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Author Topic: Which TS lens is better  (Read 5172 times)

Marek Truchlik

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Which TS lens is better
« on: October 22, 2013, 02:43:07 AM »
Hi, I´m looking forward to welcome TS lens into my roaster around Christmas.
I would like to know your opinion, which one is better:
17/4 or 24/3.5 II?
From reviews I know that 24mm is incredible sharp, plus is also can take filters. But I would be aiming for something wider.
17mm is great lens to but what I can read is that is as not sharp to tht corners as 24mm. Some articles says that Lee anounced also filter system for this lens which can be also pretty interesting.
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Which TS lens is better
« on: October 22, 2013, 02:43:07 AM »

Eldar

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Re: Which TS lens is better
« Reply #1 on: October 22, 2013, 04:03:40 AM »
These lenses are both great. Optically and mechanically they are both outstanding. The last thing I would worry about is sharpness. Make your choice based on what focal length you prefer. You will be very happy with the results.

24mm is my favorite wide angel for general photography, but I must admit that the 17mm TS-E has become a new favorite. If I had to settle for one, I would probably go for the 17mm.
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tron

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Re: Which TS lens is better
« Reply #2 on: October 22, 2013, 05:16:36 AM »
I got first the TS-E 24 and then the TS-E 17. If I were to start all over I would start with the 17.

rs

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Re: Which TS lens is better
« Reply #3 on: October 22, 2013, 05:20:29 AM »
Choosing the correct focal length for your requirements is much more important than chasing absolute optical perfection wide open.

Ignoring perspective control (which is usually used in conjunction with one below), a TS-E lens is primarily used for:

1) tripod mounting and setting up for majority of the scene in focus - this usually involves stopping down as far as you can before diffraction sets in, and tilting the lens to bring that deep plain of focus in line with most of the scene. So no worries about the corners at f3.5/f4 there.

2) limiting apparent DoF by tilting the lens the wrong way, and shooting wide open. In that scenario, you want the corners blurred anyway.

It's not a lens for taking pictures of brick walls or test charts hand held, wide open. While you might be able to, I can't think of many uses for wide open sharp corners with a lens like that. And finally, the TS-E 17/4 is phenomenally good wide open compared to almost any other comparably wide angle lens.

Your decision should be based primarily on what focal length you need, with filter considerations second and wide open corner sharpness differences a distant third.
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infared

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Re: Which TS lens is better
« Reply #4 on: October 22, 2013, 07:19:07 AM »
I got first the TS-E 24 and then the TS-E 17. If I were to start all over I would start with the 17.
I bought the 17mm TSE II (incredible) Lens first...based on the fact that (much to my surprise), I could use my Canon 1.4X III to increase the focal length of the 17mm to 24mm and get as-good (OR BETTER !), IQ as the 24mm TSE.

I already owned the 1.4X III to use with my 70-200mm...and NEVER would have considered using it on a super wide-angle lens...BUT ....I find that the combo is INDEED impressive!  Of course you lose an f/stop from the 17mm making the the combo quite a bit slower slower than the 24mm TSE (f/5.6 vs f/3.5 on the 24mm)...but considering all of my work with the lens is done on a tripod and low DOF isn't something that I am usually looking for with a super WA....for me it was like buying two TSE's for the price of one! I am AMAZED at the results with the 1.4X III. It goes against all I have learned over the years...but there it is.
Something to consider when looking at these lenses.
You still have the drawbacks of filter placement, protruding element of the 17mm...it is a little more cumbersome ...but I find it to be worth the money savings for me. If I was a pro, who shot Architecture all of the time, perhaps not.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2013, 09:03:28 AM by infared »
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Re: Which TS lens is better
« Reply #5 on: October 22, 2013, 11:23:01 AM »
Both TS-Es are very good at what they do, so it comes down to which focal length suits your needs better (as others have already stated).

Both TS-Es can use extenders, but the image degrades slightly.  The 17 also has slightly less swing than the 24, so the 17 + 1.4x will not be able to correct as much as the 24 does natively.

For buildings, especially interiors, I use the 17 primarily.  For landscapes, it's the 24.  I also find that TS-E 24 panoramas are more pleasing than the 17s because the subject to camera distance is longer and the foreground objects aren't stressed as much.

neuroanatomist

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Re: Which TS lens is better
« Reply #6 on: October 22, 2013, 11:44:18 AM »
As others stated, you should decide based on focal length only.  Personally, I picked the TS-E 24L II as my preferred focal length, after spending some time shooting my intended TS-E subjects with at both 17mm and 24mm (testing was actually done with the 7D + 10-22mm; I bought the 16-35L II and sold the 10-22mm about a month after getting the TS-E 24L II). 

