entlassen

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Re: Protective filter for 24-70 II - standard or thin?
« Reply #51 on: December 03, 2013, 12:39:10 AM »
Wow, thanks neuroanatomist for the incredibly quick and comprehensive reply!  :D

Is the XS-Pro's front-thread the same size as the F-Pro's, or is it smaller since the XS-Pro itself is thin?  I'm just curious because if there's one thing I hate, it's a small profile front-thread which causes lens caps to have problems staying on (whether it be the old Canon models or the new "center-pinch" models).  I've lost a couple of lens caps in the past because they couldn't stay on properly (using another brand of filters).

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Re: Protective filter for 24-70 II - standard or thin?
« Reply #51 on: December 03, 2013, 12:39:10 AM »

neuroanatomist

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Re: Protective filter for 24-70 II - standard or thin?
« Reply #52 on: December 03, 2013, 12:48:22 AM »
Is the XS-Pro's front-thread the same size as the F-Pro's, or is it smaller since the XS-Pro itself is thin?  I'm just curious because if there's one thing I hate, it's a small profile front-thread which causes lens caps to have problems staying on (whether it be the old Canon models or the new "center-pinch" models).  I've lost a couple of lens caps in the past because they couldn't stay on properly (using another brand of filters).

The XS-Pro thread has a lower profile, so there's a gap - but it's not big, I'd say about 0.75mm. The F-Pro has a gap, too, though its slightly smaller:



I've never had issues with caps popping off either filter, and I take lenses in and out of various bags a lot.
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entlassen

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Re: Protective filter for 24-70 II - standard or thin?
« Reply #53 on: December 03, 2013, 12:50:48 AM »
Thanks for the clarification!  I guess XS-Pro is the best option (price notwithstanding), since you get the thin profile and it still has front-threading.

I do wonder though, if you have an XS-Pro circular polarizer, whether the thin profile makes it more annoying to use, since it might make it more difficult for your hand to grasp/twist it.

neuroanatomist

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Re: Protective filter for 24-70 II - standard or thin?
« Reply #54 on: December 03, 2013, 12:59:29 AM »
I do wonder though, if you have an XS-Pro circular polarizer, whether the thin profile makes it more annoying to use, since it might make it more difficult for your hand to grasp/twist it.

I wonder about that, as well - but they're probably fine. The F-Pro CPL is 7mm thick, the Slim is 5mm thick, and the XS-Pro is only 4mm thick.  I have 77mm and 82mm Slim Käsemann CPL filters, which I bought before they came out with the XS-Pro CPL.  The Slim ones rotate easily, even with the thin knurled ring. But, if you stack a Slim CPL onto another filter, it can be difficult to remove if it 's tightened down hard.  If you ever plan to stack filters, you should have a set of filter wrenches in your bag (they're cheap, I have several sets so I can just leave them in several bags).  The issue with the Slim CPL is you have to grab the lens-side ring, and it's pretty thin...and the XS-Pro might be even thinner.
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entlassen

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Re: Protective filter for 24-70 II - standard or thin?
« Reply #55 on: December 03, 2013, 01:02:33 AM »
The F-Pro CPL is 7mm thick, the Slim is 5mm thick, and the XS-Pro is only 4mm thick. 

Slim CPL is thicker than the XS-Pro CPL?  That's sort of weird, since you mentioned the opposite was true for the Clear filters (i.e. F-Pro 5mm, XS-Pro 3.4mm, Slim 3mm).

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Re: Protective filter for 24-70 II - standard or thin?
« Reply #56 on: December 03, 2013, 01:08:16 AM »
Thanks for the clarification!  I guess XS-Pro is the best option (price notwithstanding), since you get the thin profile and it still has front-threading.

I do wonder though, if you have an XS-Pro circular polarizer, whether the thin profile makes it more annoying to use, since it might make it more difficult for your hand to grasp/twist it.
Not an issue in my opinion. Yes there is less metal to hold on to, but absolutely doable. Even if two filters get stuck together a little but, I just wiggle them back and forth a few times until they magically come loose. I never needed more grip, nor filter wrenches.

neuroanatomist

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Re: Protective filter for 24-70 II - standard or thin?
« Reply #57 on: December 03, 2013, 01:10:47 AM »
The F-Pro CPL is 7mm thick, the Slim is 5mm thick, and the XS-Pro is only 4mm thick. 

Slim CPL is thicker than the XS-Pro CPL?  That's sort of weird, since you mentioned the opposite was true for the Clear filters (i.e. F-Pro 5mm, XS-Pro 3.4mm, Slim 3mm).

Weird...but true.  Also, FWIW while almost all B+W mounts including the F-Pro and XS-Pro CPL are brass, the Slim CPL is aluminum (they say 'for manufacturing reasons,' whatever that means).  Brass is less prone to getting stuck.   If I ever need to replace a CPL, I'll get the XS-Pro version - but I don't see the need to swap unless I break/lose one of my existing CPLs.
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Re: Protective filter for 24-70 II - standard or thin?
« Reply #57 on: December 03, 2013, 01:10:47 AM »

Rienzphotoz

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Re: Protective filter for 24-70 II - standard or thin?
« Reply #58 on: December 03, 2013, 02:57:54 AM »

I see this warning in the item description for (A) on B&H's site:
Quote
This filter ring's outside diameter is slightly larger than the actual thread size, and because of this you may be unable to attach the lens manufacturer's bayonet-mounted lens hood to the lens while using this filter. This is dependent on your specific lens and how thick the front rim of the lens is; with thinner, low-profile lenses usually being affected more.
Does this lens hood problem affect the 82mm XS-Pro on the 24-70 f/2.8 II?  And is this a problem with the 77mm  XS-Pro on the 70-200 f/2.8 II?

2) Ignore the 'warning'.  I've got XS-Pro filters in many sizes, no issues with hoods.
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Re: Protective filter for 24-70 II - standard or thin?
« Reply #58 on: December 03, 2013, 02:57:54 AM »