I bought the 17mm TSE II (incredible) Lens first...based on the fact that (much to my surprise), I could use my Canon 1.4X III to increase the focal length of the 17mm to 24mm and get as-good (OR BETTER !), IQ as the 24mm TSE.
Better?  If you're referring to the original TS-E 24L, maybe - but the TS-E 24L II is sharper than the bare TS-E 17mm, and decidedly sharper than the 17 + 1.4x (very obvious in the TDP crop comparison). 
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Re: Which TS lens is better
« Reply #6 on: October 22, 2013, 11:44:18 AM »

surapon

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Re: Which TS lens is better
« Reply #7 on: October 22, 2013, 11:54:54 AM »
As others stated, you should decide based on focal length only.  Personally, I picked the TS-E 24L II as my preferred focal length, after spending some time shooting my intended TS-E subjects with at both 17mm and 24mm (testing was actually done with the 7D + 10-22mm; I bought the 16-35L II and sold the 10-22mm about a month after getting the TS-E 24L II). 

I bought the 17mm TSE II (incredible) Lens first...based on the fact that (much to my surprise), I could use my Canon 1.4X III to increase the focal length of the 17mm to 24mm and get as-good (OR BETTER !), IQ as the 24mm TSE.
Better?  If you're referring to the original TS-E 24L, maybe - but the TS-E 24L II is sharper than the bare TS-E 17mm, and decidedly sharper than the 17 + 1.4x (very obvious in the TDP crop comparison).

+ 100 for me too, Sir.
This TS-E 24 L MK II with me / on my one camera  all the times( For Super Sharp, High Contrast in Colors and For the Special Effected of Selected DOF), Another  camera = 70-200 mm L IS, and the Last Camera = 85 mm 1.2 L MK II---( Yes, I not use my Trusty 24 -70 mm.  2.8 L MK I  any more, just in my dry Box, after I get TS-E 24 L MK II 5 months ago).
Surapon
« Last Edit: October 22, 2013, 01:25:57 PM by surapon »

Eldar

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Re: Which TS lens is better
« Reply #8 on: October 22, 2013, 12:24:39 PM »
Better?  If you're referring to the original TS-E 24L, maybe - but the TS-E 24L II is sharper than the bare TS-E 17mm, and decidedly sharper than the 17 + 1.4x (very obvious in the TDP crop comparison).
In a head to head ISO chart comparison, the TS-E 24mm f3.5L II is the sharper lens. It beats almost anything you can compare it to. And it combines incredible sharpness with all the other qualities that one could wish for.

But the 17mm is also an incredible lens and with our current sensors, I believe the differences between the two are a bit academic. I am a bit worried though, walking around with the unprotected bulging front lens.  The image below is a shot, unedited raw to jpeg in LR, except for size reduction to fit the 4M size limit, with the 17mm on 5DIII (1/50s, f5.0 and ISO100).
« Last Edit: October 22, 2013, 12:26:40 PM by Eldar »
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Re: Which TS lens is better
« Reply #9 on: October 22, 2013, 12:44:01 PM »

dryanparker

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Re: Which TS lens is better
« Reply #10 on: October 22, 2013, 02:00:42 PM »
Well, neither of these are "walkaround" lenses. They're specialty tools...and manual focus. You can do some interesting things with them. I've seen wedding shooters use the tilt effect in cool ways, but the real beauty of these lenses is in slower tripod work.

Something to consider, and in my opinion a must have for a shift lens, is a geared tripod head. It really helps me to have the axial control to adjust the attitude of the camera with the shift movement to keep your lines straight.

My preference is the TS-E 24L II. It's just a miracle of engineering, and for me it yields a more natural perspective. If you need more width, you can quite easily stitch frames and get even more than a 17mm FOV.
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surapon

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Re: Which TS lens is better
« Reply #11 on: October 22, 2013, 03:14:41 PM »
Well, neither of these are "walkaround" lenses. They're specialty tools...and manual focus. You can do some interesting things with them. I've seen wedding shooters use the tilt effect in cool ways, but the real beauty of these lenses is in slower tripod work.

Something to consider, and in my opinion a must have for a shift lens, is a geared tripod head. It really helps me to have the axial control to adjust the attitude of the camera with the shift movement to keep your lines straight.

My preference is the TS-E 24L II. It's just a miracle of engineering, and for me it yields a more natural perspective. If you need more width, you can quite easily stitch frames and get even more than a 17mm FOV.

Yes, Sir, Dear Mr. dryanparker.
You are right "  the real beauty of these lenses is in slower tripod work. " = 100% right.
Yes "  They're specialty tools...and manual focus. "---Yes, I solve the problem  of this Awesome Manual Focus---By set up the one center spot Focus at my Canon 5D MK II, and set up the Loud beep sound when I use my old hand  turn the Focus ring---Yes, If  it at the right  Focus when , I turn the ring, The Canon will beep, And I will stop at that  point, and move  the camera to the best point of view, and shoot the photos.
Yes, It Slower than AF, But That the best way for my 64 years old eyes.
And for walk around  condition in day light time, I just set my F. Stop at 8.0 and Set the Focus at Between 5 Feet and Infinity , or 3 Meters and Infinity= I will get all perfected sharpest pictures in every times , with out adjust the  focus ring------Ha, Ha, Ha, But I must tape the Small piece of duct tape  on the focus ring, to make sure that It not accidential  move/ rotate ,  during I take the Shot.
Nice to talk to you, Sir.
Surapon

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Re: Which TS lens is better
« Reply #12 on: October 22, 2013, 04:33:58 PM »
As others stated, you should decide based on focal length only.  Personally, I picked the TS-E 24L II as my preferred focal length, after spending some time shooting my intended TS-E subjects with at both 17mm and 24mm (testing was actually done with the 7D + 10-22mm; I bought the 16-35L II and sold the 10-22mm about a month after getting the TS-E 24L II). 

I bought the 17mm TSE II (incredible) Lens first...based on the fact that (much to my surprise), I could use my Canon 1.4X III to increase the focal length of the 17mm to 24mm and get as-good (OR BETTER !), IQ as the 24mm TSE.
Better?  If you're referring to the original TS-E 24L, maybe - but the TS-E 24L II is sharper than the bare TS-E 17mm, and decidedly sharper than the 17 + 1.4x (very obvious in the TDP crop comparison).
I was talking mostly about functionality. You can crop a little but cannot always go backwards.

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Re: Which TS lens is better
« Reply #12 on: October 22, 2013, 04:33:58 PM »

neuroanatomist

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Re: Which TS lens is better
« Reply #13 on: October 22, 2013, 04:54:30 PM »
As others stated, you should decide based on focal length only.  Personally, I picked the TS-E 24L II as my preferred focal length, after spending some time shooting my intended TS-E subjects with at both 17mm and 24mm (testing was actually done with the 7D + 10-22mm; I bought the 16-35L II and sold the 10-22mm about a month after getting the TS-E 24L II). 

I bought the 17mm TSE II (incredible) Lens first...based on the fact that (much to my surprise), I could use my Canon 1.4X III to increase the focal length of the 17mm to 24mm and get as-good (OR BETTER !), IQ as the 24mm TSE.
Better?  If you're referring to the original TS-E 24L, maybe - but the TS-E 24L II is sharper than the bare TS-E 17mm, and decidedly sharper than the 17 + 1.4x (very obvious in the TDP crop comparison).
I was talking mostly about functionality. You can crop a little but cannot always go backwards.

Sorry - your statement about image quality suggested otherwise…
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infared

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Re: Which TS lens is better
« Reply #14 on: October 22, 2013, 05:53:54 PM »
As others stated, you should decide based on focal length only.  Personally, I picked the TS-E 24L II as my preferred focal length, after spending some time shooting my intended TS-E subjects with at both 17mm and 24mm (testing was actually done with the 7D + 10-22mm; I bought the 16-35L II and sold the 10-22mm about a month after getting the TS-E 24L II). 

I bought the 17mm TSE II (incredible) Lens first...based on the fact that (much to my surprise), I could use my Canon 1.4X III to increase the focal length of the 17mm to 24mm and get as-good (OR BETTER !), IQ as the 24mm TSE.
Better?  If you're referring to the original TS-E 24L, maybe - but the TS-E 24L II is sharper than the bare TS-E 17mm, and decidedly sharper than the 17 + 1.4x (very obvious in the TDP crop comparison).
I was talking mostly about functionality. You can crop a little but cannot always go backwards.

Sorry - your statement about image quality suggested otherwise…

That is my quote "as good or better"...  I read a review BEFORE I bought my lens (I just looked for 20min and cannot find the review...but I did read it) and there were sample photos showing less color fringing with the 17mm TSE II with 1.4X compared to the 24mm TSE.  I was in shock.  In any event ...I have shot images with the 17mm TSE II alone and with the 1.4X on the lens.  I am very critical about image quality...I have to say...unless you are a professional Architectural Photographer and use the lens daily...or desperately need the f/3.5 for some reason or the slight extra swing/tilt..I cannot see buying both lenses.  The results are really SURPRISINGLY fantastic with the converter on.  It is something I would never even considered doing until I read the article. 
So, raise your eyebrows if you want ...but it is a great setup.
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Re: Which TS lens is better
« Reply #14 on: October 22, 2013, 05:53:54 PM »